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Thread: volatility / groundedness

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    Default volatility / groundedness

    do you consider these traits type related? in what way?

    (the reason i ask is because being "too grounded & down to earth" is one of the more common arguments people have against me being esi or 6. which strikes me as odd. but i want higher level responses, not about me in particular.)

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    How is being grounded and down to earth an opposing argument for an ESI typing? Anyway from my POV you seem rather volatile
    Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit

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    no it's not because emotional reactions especially from those who are emotionally immature can cause someone of any type to behave irrationally; there's no excuse for someone who does not realize the very obvious signs of having hurt someone, like having made the other person cry from them behaving badly towards the one crying. anyone can react badly based on their maturity

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    Quote Originally Posted by William View Post
    Interesting thread.

    Yes, I would consider them related, in a way. If someone is grounded, to me, they're more likely to stand up for and defend their principles. People who are more laid-back, might not come across as "grounded" or concrete, but they might be much less volatile and more easy-going.
    You're using the wrong meaning of the word grounded. This is what the dictionary says:

    mentally and emotionally stable : admirably sensible, realistic, and unpretentious <remains grounded despite all the praise and attention>
    Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit

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    ^ yeah thats how i meant it.

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    Neurosis isn't factored into Jungian psychology.

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    Quote Originally Posted by lungs View Post
    do you consider these traits type related? in what way?

    (the reason i ask is because being "too grounded & down to earth" is one of the more common arguments people have against me being esi or 6. which strikes me as odd. but i want higher level responses, not about me in particular.)
    If anything, I would relate that to instinct stackings. Although even then I wouldn't say its directly correlated. Also, I would suggest to ignore anyone's opinion on Enneagram who told you that as they clearly don't know what they are talking about.
    <Crispy> what subt doesnt understand is that a healthy reaction to "FUCK YOU" is and not

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    I don't know why someone would say that about you. You seem reactive enough to me though not in an out of control way.

    Is lack of groundedness an ESI thing? That sounds kinda stupid to me. If it's true, I'm not an ESI either.

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    so its just flat out wrong - okay

    it mostly comes up with people comparing me to blackburry. and whether or not i'm actually "grounded"... whatever
    (i'm trying to hold my tongue and not make it about me in particular; maybe if the thread devolves it will end up there but these are good responses)

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    Quote Originally Posted by lungs View Post
    so its just flat out wrong - okay

    it mostly comes up with people comparing me to blackburry. and whether or not i'm actually "grounded"... whatever
    (i'm trying to hold my tongue and not make it about me in particular; maybe if the thread devolves it will end up there but these are good responses)
    Anyone compared to bb is going to seem more grounded.
    <Crispy> what subt doesnt understand is that a healthy reaction to "FUCK YOU" is and not

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    For the record, I think blackburry is ESFp
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    nah i think she's se-isfj.

    i keep wondering if this is passive aggressive or could be perceived that way so for the sake of full disclosure i'll mention @Finale and @jetcitywoman.
    also it was @blackburry who mentioned the enneagram thing as an explanation for our differences (she thinks i'm a 4)

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    Quote Originally Posted by lungs View Post
    nah i think she's se-isfj.

    i keep wondering if this is passive aggressive or could be perceived that way so for the sake of full disclosure i'll mention @Finale and @jetcitywoman.
    also it was @blackburry who mentioned the enneagram thing as an explanation for our differences (she thinks i'm a 4)
    4 is a rather silly suggestion for you imo, and to suggest that 4s are more grounded than 6s is even sillier.

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    Quote Originally Posted by InvisibleJim View Post
    Neurosis isn't factored into Jungian psychology.
    I'd think Jungian psychology is based on neuroses.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Radio View Post
    I'd think Jungian psychology is based on neuroses.
    Nope. Not in the modern definition and we don't speak ye olde german.

    Neither the F, N, T or S axis have a parallel Neuroticism axis which would identify how likely an individual is to appear to be behaving outside of social norms. Nor is there a Neuroticism axis (which when tested in big 5 was unrelated to MBTI or Socionics type).

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ashton View Post
    E6 thing.
    why? the definition fdg pasted ("sensible, realistic, and unpretentious") sounds like some descriptions of 6s.

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    Quote Originally Posted by lungs View Post
    why? the definition fdg pasted ("sensible, realistic, and unpretentious") sounds like some descriptions of 6s.
    I think 6s might seek out routine and stability to deal with the uncertainty and anxiety buzzing around in their heads, maybe. I can't really think of another explanation, particularly since they are given archetype names like the Defender and what not. Defender sounds pretty damn grounded to me.

