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Thread: Do you believe that "Evil" is Necessary?

  1. #1
    Landlord of the Dog and Duck Subteigh's Avatar
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    Default Do you believe that "Evil" is Necessary?

    Or "Bad Things" if you prefer or not prefer


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    Landlord of the Dog and Duck Subteigh's Avatar
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    If this was simply a question of whether "evil" is necessary because it exists it would be a meaningless question and it would be more important to ask if evil actually exists in one way or another (I think 'evil' is a value judgement only, whereas 'bad things' do exist).

    It seems to be a common opinion that 'evil' is necessary in order that things like 'Good' and 'Love' can be appreciated and assessed, I think partly because of religion but also because those words are already in people's heads. As far as I see, a person would be quite capable of experiencing Good Things e.g. feeling Elated etc. without any Objective or Subjective Negative Things to compare to. Such a person wouldn't necessarily see such feelings as Good but they would exist all the same.

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    Robot Assassin Pa3s's Avatar
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    Yes. Booth "good" and "bad" are arbitrary qualities which only exist for humans. One can not be defined without the other, so if all "bad" things would vanish, "good" would lose its meaning as well, as William said.

    Even if there were no murders anymore, other crimes would take their place in the perception of the public and nothing would really change. For instance, we see waterboarding today as an awful tortue, even if it's nothing compared to medieval methods. It's completely subjective.
    „Man can do what he wants but he cannot want what he wants.“
    – Arthur Schopenhauer

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    What a boring world it would be without evil. People would have no causes to battle for, nothing to ignite their spirits.

    "O cursed spite! that ever I was born to set it right!"

    In human form it is necessary for experience I would say. What would be the point of being here otherwise? I believe there are otherworlds with other dynamics and rules, that offer different experiences.

    "There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy."

    I am focused on this world for now and one of my favorite sayings is, when in Rome...

    "The time is out of joint"

    The concept of good and evil usually takes me back to reading Shakespeare, as a preteen, at my aunt's insistence (I am kind of grateful that she did this). She was really into good and evil, heaven and hell. I often wondered if she was good or evil, as a child. I decided she was basically good but her upbringing influenced the way she expressed herself as an adult. Loved her anyway.


    "O all you host of heaven! O earth! what else?
    And shall I couple hell? O, fie! Hold, hold, my heart;
    And you, my sinews, grow not instant old,
    But bear me stiffly up. Remember thee!
    Ay, thou poor ghost, while memory holds a seat
    In this distracted globe. Remember thee!
    Yea, from the table of my memory
    I'll wipe away all trivial fond records,
    All saws of books, all forms, all pressures past,
    That youth and observation copied there;
    And thy commandment all alone shall live
    Within the book and volume of my brain,
    Unmix'd with baser matter: yes, by heaven!
    O most pernicious woman!
    O villain, villain, smiling, damned villain!
    My tables,--meet it is I set it down,
    That one may smile, and smile, and be a villain;
    At least I'm sure it may be so... "

    "When I ought to be thinking of heaven he will nail me to earth"

     







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    Landlord of the Dog and Duck Subteigh's Avatar
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    I think if you say that a concept such as 'evil' is necessary in order to prevent people from doing evil things, this is just an acknowledgement that evil exists in this universe.

    A universe with no 'evil' in it does not need 'evil' in order that people appreciate good things.

    I don't believe that such a theoretical universe would be boring, as boringness in itself would be an evil\bad thing.

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    Chains's Avatar
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    Evil isn't necessary for anything, as I see it. It just exists because good exists and vice versa, a dilemma created by sentient beings that must chose between selfishness and selflessness. Evil lurks where the light of goodness does not shine. It is within us all.

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    Queen of the Damned Aylen's Avatar
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    Even as a child I had a talent for drawing out the darkest aspects of people and learning all their secrets. Then somehow I was able to, take it all into myself and transmute the experience into something positive. I could see through the so called "evil" facade these people felt free to share with me. It was like watching them transform from a monster with no self-awareness into an empathic human being who knew and felt the pain they caused others and it actually hurt them to face what they had created. Forgiveness was always involved and there were many heartfelt apologies that were genuine. I know this. Ultimately I do not believe in the terms of "good and evil", "right or wrong" or even forgiveness but I use them to foster some kind of understanding. It is what it is and it is all temporary. I am feeling whole again, for the most part. I still find random puzzle pieces now and then.

    "When I ought to be thinking of heaven he will nail me to earth"

     







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    Haikus Persephone's Avatar
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    Evil triggers a change.
    Without bad things, no possibility to determine and appreciate good things.

    Also, evil is as beauty, highly subjective (unless it's major things as death etc)

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    xerx's Avatar
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    Not to sound melodramatic, but no one who's had intimate experiences with a psychopath would doubt the existence of pure evil.

    Evil as effectuated by yin yang dualism is petty narcissism or ignorance at worst, not irredeemable, demonic evil.
    You can do anything with a bayonet except sit on it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by xerx View Post
    Not to sound melodramatic, but no one who's had intimate experiences with a psychopath would doubt the existence of pure evil.

    Evil as effectuated by yin yang dualism is petty narcissism or ignorance at worst, not irredeemable, demonic evil.
    you seem to contradict yourself. Which is your oppinion?

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    xerx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Esaman View Post
    you seem to contradict yourself. Which is your oppinion?
    How do I contradict myself?
    You can do anything with a bayonet except sit on it.

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    What is evil? What you consider evil, may not be what I consider to be evil. I consider people who kill innocent dogs to be evil, and most American's probably would, but surely there are exceptions here as well as in other countries. Of course there are the obvious points that the majority of the population would agree with - murder, for example - but even that has some gray area:

    - no intention vs. intention
    - premeditated vs. circumstantial

    The world could do without murder ('evil'), but individual circumstances won't always allow for that. Should a person be considered evil and crucified if it was done in self-defense? Similarly, should the murder 'victim' not be considered evil if there was premeditated intention to harm another?

    Ideal vs. Realistic. It's a part of life. It shouldn't be, but it's hard for there to always be a clear distinction between evil and non-evil when there is a large population, thus different belief systems, in play.

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    "The road to hell is paved with good intentions."

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    Good and evil are a function of the dichotomous mind.

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    Quote Originally Posted by xerx View Post
    How do I contradict myself?
    will not doubt existance of pure evil
    VS
    narcissims or ignorance at worst, not irredeemable.

    Also do you need to be difficult? The interest is wayning rapidly.

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    Evil does not objectively exist, it is only a subjective idea.

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    lump's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Subteigh View Post
    I think if you say that a concept such as 'evil' is necessary in order to prevent people from doing evil things, this is just an acknowledgement that evil exists in this universe.

    A universe with no 'evil' in it does not need 'evil' in order that people appreciate good things.

    I don't believe that such a theoretical universe would be boring, as boringness in itself would be an evil\bad thing.
    i was going to say something about the necessity of evil to prevent people from becoming complacent or to give a distinction to Goodness, but if you're talking about a theoretical universe which defies all the rules of this universe, i guess it all becomes moot. maybe evil isn't necessary in the same world where pigs fly.

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    xerx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Esaman View Post
    will not doubt existance of pure evil
    VS
    narcissims or ignorance at worst, not irredeemable.

    Also do you need to be difficult? The interest is wayning rapidly.
    I don't really see how I contradicted myself.
    You can do anything with a bayonet except sit on it.

  19. #19
    Glorious Member mu4's Avatar
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    I think evil is a word we give to things that we observe which we wish to annihilate.



    AKA DALEKS, who's with me!

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    Queen of the Damned Aylen's Avatar
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    This thread needs background music.



    [seems they fixed the lyrics]

    "Am I evil?
    yes, I fucking am
    Am I evil?
    I am man, yeah"

    "When I ought to be thinking of heaven he will nail me to earth"

     







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