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Thread: IEI - EIE mirror relations, your thoughts? (ENFj & INFp)

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    Default IEI - EIE mirror relations, your thoughts? (ENFj & INFp)

    Have any INFPs or ENFJs on this forum had a relationship with one another? If so, could you describe it? Personally, as an INFP (cue overly saccharine INFP romanticism) I've never felt so deeply connected to anyone as I have to my ENFJ friend. Perhaps my friend feels otherwise, but I choose to let this mystery remain unsolved for now. I think I feel this connection because the ENFJ thrives on bringing others out of their shells, especially this cynical, melancholy INFP who hides herself from the world. I think of this relationship as an effective contrast: the ENFJ's light must have the INFP's (or ISTJ, their dual, or any other "dark" introverted type, for that matter) darkness in order to shine. Or something like that. Perhaps I've idealized these relations too much, as I've done many other things (yeah, I have). Thanks for listening .

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    i dunno. enfjs can be pretty bitter/acrid/corrosive as well.

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    Default Re: ENFJ-INFP mirror relations, your thoughts?

    Quote Originally Posted by uninspired
    Have any INFPs or ENFJs on this forum had a relationship with one another? If so, could you describe it? Personally, as an INFP (cue overly saccharine INFP romanticism) I've never felt so deeply connected to anyone as I have to my ENFJ friend. Perhaps my friend feels otherwise, but I choose to let this mystery remain unsolved for now. I think I feel this connection because the ENFJ thrives on bringing others out of their shells, especially this cynical, melancholy INFP who hides herself from the world. I think of this relationship as an effective contrast: the ENFJ's light must have the INFP's (or ISTJ, their dual, or any other "dark" introverted type, for that matter) darkness in order to shine. Or something like that. Perhaps I've idealized these relations too much, as I've done many other things (yeah, I have). Thanks for listening .
    lmao

    A few years ago, I had this little group of friends over the summer, which consisted of me (ESTp), this ESFp guy, his INFp brother, an ENFj girl, and an ENTp girl also. I remember that I got along exceptionally well with the INFp, and we are still friends to this day. We let the ENFj in to what we were saying also, because of that whole Beta quadra business. I remember that the ENFj really liked the INFp, and the INFp liked her a lot too, but not quite as much as me (because we were all wrapped up in our duality hahaha ). The ESFp and the ENTp would just sit on the side and argue with each other.
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    Ohhh, my mom and my sister are ENFj (I think) and I love them both. I couldnít ask for a better mother (though she does tend to question me a bit too much at times) me and my sister get along fine too. were not close-close but we definitely donít clash either (except for those occasional fights that all siblings have) I can tell her anything and I know she wont leek it or tell my mother (I still wont tell her every detail about my life) she on the other hand tends to keep a lot of things from me (Iím not really sure why.) she also tends to keep to her life a lot and sheís always out with her friends (who she can make very easily)
    Quote Originally Posted by jxrtes View Post
    betas should be kept in zoos for children to stare and throw pop corn at.

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    I credit an ENFj for getting me out of a depressive rut. Twice.

    I think mirror relations can be great. There's a lot of understanding there - you tend to have those "knowing glance" moments a lot, especially in the presence of people from other Quadras. This is probably why there's so many mirrors getting involved romantically. I've seen this everywhere, and it seems to be second most common to indenticals hooking up.
    "How could we forget those ancient myths that stand at the beginning of all races, the myths about dragons that at the last moment are transformed into princesses? Perhaps all the dragons in our lives are princesses who are only waiting to see us act, just once, with beauty and courage. Perhaps everything that frightens us is, in its deepest essence, something helpless that wants our love."
    -- Rainer Maria Rilke, Letters to a Young Poet

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    This made me imagine all the different ways people gossip.

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    I had very soulful relationship with an INFP--storybookesque. Many memorable experiences and feelings.

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    i find this all very odd. this goes against my common observations of mirrors having sort of a bi-polar love <3 love/hate hate hate relationship.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pedro-the-Lion
    i find this all very odd. this goes against my common observations of mirrors having sort of a bi-polar love <3 love/hate hate hate relationship.
    I have observed that in ESFj/ISFp and (less closely) in ENFj/INFp.

    It seems to me - from a PoV - that what draws them to each other is the mutual > preference; they prefer a companion who will also prefer minimizing open conflicts and optimizing the jolly mood to discussing hard facts. However, although the EXFj would dislike a partner that would focus too much on , they do get frustrated some times with the IXFp's disregard for it. At least in the case of my parents ( mirrors), the main reasons for the "hate" bit were all related.