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    Not type related, more to do with one's astrological sign. Isn't your main sign an earth sign?

    Btw lungs I think you are enneatype 5, not 6.

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    hahaha an xsfp 5?

    i'm a taurus in western astrology so an earth sign, yeah. in vedic i'm a water sign.

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    Lol, lungs, it's all just coming from people's perspectives and experiences with the types, in this case. Not everyone will agree.... but yes, you seem overall more grounded than any of the ESIs I know. And that's all it means..... It doesn't mean that all ESIs are volatile, nor does it mean no SEIs are volatile. It's just a noticeable distinction from my own experiences.

    I don't know what your e-type is, but 6 is possible imo. I've seen you do some things that seemed 6'ish. You do seem fairly down-to-earth from my perspective. Yea, 4s can be a little less realistic from my experiences and readings.
    Last edited by jet city woman; 05-21-2013 at 07:39 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Radio View Post
    I'd think Jungian psychology is based on neuroses.
    Yeah, as long as "neuroses", as defined by Jung and (presumably Freud) are symptomatic of (to paraphrase) a long term imbalance of psychological preferences, marked by a relative absence of subconscious contents reaching consciousness. The unconscious mind was called into question, and standards for neuroses now rest more on social expectations. Consequentially, some people look to typology for a means of justifying behavior that's perceived as odd. Jung's definition of neurosis could apply to any upstanding citizen. Hell, their monetary/social excess could actually arise from neurosis.

    Different schools of thought. etc. I honestly don't see the idea of an "unconscious mind" ever fading away, though it may come in different forms as it evolves to suit the times.
    Last edited by RedBeard; 05-21-2013 at 05:24 AM.
    The trickster is at one and the same time creator and destroyer, giver and negator, he who dupes others, and who is always duped himself.

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    I judge my 5 reading because I think you integrate really well when you learn to be more assertive and tell losers to fuck off more (5 to 8) than you do being some peaceful hippie earth mother goddess (6 to 9), but maybe that's just my bias for liking the strong women thing.

    Do you know your moon sign and rising sign too btw? In western astorlogy I mean. I'm not really familiar with vedic sorry. HITTA STOP TSK TSKING AT ME.

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    I really want to say that the most grounded 6s have found a measure of personal revelation sufficient enough for them to overcome crippling doubt.
    The trickster is at one and the same time creator and destroyer, giver and negator, he who dupes others, and who is always duped himself.

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    Quote Originally Posted by lungs View Post
    nah i think she's se-isfj.

    i keep wondering if this is passive aggressive or could be perceived that way so for the sake of full disclosure i'll mention @Finale and @jetcitywoman.
    also it was @blackburry who mentioned the enneagram thing as an explanation for our differences (she thinks i'm a 4)
    If you're referring to whether what you're doing is passive aggressive than you're Ij temp; you're going to be passive aggressive. It's ok

    IDK if this topic is passive aggressive.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Radio View Post
    I'd think Jungian psychology is based on neuroses.
    That's enneagram you're thinking of.

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    Quote Originally Posted by FoxOnStilts View Post
    That's enneagram you're thinking of.
    I gotta say, for better or for worse, the harshness of the enneagram is like a big "Fuck You" to the Forer Effect.
    The trickster is at one and the same time creator and destroyer, giver and negator, he who dupes others, and who is always duped himself.

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    Quote Originally Posted by lungs View Post
    why? the definition fdg pasted ("sensible, realistic, and unpretentious") sounds like some descriptions of 6s.
    I kind of think of E6 as the most suggestible type, like their sense of reality is so constantly changing that they feel the need to pin it down by hand/manually. If you keep questioning everything, you eventually get to a point where nothing seems real and no one is worth believing in, which I think is (a highly exaggerated example of) the sort of uncertainty E6s suffer from. I notice E6s often project an image of confidence and being self-assured that's not necessarily mirrored internally (see: DJArendee) which might be a coping mechanism to reinforce where they stand, so to say. They might superficially seem "grounded", but they're also the easiest to set off-track.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RedBeard View Post
    I gotta say, for better or for worse, the harshness of the enneagram is like a big "Fuck You" to the Forer Effect.
    I love it so much. <3 A lot of people can do the same thing, but for totally different reasons. When you dig into enneagram, it's just so negative and focuses on ONE flaw so heavily that your entire life pretty much revolves around it....mmph. Enneagram has probably been the best system for me when it comes to describing behavior just because it talks about motivation without actually addressing actions most of the time.

