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Thread: Enneagram Type 9 and Bureaucracy

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    Creepy-male

    Default Enneagram Type 9 and Bureaucracy

    I'm on Lunch Break right now so I'll post a more detailed version later or edit this one, but I want to get the ball rolling on this:

    I was reading an Enneagram book (quotations to come) and it mentioned some interesting things about the e9.

    I was mentioned that the USPS was typed e9. Mainly due to it being the Postal Service, which I found humorous because it's not only a perfect portrait of a bureaucracy bogged down by inertia but only is a play on words on someone going "Postal". Both are associated to the e9 as well in the preceding passages in the book I was reading. The tendency for e9's to work in large bureaucratic organizations and the tendency for e9's to get upset after feeling abused or taken advantage of or pushed too far. In other words, "Going Postal".

    In specific the rationalization for e9's being bureaucratic was two fold. First they tend to ignore there own needs in order to harmonize with the surrounding environment, so socially they may be attracted to simple, predictable, calm, and straightforward work as opposed to ambitiously seeking out their own personal mission which could lead to conflict which they avoid. They also do this in social interactions, trying to understand there partner and put their needs first while being reserved about their own needs. Second they are usually a type represented by inertia rather than action, but there inertia may manifest itself as more than just basic sloth. There inertia could involve finding excuses to avoid doing something else. They may have stress associated to something so they spend hours working on something that isn't tied to that as a stress relieve device. These devices themselves may even develop into genuine interests.

    So this had me thinking about a few things, mainly how I could personally avoid sloth and inertia and get back on track with what's important in my own life, and secondarily how this associated to e9. I tend to type myself in the instinctive triad as e9w8 or e8w9 so I partially relate to this.

    It's also hard for me to sort out inertia from the other aspects of triads. Mainly with an e4 or e5 may be reserved as well and avoid certain things due to stress or mood and is this the result of inertia of the e9 or is it a result of another type and do those aspects overlap and integrate?

    The final interesting thing to note is that in the passage it mentioned something about e9's having the ability to zone out and process multiple threads. For example they were talking about a speed typist who could type copies and simultaneously think about something unrelated. I think this is interesting because that kind of multi-faceted awareness makes sense of a "harmonizer"-- someone who is trying to weave together many threads. This also makes them appeared subdued and zoned out because they are focusing on so much "behind the scenes" that they are moving slower on the surface.

    The characteristics identified were:
    • Bureaucracy
    • Multi-Thread Awareness
    • Inertia / Sloth
    • Sidetracking from something stressful
    • Gets upset when they are pushed past a limit
    • Forgets their own needs or personal focus/mission in life


    Do you have any thoughts or related experiences with e9's? Oh and please forgive me for momentarily knocking "Women hate sluts" off the top of the list in psychology.

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    applejacks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Man From Nantucket View Post
    The characteristics identified were:
    • Bureaucracy
    • Multi-Thread Awareness
    • Inertia / Sloth
    • Sidetracking from something stressful
    • Gets upset when they are pushed past a limit
    • Forgets their own needs or personal focus/mission in life

    I realize I'm digging out an old thread, but I've just taken the Enneagram test and got 9, with wings 3w2.

    I can absolutely relate to each of these bullet points. My husband, whom I suspect is Enneagram 1 based on my understanding of him and after reading this Communication Style Article is always telling me... "an object in motion stays in motion. An object in rest, stays at rest." Basically, he's indirectly and politely reminding me that I tend to either be super charged and getting everything done, or I'm on the couch wasting time. There's little in between. I'm capable of short bursts of productivity, followed by lulls, and my productivity streak usually ignites when the needs of others arise. However, I find it extremely difficult to examine my life's needs and motivate myself.

    The article Communication Style I just linked above had this to say about the myth of our perceived inertia and thus productivity:

    Type 9 Myth: Nines are lazy, slow, unproductive, and lacking in leadership and effectiveness.

    Fact: Nines' inertia is simply toward themselves as they put their attention and energy into others' opinions and agendas. They are often highly productive and effective consensus leaders, as well as thoughtful and giving.
    These were the solutions for how others can assist an E9:

    -Encourage me to express my own position.
    -Ask me what I want and what is good for me, and give me time to figure out the answer.
    -Support me when I act responsibly toward myself.
    -Allow me to acknowledge my anger.
    -Encourage me to set and keep my own boundaries, limits, priorities.


    As for your statement on the ability to zone out, I found this article on Enneagram Attention to be spot on in explaining the "multiple radio channel frequencies" that my mind simultaneously dials into. For example:

    Nines report that they dip in and out of conversations. A sector of their attention is mechanically focused on what is being said, but they can simultaneously co-process another train of thought or feel themselves merging into what they suppose other people are feeling. Most Nines describe co-processing as sliding from one object of attention to another. For example, a word in a conversation may trigger a memory, trigger an inner monologue about the memory, trigger feelings about how the present conversation is similar to the past.

    These interior diversions go on while the Nine is still aware of how the conversation is developing. Like the motorist who arrived at home without a memory of having driven there, Nines can wake up to hear themselves give a passable reply, having forgotten the topic of conversation. Nines say that they tune their mental radio to two or three stations, slipping between classical, country, and rock 'n' roll.



    Hope this was insightful in some way.
    And if God cares so wonderfully for flowers that are here today and gone tomorrow, won't he more surely care for you?- Matthew 6:30

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    There is no such construct as Enneagram 9 with 3w2. Not unless Ichazo went completely crazy at some point, which wouldn't surprise me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Absurd View Post
    There is no such construct as Enneagram 9 with 3w2. Not unless Ichazo went completely crazy at some point, which wouldn't surprise me.
    Ok, then I misread my results somehow, but I know I typed 9. I'll take it again and repost.
    And if God cares so wonderfully for flowers that are here today and gone tomorrow, won't he more surely care for you?- Matthew 6:30

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    Take your time.

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    Ok, so I just took it again and it's slightly different than the last result, as I think 3w2 was higher up in the secondary results, but the final result for 9 is still the same.

    Enneagram Test Results

    You are most likely a type 9.
    Taking wings into account, you seem to be a 9w1.

    No personality test is completely accurate. Although several measures were taken to make this test as accurate as possible, there's always a chance that you are not typed correctly by it. Therefore, when deciding which Enneagram type and wing you are, you might also want to consider the types with the highest test scores on the lists below.

    (Note that your lowest scores may be omitted.)

    Type 9 - 11
    Type 3 - 7.3
    Type 2 - 7.3
    Type 7 - 6.7
    Type 1 - 3
    Type 8 - 1.7

    Wing 9w1 - 12.5
    Wing 9w8 - 11.9
    Wing 2w3 - 11
    Wing 3w2 - 11
    Wing 2w1 - 8.8
    Wing 3w4 - 8.7
    Wing 1w9 - 8.5
    Wing 7w6 - 8.1
    Wing 7w8 - 7.6
    Wing 8w9 - 7.2
    Wing 1w2 - 6.7
    Wing 8w7 - 5.1
    And if God cares so wonderfully for flowers that are here today and gone tomorrow, won't he more surely care for you?- Matthew 6:30

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    I would have guessed 2w3 so/sx @applejacks from how you come off on the forum. You seem to really need people, and that is characteristic of pt.2. May be make a new thread for your Etype? You've already had sufficient presence on this forum for others to form some opinion about you and suggest possible typings.

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    Quote Originally Posted by silke View Post
    I would have guessed 2w3 so/sx @applejacks from how you come off on the forum. You seem to really need people, and that is characteristic of pt.2. May be make a new thread for your Etype? You've already had sufficient presence on this forum for others to form some opinion about you and suggest possible typings.
    Thanks, Silke! You could be right, and I appreciate the insight. I've only taken the test today, and while I'm still piecing things together, I've so far received 9w1 so/sx.

    As for my need for others, I've been unusually isolated from people for so long that I may just be acting a little more dramatic than usual about it to you all, but you could very well be right on that. It's clear that whatever the enneagram answer is, I'm not currently a healthy one.

    I always appreciate genuine insight So thank you! I really appreciate your feedback and thoughts!
    And if God cares so wonderfully for flowers that are here today and gone tomorrow, won't he more surely care for you?- Matthew 6:30

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    I like 9w1 for you, apples. I am not sure I am seeing 2. I can elaborate later!
    “Let us forget with generosity those who cannot love us”
    ― Pablo Neruda

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kim View Post
    I like 9w1 for you, apples. I am not sure I am seeing 2. I can elaborate later!
    Just noticed the Lisa Loeb in your signature! <3

    And I suppose the w1 was surprising, but on thinking back, I've always been very self critical, especially when inactive. But again, the Enneagram world is new to me. I'm still trying to soak in some of the concepts.
    And if God cares so wonderfully for flowers that are here today and gone tomorrow, won't he more surely care for you?- Matthew 6:30

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    Just on gut instinct, 9 makes sense for me too, more so than 2.

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    Quote Originally Posted by applejacks View Post
    Ok, so I just took it again and it's slightly different than the last result, as I think 3w2 was higher up in the secondary results, but the final result for 9 is still the same.

    Enneagram Test Results

    You are most likely a type 9.
    Taking wings into account, you seem to be a 9w1.

    No personality test is completely accurate. Although several measures were taken to make this test as accurate as possible, there's always a chance that you are not typed correctly by it. Therefore, when deciding which Enneagram type and wing you are, you might also want to consider the types with the highest test scores on the lists below.

    (Note that your lowest scores may be omitted.)

    Type 9 - 11
    Type 3 - 7.3
    Type 2 - 7.3
    Type 7 - 6.7
    Type 1 - 3
    Type 8 - 1.7

    Wing 9w1 - 12.5
    Wing 9w8 - 11.9
    Wing 2w3 - 11
    Wing 3w2 - 11
    Wing 2w1 - 8.8
    Wing 3w4 - 8.7
    Wing 1w9 - 8.5
    Wing 7w6 - 8.1
    Wing 7w8 - 7.6
    Wing 8w9 - 7.2
    Wing 1w2 - 6.7
    Wing 8w7 - 5.1
    how's about lighting the whole Enneagram up like a Christmas tree and checking out tritypes in the meantime? Any permutation of 279 would be triple positive outlook, which rules. And a pre-emptive and hearty "fuck you" to the dogmatic tritype naysayers out there.

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