ESFj for you = NO.Originally Posted by CodenameK
INFj could make sense.
ESFj for you = NO.
INFj could make sense.
I'm wondering about the Judicious/Decisive dichotomy in relation to lifestyle. I already read that introverts tend to be more judicious than their extroverted decisive counterparts. Well it's already established that I'm a strong introvert. But how about a judicious person with a stressful life compared to a decisive person with a relaxed life? Because I fall into the realm of the latter in that, I have a pretty relaxed and easy life for the most part. I study part-time at home and don't work, therefore I have almost no responsibilities to the external world. Yet in moments when I am under more stress and have more responsibilities to fulfil I become naturally more decisive. It's just that these busy periods don't last long and therefore I return to a relaxed judicious state fairly easily. I couldn't tell if after prolonged stress I would naturally keep up being decisive or fall back into judicious because I've never been in such a situation before. What are your thoughts on this?
You will need to wait for ages untill I get to cook
But I'll think about you next time I will be buying food, promise!
The problem with an INTj typing is that INTjs are soooooo consistent, it’s unbelievable.
ESFj and INTj are duals. INTp and ESFp are duals.
I got INFj-Ne before on the test. If you like I can go through the difference between Judicious and Decisive....
That would be helpful, yes.
For me, the most important distinction is that Judicious types relax before they have to do something, whereas Decisive types can't rest and want to get the thing out of the way. I'm definitely the latter.That would be helpful, yes.
INFj is logically the only one which fits and yet I don't really relate to the description so much. I did relate to the ENFp description so I'm thinking INFj-Ne would perhaps look/behave/reason more like an introverted ENFp?
Also can someone explain the differences between Ne and Ni to me please? And how their functions differ in Socionics as compared to MBTI (which I understand rather well)?
Ni deals with the internal constancy of things overtime a good example is noticing certain peoples actions and how they line up with previously observed ideologies
while Ne is more about how things are connected externally within a bigger picture like in 47 ronin when he finds a broken branch he also sees a deer
a somewhat gimmicky way so dont take it to heart of finding out which you prefer
being on the same wavelength as someone or having the same interest hobbies ect
this could be a Fi Fe thing or even a Ti Te thing so just think about in aspects relating to what i said above
Thanks. From this example also I'm pretty sure I'm Ni over Ne leading, which also doesn't fit with being an INFj-Ne..
It seems that persons who use Ni are decisive and yet I'm not. I'm thoroughly confused about this.
how do you figure Ni types are decisive i always thought Se correlates to decisiveness simply because it also correlates with confidence, and even then its only a correlation
Because Ni types are part of the beta and gamma quadras which are both also decisive quadras. So it makes sense that the functions Ni/Se = Decisive.
Perhaps being rather introverted and a perceiver no less makes me more prone to being judicious in comparison to the extroverted types? The extroverted types having Se (which I agree would probably come off a lot more decisive than Ni).
oh my bad i thought you meant something different
maybe your Si ego idk
@CodenameK, can you tell me please which of your eyes is smaller physically speaking, right or left?
The Decisive style has nothing to do with making quick decisions. It's about natural energy states.
When I look in the mirror, left. What does that mean?
I meant decisive instead of judicious. The decisive dichotomy belongs to Ni/Se types which belong to the beta and gamma quadras yes?
It could mean that the eyelid muscle was damaged at that time and has progressively lost some of its function, causing the eyelid to become droopy.
That's right.
Do you entertain many ideas at once, or one at a time?
lol
I assume @LostInDreams was perhaps trying to ascertain which side of my brain is more developed?
One at a time. Example: I had the thought to write an original short story recently and from this thought developed an image in my head as to how the story would go. Now all I'm waiting for is for the image to solidify enough in order to be able to transpose it into written form as an outline. As of yet I have no idea how the actual story will go, but I know that once I get round to outlining it it will more or less stay the same, without much divergence. The plot will be strong enough as soon as it comes into manifestation. This has often been the case with other written works of mine. I'm not particularly good at thinking up many different ideas at once and then trying to decide which one is best. I become unsure of myself and don't really move forward.That's right.
