Help me figure out their instinct stackings - some guesswork to do!

[aisa]

OK, so recently I got interested in Enneagram instincts and to understand how they work better I’d like to ask you to type instincts of a few people I described below. I tried to list the things that might be relevant when trying to discern instincts.
I don’t know their enneagram types (although I have suspicions) so if you feel like typing only one person, all of them, just the main instinct or enneagram – feel free to write anything.

I’d really love if there were instinct typings including two main instincts, cause that’s what I’m mainly trying to understand now. So basically I want to figure out which of these people are sp/so, sx/sp, so/sx, etc. etc.
I’m really curious. Thanks!

- very concerned with being financially secure
- almost always proper in behaviour due to not trusting people and avoiding being hurt
- low to medium sex drive
- says that often doesn’t realise that wants sex until the partner takes initiative
- pessimistic
- organised and always dressed nicely
- doesn’t like groups and calls one person a close colleague
- pays attention to the body but never undereats
- says that doesn’t like morbidity but says that sometimes compulsively watches real life murder stories and later reports being scared of the neighbours
- doesn’t like action films
- socially indifferent
- loves violin music and says that imagines that the music could be felt in the whole body when playing the violin
- makes sacrifices for financial security

- medium to high sex drive
- says that is a simple person
- sexually open
- concerned with being financially secure
- optimistic
- doesn’t like morbid art but enjoys watching thrillers involving investigations on medium level of morbidity
- loves action films that are violent but not gory in details
- not concerned with other people’s opinions unless they can harm this person’s interests
- socially open
- has a large group of acquaintances but doesn’t have close friends except for the partner with whom really appreciates the closeness
- friendly towards people
- can spend hours relaxing doing hobbies indoors
- likes acquiring new high quality material goods (mostly due to personal interests but also partly linked with status)
- prone to wearing the same type of clothes
- makes sacrifices for financial security and love

- medium to high sex drive
- says smn has to smell right
- quickly gets physical
- has trouble with emotional closeness and intimacy, committing
- might secretly wallow in sadness after a break up for a year yet show a smiling face to strangers
- has a large circle of friends but only one person whom calls a best friend
- very concerned with being financially secure
- sexually open
- pays a lot of attention to the body and may periodically undereat to stay in shape
- doesn’t like morbidity in any form whether art or movies
- concerned with other people’s opinions of the self due to wanting to avoid being humiliated
- socially fairly open
- makes sacrifices for financial security
- pays attention to other people’s clothing

- says that people other than the very closest family could not exist
- doesn’t have friends and says that doesn’t need them
- friendly towards people and has no problem chatting with random strangers
- sometimes seems socially oblivious with the things that says, jokes that makes and is not bothered by other’s perception
- has a hobby strongly related to animals, loves nature and being outdoors
- can spend hours upon hours in solitude and doesn’t feel lonely
- concerned with status and financial stability (talks about money a lot)
- has a high sex drive
- is very independent and prone to taking risks
- when really wants to do something only own opinion matters
- prone to wearing the same type of clothes and buys same clothes in bulk
- optimistic
- says group interaction is draining and wants alone time
- says that is a simple person
- sexually open
- loves action films that are violent but not gory in details
- makes sacrifices for financial security

- medium to high sex drive
- says that couldn’t live without sex, food and smn to have a discussion with
- pays attention to the body but never undereats
- sexually very open
- says smn has to smell right
- doesn’t like morbid art but loves watching thrillers involving psychological investigations on medium level of morbidity
- loves action films that are violent but not gory in details
- concerned with other people’s opinions of the self due to wanting to avoid being hurt
- socially withdrawn
- doesn’t have many friends but calls two people best friends
- says that prefers to have one or two close people who really know this person rather than a large circle of acquaintances
- makes sacrifices for love and closeness
- says that likes people but doesn’t like spending too much time in large groups
- sometimes harsh sense of humour unaware of people’s reactions
- prone to wearing the same type of clothes

- medium to high sex drive
- doesn’t like groups and doesn’t usually have more than one person that calls a friend and it doesn’t include family (usually a partner)
- appreciates morbid art and movies
- concerned with being financially secure
- says that couldn’t live life without passion in it
- enjoys playing violent computer games
- not concerned with other people’s opinions unless they can harm this person’s interests
- socially very withdrawn
- makes sacrifices for love and closeness
- sexually very open
- can spend hours upon hours in solitude
- close contact with nature is relaxing

So what are your thoughts?



