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Thread: Would a Se-Base ever back down from a fight, or submit to someone else?

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    Default Would a Se-Base ever back down from a confrontation, or submit to someone else?

    Or is the guy in this video an EIE or Se-superego?

    Last edited by suedehead; 07-02-2014 at 08:27 PM.

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    That looked like a big infantile temper tantrum to me. The Caregiver soda-buying guy talked him down. Alpha or Delta EP (Sorry, Alphas, Deltas)

    EIEs have way too much finesse for that. There was no sinister Ni undertone in his rant.
    You seek a great fortune, you three who are now in chains. You will find a fortune, though it will not be the one you seek.
    But first you must travel a long and difficult road, a road fraught with peril.
    You shall see things, wonderful to tell. You shall see a... cow... on the roof of a cotton house. And, oh, so many startlements.
    I cannot tell you how long this road shall be, but fear not the ob-stacles in your path, for fate has vouchsafed your reward.
    Though the road may wind, yea, your hearts grow weary, still shall ye follow them, even unto your salvation
    .


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pukq_XJmM-k

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    Lol, too good.

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    Don't know what type that guy is but it's neither Se-base nor EIE. I agree with @Iris on why this isn' EIE. As far as Se base, they don't talk so much shit. They'll say a harsh line or two but they'll take physical action sooner than ranting verbally till their mouth foams up. This guy doesn't have true Se aggression, it's more like he's overcompensating.
    If I had to take a shot in the dark I'd say this guy is IEE

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    Yes. Absolutely. Understanding power dynamics and striving towards less serville roles can mean backing down to achieve that end. Ideally an Se base would be able to pick their battles with some measure of intelligence when interacting with superiors.
    Easy Day

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    So much ownage. Definitely not EIE, that's for sure. Something EP and probably cp E6.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JWC3 View Post
    Ideally an Se base would be able to pick their battles with some measure of intelligence when interacting with superiors.
    In my experience Se base folks quite often (not you people here ) lack intelligence. But in that case they would probably resort to a full blown attack even faster.

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    Quote Originally Posted by darya View Post
    In my experience Se base folks quite often (not you people here ) lack intelligence. But in that case they would probably resort to a full blown attack even faster.
    You could easily say, assuming you've correctly typed your Se lead, that the degree to which they understand the necessity of and are able to 'lose a battle to win the war' is telling of their intelligence. You could also chalk such things up to dualization.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iris View Post
    EIEs have way too much finesse for that. There was no sinister Ni undertone in his rant.
    "you shall soon die thunderstruck or vultures are gonna eat your balls alive. Take your pick. I´m rising from the depth of hell to smash you in this fated fight."

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    Quote Originally Posted by Elina View Post
    Don't know what type that guy is but it's neither Se-base nor EIE. I agree with @Iris on why this isn' EIE. As far as Se base, they don't talk so much shit. They'll say a harsh line or two but they'll take physical action sooner than ranting verbally till their mouth foams up. This guy doesn't have true Se aggression, it's more like he's overcompensating.
    If I had to take a shot in the dark I'd say this guy is IEE
    Lol. Where's the Ne, and where's the Fi? Or is that just the go-to type for anybody who's kind of weeney-ish.
    Last edited by suedehead; 07-03-2014 at 12:58 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Suedehead View Post
    Lol. Where's the Ne, and where's the Fi? Or is that just a go-to type for anybody who's kind of weeney-ish.
    Hehe Suedehead, you're IEE right ?

    Ofc it's possible for SLE's to talk shit like crazy for minutes and then back down, I've seen it many times.

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    Honestly, i would expect a Se-Polr to not back down from a fight less than an Se Base.

    Anyone would back down under a given circumstance. You put a young Mike Tyson or Cain Velasquez in front of anyone in a street fight scenario and they'll yield.

    Most Se's know exactly how tough they are not. IME.
    I would say that ethically you are still supposed to act as if you have unilateral responsibility; but simultaneously you have to be able to see the other as a fully autonomous, free, aware person.

