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    chairpersonality Holon's Avatar
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    What's up everybody,

    I am but a grain of a song of sand, and by Jung's reckoning, an extremely neurotic introvert. What does he know. I reckon I'm just one of those hyper-lucid artistic types who sees the world for what it is: abstract, man. Your individual identity becomes impossible to maintain when you think of a grand informational world made up of a collective consciousness. Individuals are virtual particles in the seas of scientific knowledge, artistic thought, and common sense.

    I'm looking forward to hearing how other people see the world. I have something of a low opinion of structure-first systems like Socionics and the enneagram (as opposed to things like schizotypy, whose evolution ahs been guided by factor analysis... no wastebin monstrosities like the ILI to be found there), but the people who employ them often have juicy ways of interpreting things. I may have no respect for your system as a form of knowledge, but I have full respect for you, the user, as a mind, fascinating in its own right.

    At the moment, I'm working on a novel roleplaying experience in Oblivion. While it's interesting enough to beat a dead author with a bundle of symbols, I think it's even more interesting to play as a character constantly mentally assailed and compulsively guided by what he perceives as messages sent by some kind of entity. The way his language of symbols evolves is also an interesting experience.

    The sad irony of all this is that English was my worst and most hated subject in school.

    Ta,
    Sand

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    hello

    Quote Originally Posted by A Grain of a Song of Sand View Post
    I'm looking forward to hearing how other people see the world. I have something of a low opinion of structure-first systems like Socionics and the enneagram (as opposed to things like schizotypy, whose evolution ahs been guided by factor analysis... no wastebin monstrosities like the ILI to be found there), but the people who employ them often have juicy ways of interpreting things. I may have no respect for your system as a form of knowledge, but I have full respect for you, the user, as a mind, fascinating in its own right.
    i leik.

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    Killer of DJA's Fun fen's Avatar
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    Hello there.
    And I would hide my face in you and you would hide your face in me, and nobody would ever see us any more.


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    chairpersonality Holon's Avatar
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    Hi @lungs. I love your avatar. My mind is also a bit muddled, I instantly thought of lungs filled with sand. I suppose if my song is of sand, then sand can be a song as well, so lungs filled with song, and the breath of life...

    Although, sand to me is inherently about loss. It's the thing that you can never hold on to. Its grains slip through your grasp, leave only emptiness behind. Everyone you love, all the things you have, invariably turn to ash or dust. The one thing that will never leave your grasp is the loss left in the wake of what once was.


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    Creepy-male

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    You are a very curious one to me, and a bit bizarre.

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    @Eliza Thomason

    there's a couple of new charismatic kids we'd liek u to check over here
    unholy water sanguine addiction

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    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:08 AM: Hi Jim.
    InvisibleJim Today 02:09 AM: Hi Grain.
    InvisibleJim Today 02:09 AM: I hope you aren't going to give me mi-grain.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:09 AM: And lungs.
    InvisibleJim Today 02:09 AM: :shity
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:09 AM: Hurr hurr, gotta SAND it to you, that was a good one.
    InvisibleJim Today 02:10 AM: This one just in: how can I sleep after watching game of thrones!!!! craziness!!!
    InvisibleJim Today 02:10 AM: *InvisibleJim giggles in delight*
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:10 AM: I'm littorally shore I've never heard a pun that good.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:11 AM: Also, call me Sand, not Grain. I find Sand is more impersonal.
    InvisibleJim Today 02:11 AM: A blissful delight and a blessing from the ether, for sure.
    InvisibleJim Today 02:12 AM: Very well Sand, I dub thee Sandy.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:12 AM: You're not the first. I hope you're the last.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:12 AM: Jimima.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:12 AM:
    InvisibleJim Today 02:12 AM: That can be arranged. via a rapid name change procedure.
    InvisibleJim Today 02:13 AM: It's painless, so I'm told. But the anesthetic is quite debilitating.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:13 AM: As anesthetics are wont to be, the vicious bastards.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:13 AM: A friend was telling me ketamine causes bladder necrosis.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:13 AM: I cut her off laughing.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:14 AM: Because she introduced it as "this party drug".
    InvisibleJim Today 02:14 AM: If she introduced "this party drug" you should reconsider your screening criteria for friends.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:15 AM: Next time I'm in surgery, I'll make sure to flick my dreadlocks and go "YOU GUYS GOT SOME SPECIAL K FOR ME MAAAAAAAN".
    Fireyed Today 02:15 AM: Who is a grain of sand
    InvisibleJim Today 02:15 AM: There are important things to be done, philosophies and viewpoints to be modified and resculptured. There is no time for party drugs, only blissful endless utility and productivity.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:15 AM: I am but a thought, a mere piece in the grand consciousness that is our evolving culture.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:16 AM: All in all, Jim.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:16 AM: All in all, you sound like you're just another brick in the wall.
    InvisibleJim Today 02:16 AM: Eat meat. Demand pudding.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:17 AM: No, if you eat your meat, you get pudding.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:17 AM: Eat meat. Pudding follows.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:17 AM: A true revolutionary would shun his meat and claim his pudding.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:17 AM: An anarchist would then dash it against the ground.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:18 AM: It's the pudding of the institutions that poison our culture! I don't want it!
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:18 AM: I grow my own sweet potatoes and also my hair is falling out and I have a pot belly!
    InvisibleJim Today 02:18 AM: Consider myself more lassie faire, less anarcho-liberal.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:19 AM: I'm center-apathetic.
    InvisibleJim Today 02:19 AM: However, you should consider if the pot belly and the hair loss correlate to the growth rate of the sweet potatoes.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:19 AM: I do vote Pirate Party though. At least until I can escape to an island somewhere.
    InvisibleJim Today 02:19 AM: You may have plutonium or thorium in your garden or allotment if this is the case.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:19 AM: No, they correlate to the lack of anything in my diet other than rigorously controlled homegrown sweet potatoes.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:19 AM: My diet is the diet of freedom, though, so I'm happy.
    InvisibleJim Today 02:20 AM: Well that is good news.
    InvisibleJim Today 02:20 AM: Have you considered investing your surplus sweet potatoes in sweet potato futures?
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:21 AM: Do you have an offer for me?
    InvisibleJim Today 02:21 AM: Perhaps using the returns you can expand your plot thus eliminating the requirement for non-sweet potato consumption.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:21 AM: Interesting.
    InvisibleJim Today 02:21 AM: Alas, I'm afraid the fine art of sweet potato culturing is not one I am intimately familiar with.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:21 AM: I can't grow fruit though.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:22 AM: Jung told me I'm a most fruitless of men.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:22 AM: You can grow mushrooms as surrogate skin.
    InvisibleJim Today 02:22 AM: That's a bind. I'd reroll the dice.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:22 AM: Provided they stay in the dark until mature, once they've blossomed, you can sun them and they produce vitamin D for you.
    fen Today 02:23 AM: hi
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:23 AM: I don't know how well you'd fare grafting mushroom flesh to you in case you need artificial skin, though.
    InvisibleJim Today 02:23 AM: That's useful but I do not enjoy champingones.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:23 AM: Hi, fen.
    InvisibleJim Today 02:23 AM: I've never taken the time to acquire a taste for them.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:24 AM: Champingnons are a scam.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:24 AM: Only portobello mushrooms are the mature form of the field mushroom.
    InvisibleJim Today 02:24 AM: It appears your requirements are highly specific.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:24 AM: You can trust my radical, forceful, and possibly hasty and misinformed opinion, because I have dreadlocks.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:25 AM: I make a point to let people see me littering and disrespecting the environment, though.
    InvisibleJim Today 02:26 AM: I'm not sure that this combination of traits lends itself well to trustworthiness
    InvisibleJim Today 02:27 AM: infact only today lung's was telling us that you can only trust individuals who have suffered numerous psychological episodes.
    InvisibleJim Today 02:27 AM: With such encouragement I'm scheduling at least 12 psychological episodes in my diary.
    InvisibleJim Today 02:27 AM: I'm going to be extremely trustworthy afterwards.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:28 AM: I find people who are open about having experienced episodes to be more relatable and hence trustworthy.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:28 AM: Although, what particular kind of "episode" are we talking about? Psychotic? Breakdown?
    InvisibleJim Today 02:29 AM: Perhaps both at the same time, there's no need to start imposing roles upon it.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:30 AM: I don't personally know anyone who's experienced psychotic depression.
    InvisibleJim Today 02:30 AM: It may just be an episode recounting how exciting last nights game of thrones was; here's one fresh off the press: #got reactions: crying, shaking and then vengeful raising of fists.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:30 AM: Lol.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:30 AM: America's a strange place.
    InvisibleJim Today 02:31 AM: Me either, you see I'm quite discriminating in the choice of people who I choose to know and since my difficult demeanor is one that is difficult for others to accept then that keeps things simple and manageable.
    InvisibleJim Today 02:31 AM: I wouldn't know, I only fly in and out every once in a while.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:31 AM: They seem to have a fetish for emotion and infantilism.
    InvisibleJim Today 02:31 AM: Just don't date the woman, well, at least, that's what people seem to be telling me.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:32 AM: I don't have to be discriminating in my company. My company usually discriminates against my odours.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:33 AM: It's the goddamn menthol in my goddamn body wash, I swear.
    InvisibleJim Today 02:33 AM: Alas the sweet potato growing industry is one where even the slightest afronting smell can lead to crop spoilage.
    InvisibleJim Today 02:33 AM: You are a rich source of information Sandy.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:33 AM: I wonder what menthol oxidises into.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:33 AM: I'm a veritable hurricane of knowledge.
    InvisibleJim Today 02:34 AM: Oh my.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:34 AM: Raining down facts in my gale-force expulsions of sound.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:34 AM: Hurling the debris of ignorance from my path. Watch out!
    InvisibleJim Today 02:35 AM: I'll watch but only if I stand the chance of catching some sweet potato extract or perhaps a suitcase of bonds for sweet potato futures.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:35 AM: What's the password?
    InvisibleJim Today 02:36 AM: Irishpotat03
    InvisibleJim Today 02:36 AM: No, it's 'butts'
    InvisibleJim Today 02:36 AM: In memory of the buttsex the channel owner is known to enjoy.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:38 AM: Fascinating.
    InvisibleJim Today 02:39 AM: Alas places to do, things to go. Auf weidersehen.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:40 AM: Fare well, Jim.
    A Grain of a Song of Sand Today 02:41 AM: I'd see you off, but, well...

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by A Grain of a Song of Sand View Post
    What's up everybody,

    I am but a grain of a song of sand, and by Jung's reckoning, an extremely neurotic introvert. What does he know. I reckon I'm just one of those hyper-lucid artistic types who sees the world for what it is: abstract, man. Your individual identity becomes impossible to maintain when you think of a grand informational world made up of a collective consciousness. Individuals are virtual particles in the seas of scientific knowledge, artistic thought, and common sense.

    I'm looking forward to hearing how other people see the world. I have something of a low opinion of structure-first systems like Socionics and the enneagram (as opposed to things like schizotypy, whose evolution ahs been guided by factor analysis... no wastebin monstrosities like the ILI to be found there), but the people who employ them often have juicy ways of interpreting things. I may have no respect for your system as a form of knowledge, but I have full respect for you, the user, as a mind, fascinating in its own right.

    At the moment, I'm working on a novel roleplaying experience in Oblivion. While it's interesting enough to beat a dead author with a bundle of symbols, I think it's even more interesting to play as a character constantly mentally assailed and compulsively guided by what he perceives as messages sent by some kind of entity. The way his language of symbols evolves is also an interesting experience.

    The sad irony of all this is that English was my worst and most hated subject in school.

    Ta,
    Sand
    Welcome.

    What's Oblivion?
    The trickster is at one and the same time creator and destroyer, giver and negator, he who dupes others, and who is always duped himself.

  9. #9
    chairpersonality Holon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RedBeard View Post
    Welcome.

    What's Oblivion?
    It's a sandbox RPG. At some point, I said to myself I was going to play another game, Fallout New Vegas, and kill everybody and everything. The game does a great job of rewarding you for this, since at the end, you get a little slideshow depicting all the havoc you've caused. The problem is, it's really hard to justify doing that from a roleplay perspective.

    My next step was to roleplay as a wizard in Morrowind. He was to start off small, using magic to commit minor crimes, while having moments of wicked inspiration that he could get away with more--like murder. Early on he commits to a rise to power, and later he was to go quite mad and decide to annihilate everything, returning it to "the truth of its borrowed existence". I started that particular thread with his meditating on the casting of magic. How mathematical, inorganic, and beautiful it seems. I would've liked to experience his reaction to the epic events that unfold in Morrowind, like deicide, and chillin' with gods, but I got sick of Morrowind's constant software crashes and uninstalled it in favour of Oblivion.

    At some point I'm going to have to stop stalling and just replay Final Fantasy VI. I love Kefka. I love apocalypses. I love deicide. The game has everything for me.

    As an aside, I disagree with the youtuber MatPat13 that the FF games advocate deicide as a protest against religion. From the start, Final Fantasy's bad guys have always been either bad, or so far removed from what we consider morality that they're monstrous. Also, the examples he cites are all from different authors, and he pulls in Legends, which was only branded with Final Fantasy to generate sales in the US, lol.

