contrast of instinctual variants sx/so and sx/sp that I found

[nanashi]

I really like BumblyJack's contrast of sx/so and sx/sp types here....He describe my best friend and I so well in our behavior and in how I feel.


Note: These are relative comparisons and they are exaggerated for comparative clarity.

1. Freedom

Sx/Sp's believe in freedom. And they don't just believe in it as an abstract concept, but in reality. They don't want to be held down, confined, restricted, or contained. But then there's the problem of their siren, their drug, their love...an Sx/Sp would sell their soul to merge with their object of desire (be it a person, idea, or whatever). They will tirelessly fight off all other chains placed on them, but they will willingly don the handcuffs binding them to their love. The Sx/Sp ideal is to run away with their love and leave all the world behind.

Sx/So's will not do this. Freedom is too precious to surrender, even to the object of their deepest affection. The Sx/So ideal is not to run away but to stand and fight, tearing down the walls and breaking all chains. Their siren, their drug, their love...this is the greatest chain of them all. They have a strong desire to merge and yet are compelled to at least put up a token resistance.

2. Means to an End

The Sx/Sp places their hopes for fulfillment of their primary instinct (and ultimately, their survival) in their personal qualities and attributes: attractiveness, charisma, skills, abilities, success, wealth, status, etc. When things don't work out, this can leave an Sx/Sp feeling self-conscious. This gives Sx/Sp's an aire of self absorption and, in some cases, fatalism.

The Sx/So places these hopes in their cunning, cleverness, and ability to make the right choices and decisions. When things don't work out, an Sx/So may wonder what they could have done differently to have more success. This makes Sx/So's come off as enterprising masters of their own destiny.

Let's take seduction as an example: an Sx/Sp focuses on seeming desirable and attractive, an Sx/So focuses on saying the right things and acting the right way.

3. Romantic Relationships

Both Sexual types exhibit a push-and-pull dynamic. The Sx/Sp's version of this is the classic iteration: intense, passionate desire suddenly becomes too intense and Sx/Sp pulls away to protect themselves, only to have the desire return again.

The Sx/So push-and-pull is an internal one: drawn in with some hesitation, drawn closer, maybe pull back a little, still drawn in. It doesn't look as extreme as the Sx/Sp dynamic because the Sx/So doesn't completely surrender to their desire.

As a result, an Sx/Sp is going to be more all-or-none in relationships, either on out on the sand or drowning in the depths...possibly bouncing back-and-forth between the two with the tides. An Sx/So will be more balanced and stable in their relationships, preferring to wade in the shallows.

Additionally, an Sx/So has a much greater problem with partners that seem clingy or smothering. This is encroaches too greatly on their freedom. An Sx/Sp won't have a problem with this in itself (and may even like it); their greater concern is the desirability of their partner. Extreme closeness with a confident and secure partner is Sx/Sp heaven, with an insecure partner it's hell.

[willekeurig]

"Sx/Sp's believe in freedom. And they don't just believe in it as an abstract concept, but in reality. They don't want to be held down, confined, restricted, or contained. But then there's the problem of their siren, their drug, their love...an Sx/Sp would sell their soul to merge with their object of desire (be it a person, idea, or whatever). They will tirelessly fight off all other chains placed on them, but they will willingly don the handcuffs binding them to their love. The Sx/Sp ideal is to run away with their love and leave all the world behind."

This pretty much sums up what I perceive to be the meaning of my life.

[Galen]

This pretty much sums up what I perceive to be the meaning of my life.

Hear hear, sister.

I find that I really have a lot of trouble talking about this desire in real life though, because some part of me feels like it's wrong to want this; conceptually it feels like I'm being greedy for abandoning the lives of everybody I know. But even so, I can't help but gravitate back to an image of running off with a lover to some uninhabited wooded region in a log cabin with nobody else around to deal with, living for each other and for ourselves, and it feels right.

I remember talking with my sp/so dad about this exact sort of internal idealized image of my life, and he almost completely killed it for me. He started going on about the practical implications of having to fend for yourself etc, and it just felt like he completely missed the point. The entire point is that there's someone else there who I can trust and seriously care about on the deepest level, and I don't give a shit how economically unfeasible the scenario may be because that's not my concern. It's very rare where I can find someone who can respect that desire for what it is and not try to contextualize it under "How The Real World Works," so it's a fairly vulnerable point for me to talk about and I try to keep it hidden.

[Galen]

Oh, I didn't see the rest of the post.

The Sx/Sp places their hopes for fulfillment of their primary instinct (and ultimately, their survival) in their personal qualities and attributes: attractiveness, charisma, skills, abilities, success, wealth, status, etc. When things don't work out, this can leave an Sx/Sp feeling self-conscious. This gives Sx/Sp's an aire of self absorption and, in some cases, fatalism.

I relate to this for the most part. I often think of myself as too self-concerned for my own good, ruminating on the status of my own qualities to the extent of removing focus from other people.

Let's take seduction as an example: an Sx/Sp focuses on seeming desirable and attractive, an Sx/So focuses on saying the right things and acting the right way.

I'm kinda struggling to find a clear difference between these two, but I estimate it's a difference between "seduction through actions" for Sx/So and "seduction through qualities" for Sx/Sp. Could make sense I guess.

As a result, an Sx/Sp is going to be more all-or-none in relationships, either on out on the sand or drowning in the depths...possibly bouncing back-and-forth between the two with the tides. An Sx/So will be more balanced and stable in their relationships, preferring to wade in the shallows.

Not sure how Sx/So peeps will relate to this, but the Sx/Sp side sounds a lot like me. Relationships can't be casual for me, there is definitely an all-or-nothing approach the way I see it.

Additionally, an Sx/So has a much greater problem with partners that seem clingy or smothering. This is encroaches too greatly on their freedom. An Sx/Sp won't have a problem with this in itself (and may even like it); their greater concern is the desirability of their partner. Extreme closeness with a confident and secure partner is Sx/Sp heaven, with an insecure partner it's hell.

I didn't think anybody liked clinginess? I do think it's understandable for both partners in a relationship to have clear, demonstrable signs of mutual responsibility, but not in such a cheesy or obvious way like I ARRANGED THESE FLOWERS FOR YOU MY SWEETIE DEAREST~~~ Practical obligations, I suppose.

[nanashi]

Hear hear, sister.

I find that I really have a lot of trouble talking about this desire in real life though, because some part of me feels like it's wrong to want this; conceptually it feels like I'm being greedy for abandoning the lives of everybody I know. But even so, I can't help but gravitate back to an image of running off with a lover to some uninhabited wooded region in a log cabin with nobody else around to deal with, living for each other and for ourselves, and it feels right.

I remember talking with my sp/so dad about this exact sort of internal idealized image of my life, and he almost completely killed it for me. He started going on about the practical implications of having to fend for yourself etc, and it just felt like he completely missed the point. The entire point is that there's someone else there who I can trust and seriously care about on the deepest level, and I don't give a shit how economically unfeasible the scenario may be because that's not my concern. It's very rare where I can find someone who can respect that desire for what it is and not try to contextualize it under "How The Real World Works," so it's a fairly vulnerable point for me to talk about and I try to keep it hidden.

I really like, and am educated by, hearing first-hand accounts like this. Everything you said makes sense to me. I can keep this in mind when I talk with my sx/sp or sp/sx friendsez, and it will keep me from making the mistake of so-viewpoint-pointing out how helpful others can be by bringing in other skills and viewpoints to your life experience. I can honor and express my respect for your mad survival skillz instead, first.

[Galen]

I really like, and am educated by, hearing first-hand accounts like this. Everything you said makes sense to me. I can keep this in mind when I talk with my sx/sp or sp/sx friendsez, and it will keep me from making the mistake of so-viewpoint-pointing out how helpful others can be by bringing in other skills and viewpoints to your life experience. I can honor and express my respect for your mad survival skillz instead, first.