    Medicalizing social problems has the additional benefit of rendering society not responsible for those social ills. If it’s a disease, it’s nobody’s fault. Yay empiricism.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Suedehead View Post
    Lol. Where's the Ne, and where's the Fi? Or is that just the go-to type for anybody who's kind of weeney-ish.
    It's just a sense I can't put into words as much.
    But the Fi would be how down he got when the guy was talking sense into him.
    The Ne would be cause I don't think he's Se or Te or Fe lol
    Also IEE would put Se in his role function which would explain why it seems like his aggression is over-compensatory (idk if that's a real word lol)
    And why he then criticized himself for getting aggressive later on in the video (We're not confident about our super-ego functions and criticize ourselves in matters dealing with them)

    But yea it's just a sense. Could be wrong, but I definitely don't think it's an Se base person. But even then I could be wrong.. But I just don't think so lol

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    Quote Originally Posted by darya View Post
    In my experience Se base folks quite often (not you people here ) lack intelligence. But in that case they would probably resort to a full blown attack even faster.



    Anyway, If we are generating ideas here about this guys type and just assuming he's an Se base, I wonder, doesn't he have any idea of the effect he is having on the group of people around him? I think an Se-base would be embarrassed frankly of having a p-p-p-pout down in a group like that because they are Fe receptive, even though they may find themselves pushing people for visual reactions at times, I think it would be rare indeed for an SE base to be looking for negative reactions from others.

    I see it as a call for attention to his "problems" in an albeit childish manner (not necessarily "infantile" as those are referring to socionic EROTIC attitudes - often seeing this fact get mixed up here). When he is addressed by the large black male, one who points out his blatant Fe-role/polr "don't shout in my ear", he pauses and finds a means of expressing his tension by fiddling with his shirt. I actually view the black guy as being the Se-base, addressing what he sees and promptly acting on it without "trying to hard".

    "I acted like an asshole, smiles smiles, I am not like that, he was pissing me off". Says the guy in the end of the video. Disregard for the affect of his outburst had on the group and his friends suggests to me that he and they are Fi-valuing, as the nature of their relationships might not have changed due to his temper tantrum in public. I feel as though this would be death for an Se-base.

    My vote, LSE over his quasi, SLE at this time. "I'm from the streets, you're a fucking college boy" says the guy in an American Eagle shirt.

    However, the man could possibly be undualized, regardless of the information element he holds in his ego block, has never experienced a proper dual who would chastise him in the correct manner over time and soften his behaviour to the point that outbursts like this rarely never happen from him (LSE/EII), alternately, warn him about choosing his battles and how others will feel and react if he is yelling at them (SLE/IEI), depending on his sociotype and the corresponding dual.

    To address the question in the original post, I think at the level of basic human nature, any person confronted by a larger person who is pointing their finger at them, using direct eye contact, placing their body within the personal zone and a deeper tone of voice, then evolution teaches us that we should submit. This is a basic unconscious social survival mechanism that goes well beyond the scope of socionics.
    Last edited by wacey; 07-03-2014 at 03:51 AM.
    "If this to end in fire, then we should all burn together. Watch the flames climb higher into the night."

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    Quote Originally Posted by divergentwacey View Post
    Whatever, I stand by my opinion. Doesn't mean I don't know a bunch of highly intelligent ones.

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    is that at a mcdonalds?

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    Quote Originally Posted by divergentwacey View Post


    I see it as a call for attention to his "problems" in an albeit childish manner (not necessarily "infantile" as those are referring to socionic EROTIC attitudes - often seeing this fact get mixed up here). When he is addressed by the large black male, one who points out his blatant Fe-role/polr "don't shout in my ear", he pauses and finds a means of expressing his tension by fiddling with his shirt. I actually view the black guy as being the Se-base, addressing what he sees and promptly acting on it.

    "I acted like an asshole, smiles smiles, I am not like that, he was pissing me off". Says the guy in the end of the video. Disregard for the affect of his outburst had on the group and his friends suggests to me that he and they are Fi-valuing, as the nature of their relationships might not have changed due to his temper tantrum in public. I feel as though this would be death for an Se-base.
    Yes. and Yes!

