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Thread: 2015 Type Galen Thread

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    when you see the booty Galen's Avatar
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    Default 2015 Type Galen Thread

    It's midnight somewhere, close enough

    Do the thing, make the type, let your soul be freeeeee
    "And above all, watch with glittering eyes the whole world around you because the greatest secrets are always hidden in the most unlikely places. Those who don't believe in magic will never find it." -Roald Dahl

    http://forum.socionix.com/
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    when you see the booty Galen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    I'm starting to really suspect you may be LIE. I think you vibe similarly to other LIEs in the apathetic, 'screw everyone' fashion. You can talk candidly about your feelings which I see other LIEs as very capable of doing, which may have been misinterpreted as Fi ego this whole time. You seem similar in my mind to Ashton and @Narc, and I see you as vibing like them in a way.
    I think my affected presence is markedly different from that of other LIEs on here. I don't know if you've seen me on cam, but you can compare me to FDG or mfckr and the difference should be apparent.

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    It seems like your values are diametrically opposed to Alpha as opposed to being opposed to Beta (lots of opposing, hope that sentence makes sense ). Basically I think Gamma makes more sense for you than Delta.
    "Diametrically" is a rather strong word to describe the differences. I don't feel totally opposed to alphahood, and I don't see how you'd think so.

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    You seem to not like Deltas as much and dismiss them as being nonsensical (more than I'd expect towards others in your own quadra) yet you seem able to relate and 'get along' with Betas more lackadaisically than I would expect from a Delta who would conflict more. You seem to loathe Alpha lightheartedness, and my personality/disposition in general (which is why I find it hysterical that you were suggested to be my identical).
    There are people on here from all quadras who I get on with just fine. The inverse is also true. Most of my interactions on here are with sx > so types anyway, so the divide b/w "you're cool" and "get out of the face" is drawn pretty distinctly there.

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    I even can picture you reading this post of mine and just dismissing the entire thing as 'preposterous' in a typical Gamma NT way.
    Being smarter than you isn't type related.

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    I know you said that you were 'basically the same person' as @Radio in chat the other day. You said that if he's ESI, then you would be ESI too. Well, I think ESI might be *possible* for you still, but I think it's likely that Radio is ESI and you're LIE and you two are duals. Being duals could explain the connection you feel with being virtually the same person, without socionically being identicals.
    Radio as ESI is weird. I have no issue with him as EII.

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    The way you joke also reminds me of @Capitalist Pig. I agree with Cpiggy's self-typing of ILI. He vibes in a way of knowing what he likes, what he doesn't like, and 'screw you' if you don't like it. I don't think you exhibit quite as much Ni, Galen, or raw criticism as he does. But the perpetual Gamma NT state of apathy and not giving a fuck and happily doing your own thing and not caring what others think is very much your style.
    Sounds vaguely so-last really. I don't see Gamma NTs as apathetic as much as divorced from reality in some way. Everything is translated through the cognitive faculties, and it leaves little room for being physically present. I can see how that can come off as apathetic to an alpha SF like yourself though.

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    So please consider Gamma NT, LIE>ILI. I think you come across differently than the Delta NFs, especially the IEEs.
    Agreed with this for the most part. Seems mostly instinct related though. I relate pretty well to Radio and Agarina. The others are so > sx demon hell-spawn.

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    There's not nearly as much zest and enthusiasm for you to explore new ideas. You come across differently in my eyes compared to Refi, Kim, anndelise, etc. etc. you get the point.
    Depends on if the idea shows promise or not. If there's no evidence for engaging progression and expansion in something then I lose interest pretty easily.

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    The intuitive perception of information might actually be explained by a raw LIE honesty for how thoughts are being generated, and you may be dissecting them with your Ni all the time.
    ¿¿¿I have no idea what this means???

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    This could have been wrongly attributed to Ne whilst the whole time it may have been Te/Ni. You seem to think systematically, candidly. Very cryptically, like Narc whom I mentioned already.
    Whatever systematic thought processes I seem to demonstrate are the result of a fair amount of raw mental effort. It doesn't come as fluidly to me as you may think.

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    Have you given serious thought to LIE before?
    When I first discovered the system I consistently forgot that LIEs existed.

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    Can't say I do, mostly because Te != work. My ESE dad is one of the most diligent workers I know.

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    You even come across like the victim Romantic style, imo, And you VI similar to some of the Russian LIE portraits. This post is getting long enough already though.
    Haven't looked at romantic styles for quite a while, but I definitely don't relate to the victim descriptions. Se types bewilder me with their penchant for taking what I say too literally, I can't imagine being 'dualized' by one.
    "And above all, watch with glittering eyes the whole world around you because the greatest secrets are always hidden in the most unlikely places. Those who don't believe in magic will never find it." -Roald Dahl

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    escaping anndelise's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Galen View Post
    It's midnight somewhere, close enough

    Do the thing, make the type, let your soul be freeeeee
    E6w5 so-last; delta NF.

