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Thread: Hannibal (NBC)

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    Nymeria's Avatar
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    Default Hannibal (NBC)

    Will Graham Ni Fe
    Hannibal Lecter Ni Te**
    Alana Bloom Fe base
    Jack Crawford Te Ni
    Bella Crawford Fi Se
    Bedelia DuMaurier Delta or Gamma Rational
    http://www.imdb.com/title/tt2243973/
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2HW9rtFYsEw

    ** Negativist kind of fits, in the first episode, when he wants to help Will to 'see the cannibals face', he uses the negative to show Will, how the positive looks like.
    Last edited by Nymeria; 08-13-2015 at 03:58 PM.

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    strangeling's Avatar
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    I think I could fall in love with someone like Hannibal; I've got the same fascination that Will Graham's character does. Hannibal brings out something unconscious, yet visceral and real in Will and Will intrigues Hannibal with his imagination. I could see them as duals really, Will as NiFe and Hannibal as SeTi, though Hannibal would be much more SLE-Ti over SLE-Se.

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    Nymeria's Avatar
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    Hannibal and Will draw from the same inner source. I took it in both cases as Ni perception. Subjective rather than Objective. They feel themselves to be rather lone figures in the way how their mind works/they perceive things, but when they encounter each other, Hannibal is the first to sense/recognize the possibility of understanding.

    What he has is pure empathy [...] he can assume your point of view, or mine and maybe some other points of view, that scare him [...] perception is a tool thatís pointed on both ends.
    I think they bond over the fact that perception is borderless and devoid of judgement (good or evil), it just perceives and Will is able to understand/perceive. But then I think they differ in their value judgements and these two facts lay down the fundament for their relationship and the ongoing push and pull, sew saw dynamic. (This is from an episode, where Hannibal is introduced to another psychopath. You could have a overlay in perception and value judgements here, but Hannibal is not interested. ItĎs the difference between both of them, that draws him to Will).

    Talking to Bedelia (his psychiatrist):

    H: For the first time in a long while I see the possibilty of friendship.
    B: So is there someone new in your life.
    H: I meet a man, much like myself, same hobbies, same interest (slaughtering people), same world views, but IĎm not interested in being his friend, Iím curious about him, and that got me curious about friendship.
    B: Who's friendship are you considering?
    H: Oddly enough a colleague and a patient (Will) [...] He is nothing like me, we see the world in different ways, yet he can assume my point of view.
    B: ItĎs nice when someone sees us Hannibal or has the ability to see us, it requires trust. Trust is difficult for you.
    H: You have helped me to better understand, what I want in a friendship and what I donít.
    B: Someone worthy of your friendship.
    H: Yes.
    B: You spent a lot of time building walls Hannibal. Itís natural to want to see if someone is clever enough to climb over them.
     
    "Will is a high profiler at the FBI, but he has a hard time embarrassing all the cases because he's got too much empathy. And, that's where I come into the picture. I'm hired to help him out, to guide him through his job. And, it's like a candy store, of course, for me. I think that the key to the whole relationship is a mind-game thing. Will is a very interesting character for Hannibal. Hannibal finds him very interesting, intriguing. He can mirror himself in him, a younger version, maybe, and it gives him a fantastic opportunity to play around with this young man and maybe even get him on his side without him knowing it. " (Mads Mikkelsen)

    "For us in the story of Hannibal in the first season is really about the friendship, the bromance between Hannibal Lecter and Will Graham. The relationship between Will and Hannibal in this first season is the seduction. It is Hannibal Lecter recognizing in WIl Graham for the first time in anyone that he's ever encountered in his life - the opportunity for a friendship, a real friendship. Because he sees something in WIl Graham that he also sees in himself. They're both unique and they're crazy." (Bryan Fuller)

    "One man is slowly but surely manipulating another man to, maybe the breaking point." (Hugh Dancy)

    "Well, Hannibal is almost the first person, for certainly a very long time, that Will does allow into his life. They are the two smartest people in the room, in the terms of what they both do. The only difference is that Will doesn't know what Hannibal does in his spare time. But, ofcourse, Hannibal has an agenda for Will, he doesn't know about. Hannibal doesn't think he's doing anything cruel or unfair to Will. Or, at the very least, he thinks that with little help, with a little nudging, Will can recognize something about himself. And, if he fully embraced it, fully embraced that darkness, then he could be, I don't know what...A companion, friend, partner to Hannibal. As Will becomes more fragile, more suggestible, Hannibal's methods become darker I guess." (Hugh Dancy)

