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Thread: trusting your gut

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    fka lungs ashlesha's Avatar
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    Default trusting your gut

    i don't think i have a gut. how do you really know you have one and you're not just telling yourself that? how do you locate it? any specifically e6-geared tips?

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    I'm not sure I really understand what a 'gut' really is. It seems to be a simplification of when head and heart align to make for decisive action.

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    fka lungs ashlesha's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by InvisibleJim View Post
    I'm not sure I really understand what a 'gut' really is. It seems to be a simplification of when head and heart align to make for decisive action.
    yes. exactly

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    Quote Originally Posted by lungs View Post
    yes. exactly
    Gut trust is best trust?

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    I trust my gut when:

    - the decision I have to take is of very minor importance
    - I have experience on the matter

    in any other case, I only go by "gut feeling" when I'm time pressured. Maybe you could start by trusting your "gut" when it comes to unimportant, minor stuff and work your way up.
    Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit

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    well i personally feel a lot of my emotions all the way down to my stomach. if i'm not okay with something, i feel the anxiety in my stomach. i even get physically nauseous if something really bothers me.
    maybe a saint is just a dead prick with a good publicist
    maybe tommorow's statues are insecure without their foes
    go ask the frog what the scorpion knows

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    For me when I think of gut I think immediately of my intuition. Its not really corporeal. Its like it comes from my unconscious and I glean answers to things that I may not even know Im worried about.. anything on my mind or stressing me at any level, my intuition goes to work without me knowing about it. Its kind of weird cuz I don't consciously do anything at that level. How I respond to it is a whole other story. I usually use my tertiary function to ground my thoughts somehow into some workable solution.

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    My gut vibrates at a frequency of 5 Hz whenever someone is mistyped.

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    Fantasy/instinct is often sort of at war with your sense of gut, which is what might seem to be confusing you. Often our gut knows something is wrong whereas our hope/ideal/fantasy of the situation wants it to be otherwise. It's kinda quite simple, listen to your gut- so you don't get chopped up by the sociopath. Both your heart and head will mislead you where your gut will never falter. With basic empathy, you can feel when somebody is off or not- but if you have the fantasy that they're somebody else other than what they are well lol that probably won't end well? But then again even that is a learning experience...

    Kittens are kittens and wolves are wolves. (The adage 'trusting your gut' to me simply means having the wisdom to not fall for a wolf in sheep's clothing act, or even the reverse probably: a sheep trying to be some big bad wolf.) If all you had was the logical part of your brain you wouldn't sense real danger from fake danger it would be bloody stupid... and our guts tell us all these things. Now human beings tend to sort of get a big hard on when things are complicated and 'in the middle/morally ambiguous' but it doesn't matter. The basic principal applies.

    Ugh I sound like a harsh know it all.
    Last edited by bnd; 08-29-2013 at 11:02 AM.

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    For me, it's like I'll just recognize that me, the ground beneath me, the trees around me, the air I breathe, the buildings that stand amongst me; we are all on one side and anything in my way has no foundation whatsoever, so I'll just go and do whatever I'm getting pulled to and nothing will stop me because that's what's gotta happen. I'm in the middle of one of those moments; I just heard the most beautiful and powerful sounding guitar amp in my entire life, and I could tell from the nuances of the tone, the way there were sawed-off lengths of grey PVC pipe in the vertical corner edges of what used to be a soft case to give it the support needed to take the rigors of the road, and the way he talked about modding it; this was something he made to fit his vision, and that when I played the amp and he sculpted the tone to how I envisioned it myself in real time, and the way he got into it more and more as I got into it more and more, that we were aiming for the same target. I had this overall notion that I HAD TO DO THIS and anything else other than that was just something to overcome, all at the expense of this main thing that ended up as my target. If you feel like you're on fire and everything in the way of what you gotta get needs to be cleared out of the way, then do that! Best when what you gotta get ends up being good for a shit ton more people. Everything just moves forward like it has to and victory comes easy.

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    Quote Originally Posted by woofwoofl View Post
    If you feel like you're on fire and everything in the way of what you gotta get needs to be cleared out of the way, then do that!
    usually when i feel this way its a sign that its actually something i really shouldn't do.

