Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 40 of 71

Thread: Enlightening video: Arguments against Young Earth Creationism

Hybrid View

  1. #1
    kadda1212's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    Hessen, Germany
    TIM
    EIE-Ni
    Posts
    657
    Mentioned
    39 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Enlightening video: Arguments against Young Earth Creationism

    To make it more clear: It's about arguments taken from the scripture, not so much about science.

    Actually I never considered myself to be a young earth creationist. I think, the idea of young earth creationism itself is quite stupid.
    But I'm a Christian and therefore I believe God created the world.
    Recently my mind was full of questions though. My mother often watches natural history documentaries and my mind being full of information I somehow learned in my church or heard someone say, I didn't really know what to believe anymore. Doesn't mean I give up on my faith because of that - but I feel the urge to fight my doubts by finding a solution for the mystery.

    First of all, this video here shows the opinion of many Christians nowadays when it comes to the question if evolution and creation is reconcilable:



    I must admit, I had the same problem as this pastor for a long time. I learned in church that all pain, death, sicknesses and natural disasters are the result of sin. Obviously those things existed already before mankind, so there was a huge conflict going on between my knowledge, comprehension of the world and mind and my heart that just feels that God is there, that he exists. And my common sense just didn't allow it to answer this problem by stating that dinosaur bones were placed into the earth by the devil, like my old pastor said.

    Now I found this video, and though it doesn't answer everything, it's kind of enlightening. I see, that so many Christians actually believe in stuff that isn't even written in the Bible. I don't know why, maybe we're still deep down full with pagan mythology like Pandora's box and that's why we make up such unbiblical dogmas.

    If you're interested in the matter, here's the video:

    Love is like an energy, rushing in, rushing inside of me...

  2. #2
    Banned
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    2,915
    Mentioned
    80 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    New Earth creationism is a great example of how childhood brainwashing can cement a belief into a person, and as an adult the belief is retained despite all evidence to the contrary. No matter how obvious the evidence..

    The Bible is a channeling of the intuition by priests. Faith... is not about literal truth. You can be inspired by a good movie and apply it to your own life, you can read the new testament and apply it to yourself... the same resulting behavior shifts result, not taking the movie literally. Does whether the Bible is literally true really matter then? If Jesus was a real person, not just a sun-god myth, would he even care about this debate?
    ALso... the original Hebrew word for 'sin' meant something like 'mistake'. Mistakes are unavoidable... mistakes need to be made in order to calibrate behavior and learn from them... one becomes 'socially trained' by mistakes and corrections. Last thing... there are a couple mammals who eat their young if they (the adult) are starving.

  3. #3
    Farewell, comrades Not A Communist Shill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Beijing
    TIM
    TMI
    Posts
    19,136
    Mentioned
    506 Post(s)
    Tagged
    4 Thread(s)

    Default

    When people try to explain inconsistencies against your worldview by saying that some mythological evil agent fabricated evidence in order to make the greater mythological good agent look bad, it is difficult to provide arguments to counter that worldview.

    If on the otherhand you are interested in observable evidence, you have automatically scuppered the arguments in favour of mythological explanations.

  4. #4

  5. #5
    c esi-se 6w7 spsx ashlesha's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    the center of the universe
    Posts
    15,833
    Mentioned
    912 Post(s)
    Tagged
    4 Thread(s)

  6. #6
    both sides, now wacey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Canada
    TIM
    9w8
    Posts
    3,512
    Mentioned
    140 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    It boggles the mind how people really deeply believe the bible is like live news, for example Genesis is a CNN story.

    I visited a clients house this week to pick up a horse and her family is full on Mennonite. The moms in a dress and the little girls are in dresses and aprons and their gold hair was tied up in a bun. The men ate the food the girls brought to the table and afterwards we were in the living room and the sisters served their brother, us and their Father while we talked and they listened.

    It was a page out of the last century. There was no music playing in the house. There was no television. And yet, each person there had an almost palpable personal integrity I have not experienced in quite a while. Surely non-christians can also have integrity, I thought.

    The way I see it, why not let people hold on to their beliefs and their ways of living? If it works for them, great. I am sure they also fight their own battles against change, change in their children, change in society, change in world views. They must come to an understanding on their own, without outside influence.

    About ones faith reconciled with science? It is not that hard to do. I'm pretty sure God wants us to see the truth. I like to think that the development of planet earth, and the myriad forms of life from a small chain of acids IS the miracle. All else is fairy tales, once needed, now no longer important. What's important is how we treat each other. What's important is coming to a worldview that does not hide from the truth, in this case the truth of evolution. I feel sorry for those people who focus on the literal interpretation of the bible, I feel as though they are missing the entire point of the entire book.

    Hopefully these characters do not have that much influence over what people learn in schools in my country.

    Rich Dawkins did a big documentary on this topic of evolution vs creationism being taught in schools to children. To bad I can't find it. Here he has a discussion with a creationist.



    Would it had done anything to discuss evolution with this Mennonite family? Absolutely not. All it would have done is cause tension. Is their views on a creator Gad harming anyone? Absolutely not. The harm comes when those who believe in creationism have control over what children are learning in schools. The harm comes when a pastor tells his congregation that the world is only 6000 years old and that congregation goes home and votes on extremely important issues like environmental protection and the use of a countries resources ect..
    Last edited by wacey; 02-27-2014 at 07:28 PM.

  7. #7
    kadda1212's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    Hessen, Germany
    TIM
    EIE-Ni
    Posts
    657
    Mentioned
    39 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    The important thing I wanted to show is that some teachings are not even in accordance with scripture. Science is indeed more in accordance with scripture than some of those false dogmas.
    There is this whole page about it: godandscience.org
    Love is like an energy, rushing in, rushing inside of me...

  8. #8
    Banned
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    2,915
    Mentioned
    80 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Okay Kadda1212, but isn't it interesting how firmly those 'wrong beliefs' are held?... by the grown adults who've been raised to believe them?
    I've seen that video of Dawkins.. it was a guilty indulgence in comedy, for me. But 4 years ago I would have told you I believed the New Testament story was literally true... and I was raised to believe it.

  9. #9
    Farewell, comrades Not A Communist Shill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Beijing
    TIM
    TMI
    Posts
    19,136
    Mentioned
    506 Post(s)
    Tagged
    4 Thread(s)

    Default

    There seems to be a key danger that people who go from believing one thing with little or no evidence will end up believing in something else with little or no evidence, but I think the general trend is that people are becoming better informed and thus moving in the right direction.

  10. #10
    kadda1212's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    Hessen, Germany
    TIM
    EIE-Ni
    Posts
    657
    Mentioned
    39 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Some people in the church don't really study the Bible, actually, it seems.
    Love is like an energy, rushing in, rushing inside of me...

  11. #11
    Banned
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    2,915
    Mentioned
    80 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by kadda1212 View Post
    Some people in the church don't really study the Bible, actually, it seems.
    DirectorAbbie knows the bible from cover to cover and firmly beliefs in a young earth, like she was taught. She believes that the great flood is responsible for all fossil records by... churning up mud and somehow sorting out and distributing the creatures in layers, burying them and ... the mud accelerated the fossilization process. Despite not being able to explain aquatic fossil layers through this theory, she still believes it and in new earth creationism. This is the theory taught to her by her parents and church community.


    Quote Originally Posted by kadda1212 View Post
    Recently my mind was full of questions though. My mother often watches natural history documentaries and my mind being full of information I somehow learned in my church or heard someone say, I didn't really know what to believe anymore. Doesn't mean I give up on my faith because of that - but I feel the urge to fight my doubts by finding a solution for the mystery.

    First of all, this video here shows the opinion of many Christians nowadays when it comes to the question if evolution and creation is reconcilable:

    The two are easily reconciled.... Each creature throughout history lived life making choices... whether to follow what 'God' (their conscience) tells them; you could call them moral choices. The karma of their choices led them to survive or die. Just recognize God is in every creature, present at all times. The pastor acts like it was all pre-planned, but really from moment to moment creation takes place and 'god' is there. Romans 5:12... death is definitely part of nature, what can I say this part is wrong. You can interpret it in a certain sense if you want, and you'll be fine. But ultimately the bible is rambling of priests who don't want to die high on shrooms.
    Last edited by rat1; 02-28-2014 at 02:25 PM.

  12. #12
    ■■■■■■ Radio's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Posts
    2,571
    Mentioned
    154 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    there shouldn't be any arguments against something that is so obviously and clearly not true. apologists should be shot to death.

  13. #13
    Decadent Charlatan Aquagraph's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Continental Vinnland
    TIM
    OmniPoLR
    Posts
    3,961
    Mentioned
    127 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    “I tell you, freedom and human rights in America are doomed. The U.S. government will lead the American people in — and the West in general — into an unbearable hell and a choking life. - Osama bin Laden

  14. #14
    Eldanen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Southeastern USA
    TIM
    ILI 5w4 sx/??
    Posts
    489
    Mentioned
    17 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    There is no god. End of inconsistency. Be happy.

  15. #15
    Decadent Charlatan Aquagraph's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Continental Vinnland
    TIM
    OmniPoLR
    Posts
    3,961
    Mentioned
    127 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Eldanen View Post
    There is no god. End of inconsistency. Be happy.
    There's just as much scientific support for positive atheism than there is for theism.
    Hint: At least one of these values is 0.
    “I tell you, freedom and human rights in America are doomed. The U.S. government will lead the American people in — and the West in general — into an unbearable hell and a choking life. - Osama bin Laden

  16. #16
    Farewell, comrades Not A Communist Shill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Beijing
    TIM
    TMI
    Posts
    19,136
    Mentioned
    506 Post(s)
    Tagged
    4 Thread(s)

    Default

    Actually a supreme being would go against the laws of physics.

  17. #17
    Banned
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    TIM
    LSE
    Posts
    17,948
    Mentioned
    162 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Default

    Sure it would.

  18. #18
    Eldanen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Southeastern USA
    TIM
    ILI 5w4 sx/??
    Posts
    489
    Mentioned
    17 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Aquagraph View Post
    There's just as much scientific support for positive atheism than there is for theism.
    Hint: At least one of these values is 0.
    The thing is that I don't believe something exists unless I have positive proof of its existence. I don't see any gods or proof of them, so I don't belive in any.

  19. #19
    Decadent Charlatan Aquagraph's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Continental Vinnland
    TIM
    OmniPoLR
    Posts
    3,961
    Mentioned
    127 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Eldanen View Post
    The thing is that I don't believe something exists unless I have positive proof of its existence. I don't see any gods or proof of them, so I don't belive in any.
    Yet you subscribe to positive atheism without a proof.
    “I tell you, freedom and human rights in America are doomed. The U.S. government will lead the American people in — and the West in general — into an unbearable hell and a choking life. - Osama bin Laden

  20. #20
    Banned
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    2,915
    Mentioned
    80 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Eldanen View Post
    The thing is that I don't believe something exists unless I have positive proof of its existence. I don't see any gods or proof of them, so I don't belive in any.
    You haven't defined 'God'. How can you say something undefined doesn't exist?

  21. #21
    both sides, now wacey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Canada
    TIM
    9w8
    Posts
    3,512
    Mentioned
    140 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by rat1 View Post
    You haven't defined 'God'. How can you say something undefined doesn't exist?
    So God is an archaic word that represents our understanding of the consciousness of our right brain hemisphere. This consciousness has no boundaries, it has no sense of self, it is like the serial processor of a computer, it is omnipresent, it "knows" without words or language, it is always turned on, it is always at peace because it has no stake in it's existence, it is empty, it has no center. It takes in information of the surrounding environment outside and inside the organism like the flat canvas wall displays the projected movie on it's surface. All the higher chordates experience something like this consciousness and it could be said to be "everywhere". The consciousness of the left hemisphere is the seat of the self. It could be said to be the movie that is projected onto the screen of the right hemisphere consciousness. It is the location of language which is an important feature because it is language that gives man the sense of an individual identity, or self. It is only man, with his massive pre-frontal cortex that can lucidly experience both the right and left hemisphere with complete understanding unlike all the other creatures on this earth.

    This means that we can touch the divine, the divine being the peaceful, selfless or for lack of a better word soul, or holy spirit within us. The ancients called the right hemisphere consciousness the holy spirit, the atman, nirvana, grace, heaven, ect.. This is a place of being that lies outside the realm of self, yet by nature is the place where self is projected into.

