Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 40 of 44

Thread: The Crazy List Of Doom

  1. #1

    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    120
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default The Crazy List Of Doom

    First off, PLEASE don't answer this list with 'that could be any type.' I know that's true, but I guess this is just which type has a predispotion to what mental 'disorder.' I created this list out of funness more than anything...just reply to what you intuitively think fits the description I guess. Try not to get offended, I might strike a nerve but that's kinda the point.

    Bullying:

    Self-harm/suicide:

    Anoexria:

    Martyrdom:

    Sexual offending:

    Pyromania:

    Necrophilia:

    Nightmares:

    Narcissistic:

    Nihilism (belief that nothing matters and everything is pointless):

    Murderers:

    Serial Killers:

    Laziness, couch potato:

    Obsessive Complusive Disorder:

    Bi-polar:

    Schizophrenia:

    Social phobia:

    Anger issues:

    Alcoholism:

    Prisoners (the average type of people in prison):

    Depression:

    Anxiety:


    (more will come later but that's enough for now)

  2. #2
    Kristiina's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Estonia, Tartu
    Posts
    4,021
    Mentioned
    5 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re: The Crazy List Of Doom

    I'm not feeling very serious right now, so I might as well fill in the list. If I write some type, it doesn't mean that I actually think that all people of the type share that trait. And my list is more about the stereotypes than real-life observations.


    Bullying: ESTp, ESFp

    Self-harm/suicide: INFp

    Anoexria: INFp, ISFp
    Dysgraphia: SLeo123083 :wink: (pun intended, only based on your original "anorexia" spelling.)

    Martyrdom: INFj (it was in the description! )

    Sexual offending: ESTp (office harasser), ISTj (stalker)

    Pyromania: ESxp. (Se program taking over normal reasoning. And because fire is really pretty.)

    Necrophilia: ESFj, because the "partner" showed dual behavior. :wink:

    Nightmares: INTp? (Ni or Ne types)

    Narcissistic: ENFj?

    Nihilism (belief that nothing matters and everything is pointless): ISTp

    Murderers: ESFj?

    Serial Killers: ISTj

    Laziness, couch potato: IxTp (not lazy but they seem to have a tendency to sit back and watch the show. Fond of simply observing.)

    Obsessive Compulsive Disorder: ISTj, ISFp

    Bi-polar: ?

    Schizophrenia: ENTp

    Social phobia: INTj

    Anger issues: ENTj?

    Alcoholism: ESTj

    Prisoners (the average type of people in prison): ESTp?

    Depression: INFp (stereotype!)

    Anxiety: ISFp (at least they seem more likely to show anxiety). ENFp from what I've heard. ENxj, because everything could go wrong.
    EIE, ENFj, intuitive subtype.
    E3 (probably 3w4)

    Cool ILI hubbys are better than LSIs any time!

    Old blog: http://firsttimeinusa.blogspot.com/
    New blog: http://having-a-kid.blogspot.com/

  3. #3
    oyburger's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    somewhere overthere
    Posts
    2,528
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    *Just based on personal experience*

    Bullying: ESTp, ENTj,
    Self-harm/suicide: INTp
    Martyrdom: INFj
    Sexual offending: INFp
    Pyromania: ESTp
    Narcissistic: ESTp
    Nihilism: INTj, ENTp (on a bad day)
    Serial Killers: ESTp
    Laziness, couch potato: INFj, INTp
    Murderers: ENTj
    Obsessive Complusive Disorder: INFp, ESTp
    Social phobia: INTj
    Anger issues: INTj, ESTp
    Bi-polar: ENTj
    Alcoholism: ESTj
    Depression: INTj, INTp, INFj, ENTj
    Anxiety: INTj, INFj

    As you can see, my list is tainted by those few I know
    All Hail The Flying Spaghetti Monster

  4. #4
    XoX's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    4,407
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re: The Crazy List Of Doom

    First a disclaimer. I don't believe in these stereotypes nor do I let them in anyways affect my daily social interactions. That said...let's roll

    Bullying: Depends on the meaning. ESTj, ENTj in some sense. ESTp in some sense. ISTj in some sense. Even ESFp in some sense. I guess and are often related to bullying. They just bully differently.

    Self-harm/suicide: INFp

    Anoexria: ISFj

    Martyrdom: INFj

    Sexual offending: ISTj on purpose. ESTj accidentally. ESTp too but the "victim" is likely to call it by another name.