    Whew...my soul feels sooo freeee now. How weird.
    IEE 649 sx/sp cp

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    2 EVIL I golden's Avatar
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    Your self-typings have always fit you, imo. You're one of the broody, darkerDeltas, which I'm kind of a sucker for actually. And to me you epitomize EP physically.

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    ■■■■■■ Radio's Avatar
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    i'm happy i still have the ability to surprise people by saying stupid shit.

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    when you see the booty Galen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Radio View Post
    i'm happy i still have the ability to surprise people by saying stupid shit.
    dude hurry up and choke me already ffs
    "And above all, watch with glittering eyes the whole world around you because the greatest secrets are always hidden in the most unlikely places. Those who don't believe in magic will never find it." -Roald Dahl

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    Hmmm, now you got me wondering if you are referring to the introverted or extraverted type of choking...

    "When I ought to be thinking of heaven he will nail me to earth"

     







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    when you see the booty Galen's Avatar
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    I was not aware there was a difference. Do enlighten.
    "And above all, watch with glittering eyes the whole world around you because the greatest secrets are always hidden in the most unlikely places. Those who don't believe in magic will never find it." -Roald Dahl

    http://forum.socionix.com/
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    Quote Originally Posted by Galen View Post
    I was not aware there was a difference. Do enlighten.
    Um, one involves more control over the gag reflex (introverted). The other may cause temporary (hopefully) loss of consciousness (extraverted).

    I am on cold meds...don't judge me!

    "When I ought to be thinking of heaven he will nail me to earth"

     







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    when you see the booty Galen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aylen View Post
    Um, one involves more control over the gag reflex (introverted). The other may cause temporary (hopefully) loss of consciousness (extraverted).

    I am on cold meds...don't judge me!
    I have a very sensitive gag reflex and am prone to wooziness. What type does that make me?
    "And above all, watch with glittering eyes the whole world around you because the greatest secrets are always hidden in the most unlikely places. Those who don't believe in magic will never find it." -Roald Dahl

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    Quote Originally Posted by Galen View Post
    I have a very sensitive gag reflex and am prone to wooziness. What type does that make me?
    Same... I guess your type will remain a mystery, for now.

    "When I ought to be thinking of heaven he will nail me to earth"

     







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    Quote Originally Posted by Galen View Post
    Being smarter than you isn't type related.
    Agreed with this for the most part. Seems mostly instinct related though. I relate pretty well to Radio and Agarina. The others are so > sx demon hell-spawn.
    Kindly get the fuck over yourself?
    “Let us forget with generosity those who cannot love us”
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    Quote Originally Posted by Galen View Post
    I have a very sensitive gag reflex and am prone to wooziness. What type does that make me?
    The human type.

    Enneagram: 9w1 6w5 2w3 so/sx

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    Creepy-male

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    You're a passive aggressive prick in a way that only an IEE could be.

    edit: If any other type, then Delta whatever -- probably not EII, though...you seem like a repressed and constipated HandiAce -- for the record: the statement above does not apply to HA.
    Last edited by male; 01-05-2015 at 07:44 PM.

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    What types are you looking at for yourself?

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    This will sound ridiculous, but from the limited interaction we have, you always seem like you have Fe-PoLR and like Fe makes you physically sick. In the same cynical sarcastic ILI way like Cpig does.

    I dunno, I don't have anything close to such experience with any other person I type IEE irl. They're usually very look on the bright side, excessively charming, sunshiny people, so much so they seem Fe ego often, so I'm confused how can you be so different.

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    both sides, now wacey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by McBain View Post
    You're a passive aggressive prick in a way that only an IEE could be.

    edit: If any other type, then Delta whatever -- probably not EII, though...you seem like a repressed and constipated HandiAce.
    What the heck happened to you?
    "If this to end in fire, then we should all burn together. Watch the flames climb higher into the night."

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    Quote Originally Posted by darya View Post
    This will sound ridiculous, but from the limited interaction we have, you always seem like you have Fe-PoLR and like Fe makes you physically sick. In the same cynical sarcastic ILI way like Cpig does.

    I dunno, I don't have anything close to such experience with any other person I type IEE irl. They're usually very look on the bright side, excessively charming, sunshiny people, so much so they seem Fe ego often, so I'm confused how can you be so different.
    Can't we just blame it all on enneagram and call it a day?

    "When I ought to be thinking of heaven he will nail me to earth"

     







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    Quote Originally Posted by Aylen View Post
    Can't we just blame it all on enneagram and call it a day?
    I have a hard time seeing how the enneagram would account for that degree of disdain for your identicals/quadra.
    “Let us forget with generosity those who cannot love us”
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kim View Post
    I have a hard time seeing how the enneagram would account for that degree of disdain for your identicals/quadra.
    My joke to Darya went

    I actually did not know that he had disdain for his identicals until this thread.

    "When I ought to be thinking of heaven he will nail me to earth"

     







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    when you see the booty Galen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kim View Post
    I have a hard time seeing how the enneagram would account for that degree of disdain for your identicals/quadra.
    Because enneagram instincts is by and large more telling of how naturally two people will interact.

