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Thread: Now that we fucked, I don't love you anymore

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    Decadent Charlatan Aquagraph's Avatar
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    Default Now that we fucked, I don't love you anymore

    I can't discern whether I like someone or I'd like to fuck them. The attraction towards the target's psyche seems so real but sometimes after we have had sex for the first time, I feel like ordering a cab for her.

    I don't even know how it works: If I just kept up the social interaction without having sex with her, would I develop something more permanent? I have tried this sometimes but I'm still not sure of the results. Just the fact that I'm that interested than it would overcome my libido speaks for itself.

    I also think that this might have helped me getting laid. I think I'm attracted more seriously, I make her feel safe because she senses that.

    Also, I've retrospectively noticed that sex rarely motivates me in itself. I might rather just sleep besides her than have sex and not sleep besides her. There has been occasions when it's purely the sex motivates me; very desperate and obvious.

    There are also times when just the play of human interaction amuses me and her, both of us just wanting to seduce one another.
    This is delightful in it's simplicity since it's all just so vague and pretty hard for me to understand.
    Last edited by Aquagraph; 09-14-2012 at 12:02 PM. Reason: Grammar correction.
    “I tell you, freedom and human rights in America are doomed. The U.S. government will lead the American people in — and the West in general — into an unbearable hell and a choking life. - Osama bin Laden

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    fka lungs ashlesha's Avatar
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    you have a fear of intimacy?

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    Decadent Charlatan Aquagraph's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lungs View Post
    you have a fear of intimacy?
    Depends on the definition.

    I certainly am not afraid to be physically close to people and I tend to throw my cards in the table when with people. I just don't stick to anyone very well. When you get to know to so many people intimately it's hard to try to commit exclusively since there are so many options. To me it's just another chapter in my life of non-commitment.

    I can't keep a job, hobby, girlfriend, education, calendar, workout or anything. But I still often get inspired by a lot's of things and to women I will say foolish things sincerely if I'm high on them. Later I don't feel the same way and I feel sorry for perhaps giving them false hopes about something more permanent.

    Nowadays I usually warn them about my fluidity of my character but I still feel guilty because sometimes it just won't do. And they can't complain to me since I a warned them so they'll probably just bite their lip and mourn if I made a deep impression. They probably won't confront me about it out of shame and it makes me feel very guilty.

    It's kinda pathetic to whine about what a big heart breaker I am.

    This is my public confession to help me deal with my sins but it's also a request for words of wisdom or anyone might share. Or just to hear that I'm not alone with this.
    Last edited by Aquagraph; 09-14-2012 at 12:23 PM.
    “I tell you, freedom and human rights in America are doomed. The U.S. government will lead the American people in — and the West in general — into an unbearable hell and a choking life. - Osama bin Laden

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    squirreltual's Avatar
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    Wait! There is hope. I'm too pushed for time to post in this now but I will be back. Get your knee pads, elbow pads and safety goggles ready. We're going in...

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    Decadent Charlatan Aquagraph's Avatar
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    Appreciated.

    I just realized that my subconscious recurring slight urge to sever my penis is related to this. Don't worry, not going to do it. My insanity is an existing one but it's a leash.
    “I tell you, freedom and human rights in America are doomed. The U.S. government will lead the American people in — and the West in general — into an unbearable hell and a choking life. - Osama bin Laden

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    neverthesame's Avatar
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    @Aquagraph

    Maybe you're a natural born predator. Lol. Or maybe there's something wrong (or just different) about your brain chemistry: such as, for instance, your brain and body don't secrete enough oxytocin and other similar sexual hormones which are responsible for forming emotional attachment during and especially after the sexual act.

    Just sayin'...

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    Perpetual Confusion Machine PistolShrimp's Avatar
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    Do you actually want to "settle down" with someone exclusively, or are you mostly seeking to find a way to stop hurting those who want commitment/involvement that you can't provide?