    Pyromania: Si-hidden agenda or Si-dominant. INFj, INTj, ISTp, ISFp

    Necrophilia: Hopefully no one. Kristiina's description was funny so read that instead

    Nightmares: ESFp (desire for Ni, probably even believe the nightmares to be a sign of something). ESTp to a lesser extent. Perhaps ISFj too. Ni-types see these while awake and call them prophecies.

    Narcissistic: ENTp

    Nihilism (belief that nothing matters and everything is pointless): INTp

    Murderers: ISTj for any "good" reason. INFj and ISFj for revenge. ESTp or some type for profit. INTj for some weird reason. ENFj for some symbolic reason. INFp for some weird symbolic reason. INTp and ISTp for being exposed to high doses of .

    Serial Killers: INFj who is revenging the rape of a slave in ancient egypt to all human kind. ISFj who is revenging the rape of themself to all men. ISTjs too but for some down-to-earth reason e.g. they like to collect heads of young beautiful women because they look nice over the fireplace. Anyone with a twisted enough mind.

    Laziness, couch potato: Any type with low enough or high enough .

    Obsessive Complusive Disorder: Types with Si-hidden agenda. INFj and INTj. INFj more likely.

    Bi-polar: ESFj? Somehow related to ...I'm not sure.

    Schizophrenia: ENTp. Perhaps ENFj who has got lost in the jungle of social roles and acts.

    Social phobia: INTp. To a lesser extent ISTp. Perhaps INTj and even INFj but in their case I wouldn't call it phobia.

    Anger issues: INTp?

    Alcoholism: ISFp. To a lesser extent ESTp, ISTp. General substance abuse: INFp.

    Prisoners (the average type of people in prison): Krae says ISTp. Some other people say ESTp. I have no opinion. Depends on what kind of crimes are most often committed. Each type is more likely to cause certain kind of crimes typical to their type.

    Depression: This is hard. Seems to be pretty common nowadays among most types. Perhaps INTj.

    Anxiety: This is a hard one too. ISFj?

  5. #5
    Let's fly now Gilly's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    TIM
    3w4 sx/so
    Posts
    24,757
    Mentioned
    91 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Bullying: ESTp

    Self-harm/suicide: INFp

    Anoexria: ExFj

    Martyrdom: ExFj

    Sexual offending: ESxp

    Pyromania: ...

    Necrophilia:...

    Nightmares:ESxj? Paranoid Ni?

    Narcissistic: ExTp

    Nihilism: INTx

    Murderers: ISTx

    Serial Killers:

    Laziness, couch potato: lol ENTp

    Obsessive Complusive Disorder: ENFj

    Bi-polar: ISFp

    Schizophrenia: Alpha NT

    Social phobia: INTx

    Anger issues: ISTp

    Alcoholism: ESTj

    Prisoners: ISTp

    Depression: INxx

    Anxiety: Probably Ne related. INFj is my guess.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

  6. #6

    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    6,074
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re: The Crazy List Of Doom

    LOL, OK...


    Bullying: ESTP

    Self-harm/suicide: INFP

    Anoexria: INFJ

    Martyrdom: INFJ

    Sexual offending: ESTP

    Pyromania: ISFJ

    Necrophilia: wtf? lol, NO, I'm not answering that, hahah....

    Nightmares: INTP. boo

    Narcissistic: ENTP ftw

    Nihilism (belief that nothing matters and everything is pointless): ISTJ ("It's hopeless!" )

    Murderers: ISTP

    Serial Killers: ISTP

    Laziness, couch potato: INFP

    Obsessive Complusive Disorder: ESTJ

    Bi-polar: INTJ

    Schizophrenia: INTP (duh, I've said that like a million times)

    Social phobia: INTJ. Hahah, look, it's a member of the opposite sex, run!

    Anger issues: ISTP. Clearly.

    Alcoholism: ESTP

    Prisoners (the average type of people in prison): ESTP (because they just don't know better...)

    Depression: INFP

    Anxiety: ESTJ


    yay... that made me smile... it's like having McDonald's, only healthier...
    MAYBE I'LL BREAK DOWN!!!


    Quote Originally Posted by vague
    Rocky's posts are as enjoyable as having wisdom teeth removed.

  7. #7
    Joy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    TIM
    SEE-Se
    Posts
    24,501
    Mentioned
    58 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re: The Crazy List Of Doom

    I liked Kristiina's list a lot

    Bullying: ESTp, ENFj!!!

    Self-harm/suicide: IxFp!!!