    I was gonna mention that I got an Se vibe from the black guy too.
    Maybe he's LSI or smt.
    And I agree with you about people forgetting that the erotic attitudes only pertain to that..
    People get offended sometimes by being called infantile or anything like that, but it only pertains to how you flirt/foreplay.
    Like an infantile person might act goofy and joke around when flirting.. that's all that is. It's not a statement on anything else in their life.

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    Don't think its a McD's because people are eating pizza. Probably a cafeteria is my guess.
    "If this to end in fire, then we should all burn together. Watch the flames climb higher into the night."

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    Quote Originally Posted by divergentwacey View Post


    I see it as a call for attention to his "problems" in an albeit childish manner (not necessarily "infantile" as those are referring to socionic EROTIC attitudes -often seeing this fact get mixed up here).
    I have referred to other behavior outside sex, as caregiving, infantile, victim, etc in other posts. I don't believe that because you have entered the erotic realm, that suddenly you switch this behavior on and the rest of your hours you do not engage in that mindset because you are not romancing someone. This is actually suggested in one of the descriptions for EII, IEE:
    These are types who exhibit paternal/maternal tendencies towards others in their everyday lives and may thus carry over these notions and temperaments into their romantic life. These types habitually attempt to give their partner what he/she "needs" (or what they believe they need). As a result, they may become drained by lack of attendance to their own needs and desires. In a partner, they are searching for a combination of strength and gentleness.
    Caregiver attittude is especially easy for me to spot in everyday life.
    You seek a great fortune, you three who are now in chains. You will find a fortune, though it will not be the one you seek.
    But first you must travel a long and difficult road, a road fraught with peril.
    You shall see things, wonderful to tell. You shall see a... cow... on the roof of a cotton house. And, oh, so many startlements.
    I cannot tell you how long this road shall be, but fear not the ob-stacles in your path, for fate has vouchsafed your reward.
    Though the road may wind, yea, your hearts grow weary, still shall ye follow them, even unto your salvation
    .


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pukq_XJmM-k

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    Quote Originally Posted by darya View Post
    So much ownage.
    Ahahahaha!
    You seek a great fortune, you three who are now in chains. You will find a fortune, though it will not be the one you seek.
    But first you must travel a long and difficult road, a road fraught with peril.
    You shall see things, wonderful to tell. You shall see a... cow... on the roof of a cotton house. And, oh, so many startlements.
    I cannot tell you how long this road shall be, but fear not the ob-stacles in your path, for fate has vouchsafed your reward.
    Though the road may wind, yea, your hearts grow weary, still shall ye follow them, even unto your salvation
    .


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pukq_XJmM-k

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    Quote Originally Posted by rosewood View Post
    "you shall soon die thunderstruck or vultures are gonna eat your balls alive. Take your pick. I´m rising from the depth of hell to smash you in this fated fight."

    http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...3-Klaus-Kinski
    That's about right.
    You seek a great fortune, you three who are now in chains. You will find a fortune, though it will not be the one you seek.
    But first you must travel a long and difficult road, a road fraught with peril.
    You shall see things, wonderful to tell. You shall see a... cow... on the roof of a cotton house. And, oh, so many startlements.
    I cannot tell you how long this road shall be, but fear not the ob-stacles in your path, for fate has vouchsafed your reward.
    Though the road may wind, yea, your hearts grow weary, still shall ye follow them, even unto your salvation
    .


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pukq_XJmM-k

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    Quote Originally Posted by Iris View Post
    I have referred to other behavior outside sex, as caregiving, infantile, victim, etc in other posts. I don't believe that because you have entered the erotic realm, that suddenly you switch this behavior on and the rest of your hours you do not engage in that mindset because you are not romancing someone. This is actually suggested in one of the descriptions for EII, IEE:

    Caregiver attittude is especially easy for me to spot in everyday life.
    I disagree purely on principle, that the erotic attitudes may carry over into other areas of an individuals life, however, not necessarily. I know you (and others) have refereed to those four dichotomies outside of sex, and I can perhaps see where you maybe coming from when you pick any given attribute to describe any given person. I believe it is a misuse of the terms and confuses an already convoluted typing process. Truthfully I can't think of any examples atm. Would not aggressors seem like caregivers in everyday life, for instance ESI's as they are not strong aggressors? Can an SLE not behave like an infantile ? And in the case of this thread here, could it not also be possible this man is also caregiver erotically? Its just to silly for typology.
    "If this to end in fire, then we should all burn together. Watch the flames climb higher into the night."