    Let me be clear, I do not hate IEEs by default. I don't hate any type by default.
    "And above all, watch with glittering eyes the whole world around you because the greatest secrets are always hidden in the most unlikely places. Those who don't believe in magic will never find it." -Roald Dahl

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aylen View Post
    My joke to Darya went
    Haha, sorry!
    “Let us forget with generosity those who cannot love us”
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    Quote Originally Posted by Galen View Post
    Because enneagram instincts is by and large more telling of how naturally two people will interact.

    Let me be clear, I do not hate IEEs by default. I don't hate any type by default.
    I am still convinced that you cannot accurately determine instinct stackings without actively engaging with a person. Reading posts is not enough imho. /sidenote
    “Let us forget with generosity those who cannot love us”
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    escaping anndelise's Avatar
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    I do think that enneagram fixations have a significant impact on a person,s interactions/views of others.
    Socionics is about processing TYPES of information, not specific content. Socionics doesn't cover motivations, experiences, actual values, etc that influence the actual content.

    TLDR summary at the bottom in bold.

    Enneagram helps differentiate between IEEs that are fixated on avoiding the pains of
    * irritations and frustrations
    * separation distress
    * apprehensive uncertainty

    Enneagram also helps explain different responses of approach/avoid/attack (or fight/flight/freeze/appease).

    And of course differences in the instinct stackings involved with
    * preserving self
    * transmitting/receiving (connecting)
    * building a social support network


    Basically, it's one thing to compare an IEE to another IEE based on amount of Ne, Se, Te, Fe, etc types of info.
    But it's a whole different story to compare an IEE to another IEE based on stress fixations and responses (enneagram) which have nothing to do with socionics info types.


    I've never viewed Galen as disdaining other IEE. I don't see him as being disgusted by Fe, either.
    I DO see him as having a stress fixation regarding uncertainty, with responses of avoidance and some attack (to overcome the uncertainty and/or wrong-filled information).
    I see him spending quite a bit of time to resolve his uncertainties, studying more, garnering more information, etc.
    He has anxieties over making meaningful connections with others, and has a sense of self preservation about it too.
    It would be natural for his sense of self preserving to be at odds with other people's desire to build themselves social support networks. Not just HIS conflicts, but SP vs SO conflicts. This isn't him being anti-Fe, it's him being SO last.

    I also see Galen as having a keen awareness of the pains of being IEE as well. That IEE aren't special little roses who can do no wrong, or who must always be positive, etc etc. Ne makes the anxiety fixation worse. Which can make the avoidance response more prominent as well. I see him mocking these negative aspects of NeFi, not in terms of mocking other NeFi for being NeFi, but more like mocking himself. Being aware of the negative aspects of NeFi within himself.

    TLDR:
    How about people stop trying to compare Galen with other IEE based on stress fixations/responses.
    Stop trying to compare his SP with others' SO.
    Stop trying to compare his anxiety fixations with others' image fixations.
    Stop trying to compare his avoidance responses with others' approach responses.
    And focus instead on whether or not he himself prefers NeFiTeSi types of info.
    IEE 649 sx/sp cp

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    when you see the booty Galen's Avatar
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    ^ Why can I not like a post twelve consecutive times?
    "And above all, watch with glittering eyes the whole world around you because the greatest secrets are always hidden in the most unlikely places. Those who don't believe in magic will never find it." -Roald Dahl

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kim View Post
    I am still convinced that you cannot accurately determine instinct stackings without actively engaging with a person. Reading posts is not enough imho. /sidenote
    But instinct stackings, fixations, and responses are still more telling of how two people will interact.
    Reading/writing posts in a forum is different than informal communications in a more casual context.

    Socionics only covers types of info, and something like how misscommunications and misunderstandings can occur when two different people are focusing on different TYPES of information. But Socionics doesn't cover the experiences, values, beliefs, education, etc which make up the actual content, and thus results, of the info processing. These latter things are more likely to influence how two people will actually interact, where they might agree and disagree, etc.

    Think about it, we know that duality doesn't mean perfection, as there is still the personality issues, experiences, hopes/dreams, stressors, and stress responses that can interfere. This doesn't just influence duality, but identicals as well. It's part of how an IEE can have a sucky relationship with an SLI, a good long term relationship with an SLE, a friendship with an LSI, ESE, and even a possible future with an ILE.
    IEE 649 sx/sp cp

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    when you see the booty Galen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by anndelise View Post
    I've never viewed Galen as disdaining other IEE. I don't see him as being disgusted by Fe, either.
    I DO see him as having a stress fixation regarding uncertainty, with responses of avoidance and some attack (to overcome the uncertainty and/or wrong-filled information).
    I see him spending quite a bit of time to resolve his uncertainties, studying more, garnering more information, etc.
    This sounds pretty accurate. As should be well evinced by now, I have a knee-jerk aversion to what I see as poor argument and I'll viscerally seek to eradicate it. Dispersion of shitty information gets my goat, as with yours.

    Quote Originally Posted by anndelise View Post
    He has anxieties over making meaningful connections with others, and has a sense of self preservation about it too.
    I'm inclined to agree, but I do wonder how apparent that comes off in my communications here.

