What is the most likely type for these traits?
I know a female that I think is dominant Se, so either ESTp or ESFp. She tends to get in a lot of physical fights with other women who look at her cross eyed, has anger management issues, hits her boyfriends. She is quick to act in retaliation to any perceived sign of aggression toward her.
Obviously, she is an unhealthy extroverted sensing type, but do these seem like beta or gamma female behavior?
SLE
SLE.
I have a very hard time seeing a SEE getting that abusive. In a worst case scenario SEE can fuck up with people's minds, sleep around, or apply some more pressure when people don't go along with a goal they have, but not get physically violent. Their Se usually acts in more stealthy ways -- winning supporters, making subtle promises by gauging what people would die to have etc.
Elvis is said to have only raped his wife (to teach her "what a real man is like") when she let him know she decided to move out and live with her new bf. Just saying.
LSEs can be very physical too. I wouldn't cross it off the list, esp. if the fights are spurred out of anger.
Do you think she is Se-dom because of her behaviors?Originally Posted by Jimmers
Or do you think she is Se-dom apart from these behaviors?
I ask this a bit rhetorically, because what I really question is a general tendency to ascribe physical violence to Se.
I have heard about people who used physical violence in child upbringing (among other things ...). They were ESE, LSE, and SEI. I judged them as totally unhealthy. Laziness and weakness of character coupled with a misunderstood parental role.
I also know 2 SLEs who hit *their partners* -- one is a remote relative, while the other is a guy I briefly dated. One of the SLEs is still struggling to obtain the right to see his child after the mom used his aggressive tendencies as an argument to keep him away from her life (German law is quite protective of women's rights). He is still sorry he couldn't refrain. Other SLEs I know didn't actually use physical violence, but could easily get abusive by other means, if left unchecked. Se with Fi polr leaves the person with a looser filter when it comes to methods of winning or gaining something.
Last edited by Amber; 11-03-2014 at 07:41 PM.
I type that person SLE E8/7 sx/so just for the hell of it. Just from that miniature depiction I bet she is sorry she ain't a guy to creampie all her bfs.
isn't getting in fights with anyone who looks at you wrong kind of an irrational thing to do? such behavior would be driven by feeling rather than reason, no? the SLE's I know, despite being physically intimidating and sometimes bully-ish, are nevertheless rational in how they approach situations. I just can't imagine them using violence like that for no reason at all.
that said, I know a male SLE and a female SLE, both from different social circles, and while they're usually in control of their behavior, they've both described to me how they will "explode" if sufficiently pissed off. one time, the male, upon finding his then-girlfriend nestled up against his best friend in the back seat of a car after a night of drinking, flew into a fit of rage. he ripped them out of the car, threatened his best friend, and angrily stormed off. his girlfriend went rushing after him. when she tried to stop him by grabbing his shoulder, he turned around and backhanded her across the face. the female SLE has told me similar stories about her and her ex-boyfriend; their relationship was full of strife, apparently.
I think she is Se-dom independent of the violence, but I do think that Se-doms are much more likely to become aggressors because of the nature of the function.
As long as no one is challenging her, she can be quite enjoyable to be around, charming even.
My apologies for not giving enough information. I will make a case as to why I think she is Se dom when I have more time, and then proceed from there.
What I meant to say was "obviously, she is unhealthy" regardless of type, but I do think she is Se for other reasons.
Last edited by Skepsis; 11-04-2014 at 01:28 AM.
Well honestly, the only girls (a few) I have seen act this aggressive were all SLE's.
Also, how do you assess if someone uses Ti deductive reasoning with people who are dumb as a rock (there are some stupid Ti/Te egos out there after all) ?
welp, in my experience, SLE is a lot better at pointing out peoples' logical inconsistencies than SEE.
those are LSIs. SLEs are mainly good at finding shortcuts and pushing up the ante in whichever game they're playing or whatever serious aim they have.
you don't think a Ti-ego is adept at pointing out logical inconsistencies? with the exception of maybe LSE and LIE, the types with Ti as their ignoring function, I think all logical types are going to be good ay pointing out inconsistencies. especially types that value Ti.
they can notice them, but since it's their creative function, they don't give so much of a damn about them and they are not overly consistent themselves. Logic is subordinated to their goals, not to rigid consistency requirements, because they are irrational types. Just as Fi dominants evaluate their relationships and "ethical consistency" in people on a rather general and not easily changeable basis, while Fi creatives use this function in a very flexible way.
like seriously yo
...maybe not EII though. lol
Yeah, this was probably a clumsy question. I understand how they do it, it's more of a mystery to me how can you tell after short interaction. I've seen people here claiming some people cannot be SLE's (and are SEE's instead for example) because they suck at Ti and my question has always been - what if they're just really simple and the other person is not getting their logic or they misunderstand each other or whatever. I get what you meant in general though.
What makes me lean toward Se base for her is the fact that she lives very much in the moment, constantly lives outside her means as she spends a large amount of money on clothes, tanning, and her hair. She loves to look good and loves getting compliments. She loves to go out and go clubbing, ends up moving quite frequently, and has had dozens of sexual partners. She's never quite satisfied with life as it is. Everything is better to her if she moves to another town or experiences something new. Nothing she has is ever quite good enough.
Other things about her is she is all about getting respect from people. One of the things that set her off is when she feels disrespected. She cannot hold a job for more than two years because she doesn't take any crap from any of her coworkers. She engages them all. If she hears someone is talking about her behind her back, she will walk right up to them and confront them, often at the expense of her job.
I was thinking she may be SLE because she seems to use extroverted ethics when she is in a good mood, such as excessive smiling and hand gestures. She is also overly warm when she wants something from you, such as money; she can be very charming. But she is not the kind of person that cares about an overall positive emotional environment, which would work with either SLE or SEE. What seems to interest her most is her status within the environment. So it's really hard to tell if she is Fe or Fi valuing. She is not in the least bit book smart, but she is very street smart and is what I would call a survivor.
When we talk it is often centered around all of the financial and relationship trouble she's been having and isn't the least bit interested in anyone else's problems because she thinks no one could possibly have it as bad as she does. I used to try to give her practical advice, which she often doesn't take, but I gave up doing that. I feel sorry for her because she never seems to be able to make a good, long-term decision. Oh well.
but if we're associating logical consistency (the ability to be logically consistent, the ability to point out others' logical inconsistencies) with Ti, and if Ti is valued (which it would be if it were in the creative position), then it seems like logical consistency would be something an SLE would, in fact, give a damn about. and if Ti really does have to do with logical consistency, then a type with strong Ti would be better than a type with weak Ti at pointing out others' logical inconsistencies, which was my original point.
as far as I know, a SLE's logic is dependent on their Se. I kinda think all functions are subordinate to one's goals; if you have a source that says otherwise, I'd be interested to see it, as I don't know much about rationality/irrationality. I'm not sure that all irrational types are inconsistent in their behavior -- I suspect I'm an ENFP, and I can be counted on to exhibit quite a few behaviors.
I do have the experience of seeing Se-base and Se-creative expressed as physical domination and even violence. I can see it as part of a range of behaviors related to being Se-ego. (And I've known more Se types who were NOT violent, ever.) There's a type of violence with a particular Se flavor to it, anyhow.
Regarding the OP, my question was simply whether Se-base was concluded independent of the physical aggression, since other types can be violent.
Of the men who've struck me non-consensually, one was Se-dom, the other was Te-dom. And then there are the weaselly pricks like one of my bff's exes, who drew a gun on her and stole her car and looks to be some kind of Se-free feeler.
I'm not sure I understand quite what you're getting at.
off topic
This is the kind of interpretation of Fi that makes me want to be an LSE.
Why? Because I don't get how you can have integrity and develop a morally sound character if you're flexible (situational/circumstantial/whatever) with your ethics. So, this interpretation of Fi-creative to me implies an instability (and inconsistency) of character that would drive me crazy in relationships, and I'm supposedly an SLI.
Last edited by Park; 11-06-2014 at 03:56 AM.
“Whether we fall by ambition, blood, or lust, like diamonds we are cut with our own dust.”
Browsing through this thread I see people are doing great at their usual job, trying to doubt and disprove a poster's ability to assess a person's type. If Jimmers thinks she's Se base, he might have his reasons. He's already offered enough arguments for S_E. Jimmers, post video of chick fighting (but not smth. for a restricted audience) to see if she's SEE. Unlike SLEs, SEEs squint and engage in bootlicking before crushing their enemy.
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