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    A few more thoughts. I don't think that tantrum guy is my activity partner. That is not my kind of Se.

    In this clip, here is my idea of Beta Se as demonstrated by Harrison Ford vs Alpha Se:

    You seek a great fortune, you three who are now in chains. You will find a fortune, though it will not be the one you seek.
    But first you must travel a long and difficult road, a road fraught with peril.
    You shall see things, wonderful to tell. You shall see a... cow... on the roof of a cotton house. And, oh, so many startlements.
    I cannot tell you how long this road shall be, but fear not the ob-stacles in your path, for fate has vouchsafed your reward.
    Though the road may wind, yea, your hearts grow weary, still shall ye follow them, even unto your salvation
    .


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pukq_XJmM-k

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    Quote Originally Posted by Elina View Post
    Yes. and Yes!

    I was gonna mention that I got an Se vibe from the black guy too.
    Maybe he's LSI or smt.
    And I agree with you about people forgetting that the erotic attitudes only pertain to that..
    People get offended sometimes by being called infantile or anything like that, but it only pertains to how you flirt/foreplay.
    Like an infantile person might act goofy and joke around when flirting.. that's all that is. It's not a statement on anything else in their life.
    I agree people shouldn't be offended to be called infantile, but I don't agree that if you joke around while flirting you're automatically an infantile. I mean who doesn't joke around when flirting? It's more in the content and subtle (or not so much ) undertone of interaction...

    I still think this guy is SLE cp6.

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    I strongly doubt he is a sensing type. Multidimensional Se is surely about understanding and using implied power; screaming like a ten year old and not following through isn't Se.

    He's probably an ILE or IEE that's under a lot of stress imo.

    To be fair on the guy we don't know the context that this took place.

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    Quote Originally Posted by darya View Post
    I agree people shouldn't be offended to be called infantile, but I don't agree that if you joke around while flirting you're automatically an infantile. I mean who doesn't joke around when flirting? It's more in the content and subtle (or not so much ) undertone of interaction...

    I still think this guy is SLE cp6.
    No I agree I just mean it's a certain type of goofiness that I've noticed in infantile people's way of joking. I can't explain it but you know what I mean lol
    All types joke and goof around, of course, but I've noticed a childlike goofy quality in infantile joking/flirting that supports the infantile description

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    Not to here,
    But I still think Se is this guy's role function...
    It's so over-compensatory I watched it again and he's talking about how he's "from the streets" and telling people to not "point him out as a suspect when the cops come.."
    It's like he just wants to look tough, like he's playing a role function.
    For comparison I think the guy that talks sense into him is either SLE or LSI.
    He displays true Se manner of taking control and owning the situation.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Elina View Post
    Not to here,
    But I still think Se is this guy's role function...
    It's so over-compensatory I watched it again and he's talking about how he's "from the streets" and telling people to not "point him out as a suspect when the cops come.."
    It's like he just wants to look tough, like he's playing a role function.
    For comparison I think the guy that talks sense into him is either SLE or LSI.
    He displays true Se manner of taking control and owning the situation.
    I absolutely agree.

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    esfj

    alpha, delta: more bark
    gamma, beta: more bite

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    Quote Originally Posted by Suedehead View Post
    Or is the guy in this video an EIE or Se-superego?

    i doubt there is anything we can take from this outburst i can go on forever about why an Se base would do this or a Se role ect one scene is nothing compared to a lifetime of them

    i personally think it is very likely he could be ESFp considering how much we learn from our experience and he looks like a former frat boy, (edit: this is embarrassing what i should have said, is that yes the Se, so to speak, in this video isnt valued by society as a whole, but in certain sub-cultures it may be)

    another thing plz dont idealize anything it will screw you if you are looking for the truth, reality is far from perfect

    however i will say if he is Se base he doesnt own a mirror lol
    Last edited by trifling nincompoop; 07-04-2014 at 04:22 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kill4Me View Post
    esfj

    alpha, delta: more bark
    gamma, beta: more bite
    On that logic, Suarez must be fit into either gamma or beta. I'm hoping he's gamma