    Anoexria: IxFp

    Martyrdom: INFj, IxFp

    Sexual offending: ESTp

    Pyromania: I dunno

    Necrophilia: your mom

    Nightmares: IxFp

    Narcissistic: ENTx

    Nihilism (belief that nothing matters and everything is pointless): INTj

    Murderers: define murder... I'll go with ENFj for now

    Serial Killers: IStj

    Laziness, couch potato: INxjs

    Obsessive Complusive Disorder: ?

    Bi-polar: all

    Schizophrenia: INTx

    Social phobia: ISFj, INTp

    Anger issues: ESTj

    Alcoholism: all

    Prisoners (the average type of people in prison): ISTp

    Depression: cmon... seriously... all.

    Anxiety: ENTj, ISFj, ISFp, ENFp, ENFj, ISTj, INTj
    SEE-Se, 852 sx/so

    Check out my Socionics group! https://www.facebook.com/groups/1546362349012193/

  8. #8

    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    6,074
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re: The Crazy List Of Doom

    Quote Originally Posted by XoX
    Schizophrenia: ENTp. Perhaps ENFj who has got lost in the jungle of social roles and acts.
    "Schizophrenia", and "Extraversion" are oxymorons, fuck...


    Why the hell is ENTP the most misconcieved type on this forum recently?
    MAYBE I'LL BREAK DOWN!!!


    Quote Originally Posted by vague
    Rocky's posts are as enjoyable as having wisdom teeth removed.

  9. #9

    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    8,578
    Mentioned
    7 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re: The Crazy List Of Doom

    Bullying: ESTp/ISTj/ENFj
    Self-harm/suicide: INFp
    Anoexria: INFx
    Martyrdom: ENFj
    Sexual offending: ESTp
    Pyromania: XSTp?
    Necrophilia: ?
    Nightmares: INFp, ENFj
    Narcissistic: ENTp/ENFp/ENFj?
    Nihilism (belief that nothing matters and everything is pointless): INTp
    Murderers: ESTp/ISTj
    Serial Killers: ESTp/ISTj
    Laziness, couch potato: IXXp
    Obsessive Complusive Disorder: INXj/ENFp
    Bi-polar: ENXj?
    Schizophrenia: INTx
    Social phobia: INTx
    Anger issues: IXTj
    Alcoholism: any Se type
    Prisoners (the average type of people in prison): ESTp/ISTj
    Depression: INFp
    Anxiety: IXFj/ENFp/INFp/ESTj/ISFp?

  10. #10
    XoX's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    4,407
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re: The Crazy List Of Doom

    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    Quote Originally Posted by XoX
    Schizophrenia: ENTp. Perhaps ENFj who has got lost in the jungle of social roles and acts.
    "Schizophrenia", and "Extraversion" are oxymorons, fuck...

    Why the hell is ENTP the most misconcieved type on this forum recently?
    Let's see...

    "Schizophrenia is a psychiatric diagnosis that describes a mental disorder characterized by impairments in the perception or expression of reality."

    ok...INTj would be better ENTp is not THAT bad. Any non Se-type will do though

    "Oxymora are a proper subset of the expressions called contradiction in terms. What distinguishes oxymora from other paradoxes and contradictions is that they are used intentionally, for rhetorical effect, and the contradiction is only apparent, as the combination of terms provides a novel expression of some concept."

    It was totally unintentional from my part so it was not really an oxymoron

    Anyways, this thread isn't supposed to be that serious...this is not exactly a formal analysis of the ENTps kind of thread. And I think I was harder on the ISTjs (because of one friend that has been acting annoyingly lately).

    Anyways I agree these stereotypes can be hurtful for someone not familiar with the subject. File a complaint to admins that this "ENTp mocking" should stop and maybe it will if such thing exists. Perhaps some ENTp should write a thread like Herzy did about Fi PoLR and how it manifests in ESTps to promote their type. I think people understand ESTps better now. Now manage your anger before you respond, pleez I'm starting to get scared

  11. #11

    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    6,074
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    It's not whether you were "offensive" or whatever... I wouldn't care if someone said that all ISTP were rapists in this thread... because it's obviously a joke... what I was worried about was the correctness of what was said. Even *suggesting* that an ENTP or ENFJ *could* be schizophrenic is an abomination. That shows that either 1) you don't understand the disease, or 2) you think that ENTPs and ENFJs are Introverts. By definition, if someone is schizophrenic, then they cannot be an Extravert. What schizophreia is, is what happens when someone is completely missing any traits that would resemble Extraversion, since the Extraverted part of their brain is messed up for some reason or another.
    MAYBE I'LL BREAK DOWN!!!