Do you entertain many ideas at once, or one at a time?
In my case neither. I pulled out my eyes in shame.
I don't know anything about this.
I did, however, once see an interesting article about the correlation between Myopia and high IQ.
That's Ni over Ne. Ne types have trouble because they see many possibilities. Their visions are not convergent. Their projects can be a hotch-potch, as Ne says "Oooh, I'll have some of that over there! Oh, and maybe a bit of this too!"
As an Ni type, I can't entertain more than one theory at once, so I have the habit of trying to make evidence fit that theory until I reject it completely and consider another theory.
It was just a guess
I don't know anything about this.
I did, however, once see an interesting article about the correlation between Myopia and high IQ.I don't really know what it means. I assumed it was somehow related though to visual identification.
I figured so. My theories tend to morph over time as new information comes in. So this has to mean that I'm either of the beta or gamma quadras right? Even though I'm more judicious?That's Ni over Ne. Ne types have trouble because they see many possibilities. Their visions are not convergent. Their projects can be a hotch-potch, as Ne says "Oooh, I'll have some of that over there! Oh, and maybe a bit of this too!"
As an Ni type, I can't entertain more than one theory at once, so I have the habit of trying to make evidence fit that theory until I reject it completely and consider another theory.
I don't know of any relation.It was just a guess
You can't be beta/gamma and be judicious. To put it another way, you can't be judicious and use Ni. But that's what Reinin says...
I think you're an Ni type. Have you read the Meged descriptions? http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...Meged-Ovcharov
I worked out earlier today that I am IEI-Fe. It's all accurate apart from the careless with money bit at the end.
Beauty is ... part of yourself. <static> Love creates space <aristocratic> I look after my body best I know how <aristocratic> I've always been interested in the complex/dark/dramatic type of media <beta>delta> Or sometimes just things that touch my heart, like kindness from strangers, ect, that always makes me smile <Fi unconscious, dynamic> Do I feel a sense of belonging? More or less <questioning> What other people see as my weaknesses doesn't really interest me <Ne not valued> My relationship to society? Almost non-existent. I rarely interact with anyone <questioning>.
Other things that shine through is general negativism, feeling also, because the person dwells a lot on people.
My opinion is ENFJ-Ne.
Jesus already saved you from hell by His Atonement (Rom. 4:7), and by His Word, which says that even the unforgivable is forgivable (James 2:13). Not that He made you perfect, since we will always have our "sin nature" (1 John 1:8), but now, both all your sins, and your "sin nature" (pride, anger, lustfulness, etc.), are covered with His Blood and atoned for (Heb. 9:12; 1 John 2:2), since the Blood of Jesus atones for everything it touches. Yes, Jesus took up "sin" of even unbelievers (1 John 2:2), but, we still need to believe these things, and to thank God that we're saved (Luke 17:17-19), to make our faith in this truth alive (James 2:13). Even just a thanks is sufficient, because thanks is also an action. And immediately your living faith will save you!
I'm an anomalyYou can't be beta/gamma and be judicious. To put it another way, you can't be judicious and use Ni. But that's what Reinin says...
I think you're an Ni type. Have you read the Meged descriptions? http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...Meged-Ovcharov
I worked out earlier today that I am IEI-Fe. It's all accurate apart from the careless with money bit at the end.
The thing is with descriptions you can see a part of yourself in all of them. They're not foolproof. I'll read them up properly again later though.
ENFJ-Ne? But Ne isn't a part of an ENFJ's main functions? Or is this a subtype that makes up for the gaps in the other theories so far? In that case then why not ENFP-Ni, since Delta fits better (personally) than Beta?
I agreeI'll just go over some things that stood out for me.
Sounds likeleading, in the sense of not having a firm opinion. Also
accepting, to some extent, as you perceive the importance of conflict.
Nonvaluing
From this, a theme starts to emerge. You want more
Consistent with
Sounds a bit like
--------
On the matter of ethics vs logic, nothing stood out either way. I may need to have another look through.
The problem with MBTI is that, most of the time, the functions don't match the type temperament.
-
Dual type
Enneagram 5 (wings either 4 or 6)?