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    Quote Originally Posted by FoxOnStilts View Post
    I love it so much. <3 A lot of people can do the same thing, but for totally different reasons. When you dig into enneagram, it's just so negative and focuses on ONE flaw so heavily that your entire life pretty much revolves around it....mmph. Enneagram has probably been the best system for me when it comes to describing behavior just because it talks about motivation without actually addressing actions most of the time.
    It gives you a wonderful illustration of what sort of karma you're trapped in. Overcoming that karma is easier said, written about, and analyzed to death than performed. The kind of self-inquiry that requires reflection on why you convince yourself of the assumptions each type takes for granted requires outstanding humility and integrity. You'll find a few people on Youtube who allegedly benefited from the enneagram because it gave them a rough map of why they were the way they were; if they honestly asked themselves "why?", the last thing they would do is point the finger at others.
    The trickster is at one and the same time creator and destroyer, giver and negator, he who dupes others, and who is always duped himself.

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    Y u so messing up tidy socionics with your individuality

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    Quote Originally Posted by Radio View Post
    I notice E6s often project an image of confidence and being self-assured that's not necessarily mirrored internally which might be a coping mechanism to reinforce where they stand, so to say.
    This is interesting, and I think the answer may lie in the fact that sometimes it is conflicts between mbti or socionics type, and e-type (a self-confident mbti type combined with a doubting e-type). I also think I may seem self-confident because I've ridden myself so hard to gain confidence that I can find the answers when I need them. Over time, I've convinced myself that it's true with experience. I don't necessarily know what the answers are at that time, but I think I can find them. I suppose that IS true self-confidence. I don't think six'ness necessarily suggests a lack of self-confidence, or lack of confidence in an answer/judgment, or lack of self-assuredness.

    Quote Originally Posted by Radio View Post
    They might superficially seem "grounded", but they're also the easiest to set off-track.
    Sometimes I pretend I'm going along with people when mentally, I'm really not. It's just to gain observations and/or try a different way, or it can be a 9'ish tendency to just go with the flow of the conversation, I think, and/or to be supportive. I wouldn't necessarily call it being "set off-track"..... I have sets of beliefs/choices/actions that I've created myself over the years that won't be changed by any circumstance, more than likely. Experiences have gained me a lot more certainties concerning what to choose, philosophies that work, and how to live my life. I can be very doubting, especially when met with new situations/material, but once I've made my judgments, they don't really change unless presented with new information, which I then integrate into what I currently know to be.
    Last edited by jet city woman; 05-21-2013 at 11:53 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by lungs View Post
    do you consider these traits type related? in what way?

    (the reason i ask is because being "too grounded & down to earth" is one of the more common arguments people have against me being esi or 6. which strikes me as odd. but i want higher level responses, not about me in particular.)
    Depends on what your area of focus is: Enneagram Six or ESI Sociotype? You might want to take disintegration into account when focusing solely on Enneagram, that's for one. As for the grounded question, I think Sixes are grounded and if not, they're most definitely are striving and looking for it just to feel more comfortable in unknown and ambivalent situations, which can be somewhat annoying for Sixes. Simply put, a Six wants you to know you can count on them.

    At least that's what I've gathered a long time ago when it comes to Enneagram...

    I might scribble something more if I won't forget about it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by truck View Post
    I judge my 5 reading because I think you integrate really well when you learn to be more assertive and tell losers to fuck off more (5 to 8) than you do being some peaceful hippie earth mother goddess (6 to 9), but maybe that's just my bias for liking the strong women thing.