    Quote Originally Posted by vague
    Rocky's posts are as enjoyable as having wisdom teeth removed.

  12. #12
    Let's fly now Gilly's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    TIM
    3w4 sx/so
    Posts
    24,757
    Mentioned
    91 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    It's not whether you were "offensive" or whatever... I wouldn't care if someone said that all ISTP were rapists in this thread... because it's obviously a joke... what I was worried about was the correctness of what was said. Even *suggesting* that an ENTP or ENFJ *could* be schizophrenic is an abomination. That shows that either 1) you don't understand the disease, or 2) you think that ENTPs and ENFJs are Introverts. By definition, if someone is schizophrenic, then they cannot be an Extravert. What schizophreia is, is what happens when someone is completely missing any traits that would resemble Extraversion, since the Extraverted part of their brain is messed up for some reason or another.
    Try knowing what you're talking about before you come to conclusions like these.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

  13. #13

    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    6,074
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by gilligan87
    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    It's not whether you were "offensive" or whatever... I wouldn't care if someone said that all ISTP were rapists in this thread... because it's obviously a joke... what I was worried about was the correctness of what was said. Even *suggesting* that an ENTP or ENFJ *could* be schizophrenic is an abomination. That shows that either 1) you don't understand the disease, or 2) you think that ENTPs and ENFJs are Introverts. By definition, if someone is schizophrenic, then they cannot be an Extravert. What schizophreia is, is what happens when someone is completely missing any traits that would resemble Extraversion, since the Extraverted part of their brain is messed up for some reason or another.
    Try knowing what you're talking about before you come to conclusions like these.
    I do know what I'm talking about. I think schizophrenia is actually a misunderstood disease. In reality, it's not at all like the media or whatever would make you believe...
    MAYBE I'LL BREAK DOWN!!!


    Quote Originally Posted by vague
    Rocky's posts are as enjoyable as having wisdom teeth removed.

  14. #14
    detail's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    483
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Rocky turned into an ENTp.

  15. #15

    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    6,074
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Fine...

    Schizophrenia is characterized by several things, including zero emotional expression, apathy, inability to solve problems, flattened affect, repetition of the same words over and over again, delayed response time, loss of awearness of their surrounding, inability to communicate, solitary activites, low competativeness, tantrums, loss of will, and yes, of course, the inability objectively line up what they perceive with reality (which is what most people think of when they think "schizophrenia").

    Most of the symptoms would impossible to be related to Extraversion (except for the loss there of). Schizophrenic patients have damage to the Frontal Lobe in the brain, often called the "Executive Control" function (because it deals with managing the outside world), and the definition of schizophrenia is, in the simplest form, the inability to manage the outside world effectivly.
    MAYBE I'LL BREAK DOWN!!!


    Quote Originally Posted by vague
    Rocky's posts are as enjoyable as having wisdom teeth removed.

  16. #16

    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    6,074
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by detail
    Rocky turned into an ENTp.
    Fuck you.
    MAYBE I'LL BREAK DOWN!!!


    Quote Originally Posted by vague
    Rocky's posts are as enjoyable as having wisdom teeth removed.

  17. #17
    XoX's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    4,407
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    Even *suggesting* that an ENTP or ENFJ *could* be schizophrenic is an abomination.
    I think I understand how you relate introversion and schizophrenia. Extroversion being in touch with the outside world and introversion not being in touch with it. Schizophrenia being the ultimate form of introversion i.e. completely out of touch with outside world. However, I'm not sure you can use Jungian definition of extroversion and introversion in this sense. Especially you can't claim that a person of some "extroverted type" can't be schizophrenic considering that all types use all functions and every extroverted type has an introverted function in their Ego-block (so they are not 100% extroverted). Another thing completely is the fact that relating Jungian functions, Socionics types and psychiatric disorders is a big and messy pseudo-scientific effort (not forbidden though )

    Ok..let's go through an early screening test for schizophrenia and psychosis. It has twelve questions.

    http://www.schizophrenia.com/sztest/survey2.php

    1. I think that I have felt that there are odd or unusual things going on that I can’t explain.
    -> Any type could suffer from this

    2. I think that I might be able to predict the future.
    -> Poor INTps Here we have to remember that ENFj has strong Ni too. Any type could think they have these powers if they are mentally ill.

    3. I may have felt that there could possibly be something interrupting or controlling my thoughts, feelings, or actions.
    -> Any type could suffer from this

    4. I have had the experience of doing something differently because of my superstitions.
    -> Any type could suffer from this

    5. I think that I may get confused at times whether something I experience or perceive may be real or may be just part of my imagination or dreams.
    -> Poor N-types But really no types excluded.