I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE
Best description of functions:
http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html
It's a subype. That means the Ni function of your Ego Fe-Ni block is more emphasised. Subtypes vary quite significatntly actually, so much so that there is almost 32 types altogether. I mean judging just by the effect on tendencies in physical constitution, etc.ENFJ-Ne? But Ne isn't a part of an ENFJ's main functions? Or is this a subtype that makes up for the gaps in the other theories so far?
Jesus already saved you from hell by His Atonement (Rom. 4:7), and by His Word, which says that even the unforgivable is forgivable (James 2:13). Not that He made you perfect, since we will always have our "sin nature" (1 John 1:8), but now, both all your sins, and your "sin nature" (pride, anger, lustfulness, etc.), are covered with His Blood and atoned for (Heb. 9:12; 1 John 2:2), since the Blood of Jesus atones for everything it touches. Yes, Jesus took up "sin" of even unbelievers (1 John 2:2), but, we still need to believe these things, and to thank God that we're saved (Luke 17:17-19), to make our faith in this truth alive (James 2:13). Even just a thanks is sufficient, because thanks is also an action. And immediately your living faith will save you!
Okay, I understand that. I doubt I'm extroverted though..
You mean ENFj-Ni then? I agree with your analysis, except the negativism part.
Your enneagram tritype is triple-withdrawn, so I doubt it too!
So, do you relate to Ni or Ne?
Yep, being a triple withdrawn is greatYour enneagram tritype is triple-withdrawn, so I doubt it too!
So, do you relate to Ni or Ne?
Mostly Ni I think. Also is negativism where you see what's not there as opposed to positivism which sees what is there? I'm unsure of the definition of these terms.
I think INFp is most likely, if my analysis is accurate. What is your definition of decisive?Yep, being a triple withdrawn is great
Mostly Ni I think. Also is negativism where you see what's not there as opposed to positivism which sees what is there? I'm unsure of the definition of these terms.
I'm really not sure on the positivism/negativism dichotomy. It's the only part I'm stuck on, currently. I don't know what "functionally" triggers it.
ENFjs and ISTps are very similar, because their conscious blocks are totally interchangeable, just one is weaker and ther other is stronger that of their conflictors. So you could be ISTp too.
Jesus already saved you from hell by His Atonement (Rom. 4:7), and by His Word, which says that even the unforgivable is forgivable (James 2:13). Not that He made you perfect, since we will always have our "sin nature" (1 John 1:8), but now, both all your sins, and your "sin nature" (pride, anger, lustfulness, etc.), are covered with His Blood and atoned for (Heb. 9:12; 1 John 2:2), since the Blood of Jesus atones for everything it touches. Yes, Jesus took up "sin" of even unbelievers (1 John 2:2), but, we still need to believe these things, and to thank God that we're saved (Luke 17:17-19), to make our faith in this truth alive (James 2:13). Even just a thanks is sufficient, because thanks is also an action. And immediately your living faith will save you!
*deleted* Reason: made a mistake: aristocratic J Fe is positive, rather, because ENFjs, for example, usually try to infect others with positive emotion (they are good motivators, very humane), while ESFjs emotion is usually negative.
Last edited by kraut; 06-11-2014 at 07:55 PM.
Jesus already saved you from hell by His Atonement (Rom. 4:7), and by His Word, which says that even the unforgivable is forgivable (James 2:13). Not that He made you perfect, since we will always have our "sin nature" (1 John 1:8), but now, both all your sins, and your "sin nature" (pride, anger, lustfulness, etc.), are covered with His Blood and atoned for (Heb. 9:12; 1 John 2:2), since the Blood of Jesus atones for everything it touches. Yes, Jesus took up "sin" of even unbelievers (1 John 2:2), but, we still need to believe these things, and to thank God that we're saved (Luke 17:17-19), to make our faith in this truth alive (James 2:13). Even just a thanks is sufficient, because thanks is also an action. And immediately your living faith will save you!
Decisive as in I have to work before play instead of the other way round. I am much too judicious. This is the only problem with me using Ni consciously.