    Quote Originally Posted by anndelise View Post
    IIt would be natural for his sense of self preserving to be at odds with other people's desire to build themselves social support networks. Not just HIS conflicts, but SP vs SO conflicts. This isn't him being anti-Fe, it's him being SO last.
    I'm not sure the issue here is conflating Fe with So-first; unless it really is a common Social trope to be outwardly engaging and "let's join hands and sing Kumbaya" blah blah.

    It is always really uncomfortable to have people reach out their hand and welcome me to themselves without either of us having a sense of who the other is. "I will accept you" when they don't know what there is to accept about me in the first place. Like we haven't learned anything about each other's characters to trust the other person, so why would we start now? Probably also E6 related.

    Quote Originally Posted by anndelise View Post
    II also see Galen as having a keen awareness of the pains of being IEE as well. That IEE aren't special little roses who can do no wrong, or who must always be positive, etc etc. Ne makes the anxiety fixation worse. Which can make the avoidance response more prominent as well. I see him mocking these negative aspects of NeFi, not in terms of mocking other NeFi for being NeFi, but more like mocking himself. Being aware of the negative aspects of NeFi within himself.
    Eh, I'm not really fixated on my presence as IEE in that way. Some good chunk of it may be a latent association between being IEE and femininininity that I'm secretly trying to distance myself from. That feels terrible to say but that's kinda what's happening I think.
    "And above all, watch with glittering eyes the whole world around you because the greatest secrets are always hidden in the most unlikely places. Those who don't believe in magic will never find it." -Roald Dahl

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    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    Socionics DOES cover motivations. I think you need to read up on, ann, on the Hidden Agendas.
    no it doesn't, you seem to not understand the term "motivation" or the hidden-agenda function or it's place in the psyche. either way, slim pickings. this lends zero weight to your argument since HA "motivations" are pretty suspect to begin with.

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    I think the differences between Galen and other IEEs outweighs enneagram differences or instincts and can be defined socionically. If you have any examples, ann, I am curious.
    and how many male IEEs did you compare Galen to, out of curiosity?

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    Regarding the 'you never viewed Galen as disdaining other IEE', where have you been? Just in this thread he called them "demon hell-spawn". I really think your perceptions are off, ann.
    inside joke. also he called so > sx demon hellspawn, not IEEs. either way, omfg, inside joke.

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    Regarding Galen's 'anxiety about making meaningful connections with others', if you read my link about Hidden Agenda/ PoLR, you might see that it sounds more typical of Gamma NT as opposed to IEE. I don't see IEEs as having anxiety making meaningful connections with others at all, since they are usually great in the realm of people relationships. Galen actually exhibits behavior of Fe-PoLR similar to Cpig. He hasn't responded kindly to my posts so far but seems to have curled up as if emotionally offended that I didn't go along with his glorious self-typing. Also check out http://en.socionics.ru/index.php?opt...251&Itemid=139 which is an article on PoLR from the Socionics Institute. Fe PoLR is described as "Bursts of emotions, offences, obtrusion of one’s emotional experience" while Ti PoLR is described as "Discussing matters of logical contradictions, reproaching with misunderstanding, showing one’s erudition". I can easily see you, ann, as being IEE, as you're trying to reconcile the differences in perceived information but don't notice the inconsistencies. Galen I can see exhibiting Se HA from my 1st link, where he's trying to show how "brave and confrontational" he is, especially shown by his comments about being 'smarter' and seeing others as "demon hell-spawn". In fact, I have NEVER seen an IEE, when attacked and forced to defend themselves, resolve an argument with Ti-PoLR by saying they are simply "smarter" than someone else. That also seems much more typical of Gamma NT or another type than a cheery or perceptive IEE.
    blah blah blah blah you can rationalize anything if you bullshit enough reasons out of thin air.

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    If you love enneagram so much and think it better describes and explains interactions with people than socionics, please kindly leave the socionics forum.
    WILLIAM WOULD LIKE YOU TO LEAVE THE FORUM ANN, HOW DARE YOU BE CRITICAL OF SOCIONICS

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    @William
    This post covers your reasons given for LIE in your posts #13 and 15. I will get to your post to me later.


    * he VIs like some of the russian LIE portraits. ((VI? Seriously?))

    * you see him as coming across like the victim romantic style. ((How so?))

    * Galen said he and Radio were "basically the same person", and you think that must mean socionics, and also must mean identicals or duals; and since you type Radio as ESI, that 'must' make Galen ESI/LIE.

    * you don't see him as having zest and enthusiasm for exploring new ideas ((yet you're the one emphatically trying to curtail his interest in also using enneagram in typings rather than limiting himself to just socionics; we can also easily dismiss his other hobbies and interests as well, I suppose. I mean his zest for dance games, creating music, other theories, etc is just so...mundane.))

    * talks candidly about his feelings like other LIE do ((which LIE have written about their angst? When has Ashton, FDG, Narc, etc ever written a post like the one Galen did regarding The Lion King?))
    ((and what about IEE who have also talked candidly about their feelings and angsts? Are they to be retyped too?))

