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Thread: Is he describing Ni?

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    role's Avatar
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    Default Is he describing Ni?

    There was an artist I was watching online and an interviewer asked him what was his thought process when making music. What he described sounded like what I go through when I use Ni but I am unsure because I am not a musician. Maybe his thought process is just a musician thing or maybe it is Ni? Can you help me. Also if there are musicians on here can you tell me if you experience this as well.
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    It's the first 30 seconds so you don't have to watch the whole video, it's irrelevant.
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    Perpetual Confusion Machine PistolShrimp's Avatar
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    Sounds like synesthesia and imagination. Don't think it's function-related but I'm not sure.

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    Queen of the Damned Aylen's Avatar
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    He says when he closes his eyes he sees color. I also see vivid visuals, colors and fractals when I listen to music with my eyes closed but I also see them when there is no music so I don't know. I just assumed this was the case for everyone until I started talking about it and people didn't see them too. I create vivid paintings in my mind as well of people, creatures and places I have never been. These are the types of visuals I will get with my eyes closed but certain medications, like anti-depressants, pain killers or sleeping pills will turn it off.

    I have a cross between lexical-gustatory and auditory-tactile synesthesia. It's mild or at least I think it's mild since I really have nothing to compare it to and I rarely talk about it. It just has always been. I do not associate particular colors with sounds or letters like others report though. I really can't say if any of this is Ni related.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ideasthesia

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synesthesia

    Based on the findings that synesthesia is not a phenomenon of crossed senses but has the properties of ideasthesia, it was proposed[28] that synesthesia develops during childhood at the time at which children are for the first time intensively engaged with abstract concepts. This hypothesis—referred to as semantic vacuum hypothesis—explains why the most common forms of synesthesia are grapheme-color, spatial sequence and number form: These are usually the first abstract concepts that educational systems require kids to learn.

    Last edited by Aylen; 12-13-2014 at 03:29 PM.

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    @Aylen
    I create stories and people as well. I can make up a story in my mind and it evolves for days until I believe it is real and I have to realize that I made it up. I do this without my eyes closed though. Do you have Ni as well Aylen? I can't see your profile on my phone. Thanks for the links

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    It's not Ni, what he's describing sounds like synaesthesia.

    I have mental associations between music and colour, but I don't think it's synaesthesia so much as mental association. I don't really imagine colour while I'm writing individual melodies or riffs unless they're particularly emotionally evocative. It's usually when I hear the song all pieced together that I make the mental colour associations.

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    Queen of the Damned Aylen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by role View Post
    @Aylen
    I create stories and people as well. I can make up a story in my mind and it evolves for days until I believe it is real and I have to realize that I made it up. I do this without my eyes closed though. Do you have Ni as well Aylen? I can't see your profile on my phone. Thanks for the links
    Yes, Ni I do not need to close my eyes for a story either. It is the intense fractals that require me to close off physical vision. They are more vivid, at times, than anything I can see with my eyes open. They seem to stream through my consciousness and without effort, on my part, they evolve into intricate patterns, morphing then dissolving leaving something new in their place I could spend hours watching them if I didn't end up falling asleep after awhile. Then I will have a lucid dream, sometimes.

    My stories and my dreams feel very real. Like I have lived them before. They come from somewhere...

    I am sure that I do not experience grapheme-color synesthesia. I just know I see these amazing, often beautiful, images and colors with my eyes closed. Sometimes they take shape and other times, not so much. It is like they exist on/in another dimension of reality and I can go there. Once I had my eyes closed and I was submerged in electric blue. It took no form, just color, when I opened my eyes I was surrounded in electric blue for a few moments. In those moments I was unable to see my own body. I only saw the color. As I child I distinctly remember seeing the world through a red filter a few times. To explain that I would say it is like putting on a pair of sunglasses that changes the tint of everything I see. I had a MRI so I know it is not a brain tumor.

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    I also experience the color association when I compose music. It's innate, really. I also, in my mind's eye, have a sense of texture and can sort of visualize lines and movement depending on the rhythm and tempo, but color has more to do with chords and harmony. I don't know if it has anything to do with Ni, though. But I feel it's also natural to visualize music. I can visualize scenes that go with the music I hear as well as create. I don't know how it relates to Ni but I don't think it's exclusive to Ni ego.

    I've come to find, though, that with many classical pieces, a story is associated with the piece. I had an SLE conductor who says that stories have nothing to do with music, that music exists for music's own sake. I agree with him on that, from a composer's POV (I create music for the sake of music, being led by my ear, my emotions, and pure spontaneity as I play around with chords and single notes until something clicks inside of me, and like a sculptor, I chip away the excess until I have a fully formed melody and harmony), but I don't think it's at all unusual to have a visual association with music (I'm talking about the instrumental quality, purely, and not lyrics and songwriting) that lends to a sense of pattern, color, and even a story.
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    Maybe the op is related to Ni and Se. This thread has me thinking about it...


    Because it does much of its work subconsciously, Ni can seem to have a certain magical quality about it. In fact, it is not unusual for INJs to be viewed as having some degree of psychic or prophetic abilities.Despite its magical appearance, Ni can be understood on a rational basis. What seems to be occurring is that many INJs have a highly sensitive inferior function, Extraverted Sensation (Se), which gathers copious amounts of sensory information from the outside world, including subtleties that other personality types tend to miss. Their Ni then subconsciously processes this data in order to make sense of it, like assembling pieces of a puzzle. Once finished, Ni generates an impression that seems to come out of “nowhere.” But the fact is that the intuition did not come out of nowhere, but from a synthesis of sensory data gathered from the immediate environment combined with information from the INJ’s own psyche.
    "Frederich Nietzsche describes his intuitive process this way:

    Something profoundly convulsive…suddenly becomes visible and audible with indescribable definiteness and exactness…There is an ecstasy whose terrific tension is sometimes released by a flood of tears…There is a feeling that one is utterly out of hand…Everything occurs without volition, as if an eruption of freedom, independence, power, and divinity. The spontaneity of the images and similes is most remarkable; one loses all perception of what is imagery and simile; everything offers itself as the most immediate, exact, and simple means of expression."


    "T.S. Eliot on the auditory imagination:

    “What I call the ‘auditory imagination’ is the feeling for syllable and rhythm, penetrating far below the conscious levels of thought and feeling, invigorating every word; sinking to the most primitive and forgotten, returning to the origin and bringing something back, seeking the beginning and the end. It works through meanings, certainly, or not without meanings in the ordinary sense, and fuses the old and obliterated and the trite, the current, and the new and surprising, the most ancient and most civilized mentality.”"

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    Quote Originally Posted by aixelsyd View Post
    I also experience the color association when I compose music. It's innate, really. I also, in my mind's eye, have a sense of texture and can sort of visualize lines and movement depending on the rhythm and tempo, but color has more to do with chords and harmony. I don't know if it has anything to do with Ni, though. But I feel it's also natural to visualize music. I can visualize scenes that go with the music I hear as well as create. I don't know how it relates to Ni but I don't think it's exclusive to Ni ego.

    I've come to find, though, that with many classical pieces, a story is associated with the piece. I had an SLE conductor who says that stories have nothing to do with music, that music exists for music's own sake. I agree with him on that, from a composer's POV (I create music for the sake of music, being led by my ear, my emotions, and pure spontaneity as I play around with chords and single notes until something clicks inside of me, and like a sculptor, I chip away the excess until I have a fully formed melody and harmony), but I don't think it's at all unusual to have a visual association with music (I'm talking about the instrumental quality, purely, and not lyrics and songwriting) that lends to a sense of pattern, color, and even a story.
    Yes I have that sort of association myself. I mean the visual stuff, though excluding colours.


    Quote Originally Posted by Aylen View Post
    Yes, Ni I do not need to close my eyes for a story either. It is the intense fractals that require me to close off physical vision. They are more vivid, at times, than anything I can see with my eyes open. They seem to stream through my consciousness and without effort, on my part, they evolve into intricate patterns, morphing then dissolving leaving something new in their place I could spend hours watching them if I didn't end up falling asleep after awhile. Then I will have a lucid dream, sometimes.

    My stories and my dreams feel very real. Like I have lived them before. They come from somewhere...

    I am sure that I do not experience grapheme-color synesthesia. I just know I see these amazing, often beautiful, images and colors with my eyes closed. Sometimes they take shape and other times, not so much. It is like they exist on/in another dimension of reality and I can go there. Once I had my eyes closed and I was submerged in electric blue. It took no form, just color, when I opened my eyes I was surrounded in electric blue for a few moments. In those moments I was unable to see my own body. I only saw the color. As I child I distinctly remember seeing the world through a red filter a few times. To explain that I would say it is like putting on a pair of sunglasses that changes the tint of everything I see. I had a MRI so I know it is not a brain tumor.
    Pretty interesting

    Don't know if it's Ni, I have some special synesthesia myself, though not of the form you describe

    I do have the basic grapheme-colour one but it goes way beyond that. I have other visual and auditory components to characters and digits and other text based symbols and if I focus hard enough it can link into some entire meaningful mood that sometimes actually leads me somewhere. Sorry I don't want to elaborate on this in this thread but it's pretty interesting really. Feels like a link to the unconscious sometimes.

    Maybe related to the auditory imagination thing you quote about above from T.S. Eliot.

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    Queen of the Damned Aylen's Avatar
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    From a link to Rick's site that was shared in another thread by @glam. (Thanks!) It reminded me of this old thread, which I have stored in a part of my memory marked for further investigation. Just adding this here for future reference.




    http://www.rickdelong.com/socionics/...emantics.shtml

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    Stories from the inside world

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aylen View Post
    From a link to Rick's site that was shared in another thread by @glam. (Thanks!) It reminded me of this old thread, which I have stored in a part of my memory marked for further investigation. Just adding this here for future reference.
    Well yeah I recall now that I've seen it mentioned before that Ni-doms have synesthesia more often than other types (though this was MBTI). I don't know, as I said, I have synesthesia myself... and I'm definitely not strong in Ni.

    I do wonder if this is Ni-ish "and if I focus hard enough it can link into some entire meaningful mood that sometimes actually leads me somewhere. Sorry I don't want to elaborate on this in this thread but it's pretty interesting really. Feels like a link to the unconscious sometimes." (quoting from my previous post in this thread)

    What do you think? (I can talk more about it on skype btw if you want )

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    Quote Originally Posted by Myst View Post
    Well yeah I recall now that I've seen it mentioned before that Ni-doms have synesthesia more often than other types (though this was MBTI). I don't know, as I said, I have synesthesia myself... and I'm definitely not strong in Ni.

    I do wonder if this is Ni-ish "and if I focus hard enough it can link into some entire meaningful mood that sometimes actually leads me somewhere. Sorry I don't want to elaborate on this in this thread but it's pretty interesting really. Feels like a link to the unconscious sometimes." (quoting from my previous post in this thread)

    What do you think? (I can talk more about it on skype btw if you want )
    Yeah, Skype me.

    "When I ought to be thinking of heaven he will nail me to earth"

     







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