    6. I have thought that it might be possible that other people can read my mind, or that I can read other’s minds.
    -> This could be any type. Especially ENFps

    7. I wonder if people may be planning to hurt me or even may be about to hurt me.
    -> Any type could suffer from this

    8. I believe that I have special natural or supernatural gifts beyond my talents and natural strengths.
    -> Any type could suffer from this

    9. I think I might feel like my mind is “playing tricks” on me.
    -> Any type could suffer from this

    10. I have had the experience of hearing faint or clear sounds of people or a person mumbling or talking when there is no one near me.
    -> Any type could suffer from this

    11. I think that I may hear my own thoughts being said out loud.
    -> Any type could suffer from this

    12. I have been concerned that I might be “going crazy”.
    -> Any type could suffer from this

    I can't see how people with extroverted socionics types can be ruled out from having these symptoms and being mentally ill in the way they describe. I agree Ni is seemingly related to many symptoms so INTp and perhaps INFp are then perhaps the best candidatesand better than ENTp for example. Then again using this logic ENFj would be a lot better candidate than some introverted type with a weakish Ni e.g. ISFj or ISFp.

    The point being...when you say "Even *suggesting* that an ENTP or ENFJ *could* be schizophrenic is an abomination" you are perhaps exaggerating a little bit

  18. #18
    detail's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    483
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    Quote Originally Posted by detail
    Rocky turned into an ENTp.
    Fuck you.
    You can't deny that "I do know what I'm talking about. I think schizophrenia is actually a misunderstood disease. In reality, it's not at all like the media or whatever would make you believe..." doesn't sound like your typical drunk ENTp rambling. I wouldn't put down my type (Nor any other type) with dumb stereotypes though. Now whether YOU take it seriously or not is up to you.

  19. #19

    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    6,074
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by XoX
    However, I'm not sure you can use Jungian definition of extroversion and introversion in this sense. Especially you can't claim that a person of some "extroverted type" can't be schizophrenic considering that all types use all functions and every extroverted type has an introverted function in their Ego-block (so they are not 100% extroverted).
    Actually, that's exactly how Carl Jung defined Introversion... and he coined the word Introversion.

    The difference between Extraverts and Introverts? Simple...

    ... the determining (trusted, taken as reality, etc...) factor in one's decision making (objective factor is the Extravert, subjective factor is the Introvert). According to this base definition for seperating Extraversion/Introversion, an Extravert could not believe what he perceived from within (in other words, he can't confuse the stimulus he gets from the outside with what is actually outside) since, if he did, he would be an Introvert. It doesn't matter what the second funciton is, since the second function is never granted autonomy over the first one. That would be in violation of... everything. Type and function would break down completely, and nothing would make sense, making it worthless.

    As for what you posted, it is taken (slightley) out of context in the first place, but... you basically claimed that any type can have those symptoms. You have no basis for that.
    MAYBE I'LL BREAK DOWN!!!


    Quote Originally Posted by vague
    Rocky's posts are as enjoyable as having wisdom teeth removed.

  20. #20

    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    6,074
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by detail
    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    Quote Originally Posted by detail
    Rocky turned into an ENTp.
    Fuck you.
    You can't deny that "I do know what I'm talking about. I think schizophrenia is actually a misunderstood disease. In reality, it's not at all like the media or whatever would make you believe..." doesn't sound like your typical drunk ENTp rambling. I wouldn't put down my type (Nor any other type) with dumb stereotypes though. Now whether YOU take it seriously or not is up to you.
    Ehh... I'm not drunk, or rambling...
    MAYBE I'LL BREAK DOWN!!!


    Quote Originally Posted by vague
    Rocky's posts are as enjoyable as having wisdom teeth removed.

  21. #21

    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    694
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    IEI subtype

  22. #22
    XoX's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    4,407
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    Quote Originally Posted by XoX
    However, I'm not sure you can use Jungian definition of extroversion and introversion in this sense. Especially you can't claim that a person of some "extroverted type" can't be schizophrenic considering that all types use all functions and every extroverted type has an introverted function in their Ego-block (so they are not 100% extroverted).
    Actually, that's exactly how Carl Jung defined Introversion... and he coined the word Introversion.
    Ok then. If that is the original definition then we stick with that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    The difference between Extraverts and Introverts? Simple...