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    I try to follow my gut(instinct). It's usually right. Can't say the same for others, their guts are in no way connected to mine.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Legerdemain View Post
    I try to follow my gut(instinct). It's usually right. Can't say the same for others, their guts are in no way connected to mine.
    Yeah, it's your gut instinct and not theirs. Hmm.

    And one can't locate their gut enneagram wise. It's not physical.

    I would say it is keeping in tune with one's judgment having not complete info in some situation but nevertheless following it.
    Last edited by Absurd; 08-29-2013 at 06:00 PM.

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    Have you ever been driving (speeding) and suddenly get this sick feeling? You know that right then, at that moment you need to take your foot off the accelerator. It's maybe the way the other cars are acting or something that you pick up subconsciously, but you know something bad is coming. -- The times I ignore this feeling, and decide to push my luck, I've gotten pulled over by cops. That's what I think of as trusting my gut. Gut feeling is just your body's reaction to cues you don't consciously pick up.

    Ever meet a person, and you just get bad vibes from them? Something about them makes you feel physically ill. It may be hard to come up with concrete reasons why - it's usually some combination of body language, eye communication, tone and manner of voice, but it's all really subtle things. They just seem 'off' in some way. That's gut feeling imo.

    But generally I think when ppl talk about trusting your gut, it's something else they're talking about, something that I don't quite understand, and have never found to be very valuable to me. It seems more like guessing or something maybe? I don't know what it is. So, I'm just going to talk about my own definition. Gut feeling is an actual physical feeling to me. And it's not just bad stuff. I've sometimes felt a physical warmth and comfort-type feeling too, that makes me know a person or place is ok. It's not emotional. There aren't any emotions attached to it. It's just a bodily feeling and you know something without knowing how you know it precisely.

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    Don't think your body knows. It's not thinking nor feeling.

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    Ni dominant gets to be hawk. I imagine it's fleeting and harder to grasp for some.
    Amber casts infinity of shadows, and my Avalon had cast many of its own, because of my presence there. I might be known on many earths that I had never trod, for shadows of myself had walked them, mimicking imperfectly my deeds and my thoughts.

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    Quote Originally Posted by chriscorey View Post
    Ni dominant gets to be hawk. I imagine it's fleeting and harder to grasp for some.
    Yes, it is.

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    Not bad, dolphin, but I see something wrong with the E1 section. Meditation? The chore itself must be "brought to court." And it's been found guilty of being a waste of time. So the rest of the section is nullified.

    Lungs, as far as a gut, I'll assume you're referring to the "gut instinct" and not the thing hanging out under your ribcage (in which case, saying you don't have a gut is probably a good thing).
    Of course 6s don't have guts. 6s are part of the thinking triad. Only 1s, 8s, and 9s are in the gut triad. Absurd had the right idea, though he was vague. Guts (1, 8, 9) are not thinkers (5, 6, 7) or feelers (2, 3, 4).

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ritella View Post
    Over here, we'll put up with (almost) all of your crap. You just have to use the secret phrase: "I don't value it. It's related to <insert random element here>, which is not in my quadra."
    Quote Originally Posted by Aquagraph View Post
    Abbie is so boring and rigid it's awesome instead of boring and rigid. She seems so practical and down-to-the-ground.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Absurd View Post
    Yes, it is.
    This is why I use pictures, music and videos to explain it. It cannot be explained as a “bad vibe” because that’s too simplistic. It’s in constant motion which makes it very difficult to break apart and observe. There’s also a lot of uncertainty because it’s apparent if you’re trying to trick it.

    Trickery-->negative response-->reasoning-->confusion=kill it. It shouldn’t be trying to trick me in the first place. I do something similar to this in most fuzzy situations.

    I wish there were more “oh my god something good is about to happen!!!” fuzzies, but it just isn’t so.
    Amber casts infinity of shadows, and my Avalon had cast many of its own, because of my presence there. I might be known on many earths that I had never trod, for shadows of myself had walked them, mimicking imperfectly my deeds and my thoughts.

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    Okay.

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    @Director Abbie

    What dolphin said.

    Meditation helps strengthen the parasympathetic nervous system response, aiding in quicker recovery after stressful situations, as well as reducing how stressed a person may become. The side benefits of that is that the body and mind are more easily able to digest foods, rebuild itself, etc.

    Perhaps if you looked at what some meditation practices do, physically, to help the body, then you'll have more patience (and motivation) for it.

    If you are religious, you can even use prayer as a form of meditation-like activity, bringing your mind (and body) closer to connecting with your ideals, values, and spirituality. And doing your physical body a world of good while you're at it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by anndelise View Post
    @Director Abbie

    What dolphin said.

    Meditation helps strengthen the parasympathetic nervous system response, aiding in quicker recovery after stressful situations, as well as reducing how stressed a person may become. The side benefits of that is that the body and mind are more easily able to digest foods, rebuild itself, etc.

    Perhaps if you looked at what some meditation practices do, physically, to help the body, then you'll have more patience (and motivation) for it.

    If you are religious, you can even use prayer as a form of meditation-like activity, bringing your mind (and body) closer to connecting with your ideals, values, and spirituality. And doing your physical body a world of good while you're at it.
    so basically say ommmmmmmmmmmm lotsa times

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kill4Me View Post
    so basically say ommmmmmmmmmmm lotsa times
    There are numerous ways to meditate, if ommmm is the way you prefer, then go for it.
    Last edited by anndelise; 08-30-2013 at 12:25 PM. Reason: Added smilie to show I wasn't being snarky. :)
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    Dolphin writes books.
    “Whether we fall by ambition, blood, or lust, like diamonds we are cut with our own dust.”

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    You've done yourself a huge favor developmentally by mustering the balls to do something really fucking scary... in about the most vulnerable situation possible.

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    Quote Originally Posted by squark View Post
    Gut feeling is just your body's reaction to cues you don't consciously pick up.
    YES.

    this is dead on, imo. When i suddenly get a physical cue out of nowhere, i become alert to my surroundings to try and understand what i picked up on subconsciously so i can act on it consciously.
    maybe a saint is just a dead prick with a good publicist
    maybe tommorow's statues are insecure without their foes
    go ask the frog what the scorpion knows

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    Quote Originally Posted by anndelise View Post
    There are numerous ways to meditate, if ommmm is the way you prefer, then go for it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dolphin View Post
    Right, I'm trying to be balanced and all that shit, but sometimes my subconscious just wants to punch people in the face. I don't want to visit unnecessary violence on my loved ones. I just want to know how to fucking defend myself from being bullied or walked on by people. Remember when you had that boxing/self defense/class thingy? Did that feel empowering or anything?
    Just tap into that anger.

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    Don't trust other people's guts.
    “Whether we fall by ambition, blood, or lust, like diamonds we are cut with our own dust.”

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    You've done yourself a huge favor developmentally by mustering the balls to do something really fucking scary... in about the most vulnerable situation possible.

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    I really can't see an LSE sitting down for a meditation session. Group or single. By themselves they would feel like it was a waste of time and in a group they would think it was a joke. Actually I find the idea hilarious.

    (this is not to say I don't agree with you about the benefits because I meditate all the time. I am just saying I can't imagine some of the other sociotypes getting real benefits from it because they couldn't be patient long enough to get there.) In my view meditaion is simply focused attention and does not always mean sitting in one spot and not moving.

    When I use the term meditate on it I don't mean literally. I mean ruminate and collect your thoughts, maybe while doing chores or out for a stroll or hike, and go after what the idea or nagging thought that keeps coming up a llittle bit more. Weighing your options work, but taking the choice that feels right is going to make you feel better in the long run. And the choice that feels right is not always the easy choice. And if you are looking for answers, well then stop for a minute and accept that you already know the right answer. and if you don't, accept that you need help finding it, from who or whatever.
    "Traffic lights and loneliness. Paper cans and tape cassettes. When the world feels like this. Static shocks and bitterness."

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    Quote Originally Posted by lungs View Post
    i don't think i have a gut. how do you really know you have one and you're not just telling yourself that? how do you locate it? any specifically e6-geared tips?
    that is the definition of intuition. It is your inner voice telling you that. Well, I mean not in a socionic sense of the word. You have a gut girl. That gut told you to make this thread.
    "Traffic lights and loneliness. Paper cans and tape cassettes. When the world feels like this. Static shocks and bitterness."

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    Gut and intuition are not the same.

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    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    I used to think I was high and mighty and bragged how I didn't waste time compared to other people who did petty things. Then I realized what a hypocrite I was, because I was posting on a socionics forum. If you were truly concerned about what is a waste of time, you would by and large be more concerned about the massive amounts of time you've wasted posting 5,734 times, and not about wasting time over meditation, or putting down something that other people enjoy.
    I never claimed that I didn't waste time, but meditation is basically doing nothing. How boring can you get?
    Starting an activity is a major step. Continuing one is assumed. I had a good reason to start coming to the forum. I do not have a good reason to start to meditate.
    You assumed I was a hypocrite without understanding how my mind works. I take affront to that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ritella View Post
    Over here, we'll put up with (almost) all of your crap. You just have to use the secret phrase: "I don't value it. It's related to <insert random element here>, which is not in my quadra."
    Quote Originally Posted by Aquagraph View Post
    Abbie is so boring and rigid it's awesome instead of boring and rigid. She seems so practical and down-to-the-ground.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wacey View Post
    I really can't see an LSE (or an SLI for that matter) sitting down for a meditation session. Group or single. By themselves they would feel like it was a waste of time and in a group they would think it was a joke. Actually I find the idea hilarious.
    Fixed. And god bless.
    “Whether we fall by ambition, blood, or lust, like diamonds we are cut with our own dust.”

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    You've done yourself a huge favor developmentally by mustering the balls to do something really fucking scary... in about the most vulnerable situation possible.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dolphin View Post
    Umm, what?? Meditation has found to be extremely beneficial to the human brain and actually increases hippocampus volume. Care to share your thought process/source on why that is not the case?
    It doesn't increase anything. Only your faith alone.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Director Abbie View Post
    but meditation is basically doing nothing. How boring can you get?
    You might benefit from actually learning what it is.. before criticizing it.

    http://www.theatlantic.com/health/ar...-works/277275/
    http://www.salon.com/2013/08/02/how_..._work_partner/
    http://lifehacker.com/5989429/is-med...ust-ridiculous

    And yes, to people not familiar with or comfortable with confronting the inner experience and workings of their own minds, meditation can seem quite "boring". It takes psychological strength to do it and not everyone has that. Its the same feeling really out-of-shape people have to the thought of going out and exercising. "Oh what a waste of time!! I'll have so much more fun sitting on the couch watching trashy shows and eating popcorn!" they think to themselves. The more you exercize though the better you feel and the less boring (i.e. antagonistic to ones immediate pleasure centers) it becomes to one psychologically. Its the same thing with meditation.

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    Quote Originally Posted by OldPathWhiteClouds View Post
    You might benefit from actually learning what it is.. before criticizing it.

    http://www.theatlantic.com/health/ar...-works/277275/
    http://www.salon.com/2013/08/02/how_..._work_partner/
    http://lifehacker.com/5989429/is-med...ust-ridiculous

    And yes, to people not familiar with or comfortable with confronting the inner experience and workings of their own minds, meditation can seem quite "boring". It takes psychological strength to do it and not everyone has that. Its the same feeling really out-of-shape people have to the thought of going out and exercising. "Oh what a waste of time!! I'll have so much more fun sitting on the couch watching trashy shows and eating popcorn!" they think to themselves. The more you exercize though the better you feel and the less boring (i.e. antagonistic to ones immediate pleasure centers) it becomes to one psychologically. Its the same thing with meditation.
    You're a nihilist.

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    I have a gut, but I try to see and go for a possibility that exist beyond it by giving the situation or the person the benefit of the doubt...for instance, my gut tells me that someone is a terrible person because of the singular purpose of our interaction, the main theme or heart of it and it proves to be true when I looked passed that and instead was hoping that the person eventually saw something more valuable than that in me; for instance, if a person keeps talking about how much they need a ride somewhere at most of our interactions, your gut should say that this is the very framework in which that person wants to keep their interaction with you and can't see past any other potential of the relation with you and if you're fine with it you go with it if not, you should bail out .

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    Trevor's Avatar
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    eww gut

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    dugga dugga dun Narc's Avatar
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    My gut is so trustworthy that I cite it in academic papers.

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    fka lungs ashlesha's Avatar
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    just came across this and it made some sense to me. reminded me of this thread.


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