    "Hannibal has found someone in Will, that Hannibal can be a friend with. Hannibal Lecter doesn't really have friends. And Will Graham, oddly enough, has his own issues. He's a broken man. Adorable, vulnerable, but he's broken. And, so the two do come together. Of course, they don't trust each other. But, it's the manipulation of Hannibal Lecter, to kind of see that he can make this friendship with WiIl, that WiIl should open up. So, it's that transformation of WiIl's character to then drift towards the friendship, and once you get too close Hannibal will bite back, so, we know we're leading up to that. So, it always has that tension of - where is this going and watch out WiIl." (Martha de Laurentiis)

    "Will's not a healthy man. There's something wrong with him. And, I will make sure I can cure that." (Mads Mikkelsen)

    "In the scripts, there is a kind of a bromance between Will and Hannibal, that is quite real, and I believe that Hannibal is quite happy to finally be able to make a friend." (Mads Mikkelsen)

    "Hannibal" executive producer and showrunner Bryan Fuller explained in an interview that Hannibal's feelings for Will Graham (Hugh Dancy) are entirely sincere. He says that Hannibal views Will as a real patient, undergoing a highly unorthodox (you can say that again!) form of therapy. The therapy is intended to turn Will into a murderer -- what Hannibal views as the purest form of something that already exists inside of him -- and an equal. Despite the fact that Will seems to be Hannibal's opposite (hyper-empathetic as opposed to non-empathetic), Fuller suggests that Hannibal feels a real sense of friendship toward Will. Fuller even implies that the tears Hannibal has shed for Will and Abigail Hobbs (Kacey Rohl) are genuine, although perhaps for different reasons than those Hannibal voiced to his own therapist, Dr. Bedelia Du Maurier (Gillian Anderson). Is that even possible?

    "His feeling toward Will Graham are absolutely sincere and genuine. In Hannibalís mind, everything he has done to thwart Willís psyche has been a radical, unorthodox form of therapy. So itís almost bad parenting, in a way, where I want whatís good for my child or the person of my affections, but my point of view on the world is going to greatly determine whether that is actually good for them or if it is actually quite damaging. In Hannibalís mind, everything that he has done to Will Graham and for Will Graham has been to get Will to a place where he can more truthfully see himself and accept what it is he is as an empath, as a human being, as sort of a pure thing in Hannibalís mind. Itís part of the attraction. For Hannibal, he wants an equal of sorts, and Will Graham is in some ways, on the other side of the mirror, a purer soul than Hannibal is, but they have a similar intelligence and they have a similar understanding of the darkness that lies in a manís soul. Hannibalís just trying to convince Will that itís okay to be the way you are. Itís okay to think about killing people. Itís okay to kill people. Those are all the things that Hannibal is just trying to help Will accept about himself, and I think now that weíve crossed this benchmark in their relationship, thatís not going to stop Hannibal from trying to convince Will that he did do these things and he should just accept it." (Bryan Fuller)

    "Will now, of clear mind, is beginning his own seduction of Hannibal Lecter. Hannibal has been working very hard to seduce Will, and now, it's up to Will to seduce Hannibal and perhaps lull him into a false sense of security, so he can ultimately be exposed." (Bryan Fuller)
    The character of Will was what actually made me watch it (I still have to catch up on episodes. I will probably never manage to). Will with his little strays. I wish for some kind of stabilization for Will. Like I wish for some genuine happiness for him, a place away from all the darkness that consumes his mind. I'm afraid it will swallow him whole in the end. I want him away from the clutches of Hannibal. I donít want him near a person who framed him for murder and gutted him. I think in the fight with Hannibal, he will loose sth. important in himself in the end and I donít want him to be broken and driven to his breaking point.
    I want him to come out of all this as the stronger one.
    Last edited by Nymeria; 10-26-2015 at 08:53 AM.

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    I think:

    Will - IEI, Ni subtype
    Lecter - LIE, Ni subtype
    Alana seems alpha, ESI?
    Jack, I'd say beta ST, probably LSI
    Bedelia seems like gamma to me, LIE or ILI
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    strangeling's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nevra View Post
    The character of Will was what actually made me watch it (I still have to catch up on episodes. I will probably never manage to). Will with his little strays. I wish for some kind of stabilization for Will. Like I wish for some genuine happiness for him, a place away from all the darkness that consumes his mind. I'm afraid it will swallow him whole in the end. I want him away from the clutches of Hannibal. I don’t want him near a person who framed him for murder and gutted him. I think in the fight with Hannibal, he will loose sth. important in himself in the end and I don’t want him to be broken and driven to his breaking point. I want him to come out of all this as the stronger one.
     

    I don't think Will minds the violence though. Chiyoh said it was what he understood before she threw him off the train. It's kind of funny, Will has been gutted, had his skull partially cut open (and was most likely going to eat him), been victim to encephalitis, and framed for murder all by Hannibal, but he still finds him interesting. He doesn't hate Hannibal for all that he's done; he finds him interesting and intriguing, just as Hannibal does Will. Didn't Will also kill the serial killer that wanted to be an animal and cut up his body and put it on the bones of a beast? Supposedly, duals are described this way where they do things (sometimes to each other) that another person might see as awful and unforgivable, yet the duals don't give it any serious thought.

    But uh, Will and Hannibal are pretty similar in their ideas of morality (or lack thereof) and violence, but different in unique ways. Will said he told Hannibal Jack was coming because he thought of Hannibal as his friend. Will is learning more about himself from Hannibal and Hannibal sees Will as a friend, someone that saw through his psychological barriers and yet appreciates him for what he is; he's fascinated with Will and his worthy intelligence. But Hannibal delights in the darkness, while Will said he "tolerates" it. Would anyone argue against Will being much more a victim and Hannibal a more natural aggressor? He is the one egging Will on to his dark world.

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    Nymeria's Avatar
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    I need to watch Season 3. I'll come back to this, if I have some thoughts.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nymeria View Post
    Will Graham Ni Fe
    Hannibal Lecter Ni Te**
    Alana Bloom Fe base
    Jack Crawford Te Ni
    Bella Crawford Fi Se
    Bedelia DuMaurier Delta or Gamma Rational
    http://www.imdb.com/title/tt2243973/
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2HW9rtFYsEw

    ** Negativist kind of fits, in the first episode, when he wants to help Will to 'see the cannibals face', he uses the negative to show Will, how the positive looks like.
    Quote Originally Posted by Fay View Post
    I think:

    Will - IEI, Ni subtype
    Lecter - LIE, Ni subtype
    Alana seems alpha, ESI?
    Jack, I'd say beta ST, probably LSI
    Bedelia seems like gamma to me, LIE or ILI
    I can't see Hannibal as Ni type at all. He is down-to-earth, very practical and is very sensitive about sensations, aesthetics and actively searching for them without being clumsy or uncomfortable. Ni-types; especially LIEs and EIEs have Si-PoLR, whereas Hannibal is handling this function perfectly well; if not obsessed with it. He pays an awful lot of attention to clothes, exquisite wine, food preparation, artistic goods, has an acute sense of smell, his fussy yet graceful presentation, etc. that is Si to its finest. I think ILIs and LIEs don't care this much about them. He immensely dislikes rudeness and has an impeccable mannerism, and that strikes me as Fi-seeking, regardless how superficial his smile and his kindness to people, just out of his sense of decency. He is interested in Will's ability to uncover people's motive and can think like anybody else; because Hannibal, like all SLIs, loves it when someone notice their hidden talents, understand about who they really are; it's flattering to them without feeling being mentally invaded and harassed. They crave Ne as a good perception tool for inquiries and digging. I'm aware that people generally appreciate a good understanding, but Ne-seeking types take it to different levels. Anyway, it's highly likely that Hannibal is a caregiver, and he is SLI dominant.

    I see Will Graham as EII, maybe kind of harmonizing subtype. As long as I remember, he never elegantly states his Fe (like IEIs and EIEs), just between awkward and self-deprecating (his whole affair with Alana, for example). He is hoarding dogs not only because he loves them, but also feels responsible for their life; his heart is for the weaker subjects. He was like that to Abigail; he was dismissive to the probability of her as an accessory to her father's crime. He prefers his feeling to cold logic. Some of EIIs may also prefer to live in social isolation, may also develop Avoidant Personality Disorder. For me, Will Graham is HSP (Hyper Sensitive Person), and very likely also has LLI (Low Latent Inhibition). Anyway, it's safe to say that he is EII. My junior is also EII; she is a hoarder of stray kittens and has a good imagination.

    Jack is LSI. Domineering and demanding (Season 1 and 2), but a bit soften in Season 3. Goal-oriented, objective, and unmovable.

    Sorry for bad grammar, I'm not a native English speaker. Also, I'm new to this typing business and I'm open to a good discussion. Hannibal is an excellent show (though a bit slow in plot lines), it's nice to talk about them.
    I'm not a native English speaker. I apologise for any grammatical mistake, and feedback/correction is always welcome!

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    The Troll Slayer Hitta's Avatar
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    you are all disgracing this amazing show with socionics
    Model X Will Save Us!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hitta View Post
    you are all disgracing this amazing show with socionics
    it got canceled. 0.o

    whyohwhy

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    Will Graham IEI
    Hannibal Lecter ILI
    Alana Bloom EIE
    Jack Crawford LSE
    Bedelia DuMaurier ILI
    Abigail Hobbs SEI
    Abel Gideon ILE
    Mason Verger ILE
    Margot Verger LSI

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