    Do you know your moon sign and rising sign too btw? In western astorlogy I mean. I'm not really familiar with vedic sorry. HITTA STOP TSK TSKING AT ME.
    leo moon and libra rising.

    i feel like i'm both really grounded (and not just in a fake way) and also way more volatile than most people who know me superficially would expect. i don't think i fit into the dichotomy very well.

    i liked radio's post but i think jet has a point that it's not like every 6 who displays confidence is going to be doing so falsely.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Radio View Post
    I kind of think of E6 as the most suggestible type, like their sense of reality is so constantly changing that they feel the need to pin it down by hand/manually. If you keep questioning everything, you eventually get to a point where nothing seems real and no one is worth believing in, which I think is (a highly exaggerated example of) the sort of uncertainty E6s suffer from. I notice E6s often project an image of confidence and being self-assured that's not necessarily mirrored internally (see: DJArendee) which might be a coping mechanism to reinforce where they stand, so to say. They might superficially seem "grounded", but they're also the easiest to set off-track.
    No.
    <Crispy> what subt doesnt understand is that a healthy reaction to "FUCK YOU" is and not

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    Quote Originally Posted by thePirate View Post
    No.
    Don't get too constructive, now. There's only so much room for that.
    The trickster is at one and the same time creator and destroyer, giver and negator, he who dupes others, and who is always duped himself.

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    Quote Originally Posted by thePirate View Post
    No.
    as if you'd know.

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    Oh my.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RedBeard View Post
    Don't get too constructive, now. There's only so much room for that.
    His example is exaggerated to the point of not even being applicable to Sixes, counter-phobics in particular. The kind of questioning sixes do it to attempt to alleviate that anxiety and to get them to have something to rely on, so for them to question themselves in a way that defeats that purpose doesn't even begin to make sense. Neither does it match my experience with sixes. They are far from being the most suggestible type. Also, that whole faking confidence thing isn't 6 related either. If I had to pin that widespread behavior to any type, it would probably be one in the image group - most notably, 3's. Sixes aren't concerned with any kind of portrayal, they are too busy dealing with their anxiety to give a fuck how they come across. Also, DJA might not even be a 6, and that post is a good example of why I am not a fan of using other members here as an example for typing. He's more or less accepted as a 6 now, for very little reason other than 'it's more likely than he's an 8', and as a result of that his behaviors are now being attributed with sixes when it doesn't even match.

    There's been a real problem on this site as far as typing 6, 7, and 3. Apparently people here type anyone who seems fun and likes to party as a 7, and anyone who has anxiety as a 6. 3's just go unnoticed. It's BS, and now people like lungs are confused because of the shitty information going around. Since I didn't make it clear the first time, I will say in a more direct way - being grounded is not related to enneagram type. Looking at each types health levels will tell you that. Also, please don't type solely by integration point, depending on what phase you are in your life any integration point may seem like the right one. Enneagram was meant to be looked at holistically, as an underlying sort of presence in your life. This means taking into account wings, integration, and disintegration as well as the core motivation - not just cherry picking what you want that makes sense.
    <Crispy> what subt doesnt understand is that a healthy reaction to "FUCK YOU" is and not

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    Quote Originally Posted by thePirate View Post
    There's been a real problem on this site as far as typing 6, 7, and 3. Apparently people here type anyone who seems fun and likes to party as a 7, and anyone who has anxiety as a 6. 3's just go unnoticed. It's BS, and now people like lungs are confused because of the shitty information going around. Since I didn't make it clear the first time, I will say in a more direct way - being grounded is not related to enneagram type. Looking at each types health levels will tell you that. Also, please don't type solely by integration point, depending on what phase you are in your life any integration point may seem like the right one. Enneagram was meant to be looked at holistically, as an underlying sort of presence in your life. This means taking into account wings, integration, and disintegration as well as the core motivation - not just cherry picking what you want that makes sense.
    That simply means neither Enneagram nor Sociotype bears any significance to being grounded, so all in all most replies here if not all of them, are bunk.

  40. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by thePirate View Post
    The kind of questioning sixes do it to attempt to alleviate that anxiety and to get them to have something to rely on, so for them to question themselves in a way that defeats that purpose doesn't even begin to make sense.
    Overthinking is a more often the problem with E6s. That's like saying E4s make themselves feel alienated to fit in.

    Quote Originally Posted by thePirate View Post
    Also, that whole faking confidence thing isn't 6 related either.
    Seems to be universal with sx-first E6s.

    Quote Originally Posted by thePirate View Post
    Sixes aren't concerned with any kind of portrayal, they are too busy dealing with their anxiety to give a fuck how they come across.
    Quote Originally Posted by thePirate View Post
    Apparently people here type anyone who seems fun and likes to party as a 7, and anyone who has anxiety as a 6. 3's just go unnoticed. It's BS
    Hey, look, it's your trademark: inconsistency.

    Stop typing from shitty caricatured descriptions. Image-triad doesn't mean what you think it means here. I don't feel like explaining this to you but feel free to be resourceful and use the internet.

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