    In the ENFj/INFp couple I know, conflicts are also about (so says the ENFj) about the INFp lacking "a sense of what is realistic".
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Expat

    In the ENFj/INFp couple I know, conflicts are also about (so says the ENFj) about the INFp lacking "a sense of what is realistic".
    I can relate to this. They will get frustrated with me for those exact reasons.
    My sister usually settles it with a large **sigh** but my mother will sometimes get confrontational with me.
    Quote Originally Posted by jxrtes View Post
    betas should be kept in zoos for children to stare and throw pop corn at.

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    i've always viewed it as the ixfp fluctuating in their expressiveness which leads the exfj to get sort of paranoid and then they get all super alert style and this drives the ixfp into a shell until it explodes. then once open hostility has ensued they argue and hurt one another and later come to the conclusion that "when we argue we say mean things that we don't really mean" and then all is well until the cycle repeats.

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    SUCKZZZZ



    /end thoughts

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pedro-the-Lion
    i've always viewed it as the ixfp fluctuating in their expressiveness which leads the exfj to get sort of paranoid and then they get all super alert style and this drives the ixfp into a shell until it explodes. then once open hostility has ensued they argue and hurt one another and later come to the conclusion that "when we argue we say mean things that we don't really mean" and then all is well until the cycle repeats.
    I've seen that happening, too. It makes sense.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    They are bossy. They don't think of what other feel like before ordering them to do things, and if they DON'T do what is ordered, they carry on and lay a HUGE guilt trip on you and that pisses me the fuck off.

    *ENFj storms in house after running 5000 million airens*

    "KELLY COME UNLOAD THIS DISHWASHER AND CARRY IN ALL THE GROCERIES I JUST BOUGHT THEN TAKE ALL THE GOOEY STUFF OFF ALL THE PICTURES FROM YESTERDAY!!!"

    "I have a head ache chill out."

    "NO I JUST DID ALL THIS STUFF YOU CAN AT LEAST GET UP AND DO THIS THING FOR ME BLAHB BLALBHJLABHABH"

    "Fuck you! If you want me to throw up all over you groceries okay lets go!!"

    (i didn't really say the last part)


    *ENFj comes home from work*

    "GOD YOU WERE HOME ALL DAY AND DIDN'T DO ANYTHING BLAH BLAH BLAH"

    "Uh, yeah I did. I finished you're laundry for you and ran the dishwasher and vaccumed. I'm chillin out watching tv to relax.'

    "I've been at work ALL day IM the one who needs to relax! You sit here and veg out all day blah blah! And you say you did all that stuff, well you forgot this this and this@!!"

    KJAFLDJALKEWJIAOEWJ WTF

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    That sounds strangely like an ISFj that I know...
    , Se-sub
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    Quote Originally Posted by Expat
    I've seen that happening, too. It makes sense.
    I don't like describing types from their "weak" sides. It seems to aggregate the error with reference to how the person views himself.

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    Quote Originally Posted by aurora_faerie
    They are bossy. They don't think of what other feel like before ordering them to do things, and if they DON'T do what is ordered, they carry on and lay a HUGE guilt trip on you and that pisses me the fuck off.

    *ENFj storms in house after running 5000 million airens*

    "KELLY COME UNLOAD THIS DISHWASHER AND CARRY IN ALL THE GROCERIES I JUST BOUGHT THEN TAKE ALL THE GOOEY STUFF OFF ALL THE PICTURES FROM YESTERDAY!!!"

    "I have a head ache chill out."

    "NO I JUST DID ALL THIS STUFF YOU CAN AT LEAST GET UP AND DO THIS THING FOR ME BLAHB BLALBHJLABHABH"

    "Fuck you! If you want me to throw up all over you groceries okay lets go!!"

    (i didn't really say the last part)


    *ENFj comes home from work*

    "GOD YOU WERE HOME ALL DAY AND DIDN'T DO ANYTHING BLAH BLAH BLAH"

    "Uh, yeah I did. I finished you're laundry for you and ran the dishwasher and vaccumed. I'm chillin out watching tv to relax.'

    "I've been at work ALL day IM the one who needs to relax! You sit here and veg out all day blah blah! And you say you did all that stuff, well you forgot this this and this@!!"

    KJAFLDJALKEWJIAOEWJ WTF
    Omg thatís just like me and my mother!! bwahaha almost exactly how our arguments are! (though I love her no less!)