    All forms of religion speak of this knowledge of our right brains. I was interested to learn that Islam, of all religions speaks of something called jihad, a much maligned concept that has less to do with an outer holy war, and more to do with the battle that the ego faces when trying to arrive at God, or the consciousness of our right brain hemispheres. It is this battle that is described so fascinatingly by every culture man has developed. Every way possible to come to God has been thought of by ego. Ritual, psychotropic drugs, deep suffereing, meditation, near-death experience, art, intellectual study, spirit quests, sacrifice, ect.. are all ways in which man has attempted to see through the veil of left hemisphere ego and find home. It is home that man seeks. And it is home that man will always return. We are never separate from home, God, because like people feel on a deep level, He, it, nothing, emptiness, is always inside us.

    Separateness is a curse as well as a great gift of human nature that developed over centuries of evolution. Who knows when we first became separate from God. The bible tells a wonderful metaphor for this very topic. Adam and Eve ate a fruit from the tree of knowledge. This tree gave them both individual identity as separate beings from God. They were cast out by God and for the first time realized there own nakedness. Oh that first horror at seeing there own individual hood, at seeing there own smelly, naked apeness. The pain of being separate from the living life around himself, locked away forever as an Ego/body damned to live trapped by his own deeds and sins, always stuck on the great wheel of his own karma. This story is the first shame according to the Christianity lineage. The first time we walked away from God and said I am me. It's an interesting twist that God gave man that choice to walk away from him. I believe it is because in evolutionary terms, having a sense of self is actually quite necessary for the homo sapiens. It is the ego formed by language that allows us to think and feel for ourselves and is the great tool we used to adapt to our surroundings. Perhaps it was the sense of self that drove our ancient fathers and mothers to step outside of their habitats and enter new land, something no living creature had mastered quite like we did. Perhaps it was our sense of selves, the consciousness of "me", "you", "us" that gave us an unprecedented advantage against mother nature. No longer were we bound by biotic and a-biotic factors for our existence. We could see ourselves as outside, above the environment and because we were above the outside world, separate from it, we could manipulate to suite our needs. Only in man is this possible because we evolved the right and left hemispheres and our pre-frontal cortex grew to such massive proportions. We were once only a creature of God, like all other life, yet God gave only man the choice to live separate from him if he chooses to.

    Mans intellect has discovered the blueprints of the history of earth and even life itself. Yet God is always there, always present, always home. It is for this reason that science and God can walk hand in hand. God is a part of lifes very nature.

    In regards to sin from the OP. Sin is simply "cultural knowledge" of actions that are harmful to the body/mind organism. They are things that are understood to be potentially harmful to the self and society and thus "evil". They do not have any inherent wrongness/rightness, they are simply not good to do and if you do them you may experience an even greater sense of separation from God. You may find yourself in a type of hell. It can be very difficult to come out of this hell because emotional thought patterns and memories are stored in our brains for a very long time. Yet there is hope. It is interesting to note that although our limbic system functions throughout our lifetime, it does not mature. As a result, when our emotional "buttons" are pushed, we retain the ability to react as though we were a two year old, even when we are adults. As our higher cortical cells mature and become integrated in complex networks with other neurons, we gain the ability to take "new pictures" of the present moment. When we compare the new information of our thinking mind with the automatic reactivity of our limbic mind, we can reevaluate the current situation and purposely choose a more mature response. It is said that Jesus died for our sins, in fact I think the wording is incorrect, he was trying to show that escape from sin in your mind, sin being an act that created an emotional trigger within yourself, for example suffering, is possible in ones lifetime. Each man must face God at the metaphoric pearly gates and answer for his sins. He may also find freedom from his sins. I will say that he will still need to answer for them in relevant terms such as a death penalty from his society, jail terms, ect. however enlightened his justice system is at the time of his crimes. Yet at the level of God and man, there is always hope for redemption. He can be punished by fellow man, and find redemption from God. Now I am talking about a reasonably healthy body/mind individual, obviously there will always be exceptions like serial killers/ rapists/ ect who cannot possibly find peace because of a miss formed brain or damage.

    I think that the term God can actually be defined quite nicely, most especially in todays age where reason has allowed, for the most part, the majority of culture to see through superstition. Advances in neuroscience are taking us to the edge consiounsess and reality. Eventually it will illuminate every mystery within ourselves. I do not believe for one second that because we have intellectual knowledge of ourselves and God can we not feel in our hearts the wonder and mystery of it all at the same time. If religion is to survive our age of reason, it is going to have to give up its grip on areas it had no claim of knowing in the first place, and allowing our scientific knowledge to bolster, enrich our reverence for the world we find ourselves in.
    Last edited by wacey; 03-03-2014 at 07:09 PM.

  22. #22
    Decadent Charlatan Aquagraph's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Continental Vinnland
    TIM
    OmniPoLR
    Posts
    3,961
    Mentioned
    127 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by HereticWacey View Post
    So God is an archaic word that represents our understanding of the conciousness of our right brain hemishpere. This consiouness has no boundries, it has no sense of self, it is like the serial processor of a computer, it is omnipresent, it "knows" without words or language, it is always turned on, it is always at peace because it has no stake in it's exsistance, it is empty, it has no center. It takes in infortmation of the sorrounding environment outside and inside the organism like the flat canvas wall displays the projected movie on it's surface. All the higher chordates expereince something like this conciousness and it could be said to be "everywhere". The conciousness of the left hemishpere is the seat of the self. It could be said to be the movie that is projected onto the screen of the right hemishpere conciouness. It is the location of language which is an important feature beacuse it is language that gives man the sense of an individual identity, or self. It is only man, with his massive prefrontal cortex that can lucidly expereince both the right and left hemishpere with complete understanding unlike all the other creatures on this earth.

    This means that we can touch the divine, the divine being the peacfull, selfless or for lack of a better word soul, or holy spirit within us. The ancients called the right hemishpere conciousnnes the holy spirit, the atman, nirvana, grace, heaven, ect.. This is a place of being that lies outside the realm of self, yet by nature is the place where self is projected into.

    All forms of religion speak of this knowledge of our right brains. I was interested to learn that Islam, of all religions speaks of something called jihad, a much malainged concpet that has less to do with an outer holy war, and more to do with the battle that the ego faces when trying to arrive at God, or the conciousness of our right brain hemishperes. It is this battle that is described so fasinatingly by every culture man has developed. Every way possible to come to God has been thought of by ego. Ritual, psychotropic drugs, deep suffereing, meditation, near-death expereince, art, intellectual study, spirit quests, sacrifice, ect.. are all ways in which man has attempted to see through the veil of left hemishpere ego and find home. It is home that man seeks. And it is home that man will always return. We are never separate from home, God, because like people state, He, it, nothing, emptiness, is always inside us.

    Separateness is a curse as well as a great gift of human nature that developed over centuries of evolution. Who knows when we first became separate from God. The bible tells a wonderfull medafor for this very topic. Adam and Eve ate a fruit from the tree of knowledge. This tree ate beings from gave them both individual identity as separate beings from God. They were cast out by God and for the first time realized there own nakedness. Oh that first horror at seeing there own individualhood, at seeing there own smelly, naked apeness. The pain of being separate from the living life around himself, locked away forever as an Ego/body damned to live trapped by his own deeds and sins, always stuck on the great wheel of his own karma. This story is the first shame according to the christianity lineage. The first time we walked away from God and said I am me. It's an interesting twist that God gave man that choice to walk away from him. I beleive it is because in evolutionary terms, having a sense of self is actually quite nessasary for the homo sapiens. It is the ego formed by language that allows us to think and feel for ourselves and is the great tool we used to adapt to our sorroundings. Perhaps it was the sense of self that drove our ancient fathers and mothers to step outside of thier habitats and enter new land, something no living creature had mastered quite like we did. Perhaps it was our sense of selve, the conciouness of "me", "you", "us" hat gave us an unprecedneted advatage against mother nature. No longer were we bound by biotic and abiotic factors for our exsistance. We could see ourselves as outside, above the environemt and because we were above the outside world, separate from it, we could manipulate to suite our needs. Only in man is this possible because we evolved the right and left hemispheres in our prefrontal cortex to such massive proportions. We were once only a creature of God, like all other life, yet God gave only man the choice to live separate from him if he chooses to.

    Mans intellect has discovered the blueprints of the history of earth and even life itself. Yet God is always there, always present, always home. It is for this reason that science and God can walk hand in hand. God is a part of lifes very nature.

    In regards to sin from the OP. Sin is simply "cultural knowledge" of actions that are harmfull to the body/mind organism. They are things that are understood to be potentially harmfull to the self and society and thus "evil". They do not have any inherent wrongness/rightness, they are simply not good to do and if you do them you may expereince an even greater sense of separation from God. You may find yourself in a type of hell. It can be very difficult to come out of this hell because emotional thought patterns and memories are stored in our brains for a very long time. Yet there is hope. It is interesting to note that although our limbic system functions throughout our lifetime, it does not mature. As a result, when our emotional "buttons" are pushed, we retain the ability to react as though we were a two year old, even when we are adults. As our higher cortical cells mature and become integrated in complex networks with other neurons, we gain the ability to take "new pictures" of the present moment. When we compare the new information of our thinking mind with the automatic reactivity of our limbic mind, we can reevaluate the current situation and purposely choose a more mature response. It is said that Jesus died for our sins, in fact I think the wording is incorrect, he was trying to show that escape from sin in your mind, sin being an act that created an emotional trigger within yourself, for example suffering, is possible in ones lifetime. Each man must face God at the metaphoric pearly gates and answer for his sins. He may also find freedom from his sins. I will say that he will still need to answer for them in relevent terms such as a death penalty from his society, jail terms, ect. however enlightened his justice system is at the time of his crimes. Yet at the level of Gad and man, there is always hope for redemption. He can be punished by fellow man, and find redemption from God. Now I am talking about a reasonably healthy body/mind individual, obviously there will always be excpetions like serial killers/ rapists/ ect.

    I think that the term God can actually be defined quite nicely, most especially in todays age where reason has allowed, for the most part, the majority of culture to see through superstition. Advances in neuroscience are taking us to the very edge of reality and consiouness. As I understand it, we can have God, mystery, grace, as well as reason, rationality, truth, fact at the same time.
    Can you TL;DR this because I would be curious about concise answers to rat's question?
    “I tell you, freedom and human rights in America are doomed. The U.S. government will lead the American people in — and the West in general — into an unbearable hell and a choking life. - Osama bin Laden

  23. #23
    both sides, now wacey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Canada
    TIM
    9w8
    Posts
    3,512
    Mentioned
    140 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Aquagraph View Post
    Can you TL;DR this because I would be curious about concise answers to rat's question?
    Pardon? What does TL;DR mean? If you mean shorten it then ahhhhh, no.

    It might be an option for you to explore and think of and write your own answers to Rat's question.

  24. #24
    Eldanen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Southeastern USA
    TIM
    ILI 5w4 sx/??
    Posts
    489
    Mentioned
    17 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by rat1 View Post
    You haven't defined 'God'. How can you say something undefined doesn't exist?
    I'm using the generally accepted definition of the word. Nothing fancy.

  25. #25
    Banned
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    2,915
    Mentioned
    80 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Eldanen View Post
    I'm using the generally accepted definition of the word. Nothing fancy.
    Which one?
    Quote Originally Posted by Ath View Post
    why believe in sth else being god when I can believe in myself...
    You could believe both

  26. #26
    Queen of the Damned Aylen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Spiritus Mundi
    TIM
    psyche 4w5 sx/sp
    Posts
    11,347
    Mentioned
    1005 Post(s)
    Tagged
    42 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by rat1 View Post
    Which one?

    You could believe both
    I imagine that is a novel idea to some.

    “My typology is . . . not in any sense to stick labels on people at first sight. It is not a physiognomy and not an anthropological system, but a critical psychology dealing with the organization and delimitation of psychic processes that can be shown to be typical.”​ —C.G. Jung
     
    YWIMW

  27. #27
    fka noki, zap, ath kopyk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    402
    Mentioned
    228 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Default

    googled "I am my own god", found this, and the following:

    He then suggests that the rational Satanist should instead internalize their gods and, therefore, worship themselves; hence the Satanist maxim, "I am my own god".
    “For those who believe in God, most of the big questions are answered. But for those of us who can't readily accept the God formula, the big answers don't remain stone-written. We adjust to new conditions and discoveries. We are pliable. Love need not be a command nor faith a dictum. I am my own god. We are here to unlearn the teachings of the church, state, and our educational system. We are here to drink beer. We are here to kill war. We are here to laugh at the odds and live our lives so well that Death will tremble to take us.”― Charles Bukowski
    Quote Originally Posted by rat1 View Post
    You could believe both
    I'd rather not share my power with anyone else.

  28. #28
    Eldanen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Southeastern USA
    TIM
    ILI 5w4 sx/??
    Posts
    489
    Mentioned
    17 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Aquagraph View Post
    Yet you subscribe to positive atheism without a proof.
    Yes I do. As long as I have a reasonable amount of information about a subject and a reasonable lack of evidence to the contrary, I throw the baby out with the bath water.

  29. #29
    Decadent Charlatan Aquagraph's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Continental Vinnland
    TIM
    OmniPoLR
    Posts
    3,961
    Mentioned
    127 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Eldanen View Post
    Yes I do. As long as I have a reasonable amount of information about a subject and a reasonable lack of evidence to the contrary, I throw the baby out with the bath water.
    What's your "reasonable lack of evidence to the contrary"?
    “I tell you, freedom and human rights in America are doomed. The U.S. government will lead the American people in — and the West in general — into an unbearable hell and a choking life. - Osama bin Laden

  30. #30
    Ti centric krieger's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    5,937
    Mentioned
    80 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    people obsessing over these dumb dead horse topics make me hate science more than i already did.

  31. #31
    fka noki, zap, ath kopyk's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Posts
    402
    Mentioned
    228 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Default

    why believe in sth else being god when I can believe in myself...

  32. #32
    Eldanen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Southeastern USA
    TIM
    ILI 5w4 sx/??
    Posts
    489
    Mentioned
    17 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Aquagraph View Post
    What's your "reasonable lack of evidence to the contrary"?
    Do you see any deities walking around anywhere? No? If there were any who were interested in making themselves known to the human race, it would be as simple as waking up and saying hello. But you don't see that. The necessity of esotericism is a great point against supernatural beings.

  33. #33
    Decadent Charlatan Aquagraph's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Continental Vinnland
    TIM
    OmniPoLR
    Posts
    3,961
    Mentioned
    127 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Eldanen View Post
    Do you see any deities walking around anywhere? No? If there were any who were interested in making themselves known to the human race, it would be as simple as waking up and saying hello. But you don't see that. The necessity of esotericism is a great point against supernatural beings.
    Why do you assume supreme beings would be interested in humans?
    “I tell you, freedom and human rights in America are doomed. The U.S. government will lead the American people in — and the West in general — into an unbearable hell and a choking life. - Osama bin Laden

  34. #34
    Ti centric krieger's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    5,937
    Mentioned
    80 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    you are your own god, ath. go exercise your divine wratthhh

  35. #35
    Banned
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    TIM
    LSE
    Posts
    17,948
    Mentioned
    162 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Default

    I've been told that ET spirits are interested in not just mere humans but ILE. They invite them to their spaceship and conduct experiments on their invaluable intellect, but don't quote me on that.

  36. #36
    Farewell, comrades Not A Communist Shill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Beijing
    TIM
    TMI
    Posts
    19,136
    Mentioned
    506 Post(s)
    Tagged
    4 Thread(s)

    Default

    It is astounding to me that something so all-pervading is capable of being detected absolutely nowhere all of the time.

  37. #37
    Queen of the Damned Aylen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Spiritus Mundi
    TIM
    psyche 4w5 sx/sp
    Posts
    11,347
    Mentioned
    1005 Post(s)
    Tagged
    42 Thread(s)

    Default

    beliefs do not = truths

    Truth, for me, is that I exist, have always existed and will continue to exist. My form has changed over time (and outside of time) and will continue to change. I am one of the innumerable manifestations of "god".

    “My typology is . . . not in any sense to stick labels on people at first sight. It is not a physiognomy and not an anthropological system, but a critical psychology dealing with the organization and delimitation of psychic processes that can be shown to be typical.”​ —C.G. Jung
     
    YWIMW

  38. #38
    Banned
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    TIM
    LSE
    Posts
    17,948
    Mentioned
    162 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Default

    It is always heart-warming to see you're not going to hell for your sins, crazie rat.

  39. #39
    Banned
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    2,915
    Mentioned
    80 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    : D
    Quote Originally Posted by Absurd View Post
    It is always heart-warming to see you're not going to hell for your sins, crazie rat.
    This place is my hell.

  40. #40
    Banned
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    TIM
    LSE
    Posts
    17,948
    Mentioned
    162 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by rat1 View Post
    : D

    This place is my hell.
    In that case reading with comprehension is heaven.

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •