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    Default inert and contact functions

    can someone explain clearly the differences between inert and contact functions? I have creative Fi so I was wondering what it's like with Fi in an inert position, like restrictive. Do attractions/repulsions feel stronger with Fi in an inert position?

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    http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...-of-the-Psyche


    Inert and contact

    Inert functions (1, 4, 6, 7) are those that do not integrate information from the environment; thus, the strength of these functions remain the way they are. A person does not seek guidance in these areas as they comprise the core of their natural strengths and weaknesses.

    Inert functions 1 and 4 are a part of the mental ring; these are essentially one's most confident strengths (base function) and debilitating weaknesses (point of least resistance). It is for this reason that strong judgments about these aspects of reality are inadvertently made.

    Inert functions 6 and 7 are in the vital ring of a person's psyche. An individual is hardly aware of how these functions are used. The mobilizing function is inert since its primary mechanism is to mobilize one's creative function into action. Thus one's ability to use it does not become much stronger throughout life. The ignoring function is inert because it is part of a person's natural strength, just like the base function. Conscious information is limited here in favor of the leading function.

    Contact functions (2, 3, 5, 8) are essentially how we touch upon the environment; they adapt and integrate new experiences from the environment. These are capable of being improved over time (through ability or simply new understandings).

    Contact functions 2 and 3 are in the mental ring. The creative function produces new information out of what is accepted by the base function. This is literally how we uniquely 'make contact' with the world. This has potential to grow stronger as a conscious element since it's the Ego's connection to reality. In the role function, however, information from the environment is weakly accepted situationally, and is subdued since it opposes the base function's approach. Although it cannot truly grow in strength, where it does grow is within the individual's subjective understanding of that aspect of reality.

    Contact functions 5 and 8 are in the vital ring and strive to unconsciously make contact with the environment. This is indefinitely true of the suggestive function. Since it complements the base function, people unknowingly seek information related to it from the environment to strengthen its ability. It is theoretically the only way one can improve on their leading function. The demonstrative function makes contact with one's environment very unconsciously; it acts with the conscious leading function to produce one's unique worldview, being just as strong as the base function.
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    What is the difference between Inert/Contact and Accepting/ Producing again?
    I would say that ethically you are still supposed to act as if you have unilateral responsibility; but simultaneously you have to be able to see the other as a fully autonomous, free, aware person.

    Medicalizing social problems has the additional benefit of rendering society not responsible for those social ills. If itís a disease, itís nobodyís fault. Yay empiricism.

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    Accepting functions are the odd numbered ones; producing functions are the even numbered ones.
    Inert functions are 1, 4, 6, 7 ; contact functions are 2, 3, 5, 8
    LII-Ne with strong EII tendencies, 6w7-9w1-3w4 so/sp/sx, INxP



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    Quote Originally Posted by LIIbrarian View Post
    http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...-of-the-Psyche


    Inert and contact

    Inert functions (1, 4, 6, 7) are those that do not integrate information from the environment; thus, the strength of these functions remain the way they are. A person does not seek guidance in these areas as they comprise the core of their natural strengths and weaknesses.

    Inert functions 1 and 4 are a part of the mental ring; these are essentially one's most confident strengths (base function) and debilitating weaknesses (point of least resistance). It is for this reason that strong judgments about these aspects of reality are inadvertently made.

    Inert functions 6 and 7 are in the vital ring of a person's psyche. An individual is hardly aware of how these functions are used. The mobilizing function is inert since its primary mechanism is to mobilize one's creative function into action. Thus one's ability to use it does not become much stronger throughout life. The ignoring function is inert because it is part of a person's natural strength, just like the base function. Conscious information is limited here in favor of the leading function.

    Contact functions (2, 3, 5, 8) are essentially how we touch upon the environment; they adapt and integrate new experiences from the environment. These are capable of being improved over time (through ability or simply new understandings).

    Contact functions 2 and 3 are in the mental ring. The creative function produces new information out of what is accepted by the base function. This is literally how we uniquely 'make contact' with the world. This has potential to grow stronger as a conscious element since it's the Ego's connection to reality. In the role function, however, information from the environment is weakly accepted situationally, and is subdued since it opposes the base function's approach. Although it cannot truly grow in strength, where it does grow is within the individual's subjective understanding of that aspect of reality.