    I showed this to my mom and she was like ďoh my god! Thatís just like us! Gosh I canít believe thereíre actually other people like you on this planet!! hahaĒ

    Bwahaha they see things quite differently with their point of view.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Starfall
    Quote Originally Posted by aurora_faerie
    They are bossy. They don't think of what other feel like before ordering them to do things, and if they DON'T do what is ordered, they carry on and lay a HUGE guilt trip on you and that pisses me the fuck off.

    *ENFj storms in house after running 5000 million airens*

    "KELLY COME UNLOAD THIS DISHWASHER AND CARRY IN ALL THE GROCERIES I JUST BOUGHT THEN TAKE ALL THE GOOEY STUFF OFF ALL THE PICTURES FROM YESTERDAY!!!"

    "I have a head ache chill out."

    "NO I JUST DID ALL THIS STUFF YOU CAN AT LEAST GET UP AND DO THIS THING FOR ME BLAHB BLALBHJLABHABH"

    "Fuck you! If you want me to throw up all over you groceries okay lets go!!"

    (i didn't really say the last part)


    *ENFj comes home from work*

    "GOD YOU WERE HOME ALL DAY AND DIDN'T DO ANYTHING BLAH BLAH BLAH"

    "Uh, yeah I did. I finished you're laundry for you and ran the dishwasher and vaccumed. I'm chillin out watching tv to relax.'

    "I've been at work ALL day IM the one who needs to relax! You sit here and veg out all day blah blah! And you say you did all that stuff, well you forgot this this and this@!!"

    KJAFLDJALKEWJIAOEWJ WTF
    Omg thatís just like me and my mother!! bwahaha almost exactly how our arguments are! (though I love her no less!)

    I showed this to my mom and she was like ďoh my god! Thatís just like us! Gosh I canít believe thereíre actually other people like you on this planet!! hahaĒ

    Bwahaha they see things quite differently with their point of view.
    LoL !

    Well yeah, I love these 2 ENFj's as well but I just can't TAKE all that ALL the time! And the one is younger and harder to deal with, and she gets jealous of me a lot for no good reason I think. I don't think she has any reason to be jealous of me, she's pretty and pretty smart and has lots of friends and guys are all over her, so I don't get it. She could even think she's better because she's got her shit together WAYYY more than I do.

    =/ I hope she gets over it because we made pretty good friends when she wasn't all crazy.

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    I have an ENFj sister. I'm not really sure what type her spouse is but they'be been together 20 years now. I'm not sure if its compatibility of loyalty. Once my sister is loyal to someone, she's loyal to them.

    Her spouse has to be tough and be able to take her moody blows but still love her to pieces all the same. She keeps her inner life very private though so I wish I could say more about the relationship but she rarely talks about it.

    I have an ENFj friend who just started dating an INFp friend. By her accounts, things are going wonderful. She goes away a lot on business and he seems to be able to keep himself busy and doesn't feel neglected.

    They definately have a very deep connection. Since things moved from friend to relationship status things have been moving very quickly. They are both really good people though.
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    Default IEI and EIE mirror relationship (INFp & ENFj)

    Can someone please describe this mirror relationship to me?I am not really interested in objective facts about mirror relations, more in this specfic beta NF relationship. How does it look like?
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    Melancholic

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    They get along fairly well, it's just IEIs can be annoyed with EIEs' lack of action/rotten decisiveness and EIEs will be frustrated with IEIs' inconsistency and vague (in their understanding of course) argumentation at one point of time.

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    From an outsider perspective, they seem to be pointed in two different directions - EIE is usually wanting to conquer the countryside while IEI likes being in the fort, which has a positive aspect. However, IEI often thinks that EIE is elsewhere and never available while EIE often thinks IEI is too guarded and not contributing. They understand one another very well but will never agree on life's objectives. IEI usually has to defer to EIE and the only way to be saved from the yoke is to walk away.

    a.k.a. I/O

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    The types are similar in what want from other, - Se and Ti, - where the most of criticism is expected from both sides. If social status and money income are ok - it should be boring, but well-bred looking relations. As there is no support in super-id both may feel psychicly tired, what with having weak S leads to neurasthenia. J/P types issues.
    Types examples: video bloggers, actors

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    It's something that is better the more people you add to the mix but worse if intimacy becomes involved. Both are aware of each other's vulnerabilities but neither are really willing/able to handle those vulnerabilities .... which makes intimacy and emotional connection awkward and hard. Regardless of heart stuff though- they will often agree on things in a logical and objective way. Because they are from the same quadra.