@darya, @lemontrees, @Reficulris, @Elina, @The Martrix, @Iris, @woofwoofl, @epheme, @lungs, @InvisibleJim, @Ollyx2OxenFree, @LostInDreams, @anndelise, @rosewood, @silke, @Park

and @ anyone who feels like answering

[The Martrix]

Person 1: sp/sp
Person 2: so/sx
Person 3: sp/sx
Person 4: so/sx
Person 5: sx/sp
Person 6: sp/sx

Probably all wrong but mehhh

[aisa]

@The Martrix, I edited Person 4 cause forgot to add one (methinks important ) thing: "- concerned with status and financial stability (talks about money a lot)" (apparently I must have accidentally deleted it when I was formatting the OP...)
does it change your typing in any manner or does it not influence it?

edit: and LOLLL @ sp/sp typing

[The Martrix]

@The Martrix, I edited Person 4 cause forgot to add one (methinks important ) thing: "- concerned with status and financial stability (talks about money a lot)" (apparently I must have accidentally deleted it when I was formatting the OP...)
does it change your typing in any manner or does it not influence it?

edit: and LOLLL @ sp/sp typing

Person 1 seems to be sp everything. I can't make head or tails of Person 4, though. Must be all of the instincts, equally.

[Ron Mexican]

So what are your thoughts?

Here's my stab at it =]

Person 1: Sp/sx. Possible E types may be 6, 8, or 1.
Person 2: So/sx
Person 3: Sp/So
Person 4: Sp/Sx
Person 5: Sx/Sp
Person 6: Sx/Sp

Those are my best guesses lol

[silke]

@aisa how high of a sex drive someone has or what type of movies they like has little to do with stackings. i felt like there wasn't enough information in those descriptions to make good guesstimates but these were my impression after reading them: 1. sp/sx 2. soc-first 4. soc-last.

do you happen to have any photographs of these people? preferably more than one that would show their faces with different expressions. for instinct v/i purposes.

[aisa]

umm... @Elina @The Martrix - sorry guys, I edited person 2 with one more statement that came to mind (is it so, sp or sx related? does it influence typing?):
"- likes acquiring new high quality material goods (mostly due to personal interests but also partly linked with status)"

I'll try not to edit more, sorry.

[Birdie]

I haven't posted much lately regarding typology in any form even though my knowledge and interest
hasn't waned. If anyone wants to discuss my opinions and theories in a non-confrontational and
non-hostile manner I would be more than willing to give a more detailed explanation and explain my
rationale in regards to this exercise. Conversations can be nice. I will not argue with you. Arguing is
so silly. That being said; below are my responses.


1) sp/sx
2) so/sx
3) so/sp (I am feeling that based upon your description of this person they use sex as a social skill
slash tool slash fun hobby and less as a form of intimacy; to me that screams so and not sx. The
lack of desire for intimacy makes me think that sx is not a possibility regardless of how much they
like to fuck. They like to fuck, not be intimate. There is a difference.)
4) sp/sx (I am confused by your first description. I cannot understand what it means... I do not think
it is important enough to sway my opinion however, just noting.)
5) sx/sp
6) sp/sx

[aisa]

@silke hmm yeah I'm still learning so I just threw out a bunch of info hoping for feedback. My line of thinking was sth along the lines "likes morbidity -> sp" "fixated on sex and closeness -> sx"
probably I'm wrong there, but that's why I'm asking - to figure out how to judge this stuff and discern stackings

I have pics of a few of those people, but I feel like sharing them in a forum without their knowledge would be a breech of their privacy, so we'll have just the written descriptions to go by here

but if there are more questions that could help discern things more than what I had provided - I'll try to answer them to the best of my knowledge

[Ron Mexican]

umm... @Elina @The Martrix - sorry guys, I edited person 2 with one more statement that came to mind (is it so, sp or sx related? does it influence typing?):
"- likes acquiring new high quality material goods (mostly due to personal interests but also partly linked with status)"

I'll try not to edit more, sorry.

That statement alone (I didn't even look back at my typing of the person or the rest of the statements) is sp/so

I am feeling that based upon your description of this person they use sex as a social skill
slash tool slash fun hobby and less as a form of intimacy; to me that screams so and not sx. The
lack of desire for intimacy makes me think that sx is not a possibility regardless of how much they
like to fuck. They like to fuck, not be intimate. There is a difference.)

Yes!! That's why I didn't have sx in this person's type either. Sexual instinct, despite the name, is actually the least likely to fuck around. They look for that special connection and not just flesh. Just flesh is SP domain.

[Birdie]

Yes!! That's why I didn't have sx in this person's type either. Sexual instinct, despite the name, is actually the least likely to fuck around. They look for that special connection and not just flesh. Just flesh is SP domain.

Really? I think it leans more toward being so than sp.

Why do you think sp?