    Sounds like you're infatuated with these women, and after having sex with them the mystery is gone, the thick haze of infatuation lifts and you can see that you're not really in love with them after all. I don't think a deeper attraction can really be forced or finagled into place by waiting to have sex; it springs up naturally over time between the right people with favorable life circumstances involved. Sex can complicate things because of the addictive hormonal rush, sure, but holding off on sleeping with someone even if the time feels right seems counterproductive to the natural development of a relationship. If your partner is someone you're truly falling into love with and want something lasting with, that desire won't disappear after the wham-bam-thank-you-ma'am happens.

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    Decadent Charlatan Aquagraph's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by neverthesame View Post
    Or maybe there's something wrong (or just different) about your brain chemistry: such as, for instance, your brain and body don't secrete enough oxytocin and other similar sexual hormones which are responsible for forming emotional attachment during and especially after the sexual act.
    I have a history of several years of severe depression and that tends to do that.

    Quote Originally Posted by PistolShrimp View Post
    Do you actually want to "settle down" with someone exclusively, or are you mostly seeking to find a way to stop hurting those who want commitment/involvement that you can't provide?
    Both will do if the circumstance will be met.
    Quote Originally Posted by PistolShrimp View Post
    Sounds like you're infatuated with these women, and after having sex with them the mystery is gone, the thick haze of infatuation lifts and you can see that you're not really in love with them after all.[...]
    Sometimes when I'm deeply in love I lose the urge to have sex immediately. I don't know whether I'm making excuses but I think I start losing it if don't seduce anyone new. I get depressed, suicidal and lonely in about month. I would call this a sex addiction but I'm not sure whether it's the sex in itself but an urge to seduce someone to keep my ego boosted. Maybe sex is just the cherry on the top, but I could have the ice cream without it.

    To me this sounds very fucking pathetic but I want to defend myself that I don't do this consciously and.. well.. it's kind of a passion of mine. A very destructive one apparently but it's what I'm good at it. There are men would do the same if they could. And it's actually fairly pathetic to blame it on the gender.

    A very wise friend of mine suggested that I maybe I should try to seduce someone over and over again. This was the real deal. Next time I started dating I was the nicest motherfucker to that girl. Pleasing and seducing her over and over again became my hobby and life was like walking on rose petals. I often feel like my purpose in life is partly to be a devoted lover helping the mistress to self-actualize and be happy. After I calm down I want to be an attentive and loving father. If I can fulfill these two, maybe I can see it as making amends with my past misdeeds and I don't have to fuck around anymore. Literally and metaphorically.

    *sigh*

    Still, ironically, the relationship ended when I cheated. It was easily the most expensive lesson of my life but I will never hurt anyone again like that.

    Thanks. What you have said has reminded me of my path.
    “I tell you, freedom and human rights in America are doomed. The U.S. government will lead the American people in — and the West in general — into an unbearable hell and a choking life. - Osama bin Laden

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    Creepy-Snaps

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    It sounds like you're looking for validation from the girl. Validation as a man. Are you good enough, attractive enough, smart enough, charming enough to have sex with her? When you have sex, you get your answer, but you still feel empty inside, because you don't feel like you deserved the validation.

    There are other ways to get validation as a man. A group of guy friends, hobbies, etc., but if you depend on a woman to emotionally recognize you as a man, you'll be so dependent on her, that you won't be strong enough to lead; and as a man that will make you feel weak.

    In general, I've found life is less fulfilling when you tie your life to people and things, and more fulfilling when you tie your life to goals and dreams.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aquagraph View Post
    Sometimes when I'm deeply in love I lose the urge to have sex immediately.
    Opposite for me. You're not an eunuch?

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    Aqua, i literally, word for word could've written what you wrote. I have the almost exact same problem. Well, ok, the exact same problem. I immediately lose almost all interest in someone once I have sex with them yet at the same time, I have the highest sexual drive of anyone I know so it leads to an interesting situation. A lonely situation. I try to prolong sex and not do it but drives overcome and I do it and I lose interest and then it's like now what? Even if I do wait a decent amount, once we do it I'm immediately bored. Goddamn depressing.

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    You're not gay, jessica?

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    No but I probably should be because im great at acting like a man. I would treat women like such objects, I'd fit in well.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jessica129 View Post
    No but I probably should be because im great at acting like a man. I would treat women like such objects, I'd fit in well.
    Hah, that's swell.

    Do not ever make the same mistake homosexuals, homosexual lovers, PC wankers and racists that are against racism made, that is, the blanket accusation that all men who hate homos are closet homos. They are not. They might just hate homos the same way they hate blacks. Blacks might hate homos the same way they hate whites. Hate does not translate to "I am really that way myself."

    And speaking of those homosexuals, homosexual lovers, PC wankers, racists against racism, posting "scientific" shit that those who hate homos, hate women - you know who you are. I've got your number.

    Up yours.

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    Aquagraph,if you are indeed a Ti creative you don't have to worry about that kind of stuff.embrace your flightiness,live your youth and then a Si-SEI will appear,as if by magic.she won't be willing (or able) to move around in order to track you down anytime (that would go against the preservance of her homeostasis aka heavy Si) and she won't even be interested in that as long as your actions won't have a negative impact on your outer positive image as a couple (you violating basic Fe) .
    unholy water sanguine addiction

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    High Priestess glam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aquagraph View Post
    I can't keep a job, hobby, girlfriend, education, calendar, workout or anything. But I still often get inspired by a lot's of things and to women I will say foolish things sincerely if I'm high on them. Later I don't feel the same way and I feel sorry for perhaps giving them false hopes about something more permanent.

    Nowadays I usually warn them about my fluidity of my character but I still feel guilty because sometimes it just won't do. And they can't complain to me since I a warned them so they'll probably just bite their lip and mourn if I made a deep impression. They probably won't confront me about it out of shame and it makes me feel very guilty.
    you don't actually want them confronting you, do you? as you said, your warning serves as a pre-emptive defense, not allowing people to call you on your issue since you've already proclaimed it yourself. in a way it is honest for you to do that, and in another way it's avoidant, allowing you to avoid dealing with the negative consequence, i.e. a brokenhearted girl. though obviously the guilt gets to you regardless; warning the other person isn't going to absolve you from it.

    you recognize that your behavior often ends up hurting people, but you don't seem to be looking to change it (?). what are you gonna do, Aqua?

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    killer wolf lemontrees's Avatar
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    When I read the thread title, I thought it was going to be some completely nonsequitor thread with a clever joke title! Then I saw that the poster was Aqua...

    I think you being sx first might have something to do with it too--they say that the strongest instinct is also the one that we have the least control over...it drives you rather than you driving it. Your behaviors in romance sound very similar to that of my SLE sx/so friend, the difference being that she is female and so that power dynamic/role she plays while doing so is somewhat different.

    It also sounds like you might be feeling lacking in meaning in other areas of your life, and so to keep yourself from sinking into depression/emptiness, you have to keep the seduction frenzy going, b/c there's an adrenaline rush every time, and intensity. Are you looking for someone to complete you and make everything better, or for an intense distraction? The first might have more of a "moth throwing self against flame" frenetic quality; it almost sounds like you're stuck in more of the latter, for now.

    Anyway, I bet when the girls aren't hurt anymore you'll become a great story for them to share with others! Or a nice memory with a dark edge. Don't feel too too guilty.

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    what is essential is invisible to the eye fox's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aquagraph View Post
    Depends on the definition.

    I certainly am not afraid to be physically close to people and I tend to throw my cards in the table when with people. I just don't stick to anyone very well. When you get to know to so many people intimately it's hard to try to commit exclusively since there are so many options. To me it's just another chapter in my life of non-commitment.

    I can't keep a job, hobby, girlfriend, education, calendar, workout or anything. But I still often get inspired by a lot's of things and to women I will say foolish things sincerely if I'm high on them. Later I don't feel the same way and I feel sorry for perhaps giving them false hopes about something more permanent.

    Nowadays I usually warn them about my fluidity of my character but I still feel guilty because sometimes it just won't do. And they can't complain to me since I a warned them so they'll probably just bite their lip and mourn if I made a deep impression. They probably won't confront me about it out of shame and it makes me feel very guilty.

    It's kinda pathetic to whine about what a big heart breaker I am.

    This is my public confession to help me deal with my sins but it's also a request for words of wisdom or anyone might share. Or just to hear that I'm not alone with this.
    Other than the obvious guilt you feel, what other personal issues do you have with being this way? Do you eventually want to commit to only one person without losing interest... as in, is this an eventual goal of yours? Why so?

    I think you've basically already answered your own question. You find it hard to concentrate intimately on one person because you find it so seemingly easy to fall into both amorous & emotional connections with many different people. To me, this sounds like a boundary issue. You're too fearless when it comes to diving in. If you connect that deeply to so many people at once, you'll eventually run dry of feelings until there's nothing left to give. There's a saying that some people will only be as faithful as their options. If you think about it, it's kind of like a spoiled child who feels elated when he gets a new toy, only to eventually grow bored of it while moving his affections on to his next new shiny thing.

    I think the only way you're going to be able to "fix" this is if you decide to work on your personal emotional boundaries that you have with both new and old friends/lovers/whatnot, otherwise, you're just going continuously to fall into the same cycle.

    Maybe this is related to Fi PoLR?
    Last edited by fox; 09-15-2012 at 06:16 AM.
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    On the other side of the spectrum, I tend to be the complete opposite of this... which isn't necessarily a good thing. I'll tend to keep my guard up very high while avoiding too much physical closeness with others, always choosing to keep a solid distance. In other words, I don't find it easy to grow comfortable with others. When someone finally does break the barrier, I kind of go crazy by concentrating every ounce of my affections deeply upon one person and developing a full blown limerence, which is pretty difficult to break. I have to try hard at not becoming too emotionally dependent on one person. It's as if all my eggs are sealed shut in one tiny basket... which only sets the stage for pain, over expectations and disappointment. This is something I'm aware of & consciously working on.

    So, in this sense you could also say that I have issues with boundaries, in a way that there is an initial fear of connecting with others, and when there finally is a connection, it goes full force, train wreck style. It goes without saying, there's a healthy medium to everything.
    Last edited by fox; 09-15-2012 at 07:00 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by jxrtes View Post
    betas should be kept in zoos for children to stare and throw pop corn at.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Starfall View Post
    On the other side of the spectrum, I tend to be the complete opposite of this... which isn't necessarily a good thing. I'll tend to keep my guard up very high while avoiding too much physical closeness with others, always choosing to keep a solid distance. In other words, I don't find it easy to grow comfortable with others. When someone finally does break the barrier, I kind of go crazy by concentrating every ounce of my affections deeply upon one person and developing a full blown limerence, which is pretty difficult to break. I have to try hard at not becoming too emotionally dependent on one person. It's as if all my eggs are sealed shut in one tiny basket... which only sets the stage for pain, over expectations and disappointment. This is something I'm aware of & consciously working on.
    How exactly are you doing this, if I may ask? I've been struggling with the same issue, but haven't really found a way to change it yet.
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    Decadent Charlatan Aquagraph's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by glam View Post
    you don't actually want them confronting you, do you? as you said, your warning serves as a pre-emptive defense, not allowing people to call you on your issue since you've already proclaimed it yourself. in a way it is honest for you to do that, and in another way it's avoidant, allowing you to avoid dealing with the negative consequence, i.e. a brokenhearted girl. though obviously the guilt gets to you regardless; warning the other person isn't going to absolve you from it.
    Didn't realize it but it's true. I'm very able at using honesty for my own ends.
    Quote Originally Posted by glam View Post
    you recognize that your behavior often ends up hurting people, but you don't seem to be looking to change it (?). what are you gonna do, Aqua?
    This thread is much about me trying to become more aware of the problem. Proper information leads to necessary actions. I wish I could commit to someone or untie the reasons that make me do this sort of shit.

    Quote Originally Posted by lemontrees View Post
    It also sounds like you might be feeling lacking in meaning in other areas of your life, and so to keep yourself from sinking into depression/emptiness, you have to keep the seduction frenzy going, b/c there's an adrenaline rush every time, and intensity.
    True.
    Quote Originally Posted by lemontrees View Post
    Are you looking for someone to complete you and make everything better, or for an intense distraction?
    The difference between those two is vague but I seriously feel like I'm looking for my other half.
    Quote Originally Posted by lemontrees View Post
    Anyway, I bet when the girls aren't hurt anymore you'll become a great story for them to share with others! Or a nice memory with a dark edge. Don't feel too too guilty.
    I guess they'll be fine in time but there's at least one girl who probably lost a lot of trust towards people. Sadly, it is also likely that there are probably many many more. I don't even know how many people I've slept with to be honest. I lost the count couple of years ago. Fortunately most of them were non-romantic one night stands.

    Quote Originally Posted by Starfall View Post
    Other than the obvious guilt you feel, what other personal issues do you have with being this way? Do you eventually want to commit to only one person without losing interest... as in, is this an eventual goal of yours? Why so?
    If I could make someone happy and devout my life to her I'd have a sense of meaning. My life is meaningless without love and seducing people is one of the few things I really like doing from time to time.

    I also tend to go around and seduce new circles. I've been involved in many many subcultures and posses of friends. This has also helped me in seducing women. At first I thought that t16t would have been one of these but for some reason I stayed.

    Seduction seems to be my forte, hobby and passion. Politics, fatherhood and being a devouted lover sound optimal destinations in my life.
    Quote Originally Posted by Starfall View Post
    You're too fearless when it comes to diving in.
    I never thought that feelings will get depleted.
    Quote Originally Posted by Starfall View Post
    I think the only way you're going to be able to "fix" this is if you decide to work on your personal emotional boundaries that you have with both new and old friends/lovers/whatnot, otherwise, you're just going continuously to fall into the same cycle.
    Eight years of psychiatry, tons of psychedelics and meditation have been fairly useless in solving the issues behind this. I have now just accepted that I'm more or less broken for life.

    The idea is to fit these undesirable traits so that I can minimize the damage. One good option would be that the relentless seduction drive should be channeled on a single person.
    Quote Originally Posted by Starfall View Post
    Maybe this is related to Fi PoLR?
    That's my excuse for it.
    “I tell you, freedom and human rights in America are doomed. The U.S. government will lead the American people in — and the West in general — into an unbearable hell and a choking life. - Osama bin Laden

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    You mentioned you want to get into politics. Have you tried politics of procreation and using yourself as a tool in increasing Finland's low birthrate?

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    Can't you just conclude that you have had enough of that?
    Start looking for likes that do not end with ejaculation. A way to do that would be finding qualities you love in people you have no sexual attraction to. Then you can figure out if you really like the attractive person or it is just your dick and habit.

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    Why are you making "shoulds" for him? He is an adult, who is not of your immediate concern.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jadae2point0 View Post
    Why are you making "shoulds" for him? He is an adult, who is not of your immediate concern.
    If you think that I was moralizing, you are wrong.

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    There is steam coming out of your ears, Esaman.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aquagraph View Post
    Sometimes when I'm deeply in love I lose the urge to have sex immediately. I don't know whether I'm making excuses but I think I start losing it if don't seduce anyone new. I get depressed, suicidal and lonely in about month. I would call this a sex addiction but I'm not sure whether it's the sex in itself but an urge to seduce someone to keep my ego boosted. Maybe sex is just the cherry on the top, but I could have the ice cream without it.
    You said you used to be overweight and socially clumsy, then at some point you decided to overcome it and radically changed yourself, but perhaps that overweight, nerdy boy still lives inside of you and every day you have to remind yourself that you are not him by seducing more and more people. This kind of splitting within the self would create a compulsive drive fueled by one part disowning and distancing itself from another that is perceived as point of pain and misery, then the mind becomes consumed by the need to push away but "a man will be trapped in a room with a door that's unlocked and opens inwards as long as it does not occur to him to pull rather than to push".

    Quote Originally Posted by Aquagraph View Post
    I never thought that feelings will get depleted.
    Eight years of psychiatry, tons of psychedelics and meditation have been fairly useless in solving the issues behind this. I have now just accepted that I'm more or less broken for life.
    For every personality flaw there is also a point of exaltation, either already extant or latent, so may be you shouldn't think of yourself in this light, as defective or broken, but rather view it as a nascent point of further potential and accept it as it has come to you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Agarina View Post
    How exactly are you doing this, if I may ask? I've been struggling with the same issue, but haven't really found a way to change it yet.
    I try not to dwell too much on my feelings & put a lot more value into my own wellbeing. I try to no longer put the objects of my affections on a pedestal as an entity of idolization... something I've been guilty of in the past. I allow myself to love freely, but I try not to grow too attached anymore -- for me, this is harder than it sounds. I take breaks to myself & totally keep the other person out of mind (this becomes easier with practice). It also helps to be a bit sociably flirty with others when you're out & about, but only by a bit. By doing this, you're slightly expanding your outlook in a safe way without focusing your everything on one person... and by that, I do not mean cheat on your spouse.
    Quote Originally Posted by jxrtes View Post
    betas should be kept in zoos for children to stare and throw pop corn at.

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    just keep it at sex till you feel ready

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    I wanted to come back to this thread, but this is a bit of a freewrite with no real conclusion yet, perhaps little relevance. The only way I can relay emotive personal experience. Oi vey.

    You are not broken. It is not permanent. Do not let guilt become a way of life.

    Making yourself feel worse will not help others feel better. And anyway I think your behaviour hurts you more than other people in the long run. You have self awareness and the desire for change, which is more than many people, so you are already doing well.

    Having said that, when I was screwing people around in seemingly a much similar manner, the disclaimer I would issue, along with doing things glam mentioned, would sucker people in more. Some were rescuer types with bad self esteem and tendencies to codependency. There were lots of people who wanted to be the one to change me. It's highly effective but a high cost strategy in the long run. One person ended up locked up on suicide watch. They blamed me solely.

    On a conscious level, in these kinds of situations, I would think: Well, what did you expect from a person with a disclaimer/who knows I behave as I do. On another level I think I would be angry at their "weakness" and “irrationality”. It was like everyone had coded door locks. You press the right numbers and you’re in. Easy, simple, haHA!, short burst of intensity, boring. Next.

    I think perhaps I was partly looking for someone to act the way I did right back (worthiness/challenge). But all the time guilt was fucking me over which did not help my own self worth, which in turn did not help sticking around with people who were worth it despite their soft, lovely, gentle yieldingness and thinking I was lovely if somewhat erratic and cold and warm and cold. Maybe I felt too under pressure to show that same level of vulnerability also. Their innocence and ease of vulnerability put them in a place of power over me. The swines! (Fi ineptitude?)

    I was passed around psychiatrists for about the same time as you. For me it didn't help, I got more excuses for behaviour that impacted me and the people around me negatively. And free prescription drugs. Which can be harnessed as wonderfully numbing tools of denial. It can take a lot of time and patience to undo things from that kind of experience, a lot of things get reframed and later shuffled some more into a workable narrative. It’s a whole other loooong topic of itself.

    Maybe there is no similarity here whatsoever, I don't really know you. But I need to go drink tea now. Bye!
    Last edited by squirreltual; 09-17-2012 at 03:03 AM. Reason: i bolded the best bit

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    Quote Originally Posted by Esaman View Post
    Can't you just conclude that you have had enough of that?
    Start looking for likes that do not end with ejaculation. A way to do that would be finding qualities you love in people you have no sexual attraction to. Then you can figure out if you really like the attractive person or it is just your dick and habit.
    I have tried that. I have chosen to not have sex with someone I've seen potential. If I don't have sex with anyone, everyone will just seem attractive and I will become suicidally depressed in a month. I'm not exaggerating.
    Quote Originally Posted by siuntal View Post
    You said you used to be overweight and socially clumsy, then at some point you decided to overcome it and radically changed yourself, but perhaps that overweight, nerdy boy still lives inside of you and every day you have to remind yourself that you are not him by seducing more and more people. This kind of splitting within the self would create a compulsive drive fueled by one part disowning and distancing itself from another that is perceived as point of pain and misery, then the mind becomes consumed by the need to push away but "a man will be trapped in a room with a door that's unlocked and opens inwards as long as it does not occur to him to pull rather than to push".
    You're right. In some level I have noticed that before. I actually usually get mad if someone talks about him. And I sometimes prefer to refer to him in third person. The weight loss and the social crippledness happened so fast that it was easy to consider it as a rebirth than a dynamic change.
    Quote Originally Posted by siuntal View Post
    For every personality flaw there is also a point of exaltation, either already extant or latent, so may be you shouldn't think of yourself in this light, as defective or broken, but rather view it as a nascent point of further potential and accept it as it has come to you.
    This is how I prefer to see it. There's always another side to the coin. As said, this has given me a motivation to seduce and the skill followed. This can be used for good and bad of others and that of myself.

    Quote Originally Posted by zomgqwantz View Post
    just keep it at sex till you feel ready
    L๖l
    Quote Originally Posted by squirreltual View Post
    You are not broken. It is not permanent. Do not let guilt become a way of life.
    I consider it as a curse and a gift. It's more or less there. It can't be taken away but it can be changed. This is a process.

    I also consider the guilt of mine to be a curse and a gift. It makes me better myself. The love of self(-actualization) would be better tool though.

    Quote Originally Posted by squirreltual View Post
    Maybe there is no similarity here whatsoever, I don't really know you. But I need to go drink tea now. Bye!
    Actually it was kind of similar and that shows that we're dealing with the similar issues. Makes me feel a bit less lonelier with this although didn't offer much advice. Still thanks.
    “I tell you, freedom and human rights in America are doomed. The U.S. government will lead the American people in — and the West in general — into an unbearable hell and a choking life. - Osama bin Laden

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    Let's fly now Gilly's Avatar
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    Enneagram 3 - confirm.

    Just had a very similar conversation last with an LIE-Te Enneagram 3 sp/sx friend of mine who recently came to the realization that she uses sleeping around as a way of coping with her issues.

    Basically you are doing the same thing, but with ex-girlfriend issues. She dumped you for your sexual infidelity, so you seek to validate your infidelity by taking on a persona/mindset that says "this sexual impulsiveness is an intrinsic part of me," but simultaneously get off on controlling/having some power or influence over those you seduce (because you had no power to stop her dumping you) and all the while make it impossible to get dumped again.

    Its true that some people don't want or need to settle down, but whatever you do, it's important to do it for the right reasons.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aquagraph View Post
    advice
    Another longish one...

    What I did was impractical for most people and drastic. I got some money together, moved across the country to where I knew nobody (and wasn't confronted with social reputation/roles every day) and gave myself the challenge of having the loneliest, most boring year possible. I didn't get involved with anyone. It hadn't been so since a suicide attempt so it was either kill or cure. This is why I wouldn't necessarily recommend it. Also, a year away from all people is maybe overkill and can tip you the other way.

    I spent the time getting out of old habits and doing wholesome stuff I enjoyed doing before the age of 12; getting a whole lot of perspective (Jungian-ly psychoanalyzed myself like a motherdawg!); committed to a daily routine; even ate healthy but dramatically bland, boring food. I couldn't have created this time and space for introspection and analysis in my old environment. I won't lie, it was a miserable time. But by forcing this on myself, when it came to getting into new relationships later, I'd put a lot of issues to bed. I'd learned how to deal with lack of intensity (actually this is a lie, it was an intense experience in itself, so maybe I mean intense connections) and proved I could commit to something with no immediate rewards/gratification. It was five years ago and I can slide into the devotional cocoon of a relationship now, no worries. Maybe this was an sx/sp way of doing stuff though.

    Time and desire for change is all you really need though because you'll work it out in your own way.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly View Post
    Enneagram 3 - confirm.
    I am not too familiar with enneagram but I think I could be 7w8.
    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly View Post
    Basically you are doing the same thing, but with ex-girlfriend issues. She dumped you for your sexual infidelity, so you seek to validate your infidelity by taking on a persona/mindset that says "this sexual impulsiveness is an intrinsic part of me," but simultaneously get off on controlling/having some power or influence over those you seduce (because you had no power to stop her dumping you) and all the while make it impossible to get dumped again.
    Nah, I was like that before I cheated her.
    “I tell you, freedom and human rights in America are doomed. The U.S. government will lead the American people in — and the West in general — into an unbearable hell and a choking life. - Osama bin Laden

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    Quote Originally Posted by squirreltual View Post
    What I did was impractical for most people and drastic. I got some money together, moved across the country to where I knew nobody (and wasn't confronted with social reputation/roles every day) and gave myself the challenge of having the loneliest, most boring year possible. I didn't get involved with anyone. It hadn't been so since a suicide attempt so it was either kill or cure. This is why I wouldn't necessarily recommend it. Also, a year away from all people is maybe overkill and can tip you the other way.
    Year away might be too much. I score 98 on Extroversion in the big five for example. My social roles are fluid so I don't usually find it a problem. I'm very much of a social chameleon. But the old environment still can be somewhat awkward. I have often sat in a table with three or more people I have had sex with and it can get a bit awkward.
    “I tell you, freedom and human rights in America are doomed. The U.S. government will lead the American people in — and the West in general — into an unbearable hell and a choking life. - Osama bin Laden

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    Let's fly now Gilly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aquagraph View Post
    I am not too familiar with enneagram but I think I could be 7w8.
    Nah, I was like that before I cheated her.
    Ah, hmm.

    Yeah I thought you were 7w8 at first as well. I also thought I was 7w8 at one point...but you're not me, so, *shrug*
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

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    First impression was E7 but seeing this is going to miraculously change, meh.

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    Let's fly now Gilly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Absurd View Post
    First impression was E7 but seeing this is going to miraculously change, meh.
    Pretty clear heart triad fixation stuff here IMO.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly View Post
    Pretty clear heart triad fixation stuff here IMO.
    Well then. I have been correct again. I don't why I do this, actually, why I don't do this more. That sounds way better. I'm still wondering how the hell you or anyone else that identifies with him is not the same quadra.

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    Glorious Member mu4's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by siuntal View Post
    You said you used to be overweight and socially clumsy, then at some point you decided to overcome it and radically changed yourself, but perhaps that overweight, nerdy boy still lives inside of you and every day you have to remind yourself that you are not him by seducing more and more people. This kind of splitting within the self would create a compulsive drive fueled by one part disowning and distancing itself from another that is perceived as point of pain and misery, then the mind becomes consumed by the need to push away but "a man will be trapped in a room with a door that's unlocked and opens inwards as long as it does not occur to him to pull rather than to push".
    I think Aqua practice seduction in order to be good enough to get the one he thinks he loves. For him this is practice, but he has a hard time identifying someone he really feels a deep connection to.

    I don't know what will happen in the future, but imo Aqua should just act like someone who he will think is authentic to himself(or a version of himself integrated) because faking it, he won't believe that this other individual really understand and loves him for a version of himself that is true to himself. He will believe that this other individuals loves the fake him, and therefore his super-id functions won't be appeased.

    Aqua is no longer overweight nerdy boy, but I don't think he is this version of himself that he uses for seduction, he won't be satisfied with anything that results either. Anyways, as he said he can't keep a job, school, workout, etc. He sort of knows that no woman will stick with someone like this either, he won't be able to keep the one he wants either. So now his source of insecurity isn't that he's a overweight nerdy boy, but that of a person who is unlikely to be able to provide for a partner. There are also probably other dissatisfaction he has with himself which he thinks makes him less suitable for a partner, and this fear keeps him avoidant when he is in love with someone. But I think after having sex with them, he is like, "Well, now that they've given me sex, they must like this kind of person that I am, that's below my standard."

    I think it's fairly commonly described that ILE have a hard time settling down in the various descriptions.

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