    Contact functions 5 and 8 are in the vital ring and strive to unconsciously make contact with the environment. This is indefinitely true of the suggestive function. Since it complements the base function, people unknowingly seek information related to it from the environment to strengthen its ability. It is theoretically the only way one can improve on their leading function. The demonstrative function makes contact with one's environment very unconsciously; it acts with the conscious leading function to produce one's unique worldview, being just as strong as the base function.
    this is interesting. so the Lead function improves through the suggestive. I wonder if the same is true for the other function pairs, POLR improving through the demonstrative, ignoring through role, etc.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ConcreteButterfly View Post
    this is interesting. so the Lead function improves through the suggestive. I wonder if the same is true for the other function pairs, POLR improving through the demonstrative, ignoring through role, etc.

    Each pair has its own features and interactions with each other. Where the suggestive function stimulates and supplies the leading function with valuable experiential information, the demonstrative function assists you with problems in the vulnerable function - when you become stressed/agitated in your environment, your demonstrative will automatically trigger, and you'll reflexively react to the stress (note that this is because the 8th function is an unconscious "contact" function - it occurs in direct response to something in the environment). What kind of information is produced is dependent on which Element is within these functions.

    Example: A type with Extroverted Ethics as a vulnerable function may automatically respond to someone who is acting highly emotional with their Introverted Logic demonstrative function - they will become detached and logical, responding as matter-of-fact as possible in order to avoid becoming overwhelmed by the extreme emotional display.

    hope that helps shed some light on your question.

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    Quote Originally Posted by LIIbrarian View Post
    Accepting functions are the odd numbered ones; producing functions are the even numbered ones.
    Inert functions are 1, 4, 6, 7 ; contact functions are 2, 3, 5, 8
    Lol what I meant by my question, was the difference the dichotomy attempt to explain.

    Accepting takes in info, and producing put out info. Inert and contact seems very similar to that. One being info thats fixed within yourself, and the other being info that you can adapt (and adapts) to the environment. Both are working to explain internal and external rhythms of metabolism (in the traditional nonsocionics meaning of internal and external). So the difference betweennthe two is what I gotta work out, as the two seem easily conflatable.
    I would say that ethically you are still supposed to act as if you have unilateral responsibility; but simultaneously you have to be able to see the other as a fully autonomous, free, aware person.

    Medicalizing social problems has the additional benefit of rendering society not responsible for those social ills. If itís a disease, itís nobodyís fault. Yay empiricism.

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    Quote Originally Posted by David McCarthy View Post
    Each pair has its own features and interactions with each other. Where the suggestive function stimulates and supplies the leading function with valuable experiential information, the demonstrative function assists you with problems in the vulnerable function - when you become stressed/agitated in your environment, your demonstrative will automatically trigger, and you'll reflexively react to the stress (note that this is because the 8th function is an unconscious "contact" function - it occurs in direct response to something in the environment). What kind of information is produced is dependent on which Element is within these functions.

    Example: A type with Extroverted Ethics as a vulnerable function may automatically respond to someone who is acting highly emotional with their Introverted Logic demonstrative function - they will become detached and logical, responding as matter-of-fact as possible in order to avoid becoming overwhelmed by the extreme emotional display.

    hope that helps shed some light on your question.
    Very good post.
    I would say that ethically you are still supposed to act as if you have unilateral responsibility; but simultaneously you have to be able to see the other as a fully autonomous, free, aware person.

    Medicalizing social problems has the additional benefit of rendering society not responsible for those social ills. If itís a disease, itís nobodyís fault. Yay empiricism.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pookie View Post
    Very good post.
    Thank you. Much of the information you've seen on Wikisocion regarding Inert & Contact functions are my own contributions (from username yellowfever765). I'll try to break down your question about the difference between Inert/Contact and Accepting/Producing. First, the basic definitions of each:

    Accepting: "Input" functions. These functions accumulate raw, unfiltered information about the environment; the data is used to get a direct picture of what's going on in one's surroundings.
    Producing: "Output" functions. The information accumulated from the accepting functions is used in these functions to create something new, find answers or come to conclusions about reality. The information here is highly altered and not a direct reflection of reality.

    Inert: Rigid, fixed functions. The individual is unlikely to change data/conclusions in these functions unless a highly significant event changes them. These functions create a long, focused response to new information and the individual becomes fixated on changes made to them. (Note that this is probably because these functions are a type's strongest and weakest conscious functions).
    Contact: Highly flexible functions that act dependently on the environment. Data/conclusions here can change at a moments notice if the situation calls for it, and the individual attaches less importance to keeping these functions stable.

    From this understanding of each dichotomy, we may conclude that Accepting/Producing functions determine how information is processed, and Inert/Contact functions determine the flexibility of the information processed, or in other words, how easily information can be changed once processed.

    Let me know if that answers your question. I am currently researching each specific combination of these two dichotomies for each function (ex: Base function - Inert/Accepting, Role function - Contact/Accepting), and will post my data on a new thread when it's complete!

    EDIT: Additionally, for the Inert & Contact dichotomy, it's important to acknowledge that this also determines where the information is reliant upon - for Contact functions, the individual relies exclusively on the environment to use or gain information; for Inert functions, the individual relies on himself to accumulate information and is almost completely independent of external influence. Using the Base and Vulnerable (Inert, Conscious) functions as examples:
    -Your Base function holds the most confident, reliable information about reality. You are so assured of your clarity in this function that you naturally do not change accepted information based on external factors; you can defend your own evaluations in this aspect of reality against others' vehemently, and feel compelled to correct mistakes made by others here.
    -Your Vulnerable function is your weakest mental function. The level of clarity here is very faulty, and as a result, most new information from the environment is viewed with great skepticism and uncertainty. Only when sufficient pressure from the external world forces you to examine your vulnerabilities does this function change its conclusions.

    Both of these functions are thus Inert, or highly inflexible/resistant to change by the environment.
    Last edited by Socionics to America; 01-06-2015 at 12:26 AM.

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    How I think about it. In the mental ring, Inert functions are limits, like walls, being the weakest and strongest functions. Almost defense mechanisms. Contact functions are tools we use to interact. In the vital rings, inert functions are like projections, like spikes, shadow projections in a way. As the Hidden Agenda/Ignoring function, they are both masked in a way but project unconsciously into the environment, often neurotically. Contact functions in the Vital ring are the worldview demonstrative function which characterize one of the factors in how individuals conceive the world. It's the natural drive of the ID. And the dual seeking function which is a function individuals most want to receive externally.

    Also mental ring inert functions are evaluatory vs vital ring inert functions which are situational.

    Accepting/production is more of a function of information blocks, where each pair of function within blocks have one accepting function and one producing function, this is the basis for the I/O of each mental block.

    Inert/contact is more a structural observation of a TIM described by Model A where the strongest/weakest function as well as the inner functions of the mental/vital ring have unique characteristics of interaction.

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    Quote Originally Posted by David McCarthy View Post
    Each pair has its own features and interactions with each other. Where the suggestive function stimulates and supplies the leading function with valuable experiential information, the demonstrative function assists you with problems in the vulnerable function - when you become stressed/agitated in your environment, your demonstrative will automatically trigger, and you'll reflexively react to the stress (note that this is because the 8th function is an unconscious "contact" function - it occurs in direct response to something in the environment). What kind of information is produced is dependent on which Element is within these functions.

    Example: A type with Extroverted Ethics as a vulnerable function may automatically respond to someone who is acting highly emotional with their Introverted Logic demonstrative function - they will become detached and logical, responding as matter-of-fact as possible in order to avoid becoming overwhelmed by the extreme emotional display.

    hope that helps shed some light on your question.
    This is socionics gold, haha. Thankyou very much, and welcome to the forum. Question: does the demonstrative always react to environment-induced stress, or are there conditions in which it would remain passive? And can you consciously use this information?

    Also, if you could give other examples of the function pairs that would be great.
    Last edited by ConcreteButterfly; 01-06-2015 at 04:22 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ConcreteButterfly View Post
    This is socionics gold, haha. Thankyou very much, and welcome to the forum. Question: does the demonstrative always react to environment-induced stress, or are there conditions in which it would remain passive? And can you consciously use this information?

    Also, if you could give other examples of the function pairs that would be great.
    Hey ConcreteB! To answer your first question, the demonstrative function does not always react to stress - if the stress is based in an aspect of reality that the type is strong in (such as problems in the Base or Creative functions), the person will first utilize their Ego block to deal with the corresponding stress, find a solution, etc. I've found that the demonstrative function can trigger in three ways (there may be more, these are just what I have identified so far):

    a) The source of stress is directly in the Super-Ego block and not a part of the type's natural strengths.
    b) The source of the stress is in the type's Ego block, BUT the person could not find a solution or way to cope with the stress in these aspects of reality.
    c) The stress is directly related to the aspect of reality that is in the type's demonstrative function itself.

    Here's a situational example: a type with [Ni] as his Creative function has set a plan for the day. He has events planned on a time schedule, and halfway through the day, everything is going according to his timetable. Suddenly, his car breaks down in an unfamiliar area. With nothing to go off of to predict what will happen from there, no past experience with the area he is in and with the realization that he cannot move forward with the initial plan (unable to use [Ni] to solve it), his demonstrative function [Ne] triggers, and he automatically considers multiple possible courses of action in order to get out of the present situation.

    Additionally, the demonstrative function can react sarcastically to others that are using that aspect of reality seriously - as stated in Wikisocion's information, "A person uses this element mainly as a kind of game, or to ridicule those who he thinks take it too seriously. They often intentionally go against its conventional usage simply to prove a point in favor of their creative function."

    As for your second question, I've found that if you actually study which Information Element your demonstrative function is, and then pay attention to your thought processes in order to point out when you are using that aspect of reality, you can at least start to see how your brain is utilizing the function. It's really quite amazing to see how automatic it is (you will usually realize after the fact that you have unconsciously used information from it).

    As for being able to actually use the function at will, it is possible to some small extent if you know what Information Element it is (for example, if someone has [Ni] as their demonstrative, they could try to consciously manipulate the function by intentionally predicting/planning out the future or reflect on their past experiences, and then see what their mind comes up with!)

    But for the most part, as Model A and previous research on it suggests, it is unconscious by nature and one typically isn't even aware of its use in decision making, so in practice it would be extremely challenging to use it at will.
    Last edited by Socionics to America; 01-11-2015 at 04:34 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Socionics to America View Post
    (...) But for the most part, as Model A and previous research on it suggests, it is unconscious by nature and one typically isn't even aware of its use in decision making, so in practice it would be extremely challenging to use it at will.
    I mostly agree with all you wrote here but I'd like to comment on this part; I find I can move focus indirectly on to my demonstrative if I use my leading function to do it. I still don't really have the information processing in the demonstrative going on in a conscious fashion at all, though for 1-2 seconds here and there it may temporarily come up but I can manipulate it indirectly via the leading function. I'm fine with that btw, don't see a need to force it into consciousness, I'm not interested in that lol

    Oh and as for your example with the car, I'd like to emphasize for readers - maybe trivial to some of you - that 1) everyone can try to focus on Ne in that case but according to theory different types would do that differently 2) another IE can also help solve it, for me my ego block and demonstrative probably would work in cases like your example.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Myst View Post
    Oh and as for your example with the car, I'd like to emphasize for readers - maybe trivial to some of you - that 1) everyone can try to focus on Ne in that case but according to theory different types would do that differently 2) another IE can also help solve it, for me my ego block and demonstrative probably would work in cases like your example.
    That right there gives me an entirely new thought - the Demonstrative [Ne] in the example I was using was basically limited to the EIE-ENFj type (I did not notice myself doing this at the time), who is weak in Logic. If you take an LIE-ENTj and put him into the same situation with the car, he would be likely to not use [Ne] much at all - [Te], as the dominant function for the LIE, would be compatible for a situation where utilities cease to be efficient. He could use his most confident function to find unique, more effective ways to get that piece of shit car back on the road.

    My point on the Demonstrative function overall is that it is used extremely often on a daily basis. Paying attention to the way your mind uses it, when it is triggered, and how it helps (or hinders!!) your situations is in my opinion an incredibly effective use of Socionic theory in real-life applications. I am aware this thought needs to be expanded more, so I'm thinking of beginning an in-depth article on the Demonstrative and how important it is to each type's functioning.

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