[aisa]

I haven't posted much lately regarding typology in any form even though my knowledge and interest
hasn't waned. If anyone wants to discuss my opinions and theories in a non-confrontational and
non-hostile manner I would be more than willing to give a more detailed explanation and explain my
rationale in regards to this exercise. Conversations can be nice. I will not argue with you. Arguing is
so silly. That being said; below are my responses.

Sounds like you've been through some unpleasant situations in this forum. I really hope that this thread remains a place of calmy sharing opinions. Thank you for contributing.

3) so/sp (I am feeling that based upon your description of this person they use sex as a social skill
slash tool slash fun hobby and less as a form of intimacy; to me that screams so and not sx. The
lack of desire for intimacy makes me think that sx is not a possibility regardless of how much they
like to fuck. They like to fuck, not be intimate. There is a difference.)

Hmmm I think you're unfortunately onto sth. While I don't think this person is as shallow as the above description might suggest - it is smn who periodically surprises me with their comments and superficiality of opinions. It's smn definitely more physically driven than intimacy driven. I know this person well enough to see that there is more to all of it though. The way it works looking from the sidelines is: alone, alone, tired of being lonely, finds smn attractive and interesting, goes physical with no strings attached, after a while starts getting attached but refuses to acknowledge it, trouble with pride, at that point when actually this person starts falling in love it becomes to "dangerous" and this person withdraws or makes their partner go through tests (trust issues big time). Usually this makes things fall apart and the cycle starts all over again. I told this person when listening to complaints of lack of partner that it must be very difficult to be on receiving end for smn involved with this person. Recently the cycle started again but it seems the partner managed to jump through hoops so far and this person told me recently that is in love... So I'm keeping my fingers crossed.

4) sp/sx (I am confused by your first description. I cannot understand what it means... I do not think
it is important enough to sway my opinion however, just noting.)

This person says that doesn't need other people socially and doesn't crave friendships besides their partner and children.

[silke]

@silke hmm yeah I'm still learning so I just threw out a bunch of info hoping for feedback. My line of thinking was sth along the lines "likes morbidity -> sp" "fixated on sex and closeness -> sx"
probably I'm wrong there, but that's why I'm asking - to figure out how to judge this stuff and discern stackings

I have pics of a few of those people, but I feel like sharing them in a forum without their knowledge would be a breech of their privacy, so we'll have just the written descriptions to go by here

but if there are more questions that could help discern things more than what I had provided - I'll try to answer them to the best of my knowledge

most of my family is sp first and there is no preoccupation with morbidity that i've noticed in any of them, which is why i said that these don't seem to be related. likewise sex drive seems to be mostly physiological in its origin.

the way i go about figuring out stackings is to try to remember everything that the person has said and done, generalize it into three categories and balance those out in my mind to see how they line up, but this approach is probably too Ni specific since intuition makes it easy generalize discrete behaviors like this.

for additional questions what would you say is the biggest motivation behind the everyday actions of each of these people and how does this motivation align with the instincts? i find it to be very telling to figure out what is the primary need that they are trying to support, which is the 1st instinct, while how they go about it would be the secondary one. with photos: you can also pm me and i'll try to line them up with the instinct composites that Galen has made. it's up to you, if you feel like it's still a breach of privacy then that's fine too.

umm... @Elina @The Martrix - sorry guys, I edited person 2 with one more statement that came to mind (is it so, sp or sx related? does it influence typing?):
"- likes acquiring new high quality material goods (mostly due to personal interests but also partly linked with status)"

That statement alone (I didn't even look back at my typing of the person or the rest of the statements) is sp/so

i would have said so/sp for this quote: it's acquisition of goods (sp) to support social status (so) or some other interests. typically people "juggle around" their secondary instinct to support of their first one, and this quote illustrates that kind of secondary flexibility in the sphere of sp. the first instinct is kind of rigid in nature in comparison to the second one, like a deep seated constant need that needs to be supported.

[aisa]

@silke thank you for replying
I'll give it some more thought and try to describe it tomorrow morning when I have access to my computer (writing from mobile at the moment).

Everyone feel free to discuss things more (go on! go on! I find this really interesting) and thank you so much for contributing so far

[Ron Mexican]

Really? I think it leans more toward being so than sp.

Why do you think sp?

I think So might actually fuck around more, but their motivation is to have fun, to conquer people with their charm, to be the "big man/woman on campus."
But Sp, while not having as many sexual partners, I think does it more "for flesh" in that it's about the physical sensations and physical needs for them. Still not for intimacy.
But honestly, I haven't ever been close to a Sp leading person, so this is just theory. My best friends have pretty much always been So/sx. So if you know differently I'd love to learn =]

[Ron Mexican]

@silke hmm yeah I'm still learning so I just threw out a bunch of info hoping for feedback. My line of thinking was sth along the lines "likes morbidity -> sp" "fixated on sex and closeness -> sx"
probably I'm wrong there, but that's why I'm asking - to figure out how to judge this stuff and discern stackings

I have pics of a few of those people, but I feel like sharing them in a forum without their knowledge would be a breech of their privacy, so we'll have just the written descriptions to go by here

but if there are more questions that could help discern things more than what I had provided - I'll try to answer them to the best of my knowledge

I would actually say that Sx would like morbidity more than the other types. They're the ones that look for connection with people and are sometimes hopeless romantics which also means facing disappointment. Broken-heart love songs are Sx types domain.. if that's the kind of morbidity you mean. And while Sx is fixated on closeness, they're not actually as sexual as some of the other types (except for "with that one person") because they're too idealistic about relationships to fuck around. I'd say Soc/Sx is the stacking that's mostly likely to be the "charmer" and to like to be "the playa" and all as far as sex. Their attention is scattered and not focused on one person - that's the Soc, but they are good at making people feel an intimate atmosphere when one on one - that's the Sx.

[aisa]

most of my family is sp first and there is no preoccupation with morbidity that i've noticed in any of them, which is why i said that these don't seem to be related. likewise sex drive seems to be mostly physiological in its origin.

thanks for clarifying - this wasn't unfortunately exactly apparent from some of the instincts descriptions

the way i go about figuring out stackings is to try to remember everything that the person has said and done, generalize it into three categories and balance those out in my mind to see how they line up, but this approach is probably too Ni specific since intuition makes it easy generalize discrete behaviors like this.

yeah, this is Ni, I do the same up to the point of generalization - but making a generalization is where things get murky, cause I see too many possible Ne options behind each behaviour and thing said...

for additional questions what would you say is the biggest motivation behind the everyday actions of each of these people and how does this motivation align with the instincts? i find it to be very telling to figure out what is the primary need that they are trying to support, which is the 1st instinct, while how they go about it would be the secondary one.

I'll make it into a separate post of (hopefully more or less concise) additional descriptions in a moment.

with photos: you can also pm me and i'll try to line them up with the instinct composites that Galen has made. it's up to you, if you feel like it's still a breach of privacy then that's fine too.

yeah, thank you for the offer, this could actually be really interesting ...but I do think this would still be a breach of their privacy, so let's stay with descriptions

i would have said so/sp for this quote: it's acquisition of goods (sp) to support social status (so) or some other interests. typically people "juggle around" their secondary instinct to support of their first one, and this quote illustrates that kind of secondary flexibility in the sphere of sp. the first instinct is kind of rigid in nature in comparison to the second one, like a deep seated constant need that needs to be supported.

hmm I'm not certain which supports which in this statement regarding that person, the phrasing I used "- likes acquiring new high quality material goods (mostly due to personal interests but also partly linked with status)" was exactly how I observe this working in "Person 2". So for example this is a person that has a few particular interests and buys things in line with those interests and doesn't stay attached to those things - sells them to buy new things that finds interesting, does try to buy "the best available" only when the functionality of "the best available" is sth beneficial for the said interests and if it's sth that will be beneficial for longterm use. If along with this comes the fact that smn else thinks that they are an "expert" and own sth good then all the better. It's a person who says that would like to have a great car as a toy but in the end when faced with a decision buys a car that is useful and doesn't have the "wow" factor for other people. It is also someone who reports thinking like this though: after leaving the car in the parking lot looks around, scans other cars, looks back at this person's own car and thinks "Meh, dirty, but it'll do."

I would actually say that Sx would like morbidity more than the other types. They're the ones that look for connection with people and are sometimes hopeless romantics which also means facing disappointment. Broken-heart love songs are Sx types domain.. if that's the kind of morbidity you mean. And while Sx is fixated on closeness, they're not actually as sexual as some of the other types (except for "with that one person") because they're too idealistic about relationships to fuck around.

I think I'm beginning to understand what the instincts are about and if indeed I'm beginning to grasp this, then the above would be a good description of sx-first.

However what I meant when I mentioned "morbidity" was sth along the lines images presented in this thread (-1-, -2-). And partially due to that thread I was associating sp with morbidity. I was quite literal with my understanding of the word.
I know "Person 6" likes art similar to presented below:

 

I'd say Soc/Sx is the stacking that's mostly likely to be the "charmer" and to like to be "the playa" and all as far as sex. Their attention is scattered and not focused on one person - that's the Soc, but they are good at making people feel an intimate atmosphere when one on one - that's the Sx.

this sounds like a good description of so/sx

I think this applies to "Person 2" to some extent. I find it difficult to discern whether this is so/sx or sx/so though. This is someone who is perceived as charming and enjoyed being perceived as a player and even enhanced this image by joking, while in fact didn't go further than let's call it "2nd base" (what a terrible expression) with a few people in this person's life. This is someone who was alone a lot of the time, looking for someone close. This person is faithful to their partner who is the only person this person had sex with. This person's acquaintances would have trouble believing it though. This is someone who had trouble deciding on longterm commitment in this person's relationship and said that this was difficult because this person needed to be sure that the decision was right, because this person knew that once this person decides to commit longterm then will be willing to do just about anything for their partner. To make it short - I think this is someone who created an illusion of being a player to cover up this person's idealism when it comes to finding "the one" and only a few people can see through this illusion.
Sometimes this person's attention is scattered and this is someone who can make other people feel good when one on one - this is also true.

[aisa]

for additional questions what would you say is the biggest motivation behind the everyday actions of each of these people and how does this motivation align with the instincts? i find it to be very telling to figure out what is the primary need that they are trying to support, which is the 1st instinct, while how they go about it would be the secondary one.

ok, so I'll have a go at additional descriptions:

biggest motivation behind the everyday actions: probably safety and security, also a hidden need to not be hurt by other people (sometimes trouble standing up for own views - but is capable of this at other times and real trouble taking risks)
guess at instinct 1: sp
guess at instinct 2: sx

additional comment: This is someone who said that would rather spend their life alone without any commitment than being in a relationship where they have to make too many sacrifices. Loyalty of other people is very important to this person. It's someone difficult to get to know well.

biggest motivation behind the everyday actions: I have trouble figuring this one out, it's a mix of a need to be accepted, loved and not hurt by other people, also free to pursue interests and financially safe. I think this person needs to be liked. But this person reports needing other people as long as they are of use and uses their connections many times for this person's own benefit. At the same time I've seen this person act seemingly selfless - sometimes it was selfless and sometimes there was a well-hidden personal motivation that kept this person's interests in line with the interests of the person that was receiving the help. Doesn't like taking risks.
guess at instinct 1: so (or sx)
guess at instinct 2: sx (or so)

additional comment: This is someone who can be very helpful to other people, especially as long as believes in their good intentions (and can sacrifice for other people) but at the same time this is a person that has a "switch" into the "now only I matter" mode.
also, there is some more info quite imprtant in typing of this person in the post above on the idealism in close relationships and attitude to "goods". It's someone seemingly open but difficult to know well on emotional level - very secretive.

biggest motivation behind the everyday actions: probably safety and security, also a hidden need to not be hurt and humiliated by other people. This person needs to be liked.
guess at instinct 1: sp
guess at instinct 2: so (or sx)

additional comment: This one is difficult for me to figure out, cause I can see past the shallow behaviour and don't know which instinct is which. This person admits that is troubled with trust issues and is trying to change and warned their current partner of this (more in this post). It's someone seemingly open but difficult to know well on emotional level - very secretive.

biggest motivation behind the everyday actions: this person wants to be free and independent from almost everyone and associated freedom strongly with financial security, wants to pursue own interests and to be loved by the closest people
guess at instinct 1: sp
guess at instinct 2: sx

additional comment: This is someone who decided to change the course of life to be able to be financially independent and provide for their partner and be with the partner. It's someone seemingly open but difficult to know well on emotional level.

biggest motivation behind the everyday actions: this person wants to form a close bond with a few chosen people as individuals and at the same time to be free to do what considers right for the self and free from other people's judgements and influences
guess at instinct 1: sx
guess at instinct 2: sp (or so)

additional comment: This is someone who went to great lengths to get close to smn in a relationship and who treats love as the most important thing in life, willing to sacrifice a lot for it. It's also someone who wants to be liked "as is" and doesn't glue well with groups, isn't accommodating towards the group, but gets more flexible for people who matter to this person. It is someone who likes people as humanity, but says that doesn't need to spend time with them in order for it to be so. Tries to fit into groups sometimes out of necessity, but finds this awkward and prefers one on one interaction. It's someone difficult to get to know well.

biggest motivation behind the everyday actions: staying safe from being hurt and tricked and at the same time deep need to form a close bond with someone. Freedom to make own decisions and live life according to one's own standards.
guess at instinct 1: sp (or sx)
guess at instinct 2: sx (or sp)

additional comment: This is someone who went to great lengths to get close to smn in a relationship and who treats love as an important thing in life, but values own independence more. Finds most groups awkward and prefers one on one interaction. It's someone difficult to get to know well.
example of art preferences in this post (although this might not necessarily matter from what I've understood by now)

I still have trouble discerning what "so" is supposed to mean depending on the position in stacking... I've noticed I wrote all of these people are difficult to get to know on emotional level - I guess I like a challenge

[Ron Mexican]

 

Unfortunately the pics in your number links weren't showing for me . I would still say that the pics in the spoiler are Sx/sp and maybe a darker E type, like 4. That's got E4 written all over it lol. I could also see sp/sx but sx/sp is described as a conflicted, tortured artist type of instinctual stacking

[Aylen]

As an sx/sp I would say my drive for connections and intensity override my survival instinct in the beginning but it kicks in when things get out of hand. I am not even sure where my so fits in. Definitely not a sexual drive in the traditional sense...but sex is a part of it. I live with an sp/sx E6 and they aren't particularly sexually driven either. They seem to be driven to make money and make life comfortable for everyone. I voted them "most caring and useful" in my home and everyone agreed. <-- it was funnier than it seems...had to be there. They felt appreciated. I bought a cake.

They will take one for the team and take care of everything that needs to be done. I don't even think about the stackings of other household members because we are like ships passing... Now that I think about it, one may be so/sp or sp/so because they are always afraid of not having enough money or whatever (and they have enough), they care what the neighbors think and no one else in the house really cares what neighbors think. @silke where is that thread you created with the instinct stackings? It was a very good one.


@aisa @Elina

I am E4 and those pics were not my preference for sure.I enjoy depictions of death in art but those just seemed bland to me. Now that I said it, I hope it didn't offend anyone who likes it. I love Giger though and my taste in art is pretty vast.

 

[Persephone]

A thread full of interesting information.
How do we make a difference between sx/sp and sp/sx?

[The Martrix]

A thread full of interesting information.
How do we make a difference between sx/sp and sp/sx?

I would like to know this, too.

[darya]

Aisa it's very hard for me to type people based on this information. People with different stackings can do exactly the same things but with different motivations, so it's hard to tell. I also agree you kinda have to know them in person and feel their energy or some shit Pics would be of great help, but I agree it's not ok to post pics of people without their permission.

I will read this descriptions more precisely though and see what I can come up with .

"likes acquiring new high quality material goods (mostly due to personal interests but also partly linked with status)"
That statement alone (I didn't even look back at my typing of the person or the rest of the statements) is sp/so

I disagree completely I wouldn't be so quick, variant stackings can be very tricky. This statement alone doesn't mean that this is this persons primary motivation in life. But if we go by that statement alone I would say so/sp and not the other way around.

Yes!! That's why I didn't have sx in this person's type either. Sexual instinct, despite the name, is actually the least likely to fuck around. They look for that special connection and not just flesh. Just flesh is SP domain.

And while Sx is fixated on closeness, they're not actually as sexual as some of the other types (except for "with that one person") because they're too idealistic about relationships to fuck around.

Don't agree either, it depends completely on individual."Special connection" can mean very different things to different people.

Sx is certainly not about fucking around though. And sex drive is not really an indicator (at least that's the consensus, but I dont really agree with it completely - I think there are some major correlations) In my experience people who are sx last for example, especially sp/so, give off kind of an asexual vibe.

Sx first when unhealthy can certainly show as promiscuity (or ironically, as abstinence - both as an unhealthy way to deal with your neurosis).

I don't agree that sx first people are necessarily looking for a romantic connection or that they're extremely idealistic - it depends on an individual . Sx is more about the intense one on one connection (with people, things, ideas, hobbies), not necesarily romantic idealism (that's more E4 stuff).

Sx last can also manifest in weird ways and with some strange relations to sexuality. Sx middle probably in general has least fucked up relationship with sex, because the second instinct is the one that causes you the least neurosis.

for additional questions what would you say is the biggest motivation behind the everyday actions of each of these people and how does this motivation align with the instincts? i find it to be very telling to figure out what is the primary need that they are trying to support, which is the 1st instinct, while how they go about it would be the secondary one.typically people "juggle around" their secondary instinct to support of their first one, and this quote illustrates that kind of secondary flexibility in the sphere of sp. the first instinct is kind of rigid in nature in comparison to the second one, like a deep seated constant need that needs to be supported.[

THIS. The last instinct is your blind spot, the one you are clueless and inept at, but don't care about it that much. The first is your neurosis, which "drives your life" and you would sacrifise other things for it (especially the last instinct). The first instinct is behind your motivations, but the second instinct is the "road" you take to get or satisfy the first one. Cause if you don't get your first met, you get higly neurotic and anxious. (well at least how high it is compared to others). Basically, what silke said

I would actually say that Sx would like morbidity more than the other types. They're the ones that look for connection with people and are sometimes hopeless romantics which also means facing disappointment. Broken-heart love songs are Sx types domain.. if that's the kind of morbidity you mean.

Morbidity is more E4, E5 territorry, but yeah, probably not with sx last. Instinctual variants manifest very differently in different Enneagram types. E5 sx/sp will be very different in terms of intensity and withdrawness than E7 sx/sp.

I'd say Soc/Sx is the stacking that's mostly likely to be the "charmer" and to like to be "the playa" and all as far as sex. Their attention is scattered and not focused on one person - that's the Soc, but they are good at making people feel an intimate atmosphere when one on one - that's the Sx.

Yes, I think "players" are usually so/sx, or the life of the party people that everybody knows (but with assertive type enneagram combined - E3, E7, E8). Because they spread their charm thin between as many people as possible. They're usually very easy to talk to and charming, but not really that intense, more like flighty and a bit superficial.

sx/so is the most intense imo and usually most crazy - flamboyant or even self distructive if you will (again, withdrawn E types are more contained when it comes to this intensity, it's not so outwardlly apparent at first sight. Sx/so is like scanning the environment for the person/interest that peaks your attention and then only paying attention to that person - it's like laser, not really spreading it thin, superficial charm.

How do we make a difference between sx/sp and sp/sx?

These two are in my experience the hardest to tell apart, I can't really tell in a lot of cases. 4w5 are usually one or the other, but they're often very close. You have to find out by yourself which is your primary neurosis. I didn't really have that problem (once I properly understood what the stackings are all about), because mine are in very different ratios.

Different people can have really expressed one variant, and the second much lower, or the first two are almost the same. Or they can be all almost equal.that really affects how easy it is to figure a person and their instinctual variants out.

@The Martrix i don't think you're sx first.

[Olly From Wally World]

Sorry for the late response! Didn't look at my notifications.

While I can't really be sure with this information, my guesses would be:
1. sp/sx
2. so/sx
3. so/sp
4. sp/sx
5. sx/sp
6. sp/sx

A thread full of interesting information.
How do we make a difference between sx/sp and sp/sx?

The secondary instinct is the least anxious instinct since it doesn't completely occupy our minds like the dominant so people usually explore more in that domain and may use it to attain the dominant's desires.

Taking that into consideration, sx/sp would use sp for sx so I usually think of sx/sp as someone who is in charge mode, by default. When they're 'off', they're charging their energy and then when they are turned on (which can come on too strong or sudden to some), they spend the energy they were charging on a focused point (sometimes obliterating it ). It's more unpredictable and on/off than Sx/so. I've seen its unpredictable bursts likened to lightning and that makes sense, haha. I imagine they leave the strongest mark on those they've narrowed in on. Sp/sx uses their chemical energy in order to attain something more stable and reliable. So maybe you can imagine someone using telekinesis, bringing that which is interesting closer towards them instead of physically grabbing it since the sp wants to play it safe? I dunno, lol.

At the very least, relationship-wise, Sp/sx will find it easier to commit since they value stability and domesticity while sexuals are more erratic since they are driven by their passion and sexual energy. Sx will be more conflicted about commitment than Sp since they may fear that the intensity won't be sustained. When the relationship is losing passion, they may fantasize about strangers more (and sometimes give into temptation), feel like leaving, cause more push-pull to give it more juice, etc.

What do you guys think?

[darya]

I haven't posted much lately regarding typology in any form even though my knowledge and interest
hasn't waned. If anyone wants to discuss my opinions and theories in a non-confrontational and
non-hostile manner I would be more than willing to give a more detailed explanation and explain my
rationale in regards to this exercise. Conversations can be nice. I will not argue with you. Arguing is
so silly.

@Hydrangea why are you always so paranoid? Are you sure you're not projecting your sarcastic, confrontational and defensive tone of communication onto other people?

Maybe you should put a little trust into people and be a bit warmer and welcoming and I promise you will get that attitude back. Idk maybe it's just some sort of misunderstanding, but you come off really defensive, dismissive and sarcastic. It's no wonder people react to you negatively.

I have no idea whether it's intentional and you're trying to appear above people and keep them at save distance with this or you're really unaware of your communication style and are genuinely shocked when people react negatively. I have a suspicion it's the first though.

[Aylen]

A thread full of interesting information.
How do we make a difference between sx/sp and sp/sx?

I would like to know this, too.

I think this may have been posted here before too

http://typewatchenneagram.blogspot.c...ct-ranges.html

[darya]

@Ollyx2OxenFree (holy hell your name and a deceiving girly avatar )

I agree with your description. I read somewhere that sx/sp is the most internally conflicted stacking and I can totally see why that would be the case.

