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Thread: EII-SEE Supervision In Real Life (INFj and ESFp)

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    Default EII-SEE Supervision In Real Life (INFj and ESFp)

    Can someone help me fit up real life examples of SEE supervision with an actual functional analysis? Because I think I know some SEEs, and when I look at the pictures of SEEs like Elvis, Paul Newman, etc, it is hard for me to imagine any of them wanting to bother to engage in the kind of combat going on in the Delta dating thread. Like I canít really picture Woofie caring about any of that stuff. But maybe there is something I donít understand. I am definitely new at this compared to a lot of you. I have also been thinking that you can be made to feel inferior in areas other than your POLR, by someone who is stronger in one of your weaker functions. And even though it feels bad, it is not socionics supervision.

    Here is Expatís minimalist SEE supervision statement about EIIs: "Too nice, no backbone, unfit for the real world." That also doesnít resemble the Delta Dating thread feud, to me.
    Seeís Ego Block of Se and Fi gives them the strength of physical and social awareness and confidence. This must be why they are called the Politician. They also are strong in Si, but donít value it so donít have much patience for obsessing over it (such as EIIs with Si mobilizing.) But being EP temperament, they are not as concerned with enforcing their agenda, as would an EJ or IJ. Regarding the Ti arguments in the dating thread, to quote Wikisocion, ďThe SEE can be afraid to make discussion about fields heavy in systematic knowledge, doubting his ability to convey such thoughts in a clear, composed, and valued manner.Ē With Ti as their POLR, it seems unlikely that they would choose to exert influence in the form of a lengthy logical battle.

    So can someone give me some examples of SeFi supervising the Se of a EII? Like not in a forum argument, but in real life? I have what I think is an example, but I would like to see if I am off base before I post it. For the record, the only active SEEs I can think of on the forum are Woof Woof and JWC3.
    You seek a great fortune, you three who are now in chains. You will find a fortune, though it will not be the one you seek.
    But first you must travel a long and difficult road, a road fraught with peril.
    You shall see things, wonderful to tell. You shall see a... cow... on the roof of a cotton house. And, oh, so many startlements.
    I cannot tell you how long this road shall be, but fear not the ob-stacles in your path, for fate has vouchsafed your reward.
    Though the road may wind, yea, your hearts grow weary, still shall ye follow them, even unto your salvation
    .


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pukq_XJmM-k

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    Quote Originally Posted by Iris View Post

    So can someone give me some examples of SeFi supervising the Se of a EII? Like not in a forum argument, but in real life? I have what I think is an example, but I would like to see if I am off base before I post it. For the record, the only active SEEs I can think of on the forum are Woof Woof and JWC3.
    @dolphin is also SEE.
    ďLet us forget with generosity those who cannot love usĒ
    ― Pablo Neruda

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kim View Post
    @dolphin is also SEE.
    Oh my gosh, right! Sorry, Dolphin.
    You seek a great fortune, you three who are now in chains. You will find a fortune, though it will not be the one you seek.
    But first you must travel a long and difficult road, a road fraught with peril.
    You shall see things, wonderful to tell. You shall see a... cow... on the roof of a cotton house. And, oh, so many startlements.
    I cannot tell you how long this road shall be, but fear not the ob-stacles in your path, for fate has vouchsafed your reward.
    Though the road may wind, yea, your hearts grow weary, still shall ye follow them, even unto your salvation
    .


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pukq_XJmM-k

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    When you start to listen to Expat then there is no hope.

    You realise he left? Ask yourself why.

    Forget about EP temparement, and remember Se is their main function, and decide what they do from that, is my advice.

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    This isn't a real life example, so feel free to ignore. This is about how I look at supervision. It is not a common view, so again, feel free to ignore.

    We have a person trying to do something or explain something. We'll call this person the FiNe.
    Someone else watching them do/explain will notice that the FiNe isn't making use of Se information. Also that the FiNe isn't being grounded enough in the here and now.
    They might also see the FiNe aiming towards Si. The SeFi would likely think that the Si focus isn't as important as the Se info that is being ignored/dismissed.
    So the SeFi tells the FiNe that hey..you're focusing on the wrong thing, focus on this instead. Hence, the "supervision".

    However, the FiNe doesn't have to feel "supervised". Someone is offering them advice which they can accept or reject. The SeFi is also providing information to the NiFe which could alter the NiFe's understanding, and help them be better at what they are trying to do. Especially considering that the Si of SeFi is stronger than the Si of FiNe. So there's even more info the FiNe can incorporate.

    The FiNe also has stronger Ni and Ne than the SeFi. So while the SeFi is approaching from one way, they're advice/suggestions are very weak in the areas of Ni...which is already a major component of the FiNe's type.

    So basically, the supervisee is stronger in areas which the supervisor is weak in...
    Just as the supervisor is stronger in areas which the supervisee is weak in.
    A person can either take offense or feel victimised by the differences...or they can consider the information provided as they continue doing their own thing.
    Last edited by anndelise; 08-05-2013 at 08:59 PM. Reason: Changed "personality" to "type"
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    Even super nice SEEs scare the shit out of me. It's not so much about them being critical towards me - most of the SEEs I've met have actually liked me, I think. But I make lots of comparisons myself and it often makes me feel like I'm a lame and unassertive wimp.
    Quote Originally Posted by 1981slater View Post
    Axis of Evil: Iran, Iraq, North Korea and Agarina
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    Thanks, y'all. I think I might share my real life example of SEE supervision:
    EII: I worked at the homeless shelter all day, but still had some time to drive across town and buy some Xanthan Gum and Kamut Flour and Spelt Flour and blah blah blah to make you some special gluten free bread for our lunch tomorrow. It will only take about 5 hours to prepare, so if you get here at 7 am we can eat by noon.

    SEE: Homemade gluten free bread is so crumbly. Letís just try that new gluten free bakery instead. Iris can come, too. It will be fun and so much faster and then we will have time to go to that new dress store.


    EII (hesitantly, probably thinking of the Xanthan gum and kamut flour and spelt flour and all of that driving around town): Ok.

    SEE to me later on: EII never buys anything new. I wish she would spend a little more time and money to update herself. Maybe sheíll get herself something new tomorrow. (Hurries off to help prepare for the homeless shelter gala.)

    SEE at the dress shop: EII, why donít you try this on? (holds up something bright and striking that the EII would never wear.) Ok, Iíll try it on myself.

    The SEE buys the striking dress and looks like a million dollars at the gala. There is a picture of her in the newspaper with the donors she brought to the gala. The EII wears something understated and 10 years old and donates the money she saved to the shelter. The SEE goes to an afterparty with her donors after the gala. The EII declines to go to the afterparty, instead she stays up late and bakes the bread, which crumbled to pieces when she cut it.
    You seek a great fortune, you three who are now in chains. You will find a fortune, though it will not be the one you seek.
    But first you must travel a long and difficult road, a road fraught with peril.
    You shall see things, wonderful to tell. You shall see a... cow... on the roof of a cotton house. And, oh, so many startlements.
    I cannot tell you how long this road shall be, but fear not the ob-stacles in your path, for fate has vouchsafed your reward.
    Though the road may wind, yea, your hearts grow weary, still shall ye follow them, even unto your salvation
    .


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pukq_XJmM-k

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    I can totally relate to the having so many alternative possibilities in your mind that choosing "the best one" and ignoring the others can be tough. It depends on the matter of course, if I'm familiar with the topic I can usually do that easily and it's something I've consciously worked on a lot, but especially in unfamiliar situations and with new people choosing a course for action when all options seem balanced can be harrrrrrd.
    Quote Originally Posted by 1981slater View Post
    Axis of Evil: Iran, Iraq, North Korea and Agarina
    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa Darmandzhyan
    Agarina does not like human beings; she just wants a pretty boy toy.
    Johari Nohari

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    These viewpoints are so interesting. I feel like it is going to take me a while to consider all of it. Thanks so much for contributing!
    You seek a great fortune, you three who are now in chains. You will find a fortune, though it will not be the one you seek.
    But first you must travel a long and difficult road, a road fraught with peril.
    You shall see things, wonderful to tell. You shall see a... cow... on the roof of a cotton house. And, oh, so many startlements.
    I cannot tell you how long this road shall be, but fear not the ob-stacles in your path, for fate has vouchsafed your reward.
    Though the road may wind, yea, your hearts grow weary, still shall ye follow them, even unto your salvation
    .


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pukq_XJmM-k

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    Quote Originally Posted by dolphin View Post
    The thing is is that Si ppl will appreciate that. Your hesitancy and willingness to consider so many things is like manna from above to an ESTj with a stick up their ass. You are literally their heavenly light.
    Yeah, I guess there are two sides to each coin. It's rather comforting, isn't it?

    It's really weird though, how something something I consider to be one of my greatest and most painful weaknesses can be appreciated and even needed by someone else. Having lived with critical Betas for so many years this still takes me by surprise every time. LSEs are so cute.
    Quote Originally Posted by 1981slater View Post
    Axis of Evil: Iran, Iraq, North Korea and Agarina
    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa Darmandzhyan
    Agarina does not like human beings; she just wants a pretty boy toy.
    Johari Nohari

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    Quote Originally Posted by Agarina View Post
    Having lived with critical Betas for so many years this still takes me by surprise every time. LSEs are so cute.
    I'm surprised no one got hurt.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Absurd View Post
    I'm surprised no one got hurt.
    Oh, we all did. I hope not permanently, but it wasn't very nice for anyone of us, that's for sure.
    Quote Originally Posted by 1981slater View Post
    Axis of Evil: Iran, Iraq, North Korea and Agarina
    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa Darmandzhyan
    Agarina does not like human beings; she just wants a pretty boy toy.
    Johari Nohari

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    Well, conflict is conflict and dentist is expensive.

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    Yeah, what dolphin said so much. And since SEEs are feelers, if they are trying to be friends with you, it won't be so obvious that they are annoyed/upset with you. Unlike with my brother who has absolutely no subtly when he's upset. In that sense, lol I don't think anyone at your place was thinking you were yelling at me, @dolphin? Were you obviously flustered about it but I don't think it was anything anyone would have keyed in on. lol I dunno I live with some angry, loud people so maybe my perspective is off and so the regular people at your home would have taken it differently.

    For EIIs, they use their Ne as a way to close all the doors. So that there is only one clear course of action to take. Cause if they leave one of those doors open, they are going to worry and fret and stress about that one other option. Hah it's real silly how stressed an EII can get if you ask them where they would like to go and eat if they don't have a strong preference. And it's like when they are giving directions how super detailed they can get. It's their way of closing things off and leaving nothing left unsaid. No wiggle room. So they don't have to stress about and worry if they are doing something the right way.

    All that takes a while. Whether in umming and uhhing while thinking of what place to eat or in words said for directions. Which SEEs probably won't exactly appreciate! My advice for EIIs would be, for those decisions that always give you pause, just make yourself a default choice for when you don't have a strong preference. Let's go to Quisnos! Like that. You might worry the SEE you are going with won't like it that much but honestly it probably won't be that bad. And for directions and the like, instead of using that Ne to "close all the doors," use it instead to really look and see if that little bit really needs to be said. I know, I know, you'll worry what if they get stuck or do it wrong and they end up with something bad, But SEEs are big boys/girls. Their adults they'll know how to deal.

    You might think if SEEs are so good about action and making stuff happen why not let them make all the decisions. As dolphin said above, however, they don't really like it either when you're all limp. And honestly having one person do the majority of stuff via their preference isn't how relationships/friendships/whatever work. I think a lot of what gives EII pause is worrying about what they other person will think, and if they'll really like where you are leading them. But, you know, you gotta assert yourself sometimes. And don't forget to relax, lol.

    All this is probably stressful for you. But, I think this is very managable. And maybe the SEE will even appreciate the effort! Hah but I suspect the SEE will just take all the above as a given. How things should be. After all, you don't congratulate someone for successfully putting on their going out clothes, do you? Ahh, the plight of supervision

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    Quote Originally Posted by Absurd View Post
    Well, conflict is conflict and dentist is expensive.
    Yeah, luckily we have free dental care in here.
    Quote Originally Posted by 1981slater View Post
    Axis of Evil: Iran, Iraq, North Korea and Agarina
    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa Darmandzhyan
    Agarina does not like human beings; she just wants a pretty boy toy.
    Johari Nohari

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    Quote Originally Posted by dolphin View Post
    Ann is right that INFjs have better Ni than ESFps. The interaction works in a sense if the INFj in question is willing to give me the reigns a bit in regards to decision making while still remaining intellectually dominant. (This is the way it would go with an Ni person. They are usually very happy to let me make most of the decisions while still giving me a constant stream of feedback of what would make life easier.)

    I've had INFjs go intellectually dominant on me a few times and its like this weird flip of supervision. It is uncomfortable but it reminds me to respect them more.
    I have seen this happen with the two I described above. The SEE gets in a hurry when she is talking and uses the wrong words sometimes. Like one time she said prostate instead of prostrate. Some of them have been hilarious and/or embarrassing. The EII always corrects her word errors and the SEE says, oh thanks, and keeps right on talking. It never bothers her. I think she is grateful for the instruction.
    However, the FiNe doesn't have to feel "supervised". Someone is offering them advice which they can accept or reject. The SeFi is also providing information to the NiFe which could alter the NiFe's understanding, and help them be better at what they are trying to do. Especially considering that the Si of SeFi is stronger than the Si of FiNe. So there's even more info the FiNe can incorporate.
    @anndelise ^ This is exactly right in my opinion. The EII in my example above always has this perpetual big pile of clean laundry that she is trying to perfectly fold and find spots to bleach. The SEE teases her and says oh EII, do you want me to help you fold your laundry? Which we all know the pile would be done in about 5 minutes because the SEE doesn't mess around with stuff like that. The EII can laugh at herself for being so obsessive about it. But she wants to spend the time on it so she does. I think the way they talk to each other make the difference. They are always respectful and even teasing is always gentle. They have been friends for about 20 years. If they had to live together they would probably get on each other's nerves. But they frequently work together on projects and get along fine. They know which roles each fills best and they divide the work and don't bug each other. (I couldn't quite figure out how to quote you with your name after quoting dolphin in this post.)
    You seek a great fortune, you three who are now in chains. You will find a fortune, though it will not be the one you seek.
    But first you must travel a long and difficult road, a road fraught with peril.
    You shall see things, wonderful to tell. You shall see a... cow... on the roof of a cotton house. And, oh, so many startlements.
    I cannot tell you how long this road shall be, but fear not the ob-stacles in your path, for fate has vouchsafed your reward.
    Though the road may wind, yea, your hearts grow weary, still shall ye follow them, even unto your salvation
    .


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pukq_XJmM-k

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    Quote Originally Posted by Agarina View Post
    Yeah, luckily we have free dental care in here.
    How inviting that sounds, I'll pass. Unless you have people there that are bent on 'exterminating' you while you mind your own business and did no harm prior. Thanks anyway.

    Oh well, tables turn.
    Last edited by Absurd; 08-06-2013 at 10:40 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Iris View Post
    Thanks, y'all. I think I might share my real life example of SEE supervision:
    EII: I worked at the homeless shelter all day, but still had some time to drive across town and buy some Xanthan Gum and Kamut Flour and Spelt Flour and blah blah blah to make you some special gluten free bread for our lunch tomorrow. It will only take about 5 hours to prepare, so if you get here at 7 am we can eat by noon.

    SEE: Homemade gluten free bread is so crumbly. Letís just try that new gluten free bakery instead. Iris can come, too. It will be fun and so much faster and then we will have time to go to that new dress store.


    EII (hesitantly, probably thinking of the Xanthan gum and kamut flour and spelt flour and all of that driving around town): Ok.

    SEE to me later on: EII never buys anything new. I wish she would spend a little more time and money to update herself. Maybe sheíll get herself something new tomorrow. (Hurries off to help prepare for the homeless shelter gala.)

    SEE at the dress shop: EII, why donít you try this on? (holds up something bright and striking that the EII would never wear.) Ok, Iíll try it on myself.

    The SEE buys the striking dress and looks like a million dollars at the gala. There is a picture of her in the newspaper with the donors she brought to the gala. The EII wears something understated and 10 years old and donates the money she saved to the shelter. The SEE goes to an afterparty with her donors after the gala. The EII declines to go to the afterparty, instead she stays up late and bakes the bread, which crumbled to pieces when she cut it.
    This is the saddest story I've read all day, haha.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Iris View Post
    ... The EII in my example above always has this perpetual big pile of clean laundry that she is trying to perfectly fold and find spots to bleach. The SEE teases her and says oh EII, do you want me to help you fold your laundry? Which we all know the pile would be done in about 5 minutes because the SEE doesn't mess around with stuff like that. The EII can laugh at herself for being so obsessive about it. But she wants to spend the time on it so she does. I think the way they talk to each other make the difference. They are always respectful and even teasing is always gentle. They have been friends for about 20 years. If they had to live together they would probably get on each other's nerves. But they frequently work together on projects and get along fine. They know which roles each fills best and they divide the work and don't bug each other. (I couldn't quite figure out how to quote you with your name after quoting dolphin in this post.)
    Great story, Iris. This thread is very helpful. Nice friendship they have, and what you've shared is encouraging to me - because a friend I have made in the past recent years is my INTJ Supervisor. I admire her a lot. We met because we have our faith in common, but her past and ongoing accomplishments in life are a lot more stellar than mine (or most people's). When I realized she was my Supervisor, I got worried. Wondering if the ball was going to drop some day when she suddenly got completely exasperated by me. Yet we see none of that now. But like you say with the friendship you shared, its not a live-together thing.

    In that friendship, is SEE more the leader, EII the helper? Because I have seen my INTJ friendship like that from the very beginning I see her as the leader. In fact, as I had not yet met the man I fell in love with so unexpectedly, and was determined to be open to if the Lord wanted me to stay single, I said to her (whose faith I really admired), who is widowed: "Maybe someday we'll start a religious order, and you can be our Mother Superior!" (This was before I knew of the Supervisor thing. But she knows where she is going in her life, has a plan, so she said probably not to that. And my life has a different direction now). She has many projects, and I want to help her with them. (my past two years have been full, but things should begine to let up). Like, I'd like to be receptionist at events she organizes, fielding phone calls and showing people what to do, or beforehand stuff envelopes for her, etc. I never think of her as helping me with projects. ...So I wonder whose projects this pair works on?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eliza Thomason View Post
    Great story, Iris. This thread is very helpful. Nice friendship they have, and what you've shared is encouraging to me - because a friend I have made in the past recent years is my INTJ Supervisor. I admire her a lot. We met because we have our faith in common, but her past and ongoing accomplishments in life are a lot more stellar than mine (or most people's). When I realized she was my Supervisor, I got worried. Wondering if the ball was going to drop some day when she suddenly got completely exasperated by me. Yet we see none of that now. But like you say with the friendship you shared, its not a live-together thing.

    In that friendship, is SEE more the leader, EII the helper? Because I have seen my INTJ friendship like that from the very beginning I see her as the leader. In fact, as I had not yet met the man I fell in love with so unexpectedly, and was determined to be open to if the Lord wanted me to stay single, I said to her (whose faith I really admired), who is widowed: "Maybe someday we'll start a religious order, and you can be our Mother Superior!" (This was before I knew of the Supervisor thing. But she knows where she is going in her life, has a plan, so she said probably not to that. And my life has a different direction now). She has many projects, and I want to help her with them. (my past two years have been full, but things should begine to let up). Like, I'd like to be receptionist at events she organizes, fielding phone calls and showing people what to do, or beforehand stuff envelopes for her, etc. I never think of her as helping me with projects. ...So I wonder whose projects this pair works on?
    In that friendship, they are equal in terms of contribution. The EII is the brains and the SEE is the brawn, sort of. The SEE says, let's do something. The EII comes up with several good ideas. The SEE grabs the good ideas and runs with them, dragging the EII along with her. The SEE appreciates the EII pointing out potential obstacles ahead of them. The EII likes the drive and efficiency of the SEE. The SEE likes the EII's intellect - they have very interesting conversations. So together, they accomplish a lot and have fun and have great discussions. Sometimes the SEE will complain to me that the EII wastes too much time on Si stuff. (She usually has enough tact not to say it to the EII.) The EII probably occasionally feels a little rushed by the SEE and perhaps a little miffed when her painstaking Si creations are not fully appreciated by the SEE. But she never complains to me about that because that is not her style. Another reason the SEE has a lot of respect for the EII is that the EII spends a lot of time researching and finding the best of everything (and the SEE loves the best of everything, duh.) So they together they go have the best coffee, see the best movies, etc. Just because Si is the SEE's ignoring function doesn't mean that she can't tell the difference between good coffee and bad coffee. If the SEE needs a doctor, she calls the EII to get some names, because the EII has a long list of carefully chosen favorites. If they lived together, and the SEE was constantly telling the EII how to clean her house faster and not to waste so much time on cooking and other projects, the EII might get a little pissed off. So I think supervision is not always going to be a problem, given the working conditions. In your situation, if you are helping the LII at some event, they you will want to try a little harder to get every detail just the way she wants it. Your natural Fe as your demonstrative function will probably please the LII since that is her dual seeking function. Your dual seeking function and her mobilizing function are both Si so that could be an area where she helps you.
    You seek a great fortune, you three who are now in chains. You will find a fortune, though it will not be the one you seek.
    But first you must travel a long and difficult road, a road fraught with peril.
    You shall see things, wonderful to tell. You shall see a... cow... on the roof of a cotton house. And, oh, so many startlements.
    I cannot tell you how long this road shall be, but fear not the ob-stacles in your path, for fate has vouchsafed your reward.
    Though the road may wind, yea, your hearts grow weary, still shall ye follow them, even unto your salvation
    .


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pukq_XJmM-k

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    Quote Originally Posted by derpface View Post
    This is the saddest story I've read all day, haha.
    Ha, yes, it is a sad story of unappreciated effort, unrewarded generosity and crumbly bread. However, it is not a very dramatic story, probably because we are talking about gammas and deltas.
    You seek a great fortune, you three who are now in chains. You will find a fortune, though it will not be the one you seek.
    But first you must travel a long and difficult road, a road fraught with peril.
    You shall see things, wonderful to tell. You shall see a... cow... on the roof of a cotton house. And, oh, so many startlements.
    I cannot tell you how long this road shall be, but fear not the ob-stacles in your path, for fate has vouchsafed your reward.
    Though the road may wind, yea, your hearts grow weary, still shall ye follow them, even unto your salvation
    .


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pukq_XJmM-k

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    Quote Originally Posted by Iris View Post
    Ha, yes, it is a sad story of unappreciated effort, unrewarded generosity and crumbly bread. However, it is not a very dramatic story, probably because we are talking about gammas and deltas.
    The pathos was irresistible.

    I do have to say that 5-hour bread sounds like a sweet but kinda loopy idea.

    AIN'T NOBODY GOT TIME FOR THAT.

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    I didn't think the story was sad. I imagined the FiNe woman feeling relaxed, casual, and comfortable pulling out the bread, letting it cool, anticipating eating and/or sharing it...then slicing it...and then laughing about it. And then casually picking up crumbs with her fingers to pop into her mouth as she relaxedly eats it.

    I guess I see more peacefulness and sense of humor in the story than I do sadness.

    (Might be projection and/or wishful thinking on my part, lol.)
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    Quote Originally Posted by anndelise View Post
    I didn't think the story was sad. I imagined the FiNe woman feeling relaxed, casual, and comfortable pulling out the bread, letting it cool, anticipating eating and/or sharing it...then slicing it...and then laughing about it. And then casually picking up crumbs with her fingers to pop into her mouth as she relaxedly eats it.

    I guess I see more peacefulness and sense of humor in the story than I do sadness.

    (Might be projection and/or wishful thinking on my part, lol.)
    You exactly picked up on the underlying vibe of her life. She is very peaceful and sort of gently laughs her way through her encounters with Se-doms and crumbled bread.
    You seek a great fortune, you three who are now in chains. You will find a fortune, though it will not be the one you seek.
    But first you must travel a long and difficult road, a road fraught with peril.
    You shall see things, wonderful to tell. You shall see a... cow... on the roof of a cotton house. And, oh, so many startlements.
    I cannot tell you how long this road shall be, but fear not the ob-stacles in your path, for fate has vouchsafed your reward.
    Though the road may wind, yea, your hearts grow weary, still shall ye follow them, even unto your salvation
    .


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pukq_XJmM-k

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    Quote Originally Posted by anndelise View Post
    I didn't think the story was sad. I imagined the FiNe woman feeling relaxed, casual, and comfortable pulling out the bread, letting it cool, anticipating eating and/or sharing it...then slicing it...and then laughing about it. And then casually picking up crumbs with her fingers to pop into her mouth as she relaxedly eats it.

    I guess I see more peacefulness and sense of humor in the story than I do sadness.

    (Might be projection and/or wishful thinking on my part, lol.)
    This is a lovely way of looking at things and one that I wouldn't have considered left to my own devices.

    I have a hard time laughing off failed projects. My energies, once engaged, are focused on formal accomplishment and perfection. A failed baking endeavor (especially one that involved fancy ingredients and five hours of prep) would leave me feeling very glum.

    So I guess I was projecting too.

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    Quote Originally Posted by derpface View Post
    This is a lovely way of looking at things and one that I wouldn't have considered left to my own devices.

    I have a hard time laughing off failed projects. My energies, once engaged, are focused on formal accomplishment and perfection. A failed baking endeavor (especially one that involved fancy ingredients and five hours of prep) would leave me feeling very glum.

    So I guess I was projecting too.
    For myself, I'd have been frustrated, maybe even cursed at myself. But i would have also laughed at myself after the initial negative reaction. And just cuz it's crumbly doesn't mean total failure. It'd still be edible.

    Uh, well, ideally it would still be edible. Realistically if it was me i'd have probably screwed it up another way due to easy distractability like forgetting i even had something in the oven.
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    Quote Originally Posted by anndelise View Post
    For myself, I'd have been frustrated, maybe even cursed at myself. But i would have also laughed at myself after the initial negative reaction. And just cuz it's crumbly doesn't mean total failure. It'd still be edible.

    Uh, well, ideally it would still be edible. Realistically if it was me i'd have probably screwed it up another way due to easy distractability like forgetting i even had something in the oven.
    I remember trying to make a strawberry souffle with leftover ingredients and it was a total flop. The texture was slimy and weird so I ended up blitzing the crap out of it to make it a protein shake instead ... and it was still so bad that I ended up throwing it away.

    ANGRY DERPFACE.

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    Quote Originally Posted by derpface View Post
    I remember trying to make a strawberry souffle with leftover ingredients and it was a total flop. The texture was slimy and weird so I ended up blitzing the crap out of it to make it a protein shake instead ... and it was still so bad that I ended up throwing it away.

    ANGRY DERPFACE.
    At least you tried.
    I've figured it's too dangerous for me to cook anything in the oven. Most of my meals are one-skillet meals, salads, or sandwiches. Though in winter I play around with making soup...which my family has learned not to eat.

    But yeah, i can imagine your frustration....twice!!
    And slimey texture? I might have even tossed it instead of trying to salvage it.
    Nvm....the dog would probably get a bit here and there, muhahahah.
    IEE 649 sx/sp cp

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    Default SEE supervison of EII

    EII's what has been your experience with our supervisor the SEE. I had a See best friend in highschool and Ive never felt supervised by her. I guess you could have called me her shadow, she talked and I listened. She was fun and outgoing and I was kind of just there behind her and I was super protective of her. We laughed about everything and rarely had serious conversations but ive never felt criticisms from her, or is that not what supervision is about? SEE'S feel free to answer as well.

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    Found another thread on this. Sorry for the repetition.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jaein View Post
    EII's what has been your experience with our supervisor the SEE. I had a See best friend in highschool and Ive never felt supervised by her. I guess you could have called me her shadow, she talked and I listened. She was fun and outgoing and I was kind of just there behind her and I was super protective of her. We laughed about everything and rarely had serious conversations but ive never felt criticisms from her, or is that not what supervision is about? SEE'S feel free to answer as well.
    That's about what I've seen around SEE-Fi and EII-Ne friends. The EII girl is very communicable and talkative when she is around her friends, but when the SEE girl is around she suddenly goes quiet and switches to listening supportive mode just backing up whatever the SEE has to say. I've also seen an instance of an EII guy dating an SEE girl, and even though he's a talented, creative and accomplished guy, she would effectively "overshadow" him - whenever they were together, she would always come to the foreground and he would quietly slip to the back, and eventually he decided that this relationship wasn't for him. All in all, this one of the gentler supervision relationships from what I've seen as an outside observer. It seems to have much less to do with criticisms, but more with the the SEE expanding and appearing much more prominent or important than the EII's person when they are together, and I don't think the EII is always happy with such a predicament.

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    Quote Originally Posted by silke View Post
    That's about what I've seen around SEE-Fi and EII-Ne friends. The EII girl is very communicable and talkative when she is around her friends, but when the SEE girl is around she suddenly goes quiet and switches to listening supportive mode just backing up whatever the SEE has to say. I've also seen an instance of an EII guy dating an SEE girl, and even though he's a talented, creative and accomplished guy, she would effectively "overshadow" him - whenever they were together, she would always come to the foreground and he would quietly slip to the back, and eventually he decided that this relationship wasn't for him. All in all, this one of the gentler supervision relationships from what I've seen as an outside observer. It seems to have much less to do with criticisms, but more with the the SEE expanding and appearing much more prominent or important than the EII's person when they are together, and I don't think the EII is always happy with such a predicament.
    Mmm this describes it perfectly. I would sometimes get upset at her for being so 'out there and terrific'. But then i would get upset at myself for getting upset at her because, she cant really help it, thats just her lol. I actually miss her a lot.

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    All post!

    My brother is SEE.

    My bathroom was flooded by the guy upstairs a month ago and my landlord apologized to me and told me she wouldn't raise my rent. Knowing this is a costly fix, I've let the bathroom walls dry by keeping my window open and air circulating. My brother walks in yesterday and sees the cracking pain and comes to see me in the kitchen

    Him: what happened to the bathroom?
    Me: got flooded by the neighbor
    Him: you need to tell the manager to fix it. You're going to get mold and it's bad for you
    Me: I know but I feel bad since this will be the second time and it's costly work
    Him: it doesn't matter. This is their responsibility

    So he is aware and keenly picks up on details they don't escape him. He's aggressive about what is fact and what others responsibility are and unlike me his sense of compassion and feelings are not primary position I also think of my relationship with my manager and don't want her to get harassed by the landlord while my brother hates the manager and doesn't think we'll of her. I think of helping others before myself and thus I am slow to move on objective circumstance like he is.

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    I dated an INFj dude for about six months last year. I introduced him to personality typing actually....

    Unfit for the real world? HELL YES. Good intentions, and a sweet loving soul, but just...clueless, as far as my Se is concerned.

    Examples: I suggested getting together after work at a wine and cheese place I heard about. The place was 10 minutes from my office. We made plans to meet at 6.....soooo..where was he at 6pm? My house. Not the restaurant. He took "lets get together after work" to mean "come pick me up at my house after work." That doesn't even make sense. Why would I drive 15 minutes in the opposite direction of the restaurant for him to come get me?

    Another. He told me how he stayed in a relationship with an alcoholic woman who had crazy emotional outbursts and used him for his money for 5 years, like this information was supposed to make him look more appealing. Instead, I asked him why would he knowingly let himself be used like that? Did he not have the balls to walk away or call her on her shit? Why stay with someone like that, if you KNOW you are being used? It just made him look really weak. Even if you find yourself in an unfortunate situation like this, why would you go around announcing it to people? You might as well put on a hat with "chump" written on the front in neon letters.

    However. The sex was really good. This is why we lasted 6 months.

    One day I had to give him the "lets just be friends" talk. Valentines was about a week away. Although we were"just friends" and he pretended like he was OK with it, although I know he was not, he still bought me roses and dropped $200 on a steak dinner.

    I just couldn't, anymore
    I'm just an effin ray of sunshine

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    Quote Originally Posted by HotSauce View Post

    Examples: I suggested getting together after work at a wine and cheese place I heard about. The place was 10 minutes from my office. We made plans to meet at 6.....soooo..where was he at 6pm? My house. Not the restaurant. He took "lets get together after work" to mean "come pick me up at my house after work." That doesn't even make sense. Why would I drive 15 minutes in the opposite direction of the restaurant for him to come get me?
    that's adorable. lol

    ...but also kind of

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    Quote Originally Posted by HotSauce View Post
    One day I had to give him the "lets just be friends" talk. Valentines was about a week away. Although we were"just friends" and he pretended like he was OK with it, although I know he was not
    I do this. Like when someone expresses a wish to distance themselves from me, I try and put on a brave face. I think its just me trying to be unimposing and to show that I respect their decision and wont press the issue further. That sounds rough though, rough relations.

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    Quote Originally Posted by HotSauce View Post
    I dated an INFj dude for about six months last year. I introduced him to personality typing actually....

    Unfit for the real world? HELL YES. Good intentions, and a sweet loving soul, but just...clueless, as far as my Se is concerned.

    Examples: I suggested getting together after work at a wine and cheese place I heard about. The place was 10 minutes from my office. We made plans to meet at 6.....soooo..where was he at 6pm? My house. Not the restaurant. He took "lets get together after work" to mean "come pick me up at my house after work." That doesn't even make sense. Why would I drive 15 minutes in the opposite direction of the restaurant for him to come get me?

    Another. He told me how he stayed in a relationship with an alcoholic woman who had crazy emotional outbursts and used him for his money for 5 years, like this information was supposed to make him look more appealing. Instead, I asked him why would he knowingly let himself be used like that? Did he not have the balls to walk away or call her on her shit? Why stay with someone like that, if you KNOW you are being used? It just made him look really weak. Even if you find yourself in an unfortunate situation like this, why would you go around announcing it to people? You might as well put on a hat with "chump" written on the front in neon letters.

    However. The sex was really good. This is why we lasted 6 months.

    One day I had to give him the "lets just be friends" talk. Valentines was about a week away. Although we were"just friends" and he pretended like he was OK with it, although I know he was not, he still bought me roses and dropped $200 on a steak dinner.

    I just couldn't, anymore
    We don't think about how something may make us look weak. We don't judge the strength and weaknesses of things. When he talks about taking care of someone in a bad situation he's saying that he values compassion and caregiving as well as his ability to stick through a tough situation to be stoic and a model of good acts a good character.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa View Post
    We don't think about how something may make us look weak. We don't judge the strength and weaknesses of things. When he talks about taking care of someone in a bad situation he's saying that he values compassion and caregiving as well as his ability to stick through a tough situation to be stoic and a model of good acts a good character.
    Yes. I totally get it.That's the INFj way. However, you don't get any awards in life for how much you suffered. What is appealing about going around announcing how much you sacrificed yourself? Unless you are Jesus or something. Where are YOU at the end of the day?

    You know how flight attendants tell you to put the air mask on yourself, first? It might be a sacrifice to firstly help the old lady next to you, but you'll run out of air and die with her looking at you, breathing all good
    I'm just an effin ray of sunshine

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    I'm fairly open about manipulative and abusive situations I've been in partly to illustrate how I've grown and what I've learned and partly to weed out stupid/incompatible people who would regard it as weakness.

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    Quote Originally Posted by HotSauce View Post
    Yes. I totally get it.That's the INFj way. However, you don't get any awards in life for how much you suffered. What is appealing about going around announcing how much you sacrificed yourself? Unless you are Jesus or something. Where are YOU at the end of the day?

    You know how flight attendants tell you to put the air mask on yourself, first? It might be a sacrifice to firstly help the old lady next to you, but you'll run out of air and die with her looking at you, breathing all good
    Maybe no appeal. To be an Empath is a type. And, no body gets out of here alive no matter how we are programmed to be.

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