Well now I think it's your turn to gush about your own experiences as a smelly sp-last uhuhuhu

[nanashi]

Well now I think it's your turn to gush about your own experiences as a smelly sp-last uhuhuhu

would you like me to, or are you being facetious? I can't tell

[nanashi]

i think you mean it. um, I liked pretty much all of it. I connected to what the author was saying about sx/so types wanting their values respected while they get intensely close with their partner. I love the idea of the sx-intimacy, but if I lost part of myself or had to hide it? I'd feel like I wasn't being transformed like I want to be through growth and wasn't being supported because the person doesn't love me and know me as I am already. Or, I'd feel bored. INSANELY bored. and that's no good. my relationships also seem more hesitant and more slow and social than my sx/sp friend's do. there is dating and hitting on versus conversations.....a few months. ...fiances. I'm not like that totally...

[Galen]

Yes I'm serious lol

Interesting that you say your relationships with people seem to develop slower than sx/sp ones. I find that my sense of clicking with people is very On and Off, like I have a pretty fine-tuned immediate sense of how I'll get along with someone just from their general affect or presentation. This means though that a lot of people get packaged in Off and, unless we continue our interaction over an extended period of time and I'm proven wrong about my initial judgment about the person, I'll generally not want much to do with the person at all. So when I do meet someone who immediately clicks with me, progression in the relationship can go comparatively very fast: we skip all the "getting to know you" crap and just jump straight to the shit we click on.

I suppose what you're seeing as Sx/So progressing slower in relationships is more there not being some hard Off switch in dealing with people, where it's either On or Kinda. I estimate a lot of people fall into "kinda" with Sx/So, or at least So>Sp in general, so those sorts of relationships will move much more slowly than an Sx first would probably want. It's kinda balanced out though in Sx/Sp because instead of things moving slowly with lots of people they tend to just not move at all unless acted upon by outside circumstances.

[willekeurig]

I find that my sense of clicking with people is very On and Off, like I have a pretty fine-tuned immediate sense of how I'll get along with someone just from their general affect or presentation. This means though that a lot of people get packaged in Off and, unless we continue our interaction over an extended period of time and I'm proven wrong about my initial judgment about the person, I'll generally not want much to do with the person at all. So when I do meet someone who immediately clicks with me, progression in the relationship can go comparatively very fast: we skip all the "getting to know you" crap and just jump straight to the shit we click on.

I'm starting to think we have the same brain.

[SyrupDeGem]

oh hummm.... well, now i'm not sure. I would like to see these in conjunction with the enneagram. With just these (and the op does say exaggerated) descriptions stand alone i could be either, lean towards sx/sp still though but marginally.

[thePirate]

I read this awhile ago, it's a bunch of bullshit.

[nanashi]

I read this awhile ago, it's a bunch of bullshit.

I see it describing the marked contrast between an ILI sx/sp and myself when we interact. Why do the points not jive with you?

[Ath Is Cool]

A long time ago, a friend of mine who became a potential romantic partner, told me he wanted to move away to the middle of nowhere, in the woods with me, away from everyone else. he said he thought we were very "alike." Looking back on it, I must have been either going through a brief period of mental retardation, or a different person, because I turned him down in the end. Now, though, the whole idea seems perfect. tldr; i might also be sx/sp and this other person. also childish fantasies that are actually more beautiful than childish but I wouldn't expect many to agree. also I didn't do a good job of elaborating the ideal as it exists in my head so it might seem bland to one who does not relate and "get" what I mean

[silke]

I really like BumblyJack's contrast of sx/so and sx/sp types here....He describe my best friend and I so well in our behavior and in how I feel.
http://personalitycafe.com/enneagram...-sp-death.html

notes on instinctual stackings compiled from several forums

[nigh]

Bump

Can I mark 'like' on older posts?