    * he comes across differently from Refi ((who openly admits to using a persona on this forum)) and the female IEEs ((are we to ignore life experiences like gender, age, and sexuality, too? I mean seriously, how in the world could a mid-20's homosexual male be sooo different from heterosexual females over 35yo??))

    * apathetic, 'screw everyone' fashion
    * he doesn't engage in lighthearted discussions like Alphas do ((he's not Alpha)), or even Deltas sometimes. He has a darker, more serious tone, and you rarely see him being lighthearted and playful. ((We'll conveniently ignore instances like how the beginning of this very 2015 type thread started out as playful and lighthearted.))

    * perpetual state of apathy and not giving a fuck and happily doing his own thing and not caring what others think ((as opposed to being ...what...hyper-emotional, people pleasing, image focused, unable to just do their own thing because "OMG WHAT would people THINK???" IEE? ))

    * he has intuitive perception of information which you think might be explained by his raw honesty for how thoughts are being generated, and his dissecting them all the time.
    * he thinks systematically, candidly, and cryptically.
    * would probably dismiss your post as 'preposterous'.
    ((So, you think his thinking process is systematic, candid, cryptic, demonstrates raw honesty for how thoughts are generated, and dissects them....and that that kind of thinking ability would so easily dismiss your post as 'preposterous'. Um, do you realize that you had put down your own thinking ability?))


    Also regarding post 15:
    Quote Originally Posted by William
    So you 'get on' 'just fine' with most people, then why are you even concerned with a type-me thread?
    What does ability to get along with most people have to do with him making a type thread? Is this suggesting that the reason why you've made all those type threads for yourself was because you don't 'get on' 'just fine' with most people? Is that the only reason for doing a type me thread?


    Quote Originally Posted by William
    In most EII type descriptions I find, they abhor any sort of violence or aggression, because of Se PoLR. He often exerts his will and his opinion against others in a manner that Se dominants do.
    What do you type Maritsa as?
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    Second Part, finally.
    @William
    I write with barely 2-3 inches of text showing at a time, so I do have to multiquote cuz I'm two fingering all this and am not going to add a shitload of scrolling and place refinding to that. Suck it. (oh wait, this might be an example of an IEE not giving a fuck and happily doing her own thing?? Blasphemy!)


    Quote Originally Posted by William
    Socionics DOES cover motivations. I think you need to read up on, ann, on the Hidden Agendas.
    For starters, the hidden agenda is vital, not mental. It activates the base, feeds it, mobilizes it into action, but isn't a conscious drive. If Galen were demonstrating Se HA, we would be seeing an activation and mobilization of his supposed Te base. He would probably now be expounding on all sorts of Te shit, in an attempt to overwhelm his opponent with a bunch of big words, complex sentences, and sheer crappage. (Like Ashton does. )I'm not seeing that happening.

    What I AM seeing is Se Role, combined with a who f'n cares about William attitude. Which IS in the mental ring, and requires a certain amount of stress/irritation to get there.


    BTW, in the link you have, of Expat's interpretations of Hidden Agendas, there was a link to a thread about IEEs Te HA. http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...-hidden-agenda

    In it, Galen wrote:
    Quote Originally Posted by Galen
    For me, Te HA manifests as a strong push towards precision in verbal and written coherency. When trying to convey a serious observation or hypothesis, I make sure that my ideas are conveyed in as exact a way to my original interpretation as possible. When I'm not in the flow of things this get awfully draining though, as I have to force myself to stay focused and push onward. I also have immense appreciation for people who are able to do the same, when the ideas they have just spill out so naturally and with such verbal precision. Even now I'm struggling to come up with more specific examples of what I'm trying to describe, but I continue to push myself for the sake of self-betterment. In this way I don't really seek ways in which I can be more "efficient" with my activities, as the popular dogma would have you believe; rather, I find myself seeking greater clarity and depth in how one conveys his/her ideas, as opposed to summing things up under an arch of generalizations.
    I think this is a damned good description of IEE Te HA.


    Quote Originally Posted by William
    I agree that there is a variation of types that should be accounted for, and people's experiences affect the "actual content", but as I analyzed in post #15 of this thread, which is still unanswered, I think the differences between Galen and other IEEs outweighs enneagram differences or instincts and can be defined socionically. If you have any examples, ann, I am curious.
    In my prior post to this one, I addressed such "differences". Also, see above about Se Role and his description of IEE Te HA. Sorry about the two postings, but limited space and limited brain tonight for juggling it all at once.


    Quote Originally Posted by William
    Regarding the 'you never viewed Galen as disdaining other IEE', where have you been? Just in this thread he called them "demon hell-spawn". I really think your perceptions are off, ann.
    Please show me times before this thread where he has shown disdain for IEE in a totally serious non-joking manner.
    I've seen him do similar things regarding e6s, of which he self types as, as well.
    Also, I'm sure he was referring to IEE-SOs, which fits with the joking conversation I read in the chatbox earlier this evening.. Whether it came from that conversation or another one, it does seem to be one of his 'things'.
    Also, Radio says inside joke. You know...a 'thing'.