[The Martrix]

@The Martrix i don't think you're sx first.

I'm sp first. I know that, at least. What's the difference between sp-4 and sp-5?

[Amber]

Enneagram 5 would research or analyze stuff alone (themselves included), they wouldn't rely on others' opinions. Let alone ask others to illuminate them. Sp instinct in E 5 gives a more hermetic personality, it's like doubling the individualism and detachment/alienation of type 5. I think labcoat and phantomShadow are sp/sx 5 ...though I haven't seen too much.

[Olly From Wally World]

@Ollyx2OxenFree (holy hell your name and a deceiving girly avatar )

I agree with your description. I read somewhere that sx/sp is the most internally conflicted stacking and I can totally see why that would be the case.

Lol! Everyone mentions the girly avatar on here. Sexy name, right? *flips hair*

Yeah, I've read the same thing. I have a Facebook Friend who I'm sure is an sx/sp 4, too (she also believes she is).

[lemontrees]

I think intensity = sx/so > sx/sp > so/sx > sp/sx > so/sp > sp/so

also I think you can tell if someone has an So or not, at least, by who they are able to focus on in conversation. so-lasts always seem like they are talking to one person at one time. they may not even notice who is standing next to them or what they are saying

so-first will seem more dispersed, and have a hard time shutting this other stuff out *to* focus

i judge sp's place by how easy it seems to get to know someone. sp-firsts seem "warmer" at first b/c they will give you so or sp more freely. sp-seconds seem like they want to share something with you but are refusing or can't. but one you get to that level it's more of an outpouring. sp-firsts are more "laid-back," "sp-seconds" are more stiff.

sx-first can either look like they will steamroll you right now or seem deceptively disengaged. sx-second is more "small-dose easy to access" intimacy.

[aisa]

Ok so what would be the key behavioral differences allowing to discern between the following pairs:
sx/so vs. so/sx
sx/sp vs. sx/so
...?

[Amber]

Ok so what would be the key behavioral differences allowing to discern between the following pairs:
sx/so vs. so/sx
sx/sp vs. sx/so
...?

In very short and simple:

- sx/so is much more interested in image and power within a group and is usually markedly polarizing. So/sx is a bit softer, less aggressive and more dependent on a need to get along well with many people (think affiliating vs dividing or smooth, charming vs challenging).

- sx/sp is more interested in deep/intense bonding with another than in status within a group and has more awareness of the psyche of another (think Jung or Freud, they were both sx/sp); Both sx/so and sx/sp are rather intense and radical in their views or their likes and dislikes, but sx/so is a bit smoother, at least when interested in keeping "face" with those they want to have on their side. Sx/sp can be more tactless and self-absorbed.

[Satan]

@Ollyx2OxenFree (holy hell your name and a deceiving girly avatar )

I agree with your description. I read somewhere that sx/sp is the most internally conflicted stacking and I can totally see why that would be the case.

i thought sp/sx was the most conflicted.

[Amber]

i thought sp/sx was the most conflicted.

it's the darkest and more prone to isolation, but tension in sx/sp (when it's there) is more obvious imo; sp/sx looks more like having their feet on the ground somehow

[Satan]

I think So might actually fuck around more, but their motivation is to have fun, to conquer people with their charm, to be the "big man/woman on campus."
But Sp, while not having as many sexual partners, I think does it more "for flesh" in that it's about the physical sensations and physical needs for them. Still not for intimacy.
But honestly, I haven't ever been close to a Sp leading person, so this is just theory. My best friends have pretty much always been So/sx. So if you know differently I'd love to learn =]

from what i understand it's sp/so that tend to sleep around.

[Satan]

it's the darkest and more prone to isolation, but tension in sx/sp (when it's there) is more obvious imo; sp/sx looks more like having their feet on the ground somehow

sx/sp might appaer more tension, but that's just because sx is more outgoing, whereas sp first means that the release of such isn't as easy.

[Satan]

where'd the ocean moonshine site go?

[Amber]

Ok so what would be the key behavioral differences allowing to discern between the following pairs:
sx/so vs. so/sx
sx/sp vs. sx/so
...?

if you want historical examples to see the kind of roles played : Malcolm x (radical "black power" movement) vs Martin-Luther King (more diplomatic, non-violent activism) - they were basically aiming for pretty much the same thing, but with two very different approaches

for sx/so vs sx/sp Bukowski vs Nabokov

[darya]

for sx/so vs sx/sp Bukowski vs Nabokov

Bukowski is a great example of sx/so.

@mercutio what are your stackings?