    ... the determining (trusted, taken as reality, etc...) factor in one's decision making (objective factor is the Extravert, subjective factor is the Introvert). According to this base definition for seperating Extraversion/Introversion, an Extravert could not believe what he perceived from within (in other words, he can't confuse the stimulus he gets from the outside with what is actually outside) since, if he did, he would be an Introvert. It doesn't matter what the second funciton is, since the second function is never granted autonomy over the first one. That would be in violation of... everything. Type and function would break down completely, and nothing would make sense, making it worthless.

    As for what you posted, it is taken (slightley) out of context in the first place, but... you basically claimed that any type can have those symptoms. You have no basis for that.
    The essence of the claim was that any type can become mentally ill and have any kind of mental illness (if you believe there is such thing). You can't say that so called extrovert types can only have these and these illnesses. Perhaps there is a higher probability to have some disease over another but not more (proof for even this claim is hard to accumulate since objective and accurate tests for types don't exist, even the existence of types is not proven). Extroversion is a very abstract concept which can't be objectively measured, is unlikely to be binary (either you have it 100% or 0%), and certainly doesn't give guaranteed protection against schizophrenia. I don't buy the claim that the so called extroversion of a person is some kind of 100% reliable mental condom even if that would bring down not only socionics but even the whole UNIVERSE (and the other universes should they exist).

    Until types and functions are proven to be physically real and hard coded to your brain instead of being a theoretical illusion or a tool to classify people by currently visible external behavioral traits this claim is like saying people over xx inches tall can't possibly catch a cold.

    Then again psychiatry itself is a bit vague science and many "diseases" are diagnosed pretty subjectively. So I don't know what you can really claim about the relationship of psychiatry and socionics in general without being totally out of touch with reality or at least on extremely thin ice.

  23. #23
    XoX's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    4,407
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    (read above)
    I was taking a walk and this thing came back to me (how sad ). How pointless it may be I think I will have another take on this. Trying to understand where exactly the problem of mutual understanding lies I hope I'm somewhat consistent with my previous opinions :wink:

    So you probably approach the issue like this...First we take a theoretical concept "ENTp". Then define that a person suffering from this condition is extrovert, perhaps even 100% extrovert (though I would disagree on this since type is more than just your leading function). Then we take a theoretical concept "schizophrenia" and define that a person suffering from this condition is introvert, perhaps even 100% introvert. In this context a claim that "ENTp is schizophrenic" is a logical contradiction yes.

    I was thinking about a scenario where we take a real person. Then diagnose that person as being "ENTp". Of course we don't really know what that means. First of all we don't know if type is a physically hard-coded thing or just a temporal condition which can change in time or is it just a model of behavior etc. Then we don't know if type is "absolute". Since nothing is really absolute in real world it is unlikely that someone is 100% ENTp even if it was a physical hard-coded condition. Someone is always more ENTp than someone else. But let's forget about this and assume our person is physically 100% ENTp. Does this mean he is 100% extrovert? Probably not but lets assume it does. Now the claim I was making was that ENTp is most likely to fall into the condition called schizophrenia and be totally detached from reality. This was mostly intended as a joke because ENTps are perhaps best at generating ideas totally inconsistent with reality and impossible to implement Maybe INTjs are even better. You are free to disagree

    Anyways you cried that this can't be. As ENTp is by definition extrovert and should the person have schizophernia he is no longer extrovert. So either the person wasn't an ENTp in the first place but rather an INTp. Or the person really was an ENTp but is no longer an ENTp. In the latter case the whole type theory would collapse as a person should not be able to change their type.

    I see the condition called "schizophrenia" more as a malfunction of the brain and thus it is very possible for a real person whose type is "ENTp" to get this malfunction and thus temporarily suffer from "schizophrenia". Perhaps even permanently if the malfunction is persistent. But the person could very well still be an ENTp. That said, initially my comment was intended as a joke and I wasn't referring to this. This is only to refute the claim that I was guilty of some kind of "abomination" by making such a claim. I'm only guilty of telling a bad joke and perhaps being wrong about which type would be most likely to have "schizophrenia". You are guilty of being too absolute and judging

    Now calling "schizophrenia" as a malfunction is itself subjective. It can also be seen as just another way the brain works. In practice it looks more like a malfunction but as said that is subjective. There is really no absolutely correct way the brain "should" work.

    Another thing is diagnosing "schizophrenia" is almost as subjective as diagnosing your type. It is not really an absolute and binary condition. So saying that someone is "100% schizophrenic" versus someone else being "0% schizophrenic" is actually quite an abomination itself especially when combined with subjective diagnosis making practice.

    So saying that one theoretical and in practice subjective condition called "ENTp" is a guaranteed protection from another theoretical and subjective condition called "schizophrenia" by referring only to extroversion/introversion aspects of the concepts is an oversimplification which probably cannot be translated to reality well if at all.

    Hey I like this mental masturbation thing even if you don't always orgasm I think I learned something new about "schizophrenia" too. You were right to claim I didn't know enough about it. I probably still don't but now I know more. My claims here may still have inconsistencies but at least I tried to make a contribution to the search for the TRUTH

  24. #24

    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    6,074
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    I think you misunderstand what I was saying. I never ever said anyone was %100 Extraverted, or %100 Introverted (that would be insane).

    I said the defining characteristic of Extraversion was that the Extraverted data was the deciding factor in consciousness, and the characteristic of Introversion was that the deciding factor was the stimulus.
    MAYBE I'LL BREAK DOWN!!!


    Quote Originally Posted by vague
    Rocky's posts are as enjoyable as having wisdom teeth removed.

  25. #25
    XoX's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    4,407
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    I think you misunderstand what I was saying. I never ever said anyone was %100 Extraverted, or %100 Introverted (that would be insane).

    I said the defining characteristic of Extraversion was that the Extraverted data was the deciding factor in consciousness, and the characteristic of Introversion was that the deciding factor was the stimulus.
    Ok. I have to meditate on this some more Especially on what is the exact meaning and difference between "data being a deciding factor" and "data being a stimulus" and how does it relate to what was claimed and written before. Also I need to understand better how exactly is schizophrenia claimed to alter the sensing of your environment and processing of collected data.

  26. #26
    XoX's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Posts
    4,407
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by XoX
    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    I think you misunderstand what I was saying. I never ever said anyone was %100 Extraverted, or %100 Introverted (that would be insane).

    I said the defining characteristic of Extraversion was that the Extraverted data was the deciding factor in consciousness, and the characteristic of Introversion was that the deciding factor was the stimulus.
    Ok. I have to meditate on this some more Especially on what is the exact meaning and difference between "data being a deciding factor" and "data being a stimulus" and how does it relate to what was claimed and written before. Also I need to understand better how exactly is schizophrenia claimed to alter the sensing of your environment and processing of collected data.
    Damn you. I think I'm gonna leave it here. Too much work and not much to gain. It is very hard for me to approach the question from the same angle than you are. Right now I'm getting more interested in the functional differences in our point of views than getting a definite answer to the question at hand

    But still, one more approach...let's visualize a human brain. Now let's assume the type "ENTp" is somehow printed into that brain. Now the question is...is it possible to change the brain in a way that will make the brain owner schizophrenic without affecting the parts that make the person "ENTp". In effect resulting in a "schizophrenic ENTp". I would think you can. If you can't then the type is a pretty holistic feature of the brain and much more than I'm used to think it is. I would need some experimental proof or very solid theoretical explanation in order to believe this can't be done. But who knows. Well, enough of this question now If you want to go on PM me or something. Perhaps we can figure out our functional differences in the process.

  27. #27

    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    M-H λ
    Posts
    2,609
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re: The Crazy List Of Doom

    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    Quote Originally Posted by XoX
    Schizophrenia: ENTp. Perhaps ENFj who has got lost in the jungle of social roles and acts.
    "Schizophrenia", and "Extraversion" are oxymorons, fuck...


    Why the hell is ENTP the most misconcieved type on this forum recently?
    YOU DON'T SEE THE WORLD THAT SEES SO YOU DON'T KNOW

  28. #28

    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    6,074
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re: The Crazy List Of Doom

    Quote Originally Posted by Pedro-the-Lion
    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    Quote Originally Posted by XoX
    Schizophrenia: ENTp. Perhaps ENFj who has got lost in the jungle of social roles and acts.
    "Schizophrenia", and "Extraversion" are oxymorons, fuck...


    Why the hell is ENTP the most misconcieved type on this forum recently?
    YOU DON'T SEE THE WORLD THAT SEES SO YOU DON'T KNOW
    o rly?

    So ENTPs are a bunch of whimpy self-centered psychos who try and take over the world with absolutely no social skills or friends or life what-so-ever? If you say so...
    MAYBE I'LL BREAK DOWN!!!


    Quote Originally Posted by vague
    Rocky's posts are as enjoyable as having wisdom teeth removed.