    Quote Originally Posted by William
    Regarding Galen's 'anxiety about making meaningful connections with others', if you read my link about Hidden Agenda/ PoLR, you might see that it sounds more typical of Gamma NT as opposed to IEE. I don't see IEEs as having anxiety making meaningful connections with others at all, since they are usually great in the realm of people relationships.
    Sit down and have a real conversation with any IEE, and you'll soon learn that it's truly not uncommon for IEE to be neurotic about their relationships with other people. See, Ne-HP really has a way of fucking with one's perceptions. For every positive, sure thing, there's two or more unsure things tagging along with it. We can't help but turn things around, see them from differing lights. And it's pretty much guaranteed that not all of those lights are positive ones. If you ever got involved with an IEE, it wouldn't be long before the neuroticness would start to appear.

    Add in enneagram's Anxiety/Head Center, and you've really got a mess to deal with. Oh...wait...sorry, I forgot I'm supposed to be LIMITING my ideas and understandings for you.


    Quote Originally Posted by William
    Galen actually exhibits behavior of Fe-PoLR similar to Cpig.
    Not seeing it.


    Not quoting the whole paragraph here, just the best parts, lol.
    Quote Originally Posted by William
    He hasn't responded kindly to my posts so far but seems to have curled up as if emotionally offended that I didn't go along with his glorious self-typing.
    Galen I can see exhibiting Se HA from my 1st link, where he's trying to show how "brave and confrontational" he is, especially shown by his comments about being 'smarter' and seeing others as "demon hell-spawn".

    First, typing one's self as IEE isn't glorious. It has way too much neurosis that goes with being IEE.

    Secondly, Do you seriously think that you have that much of an affect on him? To make him curl up at your 'weak-Fe'. At your supposed Fe-HA of "trying to show how popular and liked by the crowd you are, but are actually making yourself look like an ass"?

    Which is it, William? Are you Fe base and polr hitting him, making him curl up because you, personally, William the Great, don't support his self-typing? Or are you merely Fe-HA making yourself look like an ass?

    Also, talk about contradictions. One minute you're claiming he's curling up at your supposed weak-Fe, the next that he's "trying to show how "brave and confrontational" he is". Which is it? Is he cringing away at your mighty Fe or puffing his chest up in confrontational stance? Make up your mind. Is it Fe polr you're 'seeing', or is it Se HA? You can't even keep it straight in your own mind, in the SAME freaking paragraph!!

    I can easily see you, ann, as being IEE, as you're trying to reconcile the differences in perceived information but don't notice the inconsistencies.
    Then you totally SUCK as an ILE, cuz a Ti-Polr IEE can see your inconsistencies a mile away. (See the above as a reminder.)


    In fact, I have NEVER seen an IEE, when attacked and forced to defend themselves, resolve an argument with Ti-PoLR by saying they are simply "smarter" than someone else. That also seems much more typical of Gamma NT or another type than a cheery or perceptive IEE.
    You've never seen an IEE suggest that they are smarter than you? Can you truly not read between the lines? I've told you numerous times, in varying threads, just not in such abrupt words. Seriously, look above, I told a supposed ILE that I can see his dumbass inconsisencies from a mile away.

    Oh..you said resolve it. Well, yeah. It wouldn't resolve an argument very well. But that's not to say an IEE wouldn't say such a thing.

    And ffs, Ne base with Fi creative, does NOT mean "cheery and perceptive". Nor does it mean they don't have their Se role moments.

    -----
    Quote Originally Posted by William
    If you love enneagram so much and think it better describes and explains interactions with people than socionics, please kindly leave the socionics forum. Until then, stop using it as a crutch to dismiss any socionics inconsistencies pointed out.
    If you can't handle alternative ideas, alternative theories, alternative understandings, or other legitimate possibilities, etc, then please kindly drop the Ne base from your typing.


    Quote Originally Posted by William
    I will add my usual disclaimer and say I can still be wrong in my analysis. Perhaps Galen is a ridiculously unique IEE.
    He's not 'a ridiculously unique IEE'. You've just got ridiculously unique inconsistencies in your arguments.


    Quote Originally Posted by William
    But more importantly - what I hate most - is people who disagree with someone else's socionics analysis/posts by saying 'no, no, that's because of enneagram'. It's a cowardly way to construct an argument, is it not?
    No, it's not. It's typical for NFs to have numerous theories about people.
    It's also typical of NeFi to have varying ideas of what all might be influencing the differences between people, and how two people are interacting.

    @Galen, stop being so IEE for William, it's agitating him.


    Quote Originally Posted by William
    I could easily dismiss someone else's entire socionics analysis by saying 'no no, that's because of enneagram' - but that wouldn't really lead to fruitful socionics discussion, would it? How can any intelligent socionics discussion be generated if anytime functional definitions and IE are discussed, people just point to enneagram out of - laziness? - of constructing an answer with socionics?
    How can any meaningful discussion about actual people and their actual relationships be generated if you insist on blocking out all other ideas/theories/possibilities?
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    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    Whiny in a way to attract attention from aggressors.
    You think aggressors are romantically attracted to whining?
    Wouldn't whining be more of a caregiver attractor?