    To be fair, it is interesting to think of the Final Fantasy games as being a single collective consciousness. The great thing about authors in series is that, as the series grows, it begins to develop patterns, which prime its authors to produce more of those themes and ideas. Long runners take on lives of their own. More than just games, I'm starting to think of science as a collective consciousness. It is a bit strange to think of a consciousness that has an apparent will and capacity to act, but has no traditional animal ways of perceiving the world. It has the knowledge we feed it, but it has no senses of its own.

    Vaguely related, the idea of culture producing itself:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNBOkp346G8

    We might not be alone. Instead of a skynet, we might have entities of pure information evolving inside the wires running all along our planet. Is that cool? Or scary?

    So yeah. That's what Oblivion is.
    Last edited by Holon; 06-04-2013 at 04:46 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by A Grain of a Song of Sand View Post
    It's a sandbox RPG. At some point, I said to myself I was going to play another game, Fallout New Vegas, and kill everybody and everything. The game does a great job of rewarding you for this, since at the end, you get a little slideshow depicting all the havoc you've caused. The problem is, it's really hard to justify doing that from a roleplay perspective.

    My next step was to roleplay as a wizard in Morrowind. He was to start off small, using magic to commit minor crimes, while having moments of wicked inspiration that he could get away with more--like murder. Early on he commits to a rise to power, and later he was to go quite mad and decide to annihilate everything, returning it to "the truth of its borrowed existence". I started that particular thread with his meditating on the casting of magic. How mathematical, inorganic, and beautiful it seems. I would've liked to experience his reaction to the epic events that unfold in Morrowind, like deicide, but I got sick of Morrowind's constant software crashes and uninstalled it in favour of Oblivion.

    At some point I'm going to have to stop stalling and just replay Final Fantasy VI. I love Kefka. I love apocalypses. I love deicide. The game has everything for me.

    As an aside, I disagree with the youtuber MatPat13 that the FF games advocate deicide as a protest against religion. From the start, Final Fantasy's bad guys have always been either bad, or so far removed from what we consider morality that they're monstrous. Also, the examples he cites are all from different authors, and he pulls in Legends, which was only branded with Final Fantasy to generate sales in the US, lol.

    To be fair, it is interesting to think of the Final Fantasy games as being a single collective consciousness. The great thing about authors in series is that, as the series grows, it begins to develop patterns, which prime its authors to produce more of those themes and ideas. Long runners take on lives of their own. More than just games, I'm starting to think of science as a collective consciousness. It is a bit strange to think of a consciousness that has an apparent will and capacity to act, but has no traditional animal ways of perceiving the world. It has the knowledge we feed it, but it has no senses of its own.

    Vaguely related, the idea of culture producing itself:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eNBOkp346G8

    We might not be alone. Instead of a skynet, we might have entities of pure information evolving inside the wires running all along our planet. Is that cool? Or scary?

    So yeah. That's what Oblivion is.
    I thought so. You must be gifted with quite an imagination to actually Role-Play in Oblivion in the fashion you originally described. Are your character's idiosyncrasies a far cry from your true personality?
    The trickster is at one and the same time creator and destroyer, giver and negator, he who dupes others, and who is always duped himself.

  11. #11
    chairpersonality Holon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RedBeard View Post
    I thought so. You must be gifted with quite an imagination to actually Role-Play in Oblivion in the fashion you originally described. Are your character's idiosyncrasies a far cry from your true personality?
    Definitely a far cry. The Oblivion character has large parts of myself and my history in him, while the Morrowind character was a reaction to FNV encouraging me to run rampant and kick down every castle in my little sandbox. Of course, his journey has to be down a path I understand (meditating on magic--a stand-in for mathematics and what quantum theory I've been able to patch together, losing sight of his individuality, losing sight of the reality of other people's existence), but his destination came from outside.

    Though, that thought holds only if personality is action, rather than thought and attitude. If personality is thought, then my characters are like distilled essences of myself. For the Morrowind character, I attempted to understand what drives someone to be so destructive. The way immediate to me is that he begins to lose his head in the clouds, seeing life as being transient and unreal, and seeing himself as an agent of some abstract belief system.

    As for the Oblivion character, the ability to see the world as an unfolding story, filled with messages, spoken in symbols, fits into the current stage of my worldview: that the world is fundamentally made of the languages used to describe it. The Universe is less a great machine, less a grand thought, and more a fragment of a vast utterance. It helps that, when I was young, if my memories are truthful, I went through a phase of seeing symbolism everywhere in my life. I never thought it was an attempt to communicate with me, though. (Although I did once ponder if I had invented time travel and was communicating with myself through crop circles... lol).

    One unfortunate thing about Oblivion is that it keeps you moving through a world filled with highly salient objects. The real world is more static, with less obvious "things" in it. There doesn't seem to be much smybolic worth in a bus trip down the same street you've bussed down hundreds of times, but there is something profound and rich about a journey through crumbling tunnels that ends in a river in the bottom of a valley. Maybe it's just because fiction makes symbolism more salient for me, and I'm used to experiencing reality as being more consistently drab and barren.

    That all said--

    I have a tendency to want to roleplay highly intelligent, highly amoral characters. My last D&D session, I was a Bard en route for Assassin levels. My first night, I tried to talk to some thugs in a bar, spiking their alcohol with acid just in case. As it turns out it was quite helpful when they couldn't be swayed, so I used telekinesis to splash the acid in the thug's eyes. Glorious. One survived the ensuing carnage, though, and I made sure to attempt to cripple him with an arrow when he fled.

    That's out and out power fantasy for me, though. No higher idea, just good, filthy, evil fun.

    My Oblivion character isn't evil, though. He's quite mad, but if he winds up feeling compelled to do something we're programmed as humans to feel is wrong, he will be conflicted about it. I need to find an excuse to bring such a situation up. Later, though, that will be the start of something big, and I don't want it to just be the moment where he starts to decline into murderousness. Been there, done that, want something new.
    Last edited by Holon; 06-04-2013 at 05:55 PM.

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    Hello sand.

    I still haven't seen you. >:c

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    chairpersonality Holon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by derpface View Post
    Hello sand.

    I still haven't seen you. >:c
    Ask and you shall receive. I figured I can use my Android for this.

    I'll make a video talking about My Take On Life as well, after my exam.

    EDIT



    Larger image.
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by Holon; 06-05-2013 at 03:48 AM.

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    Hi.

    Quote Originally Posted by A Grain of a Song of Sand View Post
    I'm looking forward to hearing how other people see the world.
    At some point in my life, I noticed there were right angles everywhere I looked. It used to bother me like you wouldn't believe.

    I like your picture a lot. You seem so calm with this small smile. Like a dead person, but in a good way.

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    Quote Originally Posted by malna View Post
    Hi.

    At some point in my life, I noticed there were right angles everywhere I looked. It used to bother me like you wouldn't believe.

    I like your picture a lot. You seem so calm with this small smile. Like a dead person, but in a good way.
    I know what you mean with the right angles. I've had several things like that, first with moire interference, which suddenly popped into my awareness everywhere, and has been doing so ever since, and looking at the extravagantly self-similar structure of plant life. (Animals have it too, it's just more subtle.) The experience of not being able to unsee something once it becomes salient is quite fascinating, especially when I think about what kind of a planet quantum physicists and mathematicians must see when they look at the world. Of course it's down to the individual, but I've seen some interesting extremes, like an old statistics professor who talked in a mathematics-English pidgin, with as many symbols as typical words.

    As for the smile, thanks, that's a delightfully quirky kind of a compliment I learned recently about duchenne smiling, where you engage the corners of your eyes in a smile. A truly fake smile with just the lips doesn't do much for your state of mind or feelings, but a duchenne smile brings all those smiley feelings with it, like calmness and happiness. For a while, I tried smiling when I could, since the emotional changes bring with them an attendant change in outlook. It's still remained as a good habit for posing for photographs though.

    On the topic of salience, a steadily growing theme in my thoughts over the past two years has been that of "relationships", in the sense of systems. I think it's true that the world smiles with you, not because of any objective change your actions might have on the people around you, but because of the way your environment changes in appearance. When you remember to smile, people seem less threatening, less subtly sardonic, and you feel an intoxicating liberty to flout as much convention as you please. Perhaps that's socially naive, though. I don't know, though I do know that I don't, at least. I'm painfully aware of the limits of my insight as a recluse.

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    Quote Originally Posted by A Grain of a Song of Sand View Post
    Ask and you shall receive. I figured I can use my Android for this.

    I'll make a video talking about My Take On Life as well, after my exam.

    EDIT


    Larger image.
    Hi Song, Um, I appreciate this picture but unfortunately, for me, it's not typable. I need one taken from the side of your body, shoulder up and one closer to your face again face forward and shoulder up.

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