    They are essentially on the same team with similar cultural viewpoints, but EIE will find IEI too shy and victimy and the IEI will find EIE too harsh and overbearing... also the IEI senses the insecurity and human-ness behind the EIE's boldness, which makes EIE feel uncomfortable as it's kinda too idk "delta-ish" and annoying for them. With an IEI/SLE, the SLE is much more excited to hear that the IEI senses their ethical and emotional motivations so aptly. and the IEI feels more personally valued. With an LSI/EIE, there is less shyly gazing at them in a serious manner and more enhancing their own playful bad assery (as opposed to making them feel awkwardly guilty about it) with their own skill for militarism.

    When war is drawn and objectivity is needed, both types are good at getting over these personal slights for a common goal. Conflict occurs, but forgiveness comes just as easily.

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    Interesting, I thought that mirror relations like that are overall positive.
    INFP
    4w3-5w6-1w9
    Hyper introverted extrovert
    Melancholic

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    Positivity is an illusion in a way I think... life is about challenges to overcome. What feels like positivity in relationships I think is the other person's ability to help you overcome psychological limitations via their own functions.

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    Two of my best friends are EIE. I have very different relationships with each of them, due I'm sure to gender differences, instinct differences, subtype differences, enneagram differences, and you know, just the fact that they're different people. Unfortunately one of them now lives in Kazakhstan and the other in Los Angeles so we don't see each other much. But from my experience these relationships are great. We understand each other's poetic souls, they make me do stuff, and I give them an audience. Pretty win-win.

    (Also, the above are long term relationships, pretty tried and true. I've lived with both of them, separately. Spent all day, 'er day with each of them at different times in my life.)

    P.S. I forgot to say that we bring out the meanness in each other.... but in a funny way. Or maybe we're just bad people.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bullets View Post
    It's something that is better the more people you add to the mix but worse if intimacy becomes involved. Both are aware of each other's vulnerabilities but neither are really willing/able to handle those vulnerabilities .... which makes intimacy and emotional connection awkward and hard. Regardless of heart stuff though- they will often agree on things in a logical and objective way. Because they are from the same quadra.

    They are essentially on the same team with similar cultural viewpoints, but EIE will find IEI too shy and victimy and the IEI will find EIE too harsh and overbearing... also the IEI senses the insecurity and human-ness behind the EIE's boldness, which makes EIE feel uncomfortable as it's kinda too idk "delta-ish" and annoying for them. With an IEI/SLE, the SLE is much more excited to hear that the IEI senses their ethical and emotional motivations so aptly. and the IEI feels more personally valued. With an LSI/EIE, there is less shyly gazing at them in a serious manner and more enhancing their own playful bad assery (as opposed to making them feel awkwardly guilty about it) with their own skill for militarism.

    When war is drawn and objectivity is needed, both types are good at getting over these personal slights for a common goal. Conflict occurs, but forgiveness comes just as easily.

    Kewl post

    I'm following you here, but uno question.

    "With an LSI/EIE, there is less shyly gazing at them in a serious manner and more enhancing their own playful bad assery (as opposed to making them feel awkwardly guilty about it) with their own skill for militarism."

    What did you mean by that? I don't really understand. Can you demonstrate what you mean?

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    Quote Originally Posted by epheme View Post
    Two of my best friends are EIE. I have very different relationships with each of them, due I'm sure to gender differences, instinct differences, subtype differences, enneagram differences, and you know, just the fact that they're different people. Unfortunately one of them now lives in Kazakhstan and the other in Los Angeles so we don't see each other much. But from my experience these relationships are great. We understand each other's poetic souls, they make me do stuff, and I give them an audience. Pretty win-win.

    (Also, the above are long term relationships, pretty tried and true. I've lived with both of them, separately. Spent all day, 'er day with each of them at different times in my life.)

    P.S. I forgot to say that we bring out the meanness in each other.... but in a funny way. Or maybe we're just bad people.

    "Poetic souls"

    Ugh... yes. My IEI's... there always comes that moment when I look at them and realize what they are. I usually test this by saying something cryptic and seeing if they pick up on it. They see what I see. We come to one conclusion.

    My most beautifulest IEI friend and I would stay inside all day and dissect each other's poetry. I would come up with these elaborate stories and read these deep meaning into her words. I was always correct, or nearly correct in my interpretation, but from there I would elaborate extensively. Lol! It was so fun. We would look outside at the starts and share our dreams. We kind of built a little world together filled with poems and crafting and art. And after we were done creating, then we'd sit and share the meaning behind the colors we used..etc.. Because there was always a reason, and a meaning behind it all. I would so love to have even more IEI's in my life right now. I can unleash my beta NFness on them and they just sigh with understanding. We have shared so many beautiful moments it could make me cry with nostalgia.

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