    Interest in current things already known does not = zest and enthusiasm for exploring new ideas. Ne I see as more open to the opinions and perspectives of others. Even if they disagree - take for example your willingness to even type out your response, even if you disagree with me. Every type will have NTR interests such as dance games, creating music, other theories, etc. That doesn't mean functionally the person is exhibiting Ne.
    Creating music is a continuous development thing, not something one learns once and is done. There's always new things to explore when creating music.

    Do you have a link to the post you are referring to?
    I'll look for it. While you look for posts from Ashton, fdg, or Narc that demonstrate the candid sharing you say exists.

    Coming across differently to IEEs could be interpreted as evidence that he's NOT IEE. Or considering your perspective that it's based on other factors in his life, his sexuality, his gender, age, etc. - technically every singe one of us on this form 'comes across' slightly differently - that's why I think it's best to type by function. How do you define Ne & Fi, ann? How do you see Galen using them?
    Except you weren't totally typing by function now, were you. There was an awful lot of vibe talk in your posts. Even a touch of VI.

    I'm not retyping socionics for you. Go to my blog and you'll see my views on the elements there.
    The rest is worthless to type more than i've already done for you.

    It's not that it's ignored - every type can exhibit 'playfulness'. It's the degree and nature and pattern of their playfulness which should be taken into account. One instance of borderline attention-seeking / narcissism is not evidence of a single type. Again, impressions like these steer away from the definitions of the functions and how information is interpreted.
    Hmm, interesting, all those typing threads you did for yourself were borderline attention-seeking/narcissism eh?

    I'd like to hear how you define Ne & Fi. Not all IEEs are the same. Your stereotype you impose is not true for all IEEs. I'll give an example - Simon Small or w/e his name was who used to be active, I believe is a male IEE who is NOT cheery. This blows apart any bias you think I have.
    And yet you wrote elsewhere in this thread about Galen's difference to "cheery and perceptive" IEE.

    No. That's definitely more typical of Galen. Do you care to provide an explanation why you think this is more typical of me?
    Reread what i said, you obviously either didn't understand it, or are pretending you didn't.

    No. But I still haven't heard Galen's official answers to my questions. I think I already have heard them though. Like woof said, drama and type-masquerading, too much for me at least.
    I'm pretty sure he already hinted he wouldn't, in one of his responses to you, something to the effect of if he couldn't see something going anywhere, then he wouldn't bother wasting his time/energy on it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    It's a strong word but I think it's accurate. I don't see you engaging in much lighthearted discussion like Alphas do, or even Deltas sometimes. You seem to have a darker more serious tone and I rarely see you being lighthearted and playful.
    maybe I've been super playful this whole time but you're just casually misinterpreting it as me holding serious sentiments that are in actuality mere exaggerations

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    So how you interact with anyone else shouldn't be a deciding factor?
    Sure it's a deciding factor. There are different qualities you look for in different styles of interaction, some of which that are relevant and some that aren't.

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    So the corollary that your anecdotal evidence that your type has to be compatible with Radio shouldn't be considered?
    Sure it should. Why would you say otherwise?

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    So you 'get on' 'just fine' with most people, then why are you even concerned with a type-me thread?
    Where did I say I get on fine with "most people?"

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    (I'm also not a fan with dismissing any socionics patterns or discussion with 'OH THAT'S BECAUSE OF ENNEAGRAM'. I think it's a crutch when things can't be explained socionically)
    This is because you're a blind socionics fanboy without any substantive independent thought on the matter.

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    Lol? Not sure why you even bring up intelligence. Perhaps you feel threatened by me in a way. At least enough to try to put me down. I'm very smart, thank you
    Hah, not too long ago @Narc and I were talking about how saying "I'm intelligent" automatically puts someone into "I'm actually a moron" by default.

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    But how that relates to the point I made about how you might dismiss this perspective - I'd like to point out that dismissing something and being wrong are NOT mutually exclusive. You can think I'm wrong and believe I'm wrong 100%, but that doesn't actually mean that you're right.
    You can dismiss a terrible idea and not be in someone's conflicting quadra. Sturgeon's Law.

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    This is where I'll simply disagree with you. Radio exhibits Se all the time and virtually no Ne. Just today for example in chat he was talking about how he likes choking people during sex. His romance style is very typical of the Aggressor.
    And how long did your relationship with Radio last, praytell?

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    In most EII type descriptions I find, they abhor any sort of violence or aggression, because of Se PoLR. He often exerts his will and his opinion against others in a manner that Se dominants do. I can't see him as EII. I think your perception and understanding of the functions and types is off because of this.
    Typing words on a computer box != being violent. You seem to have a really poor intuitive sense for when someone's being facetious and not.

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    Perhaps apathetic is a wrong way of putting it. That's from the Alpha perspective, yes. But yes - divorced from reality. In your own words, how you see that --- could you describe how you then are engaged in reality, as opposed to your understanding of how Gamma NTs are divorced from reality?
    It's not so much I'm 'engaged with reality' as much as I'm engaged in my own emotional experience that's passively derived from 'reality.' You'll usually find Gamma NTs on here talking about things totally divorced from that side of their psyches.

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    Others have mentioned they think I'm similar to you as well
    One person has said this, and I have no idea why sienna made that comparison because it's patently wrong.

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    (which I can see in parts but mostly disagree with), but perhaps that piece of information of my self-typing would be relevant to their comparisons and analysis in this thread.
    I sure as hell hope it isn't

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    (sheesh more enneagram crutch answer to explain differences blah blah blah)
    Because they are relevant differences that should not be the burden of socionics to answer.

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    1. How do you type Agarina, whom you say you relate to?
    I have no issue with her as EII and some sx/sp. We haven't talked much one-on-one before, but from what I've read we have very similar outlooks on relationships w/ others.

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    2. Why do you hate the IEEs so much to call them "demon hell-spawn"
    methinks your critical reading skills need some exercise. the hilarious demon hellspawn quip was directed at so > sx types, which as @Radio mentioned before was excruciatingly tongue-in-cheek. I didn't expect anybody to take as a serious attack on any type.

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    and yet say you get along perfectly with the people you 'think' are EII?
    I get along with some EIIs, not so much with others, for reasons already expounded upon at length by people like @anndelise.

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    Have you not considered that it's at least a bit weird to hate one type so much yet vibe perfectly and get along with its Mirror partner?
    ugh critical reading skills jesus

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    (Please provide an answer in socionics terms without using enneagram differences or instinct-stacking as a crutch)
    I'm not going to play by your rules for argument just because it's convenient to you.

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    3. It seems you still self-type Delta after saying this quote and after saying you don't identify as Gamma. If you don't identify as IEE, how do you self-type?
    Same as before

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    Why did you make this thread to begin with?
    I wanted attention.

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    Are you considering either EII, SLI, or LSE as the other 3 non-IEE Delta possibilities, or is this thread simply for your own fun/musings and to reaffirm some idea of your type you already had in your head?


    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    4. If you actually do still self-type as IEE, then how the heck do you explain the differences you feel with other IEEs? Again, please don't use another system of enneagram in your answer. I want to hear a pure socionics answer.
    Except that other system does explain the differences perfectly well, dingus.

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    1. How do you define Te?
    ugh this is why socionics arguments are impossible. It doesn't matter how I explain any of the IEs at this point because it's all easy fodder for half-assed reinterpretation and nitpicky bullshit. Most of what I understand of socionics happens at a base experiential level that makes it really tough to explain verbally.

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    2. Are you saying Te does not equal work
    Of course I am, that's literally the thing I just said.

    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    supported by the example of a non-Te ego being a diligent worker? Then how does that make sense when saying you don't identify with a type description of Te-leading because it includes the component of work? Aren't those ideas in conflict with one another?
    No, I'm saying that I don't identify with that description in part because it's shitty and dumb.
    Last edited by Galen; 01-06-2015 at 05:47 PM.
    "And above all, watch with glittering eyes the whole world around you because the greatest secrets are always hidden in the most unlikely places. Those who don't believe in magic will never find it." -Roald Dahl

    http://forum.socionix.com/
    It's pretty cool

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    Quote Originally Posted by anndelise View Post
    @William
    I found it, but after rereading it, and you being a bit of an asshat regarding how you're trying to interpret him, I'll instead wait to see if @Galen is ok with me linking you to it.
    Go for it
    "And above all, watch with glittering eyes the whole world around you because the greatest secrets are always hidden in the most unlikely places. Those who don't believe in magic will never find it." -Roald Dahl

    http://forum.socionix.com/
    It's pretty cool

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    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    If you love enneagram so much and think it better describes and explains interactions with people than socionics, please kindly leave the socionics forum. Until then, stop using it as a crutch to dismiss any socionics inconsistencies pointed out.
    You made some good points in favor of other types but then you lost me with this narrow-minded statement. Really? There would be no forum left if everyone who believed that socionics was not the only measure of intertype relations were to leave. I think we are conflictors again. :/

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    I read this months ago and I loved it.

    "When I ought to be thinking of heaven he will nail me to earth"

     







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    Last edited by anndelise; 01-06-2015 at 05:31 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aylen View Post
    I think we are conflictors again. :/
    rofl
    "not everything is explained by socionics. the fact that you think this must be socionics related"
    "And above all, watch with glittering eyes the whole world around you because the greatest secrets are always hidden in the most unlikely places. Those who don't believe in magic will never find it." -Roald Dahl

    http://forum.socionix.com/
    It's pretty cool

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    Quote Originally Posted by anndelise View Post
    lol that one was cute. Looking at it again makes me all smiley.
    "And above all, watch with glittering eyes the whole world around you because the greatest secrets are always hidden in the most unlikely places. Those who don't believe in magic will never find it." -Roald Dahl

    http://forum.socionix.com/
    It's pretty cool

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    Quote Originally Posted by Galen View Post
    rofl
    "not everything is explained by socionics. the fact that you think this must be socionics related"

    "When I ought to be thinking of heaven he will nail me to earth"

     







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