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Martrix View Post
    On that logic, Suarez must be fit into either gamma or beta. I'm hoping he's gamma
    no he´s istj
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    Quote Originally Posted by FDG View Post
    no he´s istj
    That's put the muzzle on him!
    I can see ISTj for him, actually.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Martrix View Post
    That's put the muzzle on him!
    I can see ISTj for him, actually.
    ISTj, that's LSI, right? My mother is LSI and she is quite an aggressor when she wants to be. Usually the passive kind. I am not sure if he in anyway matches my mother's type. I was thinking SLI but that may be because I was just reminiscing on SLI chicks from my past and the way he flies of the handle was familiar. Regardless of type this person radiates all kinds of embarrassment and trying to play it off when he is put in his place. Big dude is SLE and dualized. hahah Fighting over food seems kinda alpha though.

    Edit: Nevermind I read it wrong. He wasn't saying video dude was LSI.
    Last edited by Aylen; 07-03-2014 at 11:23 PM. Reason: typo

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Martrix View Post
    That's put the muzzle on him!
    I can see ISTj for him, actually.
    LSI for Suarez or tantrum men? Are y'all messing with me?
    You seek a great fortune, you three who are now in chains. You will find a fortune, though it will not be the one you seek.
    But first you must travel a long and difficult road, a road fraught with peril.
    You shall see things, wonderful to tell. You shall see a... cow... on the roof of a cotton house. And, oh, so many startlements.
    I cannot tell you how long this road shall be, but fear not the ob-stacles in your path, for fate has vouchsafed your reward.
    Though the road may wind, yea, your hearts grow weary, still shall ye follow them, even unto your salvation
    .


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pukq_XJmM-k

  37. #37
    Kill4Me's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Martrix View Post
    On that logic, Suarez must be fit into either gamma or beta. I'm hoping he's gamma
    gamma: intelligently precise
    beta: crudely precise
    delta: crudely imprecise
    alpha: intelligently imprecise

  38. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Suedehead View Post
    Or is the guy in this video an EIE or Se-superego?
    An opportunity has arisen for you to observe EIE rage in this thread. Stay tuned.

    http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...75#post1028275
    You seek a great fortune, you three who are now in chains. You will find a fortune, though it will not be the one you seek.
    But first you must travel a long and difficult road, a road fraught with peril.
    You shall see things, wonderful to tell. You shall see a... cow... on the roof of a cotton house. And, oh, so many startlements.
    I cannot tell you how long this road shall be, but fear not the ob-stacles in your path, for fate has vouchsafed your reward.
    Though the road may wind, yea, your hearts grow weary, still shall ye follow them, even unto your salvation
    .


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pukq_XJmM-k

  39. #39
    Haikus
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iris View Post
    An opportunity has arisen for you to observe EIE rage in this thread. Stay tuned.

    http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...75#post1028275
    Man, it's not even sure you're EIE, you're leading people astray with your fit of anger : http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...Type-me-please

  40. #40
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    I have learned a lot about myself since that 2-year old typing thread. There is no question that I am a Beta. If there is any indecision it would be between IEI and EIE. I feel fairly confident at this point that I am not IEI.

    I am very controlled because I was beaten with a belt as a child and teenager if I ever raised my voice or disagreed with my father.
    You seek a great fortune, you three who are now in chains. You will find a fortune, though it will not be the one you seek.
    But first you must travel a long and difficult road, a road fraught with peril.
    You shall see things, wonderful to tell. You shall see a... cow... on the roof of a cotton house. And, oh, so many startlements.
    I cannot tell you how long this road shall be, but fear not the ob-stacles in your path, for fate has vouchsafed your reward.
    Though the road may wind, yea, your hearts grow weary, still shall ye follow them, even unto your salvation
    .


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pukq_XJmM-k

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