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Last edited by Limitless; 03-19-2015 at 03:25 AM.
EIE?
My mom is LSI and my biological dad is EIE. I kind of relate to what you are saying. I'm not sure what it is about my dad but he pushes for way more connection than I can give him. I often tell my mom I don't want to talk when he calls because he just overwhelms me with some kind of enthusiasm and joy over us speaking and I don't feel the same. My EII sister is way better with him. She tries to be open and talk to him even though he doesn't even speak English and knows very few words. It feels like too much work for me. I know I love him on some level but I did not grow up with him around. He lives in another country and he and my mom did not talk for like 20 years after they split. I feel like he is trying to make something up to me and he doesn't have to. His Fe can be too much for me because I want to hold him at a distance. Probably because of the way he left.
Hope everything works out and you have fun on your retreat. You are not a terrible son.
“My typology is . . . not in any sense to stick labels on people at first sight. It is not a physiognomy and not an anthropological system, but a critical psychology dealing with the organization and delimitation of psychic processes that can be shown to be typical.” —C.G. Jung
Also, thanks @Aylen. You're so great/encouraging!Hope everything works out and you have fun on your retreat. You are not a terrible son.
Last edited by Limitless; 02-14-2016 at 01:42 AM.
SEEs don't necessarily come off as gushy. I certainly don't (I used to think I could be Fe PoLR due to my flat moods and expressions when I can't be bothered to care) and the more expressive SEEs really don't come off as gushy (and if so, it's usually not for serious/has a tongue in cheek element). I'm like that but have no expectations that people match that or react to it. Also, our duals often want to be left alone and I don't see SEEs as likely to take that personally. We're usually pretty understanding of that sort of thing and defer to people's moods and internal emotional needs. I can totally understand needing space and alone time and would rather give someone that space than intrude. Fi tends to be more understanding and accommodating of that sort of thing.Originally Posted by Limitless
Yeah, something about his eyes, expressions, and face gives me the EIE impression. I feel more rationality than irrationality, for one, and ethical is obvious. I get some Bowie vibes from him, except without the gayness. He also gives Ben Stiller vibes but idk what type he is. Some say ILE, but I don't really agree there. I would guess Beta rational for him.
A lot of EIEs I've known would be more likely to take the wanting to be alone thing more personally, I think. I had an EIE music teacher who I felt I had to always pretend to be happy to keep him happy and if I expressed my real emotions, it would do something bad for our relationship. I've never felt a need to do that with Fi creatives who, as I more or less said, seem more understanding of that sort of thing and less critical and controlling of people's emotions and emotional expressions.
Your dad is xstx something. ...please provide a valid side profile like this. .. http://imgur.com/yFh4jZF That's my love
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Dual type(as per tcaudilllg)
Enneagram 5 (wings either 4 or 6)?
I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE
Best description of functions:
http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html
Nice observation. I'm typing. ...will get back to you in a few
Dual type
Enneagram 5 (wings either 4 or 6)?
I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE
Best description of functions:
http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html
except I think Jim Carry is SEE@Limitless. I think your dad is SLE. Se-leading types have a tendency as they get older to have puffiness around their eyes, for always scanning the environment, and this can be more pronounced with SLEs than SEEs. Your dad visually reminds me a bit of Jim Carrey, whom many type as a very expressive (Fe-seeking) SLE (the last picture showing the eye puffiness seems closest to your dad):
I also think this makes sense for everything you've described of him. ie. he likes to seek an emotional atmosphere with others but isn't necessarily able to create it himself.
Also, I get the impression, Limitless, that you're some type of Fi-ego. You seem to voice your feelings a lot: sad, annoyed, happy, moody, etc. that I tend to notice many of the Fi-types do, that their feelings are so strong they feel the need to voice them.
So ultimately, I suspect your relationship difficulties revolve somewhat around your dad's Fi-PoLR. He seems to like the idea of 'doing a fun activity' like going away for a weekend retreat (doing activities together for interaction is more Fe. Fe tends to focus on the activity over the relationship, whereas Fi tends to focus on the relationship over the activity), when you don't think this will change your inner feelings long-term.
Both ILE and SLE in my opinion can occasionally have sentimental moments flare up. They can also be more expressive and downright annoying at times to Fi-egos. Is there anything besides your dad's "sappiness" that annoys you?
You said he hasn't really done much bad specifically, but it might just be the relationship itself that causes difficulties? It seems good that he wants to do a weekend retreat with you. That shows he's at least trying to improve his relationship with you. (my relationship with my dad personally has been very strained at times also, so I can relate to what you write)
Anyway, long story short, I would consider SLE for him, and maybe some of your intertype struggles come with you being an Fi-ego, and interaction strain related to the Fe-valuing and Fi-ego difference. I'm not sure of your mom's type by only two pictures.
Dual type
Enneagram 5 (wings either 4 or 6)?
I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE
Best description of functions:
http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html
I'm very certain that he's xSTx; what about that are you not certain about?You guys are probably going to see a shocking side of me in this post here, but that’s alright… I need to be honest, or else this problem will never be solved. And, anyways, I know it’s alright to be honest here, because people will work to understand me and won’t really care if it seems bad at first, as long as you’re able to label it with a particular type related feature…
I need your help in typing my dad, or at least figuring out a way to mend our uncomfortable relationship (possibly, through pinpointing our intertype relationship?)… And I need to know soon, like before noon today, or else it’ll be reallllyyy bad. Well, not really bad. But it’d probably be discouraging for him, and I’d feel really bad about that, so it’d probably ruin my winter vacation, knowing he felt so horrible about this.
We’re leaving for a father-son retreat later this afternoon, and my dad sort of seems to have this idea in his mind that he’ll be able to rebuild his relationship with his irritable teenage son (the type of person I promised myself I’d never be.) upon my realizing that we’re able to reconnect in the majesty and glory of nature, while the leaves are rustling, and wind is blowing in our hair, and we’re playing cards in a cabin together, late at night… Oh, man… I feel so horrible for saying this. I’m such a terrible son. It’s just a weird situation and I’ve tried to work it out before, it’s just really difficult
. Please try to relate to me and understand me for where I’m at right now and help me and reply, if you’re able to help, since this really needs to change.
Anyways, I sort of feel like writing this will help temporarily. But, not for long. I’ve realized this a while ago. What always ends up happening, is, we start out together feeling like we’re off to a healthy start, and then I’ll get really moody and miserable and grossed out by his sappiness, and he’ll get offended and hurt and try to fix this problem, which I feel really bad about. I just hate being pretending that I like being around him when I’m in these harsh moods. Sometimes I do like being around him, so I feel like it could probably get better, it’s just really hard because I feel like I’m the cruel one in this relationship, which makes me feel like I’m evil, which makes me scared I’m predestined for Hell, etc… (Yes, I’m a Christian… Please don’t comment on religion. I’ve already got enough things to work through and I sort of feel like it’s irrelevant for this thread.)
The reason I get grossed out by his sappiness, is, to me, it’s not enjoyable. I know he’s a lot older and so to him they’re probably genuinely great moods. But to me they feel like a forced euphoria, which I hate, because I do it myself (I guess everyone probably does) and it’s silly. I don’t know how else to describe it, but it’s like pretending you’re happy, when, in reality, you’re miserable, so to you it feels terrible seeing other people who are happy, because it’s hard to relate to at the moment, although you still know it’s real for them. I can clarify if someone misunderstands this… It’s probably complicated and not very relatable to understand for most people. But I’m sure some of the people who have already gone through relational problems here probably already understand it. Ahaha.
Anyways, I’d like for people to V.I. him and let me know what type he might be. Apparently, V.I. is a lot more accurate than I originally realized, so I figured I’d give it a shot and possibly people will be able to help. I originally thought EXXp, but now I have absolutely no idea. It’s weird, how hard it is to type him! I don’t know what all the different types look like, so hopefully some seasoned typologists will be able to help me with figuring out a particular type.
I sort of feel like he could be suffering from some sort of mental disorder, but hopefully not, because (although it probably doesn’t seem like this.) I’d really hate for him to have such a tough type of disease. I figure I should probably put that out there, in case it makes it a lot more complicated for people to figure out possible types, and plus it’s still related to our relationship.
The pictures are already attached to the file below, since I couldn't upload them all without it taking too long. So let me know if there is any particular type that stands out!
Also, my mom's in several of the pictures, so feel free to V.I. her as well lol.
Secondly, I am having a hard time deciding for certain E/I or P/J because your father seems to be kind of buff which eludes my vision or criteria a bit. I want to say ISTp and final.
Dual type
Enneagram 5 (wings either 4 or 6)?
I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE
Best description of functions:
http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html
Your mom is esfp. How is their communication? Is your dad a planner? How good is he with time?
Dual type
Enneagram 5 (wings either 4 or 6)?
I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE
Best description of functions:
http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html
Can I please see images of their current MRIs? I don't think it is fair to type them on a few still images of their outside without seeing the inside of their brains too.
You are intuitive and I think that it will all just come to you in a huge insight once you have a good overview of the functions and how they manifest in different types. You're doing great! Just keep up what you are doing. Ask for insight but in the end rely on your own insights/intuition.
What I am saying is stay open so you don't inadvertently lock yourselves into a certain intertype relation that might be wrong. I think you are clever so you will have doubts about things, that feel off, and that will push you to dig deeper. <3
“My typology is . . . not in any sense to stick labels on people at first sight. It is not a physiognomy and not an anthropological system, but a critical psychology dealing with the organization and delimitation of psychic processes that can be shown to be typical.” —C.G. Jung
Your father is 100% ISTp because he does not perceive reality of people's conditions well hence ignoring Se and favoring Ne the idea tbat what makes him geel good and strong should be propegated or inforced on others despite their lack of good perceivable health. In any case I'm very happy that your parents get along well.Their communication seems very natural. I feel like my mom will notice things to worry about, especially about the family, and he'll do things that will help. He'll get tired after work and she'll make dinner for him. She'll think about where we could go for vacation and he'll make the phone calls. Then, he'll drive us and she'll make sure we all feel happy, and will try to fix things if we don't. Like, if someone's not feeling well, she'll list possibilities to feel better, like eating something. She'll notice if we need help with a school subject (although sometimes she doesn't realize I'd rather learn it on my own...) and he'll make arrangements with us, expect us to follow through with those plans, and help us find a solution. He will "integrate upgrades to our procedures" as he sees fit. If he doesn't see a point in something he'll discard it. Thankfully, I'm very lucky they have such a healthy relationship! I’m not sure if they’re dual. Maybe, but it doesn’t really feel like it anymore. Also, I've realized my mom's probably not IEI. Thanks for the V.I!
I suppose he plans things alright. I don't really know... I don't think he's Ni ego because it's not particularly apparent in him... He'll make plans with us and stuff, and always follows through, but doesn't worry a lot if things don't meet his plan, as long as theres a reasonable cause. If there’s not a reasonable cause and it’s related to one of us kids being lazy or something like that, he will talk with us and maybe get upset, and feel like we don’t care about him, when in reality we DO, we were just being lazy kids .
He always says I’m making a big drama (Well, I probably do seem like it from that first post… ) out of everything and believes everything in life is simple, when in reality it’s not and he doesn’t realize that I need to consider all the things that I do for a good reason. (Not always, and I realize this, but generally I feel like I need to, at least for myself and my peace of mind…) He always says I’m really lazy and irresponsible (don’t worry, generally he’s very nice. It’s just when he gets upset he says these things, but I don’t mind. As long as he’s alright with it. Haha.) and need to work out a deliberate schedule, ect. But, he’s come to realize over time that we just work differently, but he’s always ready to help me figure out a particular system or improve things if I’d like for him to help me. That’s another reason why I’m becoming more and more certain he’s ST. He says I believe everything’s really complicated and wishes I could come to realize that it’s all simple in reality. (For HIS reality it is. But for my reality it isn’t. And that’s alright. Just different views. And I’ve already explained this, but he still feels “sorry” for me. Which I’m alright with, because I’ve learned about personality theories, ect. and realize we’re just different…)
Anyways, getting back to time, I don’t really notice him being particularly interested in it. He doesn’t really daydream or like history, as far as I can tell... BUT, he has several times volunteered himself to help generate church vision plans and has started several church related projects on his own. I get the feeling this sort of thing is really fun for him. He once considered himself prophetic on a spiritual gifting test, and said he and I are similar in that way, when I’ve already taken the test and gotten a different result. (I should add I don’t mean this as an insult or anything like that. I still love him and am fine he sees me this way.) Either way, I do get the feeling he likes to believe he is a visionary advisor, a sage, or something like that. He likes to feel like things are actually making progress and people are in a happier place. (Although I guess most people probably do.)
He’s friendly with us children and our friends, and wants to help them and will insist of prayer and Bible readings whenever they’re sleeping over or something, because he believes it will be helpful for them, and it’s important to stay grounded on what’s really truth. He wants to feel like he’s involved with all our friends, but is alright with not being involved. He wants them to feel like they can ask for advice from him. Sometimes he’ll worry about me because he feels like I don’t do enough with other people and will actually invite my friends over to my house to spend time with me, without me even realizing it until after he’s done talking on the phone with them.
It’s hilarious, in reality.
I'll describe some more things off the top of my head. Part of the reason I originally wondered if they were SLE-IEI is that my dad is generally very enthusiastic about helping people create systems or solve problems in life. He gets genuinely enthusiastic about those things, and seems like he enjoys marveling at the wonderfulness of life sometimes... (I don't know how else I'd put it .) He believes everything should be simple, and will get really frustrated when I fail to preform a particular task according to his rules. He likes it when he's able to find a more effective way to get things done. He generally gives advice a lot, but they both do so I suppose parents are just naturally like that. I actually really like it, when he's able to help explain things more thoroughly (But only toan extent.)He sometimes enjoys talking about theoretical things, but not all the time, it sort of like every once in a while is enough. But when he does, he seems to inherently become enthusiastic and has this vibe like he's in awe of it. He likes helping me with schoolwork and particularly math, which he loves. He also likes science. He goes running every single morning, and will always suggest to other people to go running when they’re not feeling well, because he believes it’s a cure all. (Hence why I no longer talk to him when I’m sick or down.) Like I said already, he actually gets hurt very easily over some subjects. Others, he doesn’t really care about, as long as we’re able to find a solution.
Also, when we go to a movie or a play or something together, we like talking about symbolism, overall themes, motifs, etc. That’s one thing that’s really fun for both of us a nd it’s generally the kind of thing we like to talk about when we’re together.We usually have different views of whatever we’re talking about, so that’s stressful, but I just avoid that and agree with him when he tells me he interprets it a particular way.
I agree, he’s actually a very good dad!
I should probably add, I think the sappiness is just something that generally I’m very hypersensitive to, and like you said, I’m wondering if it actually could be Fi… I’d like to look into that. It’s not just him, though, so I don’t want it to seem like I’m being hard on him. I’ve noticed it in almost everyone, which means it’s actually my own subjective perception at those particular moments. I’m wondering if it’s actuallyand a problem with me neurologically/something like that. There are times when I love him! It’s just, I figure it’d probably be helpful to look for some thoughts on here.
There’s nothing in particular wrong with the relationship with me and my dad, actually. I sort of feel like all the problems come from us seeing things differently. Particularly, I’m very touchy about things and he doesn’t always realize this. Then, I’ll need to have some space or else I’ll feel badly for hurting him, but if I don’t get space, he’ll get really hurt because to him, it feels like I’m mad at him in particular, when in reality I’m just really difficult at times. But I realize this, and we’ve talked it over several times, and I think he’s starting to feel alright with it. The retreat went very well and we were able to talk about it actually! I told him I’m just very touchy and not to take it personally, but explained it a lot more in depth, too.
Dual type
Enneagram 5 (wings either 4 or 6)?
I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE
Best description of functions:
http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html
Here are some descriptions of types offered for you dad. If you get a chance, read through them, see how they feel. The way you describe him comes off leaning toward some kind of ethical and intuitive type, to me.
http://www.wikisocion.org/en/index.php?title=SLI
http://www.wikisocion.org/en/index.php?title=SLE
http://www.wikisocion.org/en/index.php?title=EIE
Edit: I didn't see SF's post so here are the types she offered.
http://www.wikisocion.org/en/index.php?title=IEE
http://www.wikisocion.org/en/index.php?title=ESE
Connecting through symbolism actually sounds like something you could cultivate and instead of disagreeing or agreeing with him you could just try to understand that you see things from different perspectives and symbolism can be a very personal thing. Then you can tell him how you see it without stressing. If you genuinely appreciate his point of view let him know. It really does makes things less stressful and you won't have to hold back your translation of symbolism and meaning.
Edit2: You seem to have landed in the perfect family for your particular needs. Your parents sound like wonderful people.Also, when we go to a movie or a play or something together, we like talking about symbolism, overall themes, motifs, etc. That’s one thing that’s really fun for both of us a nd it’s generally the kind of thing we like to talk about when we’re together.We usually have different views of whatever we’re talking about, so that’s stressful, but I just avoid that and agree with him when he tells me he interprets it a particular way.
Last edited by Aylen; 03-04-2015 at 02:25 AM.
“My typology is . . . not in any sense to stick labels on people at first sight. It is not a physiognomy and not an anthropological system, but a critical psychology dealing with the organization and delimitation of psychic processes that can be shown to be typical.” —C.G. Jung
He's trying hard to be a good dad. Sappiness is corny but it's better than what a lot of dads do and not be there for their kids at all.
I don't see why you couldn't just cut him some slack while at the same time just tell him out right that you can't force special heartwarming moments. They gotta come naturally.
My dad was really sweet and empathetic too. Like I said to everybody before, he was like an older @zap. He was INTj Se polr, Fe dual seeking male and he liked when I just was all nice and warm.
We could still be assholes to each other. I was probably the bigger asshole. I trolled/mocked him sometimes because he was so damn sensitive and I feel guilty about that because now, he's not in my life anymore. He's dead of cancer.
Honestly, this problem is kind of petty- a lot of people don't like the Nickelodeon sappiness of their parents. But did you know that most parents just want their kids to be kind. They want them to be successful too, but the kindness is more important. Being worldly and hardened is overrated. Have a heart. Be sappy occasionally. Meet halfway. Be a little sappy if he bes a little more realistic.
Also give up the idea of Hell. It's stupid. I don't care if you are a naturally cruel person, the idea that you will be punished naturally for that for all of eternity is silly. It's more harsh than being a bad person yourself so get over that. When we're dead, we're dead. I think either we all go to heaven no matter what or we just die and that's it, or we go back into another body and start life all over again. (Honestly this is my favorite) But there is no hell. Only if we create it.
lol its okay. <3
@LimitlessBasically, what I've realized is although I should always try to be honest it's gonna have a bad impact on other people if I'm not careful, so I'll try not to make silly posts like this anymore.
Your thread is not silly. Your threads are thought provoking. You don't have to take those comments to heart and let them limit how you express yourself. That is just someone else's subjective opinion.
“My typology is . . . not in any sense to stick labels on people at first sight. It is not a physiognomy and not an anthropological system, but a critical psychology dealing with the organization and delimitation of psychic processes that can be shown to be typical.” —C.G. Jung
eh don't be. I didn't mean to be like 'well some people don't even have a dad anymore you asshole!' that wasn't really my intention. You didn't offend me. It's just like yeah, cherish your dad and try to forgive all the petty shit cause you may not know how much time u have w/him.I felt so terrible realizing how you must have felt after reading through all this.
I'm sorry about the back n forth but now im leaning back to LSE for him
Dual type
Enneagram 5 (wings either 4 or 6)?
I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE
Best description of functions:
http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html
He's caring but authoritarian, his way and his rules, wants closeness of bond/relationship. He is LSE and final
Dual type
Enneagram 5 (wings either 4 or 6)?
I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE
Best description of functions:
http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html
Your dad is an exclamation point. I had considered comma, question mark, and semicolon, but based on VI exclamation point fits much better.
Suomea
His dad must have discovered he was playing and fishing and grumbling online. He didn't wanna tell me open-heartedly why he deleted all his pics and removed his smirky avi.
So Ej for Dad. ES_j closer to heaven.
(m'didn't read the entire thread.)
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