Talking of roles (this is a new concept to me) I assume that the role is the way one first presents themselves socially? So if I was an ISTp then I would introduce myself to someone using Fi? Wouldn't that make me more friendly then? Because when I meet a stranger I tend to just ignore them unless they take interest in me, and even then I stay pretty distant and formal unless I feel a connection with them.
So what role function am I using here?
Ooohh.... Where did you learn this?
@ CodenameK: I think you are right. For example I always smile when I meet new people, because my role block (3rd and 4th) is NiFe, which includes Fe. I think this is Fe+, because ENFjs usually try to infect others with positive emotion (they are good motivators, very humane), while ESFjs emotion is usually negative, I made a mistake in the last post, which is why Lost in Dreams attacked me at first -- it was an attacking emotion on her part, negative emotion. You distancing yourself from people at first, could be Fi negative or "distance" between people (while Ti is distance between objects). Fi negative is ISFj-ENTj kind of Fi, because ISFjs keep people away, while INFjs, for example, are open to people. Your type could be INTj.
Jesus already saved you from hell by His Atonement (Rom. 4:7), and by His Word, which says that even the unforgivable is forgivable (James 2:13). Not that He made you perfect, since we will always have our "sin nature" (1 John 1:8), but now, both all your sins, and your "sin nature" (pride, anger, lustfulness, etc.), are covered with His Blood and atoned for (Heb. 9:12; 1 John 2:2), since the Blood of Jesus atones for everything it touches. Yes, Jesus took up "sin" of even unbelievers (1 John 2:2), but, we still need to believe these things, and to thank God that we're saved (Luke 17:17-19), to make our faith in this truth alive (James 2:13). Even just a thanks is sufficient, because thanks is also an action. And immediately your living faith will save you!
Fe+ is all about boosting all emotion (Gamma value), whereas Fe- is avoiding negative emotion (Alpha value).
Why INTj?
Are you saying @LostInDreams is using Fi-?
So wait.. I'm Fe+ and Fi-? Is that what you mean? (reminds me of blood type lol) This is slightly over my head. What I understand so far:
Fe+ = Trying to infect people with your happiness
Fe- = Trying to infect people with your sadness
Fi+ = Measuring distance between two people as something that lets you get closer to them?
Fi- = Measuring distance between two people as something that keeps you.. more distant from them?
I'm confused.
I would say in my case I prefer it when people around me are getting on nicely and if I'm close to someone I will try to cheer them up.. I prefer to withdraw to deal with negative emotions. So this is an example of being Fe+ right? But I'm always aware of the distance between me and another person, especially more so with strangers. If they engage me I respond accordingly but if they don't I keep my distance. So that's an example of me being Fi- role and then responding with Fe+, do I understand this correctly?
This has me more confused!
I don't avoid negative emotion. But I don't parade it either. I'm okay with others around me being negative, but I don't prefer it. From your description I'm thinking perhaps this is still an example of Fe+? Or is it a version of Fi?
I guess someone with Fe- would be more bothered being around negative emotions. Someone with Fe+ wants uplifted shows of emotion -- positive or negative -- that's just beta. But if you have it in the creative position, it's not the be all and end all.This has me more confused!
I don't avoid negative emotion. But I don't parade it either. I'm okay with others around me being negative, but I don't prefer it. From your description I'm thinking perhaps this is still an example of Fe+? Or is it a version of Fi?
@ The Matrix: Yes, just as INTjs do, Fi- is the function they use.
Jesus already saved you from hell by His Atonement (Rom. 4:7), and by His Word, which says that even the unforgivable is forgivable (James 2:13). Not that He made you perfect, since we will always have our "sin nature" (1 John 1:8), but now, both all your sins, and your "sin nature" (pride, anger, lustfulness, etc.), are covered with His Blood and atoned for (Heb. 9:12; 1 John 2:2), since the Blood of Jesus atones for everything it touches. Yes, Jesus took up "sin" of even unbelievers (1 John 2:2), but, we still need to believe these things, and to thank God that we're saved (Luke 17:17-19), to make our faith in this truth alive (James 2:13). Even just a thanks is sufficient, because thanks is also an action. And immediately your living faith will save you!
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