  29. #29

    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    M-H λ
    Posts
    2,609
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    and istps are small-minded persons who place their definitions of how others view things onto persons to whom they do not apply apparently

  30. #30
    Let's fly now Gilly's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    TIM
    3w4 sx/so
    Posts
    24,757
    Mentioned
    91 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re: The Crazy List Of Doom

    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    So ENTPs are a bunch of whimpy self-centered psychos who try and take over the world with absolutely no social skills or friends or life what-so-ever?
    You're closer than you think.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

  31. #31

    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    6,074
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Pedro-the-Lion
    and istps are small-minded persons who place their definitions of how others view things onto persons to whom they do not apply apparently
    Not really, I said the opposite...
    MAYBE I'LL BREAK DOWN!!!


    Quote Originally Posted by vague
    Rocky's posts are as enjoyable as having wisdom teeth removed.

  32. #32

    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    6,074
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re: The Crazy List Of Doom

    Quote Originally Posted by gilligan87
    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    So ENTPs are a bunch of whimpy self-centered psychos who try and take over the world with absolutely no social skills or friends or life what-so-ever?
    You're closer than you think.
    http://the16types.info/forums/viewtopic.php?t=4531
    MAYBE I'LL BREAK DOWN!!!


    Quote Originally Posted by vague
    Rocky's posts are as enjoyable as having wisdom teeth removed.

  33. #33

    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    M-H λ
    Posts
    2,609
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    Not really, I said the opposite...
    i was referring to how you framed the scope of the conversation

  34. #34

    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    6,074
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Pedro-the-Lion
    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    Not really, I said the opposite...
    i was referring to how you framed the scope of the conversation
    Well, in that case... .

    There's also the possibility that you were setting yourself up to be misinterpreted by what you say, what you didn't say, the way you said it, or a combination of all of the above... and maybe the reason people read in to what you say the wrong way doesn't make them small-minded.
    MAYBE I'LL BREAK DOWN!!!


    Quote Originally Posted by vague
    Rocky's posts are as enjoyable as having wisdom teeth removed.

  35. #35
    Let's fly now Gilly's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    TIM
    3w4 sx/so
    Posts
    24,757
    Mentioned
    91 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Re: The Crazy List Of Doom

    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    Quote Originally Posted by gilligan87
    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    So ENTPs are a bunch of whimpy self-centered psychos who try and take over the world with absolutely no social skills or friends or life what-so-ever?
    You're closer than you think.
    http://the16types.info/forums/viewtopic.php?t=4531
    h3h
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

  36. #36

    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Posts
    13
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    I think diarrhea is actually a misunderstood disease. In reality, it's not at all like the media or whatever would make you believe... Only ESxx types can have it.

  37. #37

    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    M-H λ
    Posts
    2,609
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    There's also the possibility that you were setting yourself up to be misinterpreted by what you say, what you didn't say, the way you said it, or a combination of all of the above... and maybe the reason people read in to what you say the wrong way doesn't make them small-minded.
    i DO do this. it is sort of a gaffe an my "opponent" sycophant usually picks it up and shoves the comment back down my throat however. i am sure anyone could develop the facility. i do not do this to make persons look stupid however it is just sparring to me

  38. #38

    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    120
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    I think diarrhea is actually a misunderstood disease.
    In my biased opinion, extraverts have a problem with diarrhea. Introverts have a problem with constipation. <g>

    Btw, great list guys. I pretty much agree with all the answers.

  39. #39

    Default Re: The Crazy List Of Doom

    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky

    So ENTPs are a bunch of whimpy self-centered psychos who try and take over the world with absolutely no social skills or friends or life what-so-ever? If you say so...
    I don't agree with this. If I had no social skills, I wouldn't have been able to pick up my mate, Travis. He is an IxTp (I can't decide between the N and the S), and he doesn't take any flack from men without balls. Along with being my mate, Travis is also my friend. I DO HAVE FRIENDS, YOU DIPSHIT!!!

  40. #40

    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Posts
    120
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    BTW, as for Schizophreina being the ultimate form of introversion with no balance, when you 'run away from the world completely' then the ultimate form of extroversion could very well be trying to take over and control the world without stopping and thinking.

    I mean I guess it's true in a roundabout way, but I look at both types in a much more positive light. Everybody needs a balance anyway...

    People have though I was Schizo before actually, but I'm just uber introverted. My skills are very weak, I almost seem psychic because I just don't rely on it. Like the other day, it took me like five minutes to notice that a bowl of spaghetti spilled in the car. Then I just suddenly sensed something was wrong, I had a funny feeling and then I looked over.

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •