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Thread: Derail - With his permission: Johannes Bloem

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryene Astraelis View Post
    I can only speak for myself, but there is a huge difference between quantifying one's statement as merely a gut feeling (which is a surface-level analysis) and expecting said gut feeling to be taken just as seriously as a carefully thought out and well-defended analysis (or throwing around that gut feeling like it's absolute truth and should be seen as such, especially when they cannot and/or will not justify it). If someone expects an intuitive insight to be taken as a solid argument, it should be defendable/explainable.
    You sound Ti-valuing I read you as an Alpha by the way.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zero11 View Post
    You sound Ti-valuing I read you as an Alpha by the way.
    I do hear Ti in what she's saying here, but I think it's her Role function talking.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joy View Post
    I do hear Ti in what she's saying here, but I think it's her Role function talking.
    Why her role function? Let me guess a gut feeling?

    seriously? She hates me so being an Alpha is pretty much one of the best explanations donīt worry the Inspiration concept stay due to the love/hate duality thing.

    I can only speak for myself, but ...
    trying to move the Dynamics

    there is a huge difference between quantifying one's statement as merely a gut feeling (which is a surface-level analysis)
    surface level (NT) analysis ()

    and expecting said gut feeling to be taken just as seriously as a carefully thought out and well-defended analysis (or throwing around that gut feeling like it's absolute truth and should be seen as such, especially when they cannot and/or will not justify it).
    total devauling of

    "carefully thought out", "well-defended analysis" is jumping to my face here

    If someone expects an intuitive insight to be taken as a solid argument, it should be defendable/explainable.
    That goes totally against I mean it is just totally impersonal it may be right to some extent but it is stated as a real argument. Also it is more unrealistic > expectations over reality.
    Last edited by Zero11; 01-02-2014 at 07:15 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zero11 View Post
    Why her role function? Let me guess a gut feeling?

    seriously? She hates me so being an Alpha is pretty much one of the best explanations donīt worry the Inspiration concept stay due to the love/hate duality thing.



    trying to move the Dynamics



    surface level (NT) analysis ()



    total devauling of

    "carefully thought out", "well-defended analysis" is jumping to my face here



    That goes totally against I mean it is just totally impersonal it may be right to some extent but it is stated as a real argument.
    I say Role because I've interacted with her a lot and think she's probably EII. I'm typing a person, not picking apart a single statement. Of course, I could be wrong about her being EII, but if she's Alpha or Beta, she's Fe ego, not Ti.

    I don't know what your type is so I can't speak to how you get along with her, but it's possible to like or dislike people of any intertype relation.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joy View Post
    I don't know what your type is so I can't speak to how you get along with her, but it's possible to like or dislike people of any intertype relation.
    You can view my type I am ILI and if this isnīt enough for you you can videochat with me on Skype. I donīt explained myself enough I already put functions into account of course it is possible to dislike even the same type but that is kind of mutual hatred and not this I donīt understand you version.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zero11 View Post
    You can view my type I am ILI and if this isnīt enough for you you can videochat with me on Skype. I donīt explained myself enough I already put functions into account of course it is possible to dislike even the same type but that is kind of mutual hatred and not this I donīt understand you version.
    I go into the17th on tinychat sometimes, though I see no reason to doubt or to validate your self-typing at this point. As for your lack of understanding with her, idk.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joy View Post
    though I see no reason to doubt or to validate your self-typing at this point.
    just sayin

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    lol For sure. Usually if we're in the17th it's night time in the US. Not sure what time that would be for you.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joy View Post
    lol For sure. Usually if we're in the17th it's night time in the US. Not sure what time that would be for you.
    hasnīt the US without Alaska and the Island which name i currently donīt remember 4 timezones? I think you could add 6-8 hours

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    Yes. I think it's usually around 11 pm or 12 am here in CST when there are people in there. It's not everyday, but I usually at least check to see if there are people in there.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zero11 View Post
    You sound Ti-valuing I read you as an Alpha by the way.
    Quote Originally Posted by Zero11 View Post
    Why her role function? Let me guess a gut feeling?

    seriously? She hates me so being an Alpha is pretty much one of the best explanations donīt worry the Inspiration concept stay due to the love/hate duality thing.



    trying to move the Dynamics



    surface level (NT) analysis ()



    total devauling of

    "carefully thought out", "well-defended analysis" is jumping to my face here



    That goes totally against I mean it is just totally impersonal it may be right to some extent but it is stated as a real argument. Also it is more unrealistic > expectations over reality.
    You've improved in that you're actually attempting to make solid arguments this time. Regardless, your arguments are still weak, and I stand by my previous assertions concerning taking you seriously.
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    @Zero11 Also, do consider that I loathe you because you are an insufferable person who relies on bad logic and who accused me of trying to be something I wasn't rather than reconsider your faulty and over-simplistic arguments when I turned out not to fit your analysis, as opposed to trying to foist it off on my being in the opposing quadra.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryene Astraelis View Post
    You've improved in that you're actually attempting to make solid arguments this time. Regardless, your arguments are still weak, and I stand by my previous assertions concerning taking you seriously.
    so my arguments are "weak" very ish of you

    define "insufferable" please

    "bad logic" there we have it again _ you could be a result type as it seems that you judge my process every time

    who accused me of trying to be something I wasn't rather than reconsider your faulty and over-simplistic arguments when I turned out not to fit your analysis
    "faulty" "over simplistic" perfectionism

    you sure hate how searches for the Unknown _ the best guesses are viewed as faulty logic but Intuition is surely not logic

    I donīt care if you view this as an accusation anymore because this difference clearly stems from coginitve dissonance.

    Ep temperament "donīt restrain me" defensive "I donīt let myself be restrained"

    Besides what is so bad if I am wrong? Should I just shut up and do nothing at all? That would just be a giant waste.

    You refuse new Information "just because" it does not fit your Model / > / and you clearly hate my like how you hate this way of exploring new Ideas so to speak.
    Last edited by Zero11; 01-02-2014 at 11:00 PM.

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    @hkkmr You're welcome to split this. It's not relevant to Johannes' thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zero11 View Post
    so my arguments are "weak" very ish of you
    It doesn't take a type to find your arguments lackluster.

    define "insufferable" please
    I mentioned what really pisses me off about you. If you'd like "insufferable" defined, go consult a dictionary.

    "bad logic" there we have it again _ you could be a result type as it seems that you judge my process every time
    I touch neither Reinin nor your assessments.

    "faulty" "over simplistic" perfectionism
    Again, it doesn't take a type to see that your logic is shitty. Shall I quote your original assessment of my type?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zero11 View Post
    Goddamn her movements are the same

    [Ryene] would be a IEI on Ti mode this would be introverted judgment but because she is a feeler led her to being typed as EII (Fi leading). Her typing in MBTI as a SEI correlate is also understandable if she is an IEI.

    She does this cunning(Ni) not concerning(Si) eye-drifts to the left (right on the screen) very often. I need to make a comparison video or more.

    Satisfied?
    Quote Originally Posted by Zero11 View Post
    In that case, the conclusion behind the observation isn't worth much to me. That aside, I'm pretty blatantly Fi.
    You are but thats not Fi thats a emphasis on something that looks or is supposed to look like Fi. Only because you adopted ESI like behaivour does not makes you an ESI your Ti emphasis is too high for that. Such a mask is really creating a problem in the typing process.

    This is my current perception of you (itīs not final but Iīm pretty sure)

    ESI like:

    I don't recall asking for your help

    And you accept it because it fits into yours.
    You talk like a Fi-dom but your structure on that in the video was Ni-dom. I donīt know why are you acting like that or if Iīm just plain wrong but thats my honest impression.
    Oh, and this gem:

    Quote Originally Posted by Zero11 View Post
    And frankly, how do you even know that I'm "acting like an ESI"? First of all, you would have to have seen or interacted with me on another board to know what my normal behavior was like, or you cannot accuse me of acting like something I'm not. Second, I've actually been more myself here than I have been on other boards, so even if you had seen me elsewhere, you still couldn't judge based on that.
    Gosh this is so literal how can I do this? It is simply based on how I do this like every time doing. I donīt need concrete data because I derive conclusions from concrete data that was converted into a tool for recognition.

    Itīs called heurisitic detection and it doesnīt matter how I came to such conclusions because I can trust my dominant introverted intuition on that.
    you sure hate how searches for the Unknown _ the best guesses are viewed as faulty logic but Intuition is surely not logic
    No, you've just yet to present me with a decent argument. There are people here who disagree with me on my type. That's fine. But I at least like to know that anyone who disagrees has put thought into it and that they understand what they are talking about to my satisfaction. You have never met this standard.

    Ep temperament "donīt restrain me" defensive "I donīt let myself be restrained"
    Or I simply find it insulting that you would sooner call me a liar than consider yourself incorrect.

    Besides what is so bad if I am wrong? Should I just shut up and do nothing at all? That would just be a giant waste.
    You could at least do yourself (and others) the service of admitting that you are wrong, which you didn't have the decency to do with me.

    You refuse new Information "just because" it does not fit your Model / > / and you clearly hate my like how you hate this way of exploring new Ideas so to speak.
    Justify it to yourself however you like. I really don't care.
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    @hkkmr You're welcome to split this. It's not relevant to Johannes' thread.
    Calling the authorities how considerate of you who are you to decide what is relevant and what is not?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ryene Astraelis View Post
    Again, it doesn't take a type to see that your logic is shitty. Shall I quote your original assessment of my type?
    If you canīt differentiate between assumptions and analysis you shouldnīt call it logic then.

    No, you've just yet to present me with a decent argument. There are people here who disagree with me on my type. That's fine. But I at least like to know that anyone who disagrees has put thought into it and that they understand what they are talking about to my satisfaction. You have never met this standard.
    There is no standard on complete misunderstanding and disagreement through a lack of understanding in the first place.

    Or I simply find it insulting that you would sooner call me a liar than consider yourself incorrect.
    You really have a problem with that do you. It just proves your and there is no incorrection it is just that you want me to say that I am wrong and you are right. Sugarcoated into what you call your

    You could at least do yourself (and others) the service of admitting that you are wrong, which you didn't have the decency to do with me.
    Wrong on what? Just in general? Ow yeah bow down to ahahaha this is the internet not some Family relationship.

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    @Johannes Bloem

    Well done according to post #1 in this derail (now moved here), you annoyed this upstanding and remarkably infallible community by being wrong because you're 'defying inertia'.

    What a remarkable rebuttal to your hypotheses and assertions.

    10/10 for effort.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zero11 View Post
    Calling the authorities how considerate of you who are you to decide what is relevant and what is not?
    In a thread about Johannes' type, we are now arguing mine. That does very little for the original topic, and it does not need to clutter a thread that is supposed to be about him.

    If you canīt differentiate between assumptions and analysis you shouldnīt call it logic then.
    I'd be lying if I said I had any clue what you're talking about here. If you're trying to call that attempt an analysis, then it was an incredibly poor one. If you're claiming it was an assumption, then your following actions are all the more insulting.

    There is no standard on complete misunderstanding and disagreement through a lack of understanding in the first place.
    So it can't be that I disagree because I honestly think you're wrong? I can only disagree because I don't understand your arguments or you? Surely that's not what you're implying here.

    You really have a problem with that do you.
    Imagine that.

    It just proves your and there is no incorrection it is just that you want me to say that I am wrong and you are right. Sugarcoated into what you call your
    *yawn* More of the same.

    Wrong on what? Just in general? Ow yeah bow down to ahahaha this is the internet not some Family relationship.
    Do explain to me how that is supposed to be . In fact, define for me while you're at it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by InvisibleJim View Post
    @Johannes Bloem

    Well done according to post #1 in this derail (now moved here), you annoyed this upstanding and remarkably infallible community by being wrong because you're 'defying inertia'.

    What a remarkable rebuttal to your hypotheses and assertions.

    10/10 for effort.
    Aw, he is back to bitch.

    32489750.jpg
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kim View Post
    Aw, he is back to bitch.

    32489750.jpg
    The forum was so nice without him.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kim View Post
    Aw, he is back to bitch.

    32489750.jpg
    Like this?

    http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...Johannes-Bloem



    4 pages and a derail later.

    Fucking hilarious failure.

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    I asked him if we could open a type thread after conversation about his type in the chatbox and he said sure. The end.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryene Astraelis View Post
    In a thread about Johannes' type, we are now arguing mine. That does very little for the original topic, and it does not need to clutter a thread that is supposed to be about him.



    I'd be lying if I said I had any clue what you're talking about here. If you're trying to call that attempt an analysis, then it was an incredibly poor one. If you're claiming it was an assumption, then your following actions are all the more insulting.
    How could you possibly know that it does not lead into the other direction?

    So it can't be that I disagree because I honestly think you're wrong? I can only disagree because I don't understand your arguments or you? Surely that's not what you're implying here.
    Wrong on what on you? How can I be wrong without stating anything definitive? Obviously our understanding considering the definiton of being wrong is completely off. I am kind of happy that you donīt get what your definiton of wrong in opposition to mine is here.

    Do explain to me how that is supposed to be . In fact, define for me while you're at it.
    In case of PoLR it is to summon the people against an indivdiual that is targeted through persuasion, sure it wasnīt pure in this example but it was a version of it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kim View Post
    The end.
    Kim, hate to break it to you, but I don't think your embarrassing self inflicted 4 page riot and it's derails has ended yet.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zero11 View Post
    How could you possibly know that it does not lead into the other direction?
    Again, no clue what you're attempting to say, and I'm beginning to not care at this point.

    Wrong on what on you? How can I be wrong without stating anything definitive?
    Impressions can be mistaken. Arguments can be poorly constructed. Methods can be ass-backwards. It's not rocket science, sweetheart.

    Obviously our understanding considering the definiton of being wrong is completely off. I am kind of happy that you donīt get what your definiton of wrong in opposition to mine is here.
    .................................................. ............................................



    In case of PoLR it is to summon the people against an indivdiual that is targeted through persuasion, sure it wasnīt pure in this example but it was a version of it.
    You did not explain to me what you consider to be. And that sounds like a cop-out at the end: "it's not entirely this, but it kinda sorta is".
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    @Ryene Astraelis
    I had enough information aquired during this exchange. Further interaction would just lead to more useless confusion on your side. I donīt really understand how you came interested if I can call this interest what you have on Typology. And yes I did answered your Questions but you are still completely cluesless and thats it. Believe what you want I will never surrender to your kind as I am over this level a hundred times.

    You have no Idea what the functions are not at a basic level at all and due to your so called knowledge you accuse me of being logical inconsistent. There is now way ever that you get something out of this.
    Last edited by Zero11; 01-03-2014 at 12:28 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zero11 View Post
    I had enough information aquired during this exchange. Further interaction would just lead to more useless confusion on your side.
    Feel free to bow out. I was growing tired of beating my head against the wall that is conversing with you anyway.

    I donīt really understand how you came interested if I can call this interest what you have on Typology.
    Is that supposed to be some kind of degrading remark? "If I can call this interest what you have"? Really? Oh god.

    And yes I did answered your Questions but you are still completely cluesless and thats it.
    If that's what you wish to tell yourself.

    Believe what you want I will never surrender to your kind as I am over this level a hundred times.
    ....I fail to imagine precisely what "my kind" is, but the concept sounds utterly hilarious. Fight on, brave warrior of the One True Interpretation. Soldier away with your fearsome strings of gibberish and smite all who oppose you. You will arise victorious! *raises fist in solidarity*

    You have no Idea what the functions are not at a basic level at all and due to your so called knowledge you accuse me of being logical inconsistent.
    Rather than explain your opinion of you choose to declare I don't know what I'm talking about. *yawn* Mmhm.

    There is now way ever that you get something out of this.
    Well, it's you, so I hadn't expected anything to begin with. Carry on.
    Johari/Nohari

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    Quote Originally Posted by InvisibleJim View Post
    Kim, hate to break it to you, but I don't think your embarrassing self inflicted 4 page riot and it's derails has ended yet.
    No, I don't think my embarrassing self inflicted a 4 page riot either. I just opened a type thread after conversing with the person in question and with his permission and am hardly responsible for what people post in it.

    But feel free to twist this to your heart's delight. I even missed your bitching a little.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kim View Post
    No
    Sure...


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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryene Astraelis View Post
    ....I fail to imagine precisely what "my kind" is, but the concept sounds utterly hilarious. Fight on, brave warrior of the One True Interpretation. Soldier away with your fearsome strings of gibberish and smite all who oppose you. You will arise victorious! *raises fist in solidarity*
    Shut up Conflictor

  30. #30
    So fluffeh. Cuddly McFluffles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zero11 View Post
    Shut up Conflictor
    Mmhm. Keep trying, sweetie.
    Johari/Nohari

    "Tell someone you love them today, because life is short; shout it at them in German, because life is also terrifying."

    Fruit, the fluffy kitty.

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