Results 1 to 36 of 36

Thread: Compatible instinct stacking theory

  1. #1

    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Moons of Uranus
    TIM
    IEI
    Posts
    629
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Compatible instinct stacking theory..

    My interest in this was sparked by Clumsys thread "Instinctual stackings and relationships."

    Over the last week I've become very interested in instinct stackings and I've realized they have a MAJOR effect on compatibilty. I've been thinking about my own experiences with other stackings & reading descriptions by enneagram writers, and various personality boards to hear other peoples opinions. I came to the conclusion that we're likely to be compatibile with those who share the same sexual variant position, especially those with the sp and so reversed:

    If you're so/ sx, you would be most compatible with sp/ sx.
    If you're so/ sp, you would be most compatible with sp/ so.
    If you're sx/ so, you would be most compatible with sx/ sp.

    IME It can even make us more compatible with certain sociotypes, just one example being my childhood best friend - an IEE 6w7 so/sx.. I'm sp/sx; of course we quarreled sometimes but the friendship was so strong - we were like sisters and we had great fun together for contrary type relations (almost as if we had a little drop of socionics duality in there).

    Do you have any criticisms of this theory?.. doesn't it match your interactions? and, What are your real life experiences with those who I theorized to be your most compatible partners?


  2. #2
    Let's fly now Gilly's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    TIM
    3w4 sx/so
    Posts
    24,757
    Mentioned
    91 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    In my experience the best matches are the same stack or with the secondary instinct switched. So sx/so would do best with sx/sp or another sx/so; sp/so would do best with sp/sx or sp/so; so/sx fits with so/sx or so/sp. I think identical stacks are the most comfortable, but sharing the first and flipping the 2nd and 3rd has more potential for growth or kind of teaching each other.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

  3. #3
    lump's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    TIM
    Fi/Te 641 sp/sx
    Posts
    12,614
    Mentioned
    632 Post(s)
    Tagged
    3 Thread(s)

    Default

    I don't usually type other people in Enneagram but with the very small amount of observation I have made I find sp-lasts the most frustrating everything else considered. I'm skeptical that so/sx would have the highest compatibility with me.

  4. #4
    strrrng's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    TIM
    Ni-IEI 4w3 sx/so
    Posts
    8,781
    Mentioned
    40 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    still not sure how compatibility works. my immediate reaction is just sx/sp... they're always the ones I get most entangled with. but sx/so's have always been a more refreshing spark, less grimly illicit. so/sx's have annoyed me more than any other stacking because of their glinty jumpiness. sx-lasts I can't even remember having any dealings with... they're probably all 5-year-planners. I don't think I could marry an sx/so, even a russian escort.
    4w3-5w6-8w7

  5. #5

    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Moons of Uranus
    TIM
    IEI
    Posts
    629
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly View Post
    In my experience the best matches are the same stack or with the secondary instinct switched. So sx/so would do best with sx/sp or another sx/so; sp/so would do best with sp/sx or sp/so; so/sx fits with so/sx or so/sp. I think identical stacks are the most comfortable, but sharing the first and flipping the 2nd and 3rd has more potential for growth or kind of teaching each other.
    Maybe you say this because you're an sx-first...? Therefor your experiences match up with my theory. Although as an sp/ sx they don't match up with mine. I prefer so/ sx... Possibly an identical stacking or sx/sp. I don't have much connection/ chemistry with sp/ so's.. I wouldn't consider them in my top two best options as you suggested, there is nothing that draws me to this variant. I've nothing in common with so/ sp's and I have difficulty understanding them for that matter. Sx/ so's drain me strangely enough, because so/ sx's seem to energize me.

  6. #6
    strrrng's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    TIM
    Ni-IEI 4w3 sx/so
    Posts
    8,781
    Mentioned
    40 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    yeah, primary pairing would be most likely with sx-doms... maybe there's more influence from the tertiary instinct. so/sp's are distantly neutralizing to me, I understand their purpose, have absolutely no shared ground, but can't really get into conflict with them. however sp/so's *can* be more grating, because of a perceived selfishness and self-righteous obstinacy. if I'm taking this logic further... it would imply that compatibility is governed by the sx instinct, which while being entirely baseless, does align with your preference for so/sx's.
    4w3-5w6-8w7

  7. #7

    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Moons of Uranus
    TIM
    IEI
    Posts
    629
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by strrrng View Post
    yeah, primary pairing would be most likely with sx-doms... maybe there's more influence from the tertiary instinct. so/sp's are distantly neutralizing to me, I understand their purpose, have absolutely no shared ground, but can't really get into conflict with them. however sp/so's *can* be more grating, because of a perceived selfishness and self-righteous obstinacy. if I'm taking this logic further... it would imply that compatibility is governed by the sx instinct, which while being entirely baseless, does align with your preference for so/sx's.
    Yeah that's it, I think SX placement governs compatibility. I think thats why sx is sometimes called the relationship instinct anyway.

  8. #8
    strrrng's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    TIM
    Ni-IEI 4w3 sx/so
    Posts
    8,781
    Mentioned
    40 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    it would make sense... I mean, sx is about intimacy in and of itself, so when two of them collide, it isn't just like they become soulmates, more like they can keep up with each others' energy. I found this to be the case when I lived with gilly, I thought less and less about my impulses, which is usually my achilles heel, having an extrovert sx-dom there to stoke the flames. there's an all-or-nothing quality to the attitude that's pretty vital, which falls flat on sx-lasts and gets misdirected by sx-secondaries ime.
    4w3-5w6-8w7

  9. #9
    when you see the booty Galen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    everywhere at once
    Posts
    8,449
    Mentioned
    203 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    @Diam0nd it sounds to me like you're overemphasizing the power of the sx instinct and failing to realize that sp and so can just as easily take greater precedence in an individual when it comes to relationships.

    To say that Sx is the "relationship instinct" is kind of a misnomer in my view. Pretty much everybody on the planet is looking for a relationship, assuming they aren't already in one. What's more important is why they want a relationship in the first place, and what they hope to get out of it. For Sx firsts this just means that their greatest drive for survival lies in having a strong and intimate energy-sync with another, while for say an Sp primary they'll want a relationship that better contributes to their own sense of personal well-being and homeostasis. I couldn't really say what drives So primaries into relationships since I barely know any So-firsts, but I would imagine something about seeking a relationship which better allows them to associate with whichever group they belong.

    Furthermore, I find that it's more beneficial to view the valuing of instincts as lying on a continuum where each instinct is allocated a certain amount of focus, as opposed to lumping the stackings into simplistic discrete chunks of first -> second -> third. All of the research I've done on the subject suggests that all people value the three instincts to varying degrees, and just from an intuitive standpoint I don't see why each instinct would easily line up in clear-cut order like that. For example, I see both my sexual and self-pres instinct to be fairly close to each other with social falling flat near the bottom in terms of priority, so probably closer to 47% - 38% - 15% than a simple gold - silver - bronze. In this way, to say that all sx-seconds are most compatible with each other kinda becomes a moot point when its degree of valuation can be so varied, especially when compared to the primary instinct which will take higher precedence anyways.

    For the record, I still have strong reason to believe that similarly-valued instincts get along best with each other, given what I've observed in my relationships with others. In my experience a pair with shared first and flipped second instinct can be engaging and comfortable for a while, but I find that the second instinct eventually grows to be more grating than beneficial for personal growth. The way that Sx/Sos try to engage me in a sort of "play with meeeee" mentality gets to be too much for me at times, makes them come off as too emotionally dependent.
    "And above all, watch with glittering eyes the whole world around you because the greatest secrets are always hidden in the most unlikely places. Those who don't believe in magic will never find it." -Roald Dahl

    http://forum.socionix.com/
    It's pretty cool

  10. #10

    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Moons of Uranus
    TIM
    IEI
    Posts
    629
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Galen View Post
    @Diam0nd it sounds to me like you're overemphasizing the power of the sx instinct and failing to realize that sp and so can just as easily take greater precedence in an individual when it comes to relationships.

    To say that Sx is the "relationship instinct" is kind of a misnomer in my view. Pretty much everybody on the planet is looking for a relationship, assuming they aren't already in one. What's more important is why they want a relationship in the first place, and what they hope to get out of it. For Sx firsts this just means that their greatest drive for survival lies in having a strong and intimate energy-sync with another, while for say an Sp primary they'll want a relationship that better contributes to their own sense of personal well-being and homeostasis. I couldn't really say what drives So primaries into relationships since I barely know any So-firsts, but I would imagine something about seeking a relationship which better allows them to associate with whichever group they belong.

    Furthermore, I find that it's more beneficial to view the valuing of instincts as lying on a continuum where each instinct is allocated a certain amount of focus, as opposed to lumping the stackings into simplistic discrete chunks of first -> second -> third. All of the research I've done on the subject suggests that all people value the three instincts to varying degrees, and just from an intuitive standpoint I don't see why each instinct would easily line up in clear-cut order like that. For example, I see both my sexual and self-pres instinct to be fairly close to each other with social falling flat near the bottom in terms of priority, so probably closer to 47% - 38% - 15% than a simple gold - silver - bronze. In this way, to say that all sx-seconds are most compatible with each other kinda becomes a moot point when its degree of valuation can be so varied, especially when compared to the primary instinct which will take higher precedence anyways.

    For the record, I still have strong reason to believe that similarly-valued instincts get along best with each other, given what I've observed in my relationships with others. In my experience a pair with shared first and flipped second instinct can be engaging and comfortable for a while, but I find that the second instinct eventually grows to be more grating than beneficial for personal growth. The way that Sx/Sos try to engage me in a sort of "play with meeeee" mentality gets to be too much for me at times, makes them come off as too emotionally dependent.
    I didn't say that only sx-first are interested in relationships.. I know that we all are. But, I think /sx/ placement may govern the level of intimacy and intense experiences people are comfortable with, therefor I think it's the biggest decider in terms of one-on-one compatibility. I find so-lasts to be the next-best-thing for me personally but I think so/ sx complements me more. I'm not saying that this is the reason you disagree, but maybe you prefer so-lasts because you're an extrovert? It could different for so-last extroverts and sp-last introverts.. maybe they do better with identical stackings? Have you ever met and interacted with a Te-SLI sx/so, if so, do you still them draining in the same way?

  11. #11
    when you see the booty Galen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    everywhere at once
    Posts
    8,449
    Mentioned
    203 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Diam0nd View Post
    I didn't say that only sx-first are interested in relationships.. I know that we all are. But, I think /sx/ placement may govern the level of intimacy and intense experiences people are comfortable with, therefor I think it's the biggest decider in terms of one-on-one compatibility. I find so-lasts to be the next-best-thing for me personally but I think so/ sx complements me more.
    This makes sense to me, although I don't think it's fair to conclude from this that sp/sx gets along best with so/sx in relationships. Despite their intimacy priorities being technically the same, they're still flipped on end in terms of overall instinct valuing which will eventually drive the two apart more than keep them together. Then again I haven't known any sp/sx + so/sx relationships, in the same way that I haven't seen any opposing stacking relationships at all, so I still have to be open to that possibility in spite of what seems implausible to me.

    Quote Originally Posted by Diam0nd View Post
    I'm not saying that this is the reason you disagree, but maybe you prefer so-lasts because you're an extrovert? It could different for so-last extroverts and sp-last introverts.. maybe they do better with identical stackings? Have you ever met and interacted with a Te-SLI sx/so, if so, do you still them draining in the same way?
    I haven't known anybody of that specific type combo personally, but my relationships with sx/so IPs in general still follow that general pattern. They're generally the most stereotypically extroverted and energetic of the IPs, and while I have great appreciation for their energy levels at first, once we stay around each other for long enough I find myself just getting annoyed. I will say that there's generally a big initial interest in sx/so IPs, because while they're introverts they still have this way of getting me to interact and open up. Even so, it only lasts for so long until I learn how distracted they can really be, and that they have no off-switch lol. The only SLI sx/so I can think of is Bryan Cranston, who if he was a good 30 years younger I'd be all up ons. He could possibly be sx/sp though, so tough call. (EDIT: Oh yeah, Neil Patrick Harris could be sx/so as well. Also much <3 for him.)

    Comparatively, the sx/sp IPs I've met seem to have more staying power with me for whatever reason. Just recently I became good friends with a Te-ILI sx/sp, and we have plenty of good shit to talk about without feeling like he's intruding in my personal space (he has a healthy drive for personal space as well, but doesn't let it overpower his interactions with others, which I respect). My Te-SLI sx/sp friend is a lot the same way, where we can kinda keep to ourselves when we want but when one of us feels like talking about something the other will join in and engage on the spot. It is a very comfortable relationship, as Gilly said, but I don't think it's as sedentary as he implies.
    "And above all, watch with glittering eyes the whole world around you because the greatest secrets are always hidden in the most unlikely places. Those who don't believe in magic will never find it." -Roald Dahl

    http://forum.socionix.com/
    It's pretty cool

  12. #12
    Park's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Beyond the blue horizon
    TIM
    SLI
    Posts
    13,088
    Mentioned
    164 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly View Post
    In my experience the best matches are the same stack or with the secondary instinct switched. So sx/so would do best with sx/sp or another sx/so; sp/so would do best with sp/sx or sp/so; so/sx fits with so/sx or so/sp. I think identical stacks are the most comfortable, but sharing the first and flipping the 2nd and 3rd has more potential for growth or kind of teaching each other.
    Speaking in Socionics terms, the Social instinct sounds like a weak and unvalued area to me (by itself), and sp/so types are a little bit too cold/distant for me. And I can't imagine how I'd be "teaching" someone things like intimacy, if they don't have it in themselves. Both sx/sp and sx/so descriptions sound more attractive and inspiring to me than the sp/so one, although I do like the communication style attributed to sp/so types. But then I can't imagine developing and sustaining a romantic interest with someone as dull and business-like, for example. For deeper relationships, I'd probably be most at home with other sp/sx types, and potentially sx primaries, while least comfortable with so/sp's... I think.

    The most recent enneagram stuff I've read is the ocean-moonshine descriptions, so the previous paragraph is largely based on my recollection of those.
    “Whether we fall by ambition, blood, or lust, like diamonds we are cut with our own dust.”

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    You've done yourself a huge favor developmentally by mustering the balls to do something really fucking scary... in about the most vulnerable situation possible.

  13. #13

    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Moons of Uranus
    TIM
    IEI
    Posts
    629
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Park View Post
    Speaking in Socionics terms, the Social instinct sounds like a weak and unvalued area to me (by itself)
    I've realized sp's like a comfort zone, sx is like an area of "creative awareness" and the /so/ isn't actually unvalued it's really more like an unused muscle that we're typically indifferent towards and unaware of. When we actually get interested in it and a little stronger in our last instinct it can really improve our lives. It's like a secret weapon.


    Quote Originally Posted by Park View Post
    and sp/so types are a little bit too cold/distant for me. And I can't imagine how I'd be "teaching" someone things like intimacy, if they don't have it in themselves. Both sx/sp and sx/so descriptions sound more attractive and inspiring to me than the sp/so one, although I do like the communication style attributed to sp/so types. But then I can't imagine developing and sustaining a romantic interest with someone as dull and business-like, for example. For deeper relationships, I'd probably be most at home with other sp/sx types, and potentially sx primaries, while least comfortable with so/sp's... I think..
    Yeah I feel the exact same things you've described toward sx-lasts. ^^

    I'm very comfortable with other so-lasts like you. Not much experience in identically stacked relationships. However, sx/ sps have been alluring to me and I have some experience in the romantic sphere. What happens is my sp-first makes me withdraw too much for them and I can't change that at the end of the day. I'm not out to completly immerse myself in the relationship like they're, although, that used to sound romantic and desirable to me...it's not. Truth is I want to remain within my comfort zone, do my own thing and come out when I choose. I reckon sx/ sp's are kind of like the "ying" searching for their sx/ so "yang".. sp/ sx just can't measure up enough to maintain the /sx/ and we can't introduce their so instinct either. I imagine if I did get together with another so-last we'd end up shut off from stuff and it would stagnate.

  14. #14
    redbaron's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Posts
    9,321
    Mentioned
    16 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Instict stacking is huge in my experience. You'd be hard-pressed to find anyone in my (wealthy) neighborhood who's not sp-first. When push comes to shove, they either stay in bad relationship, ignoring them, or get out of them and use their social circles for attention/affection. Most of them are focused on careers and family the most. I do like how they draw me into their circles. I need that, but I don't CARE about it sufficiently to become a permanent member of their inside circles. I find a lot of the interaction in groups to be a little empty and boring. I almost always find that people (in general) are more interesting one-on-one. But the only way to see this is when you're alone so that's what I tend to crave, whether with men or women.
    IEI-Fe 4w3

  15. #15
    FoxOnStilts's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    TN
    TIM
    Fi-SLE 3w9 so/sp
    Posts
    780
    Mentioned
    29 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly View Post
    In my experience the best matches are the same stack or with the secondary instinct switched. So sx/so would do best with sx/sp or another sx/so; sp/so would do best with sp/sx or sp/so; so/sx fits with so/sx or so/sp. I think identical stacks are the most comfortable, but sharing the first and flipping the 2nd and 3rd has more potential for growth or kind of teaching each other.
    This is what I've noticed as well.

  16. #16
    Breaking stereotypes Suz's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    On a chatbox diet
    TIM
    IDK
    Posts
    6,470
    Mentioned
    169 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Diam0nd View Post
    My interest in this was sparked by Clumsys thread "Instinctual stackings and relationships."

    Over the last week I've become very interested in instinct stackings and I've realized they have a MAJOR effect on compatibilty. I've been thinking about my own experiences with other stackings & reading descriptions by enneagram writers, and various personality boards to hear other peoples opinions. I came to the conclusion that we're likely to be compatibile with those who share the same sexual variant position, especially those with the sp and so reversed:

    If you're so/ sx, you would be most compatible with sp/ sx.
    If you're so/ sp, you would be most compatible with sp/ so.
    If you're sx/ so, you would be most compatible with sx/ sp.

    IME It can even make us more compatible with certain sociotypes, just one example being my childhood best friend - an IEE 6w7 so/sx.. I'm sp/sx; of course we quarreled sometimes but the friendship was so strong - we were like sisters and we had great fun together for contrary type relations (almost as if we had a little drop of socionics duality in there).

    Do you have any criticisms of this theory?.. doesn't it match your interactions? and, What are your real life experiences with those who I theorized to be your most compatible partners?

    This is really very interesting... I think you are onto something there!
    Enneagram: 9w1 6w5 2w3 so/sx

  17. #17
    Let's fly now Gilly's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    TIM
    3w4 sx/so
    Posts
    24,757
    Mentioned
    91 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    I'm the same, sx/sp, sx/so, and sp/sx are the most comfortable stacks for me. so/sx is ok but they can be exhausting and are sometimes disappointingly shallow to me.

    People who are sx last just seem very "other" to me for the most part.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

  18. #18
    when you see the booty Galen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    everywhere at once
    Posts
    8,449
    Mentioned
    203 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Maybe sx/sp, sx/so, and sp/sx are just the best types
    "And above all, watch with glittering eyes the whole world around you because the greatest secrets are always hidden in the most unlikely places. Those who don't believe in magic will never find it." -Roald Dahl

    http://forum.socionix.com/
    It's pretty cool

  19. #19
    Let's fly now Gilly's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    TIM
    3w4 sx/so
    Posts
    24,757
    Mentioned
    91 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Or maybe I am somehow sx/sp...? o.O
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

  20. #20
    Darn Socks Director Abbie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Southwest USA
    TIM
    LSE
    Posts
    6,724
    Mentioned
    237 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    I believe it's best to share the last instinct. So as an sp/sx I should get an sp/sx or an sx/sp.

    ESTj
    1w2 sp/so 1-2-6
    Brilliand's Younger Sister
    Squishy's Older Sister

    Johari Nohari

    Quote Originally Posted by Ritella View Post
    Over here, we'll put up with (almost) all of your crap. You just have to use the secret phrase: "I don't value it. It's related to <insert random element here>, which is not in my quadra."
    Quote Originally Posted by Aquagraph View Post
    Abbie is so boring and rigid it's awesome instead of boring and rigid. She seems so practical and down-to-the-ground.

  21. #21
    . willekeurig's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    1,512
    Mentioned
    70 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly View Post
    In my experience the best matches are the same stack or with the secondary instinct switched. So sx/so would do best with sx/sp or another sx/so; sp/so would do best with sp/sx or sp/so; so/sx fits with so/sx or so/sp. I think identical stacks are the most comfortable, but sharing the first and flipping the 2nd and 3rd has more potential for growth or kind of teaching each other.

    This works very well for me. Pretty much all of my best/long term friends are/have been sx doms. I have/ have had a few sx secondary friends, too, but not very many, and relationships with sx-lasts have always became very frustrating and disappointing after a while.
    Quote Originally Posted by 1981slater View Post
    Axis of Evil: Iran, Iraq, North Korea and Agarina
    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa Darmandzhyan
    Agarina does not like human beings; she just wants a pretty boy toy.
    Johari Nohari

  22. #22
    killer wolf lemontrees's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    emotionz
    TIM
    SEI
    Posts
    1,114
    Mentioned
    100 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    I think a lot of the people who have advocated for first instinct same, second instinct switched have been Sx doms, which doesn't really go against Diamond's theory.

    Personally I find that I quite like Sp/So's, but being in a romantic relationship with one was extremely frustrating. Every time we finally pushed out of our shells, I wanted to spend time with him, and he always wanted to spend time with me plus all our friends. And when I pushed for one on one time it's like he wouldn't even be present.

    I also find Siuntal's theory of "flow" and "contra-flow" to make the most sense, theoretically. Perhaps problems from instinct stackings arise more at a closer psychological distance, though? For instance I can see So/Sx and Sp/Sx being really good friends but beginning to irritate each other if they were, say, in a romantic relationship and living together.

  23. #23
    FoxOnStilts's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    TN
    TIM
    Fi-SLE 3w9 so/sp
    Posts
    780
    Mentioned
    29 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Galen View Post
    Maybe sx/sp, sx/so, and sp/sx are just the best types
    Well I thought that was just a given.

  24. #24

    Join Date
    Jan 1970
    Posts
    0
    Mentioned
    Post(s)
    Tagged
    Thread(s)

    Default Relationship Question

    I am Sx/Sp.

    Can anyone out there fill me in on the dynamics in relationships/friendships with people of other instincts/stackings.

    For instance, my husband is sp/sx, & I am sx/sp ~ what does that generally look like?
    I think I know, given we are married, but I'm still curious.


    Also, what would sx/sp + so/sp generally equate to?
    Or, sx/sp + so/sx ?

    I am really trying to get a better picture of what relations with So's is all about (w/ me. a sx/sp).
    outside of my own personal, vague references (/current understandings). looking for more of a third-party standard -ish.

    Thanks!
    INFJ 9w8 sx/sp 974

  25. #25
    lunarpine's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    London/Sweden
    TIM
    IEI-Fe 9w8 sx/so
    Posts
    49
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly View Post
    In my experience the best matches are the same stack or with the secondary instinct switched. So sx/so would do best with sx/sp or another sx/so; sp/so would do best with sp/sx or sp/so; so/sx fits with so/sx or so/sp. I think identical stacks are the most comfortable, but sharing the first and flipping the 2nd and 3rd has more potential for growth or kind of teaching each other.
    this is something I've experienced as well. I feel this magnetism towards those who share tha same instinctual stacking as me. As an sx/so I feel that I gravitate towards sx/sp as well, but I don't know if it's because my so only is slightly higher than my sp. I can enjoy the company of so/sx's as well but in a more friendship kind of way. Becasue it feels like I'm the one dragging them towards me, which isn't always plesant and can be quite draining. Also, with so/sx, as soon as I get a little bit bored and stop pulling there's no connection anymore. So maybe sharing the same instinctual stacking in more stable in the long run?
    Last edited by lunarpine; 02-05-2013 at 01:29 PM.

  26. #26
    Let's fly now Gilly's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    TIM
    3w4 sx/so
    Posts
    24,757
    Mentioned
    91 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by lunarpine View Post
    this is something I've experienced as well. I feel this magnetism towards those who share tha same instinctual stacking as me. As an sx/so I feel that I gravitate towards sx/sp as well, but I don't know if it's because my so only is slightly higher than my sp. I can enjoy the company of so/sx's as well but in a more friendship kind of way. Becasue it feels like I'm the one dragging them towards me, which isn't always plesant and can be quite draining. Also, with so/sx, as soon as I get a little bit bored and stop pulling there's no connection anymore. So maybe sharing the same instinctual stacking in more stable in the long run?
    Maybe, just out of pure familiarity, but I think the pairs with the second instinct different (ie sx/so and sx/sp) tend to push each other to grow more, but in a way that is not abrasive.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

  27. #27
    lunarpine's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    London/Sweden
    TIM
    IEI-Fe 9w8 sx/so
    Posts
    49
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly View Post
    Maybe, just out of pure familiarity, but I think the pairs with the second instinct different (ie sx/so and sx/sp) tend to push each other to grow more, but in a way that is not abrasive.
    Good point, there could be an element of familiarity to it, but the way I see it is more like shared long term goals. But yeah, differences leave space to grow, but also maybe more space to grow apart? Do you have any thoughts on how shared first instinct, while the second is different would work between types that are less compatible in sociotype?

  28. #28
    lunarpine's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    London/Sweden
    TIM
    IEI-Fe 9w8 sx/so
    Posts
    49
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Monica Reads View Post
    I am Sx/Sp.

    Can anyone out there fill me in on the dynamics in relationships/friendships with people of other instincts/stackings.

    For instance, my husband is sp/sx, & I am sx/sp ~ what does that generally look like?
    I think I know, given we are married, but I'm still curious.


    Also, what would sx/sp + so/sp generally equate to?
    Or, sx/sp + so/sx ?

    I am really trying to get a better picture of what relations with So's is all about (w/ me. a sx/sp).
    outside of my own personal, vague references (/current understandings). looking for more of a third-party standard -ish.

    Thanks!
    INFJ 9w8 sx/sp 974
    I don't feel like I can answer your questions, but have a look at: http://theenneagram.blogspot.co.uk/ I find it quite useful. Maybe you can puzzle it together yourself?

  29. #29
    when you see the booty Galen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    everywhere at once
    Posts
    8,449
    Mentioned
    203 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Monica Reads View Post
    I am Sx/Sp.

    Can anyone out there fill me in on the dynamics in relationships/friendships with people of other instincts/stackings.

    For instance, my husband is sp/sx, & I am sx/sp ~ what does that generally look like?
    I think I know, given we are married, but I'm still curious.
    In my experience with an sp/sx relationship, I found that while they have generally the same priorities and outlooks on life there's some unconscious tug-of-war playing out between them. When just talking about it, both sides tend to agree that Sp and Sx needs are definitely important, but in practice they find that one side will always outweigh the other. This begins a never-ending battle of correction and overcompensation where each side fights for priority in what they already think the other side agrees with.


    Quote Originally Posted by Monica Reads View Post
    Also, what would sx/sp + so/sp generally equate to?
    Or, sx/sp + so/sx ?
    So/Sps can come off as very unengaging people to me, almost robotic in the way that they interact with others. Same apples to Sp/Sos I've known, but they're ultimately chill enough so that I can interact with them on some level without feeling overbearing. With So/Sps though, I never feel like I can get them to react in the ways I expect them to, so conversations with them can come off as very stilted from both myself and the other party.

    So/Sxs are somewhat easier for me to deal with, but our interactions ultimately tax my energy more than I see as worth it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Monica Reads View Post
    I am really trying to get a better picture of what relations with So's is all about (w/ me. a sx/sp).
    outside of my own personal, vague references (/current understandings). looking for more of a third-party standard -ish.

    Thanks!
    INFJ 9w8 sx/sp 974
    My understanding of the instincts is also very highly colored by my own personal experiences and biases as an Sx/Sp myself, so trying to remove one's self from the picture can be a fairly difficult task.
    "And above all, watch with glittering eyes the whole world around you because the greatest secrets are always hidden in the most unlikely places. Those who don't believe in magic will never find it." -Roald Dahl

    http://forum.socionix.com/
    It's pretty cool

  30. #30
    Let's fly now Gilly's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    TIM
    3w4 sx/so
    Posts
    24,757
    Mentioned
    91 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by lunarpine View Post
    Good point, there could be an element of familiarity to it, but the way I see it is more like shared long term goals. But yeah, differences leave space to grow, but also maybe more space to grow apart? Do you have any thoughts on how shared first instinct, while the second is different would work between types that are less compatible in sociotype?
    *shrug* I think there is a lot more to a successful relationship than either Socionics or Enneagram or the two combined can say, which is basically to say I don't see the need to bother with that level of hair splitting, because the theories as I've come to understand them are already categorical and overly precise in attempting to simplify things as they stand.

    The second instinct tends to be something that is occasionally put to the side or trodden over for the sake of the primary fixation gaining fulfillment, but is a bit more of a conscious element than the primary instinct, because it's something that has to be "dealt with." So people who share the same primary fixation, tend to have similar priorities, and with different second instincts, they can teach each other how to "deal with" the things that the other outright ignores, or is somehow pathological about.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

  31. #31
    Fembot Olimpia's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    TIM
    IEI-1Ni
    Posts
    6,536
    Mentioned
    537 Post(s)
    Tagged
    5 Thread(s)

    Default

    As an So/Sx, I can say I am fascinated and smitten by Sp/Sx, which would support @Codie 's theory.

    However, I have mostly been focusing on the flow theory before, which actually suggests that the So/Sx - Sp/Sx pairing produces the most misunderstandings.

    Stackings that share the same middle instinct but not the leading one can be said to be most opposite in their orientation. If there is any attraction between people of these stackings, it usually forms on basis of overlap of their middle instinct (...). They soon discover, however, that their primary motivations and desires couldn't be any more different, that they do not truly understand each other's orientation and primary desires. Feeling that it is difficult to bridge the distance, they often part ways. Often it happens that one of them finds that the primary orientation of the other is too disruptive to their own world (...). In such worst case scenarios, one of the people involved may try to eliminate or somehow suppress the other person. This pairing holds the most potential for misunderstandings and conflicts of all other stacking combinations.
    Sx/Sp is supposedly a better match for So/Sx, and I can see how (Sx/Sp can be pretty magnetizing), though many Sx/Sp people (mostly unhealthy ones) I have interacted with were too much of a bother to me – they have wanted ultimate merging, often way too early, and without gauging whether we were actually on the same page. This usually freaked me out. I would imagine it to be more relaxing with an Sp/Sx when it comes to the intimacy factor, but I can see how each other's blindspots could drive the other up the wall. It seems like connecting emotionally with an Sp/Sx would be more effortless and comfortable, with an Sx/Sp more intense, but draining and "all-or-nothing"; though sharing your daily life with an Sp/Sx could be more of a hassle because of the blindspots ( – the same for Sx/Sp, actually, but to a lesser degree, because their first instinct is not my blindspot). You probably would have to take breaks from each other. With Sx/Sp, due to their merging being often too "extreme" (for anyone not Sx dom), and with Sp/Sx because of the (stronger) blindspot clashes.
    So far, I could not say whether Sx/Sp or Sp/Sx would be better for me, as an So/Sx. I suppose the individual's level of health would be more of a determining factor in this regard.

    I doubt I could enjoy being with an So/Sp or Sp/So in a romantic relationship for the long run, due to their Sx blindspot. I need the Sx glue that makes us stick together – otherwise I would see us drifting apart rather quickly. (Particularly because I have a dismissing attachment style.)
    Sp/So would be the more interesting to me of the two. So/Sp is kind of weird to me; very similar, but also too different. They are actually too "social" for my own taste; having the same main instinctual fixation would make me feel imbalanced in the relationship, in a sense. I think I'd prefer someone who is more chill about So, who could ease my worries regarding the Social domain. That's also why being with an So/Sx could be a hit or miss situation – great for camaraderie, bad for securing a life together and balancing each other out (similar with Sx/So, who shares the same blindspot).

    All in all, I have decided for myself that I'd (theoretically) prefer to date someone who is either Sx/Sp or Sp/Sx.
    To make it work, they would need to be healthy, and open to growth – letting me fulfill the social role, so to say, and bringing them somewhat closer to it (under certain circumstances), while they do the same with their Sp instinct (care for and help me with Sp matters). I know I would have to either strengthen my Sx or Sp instinct for either an Sx/Sp or Sp/Sx person, but I am fine with doing so – I do want to grow as an individual.

  32. #32
    suedehead's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Posts
    3,024
    Mentioned
    195 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Default

    I could be with an Sp/Sx or an So/Sp LIE/EIE who's well-rounded and kind of does their own thing without seeming prudish. But depending on who it is there might be some superfluous stuff that I'd find annoying or hard to keep up with. I like some Sx/So's.
    Last edited by suedehead; 11-16-2014 at 05:09 PM.

  33. #33
    Haikus
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Berlin
    TIM
    LSI 5w6 sx/so
    Posts
    5,421
    Mentioned
    144 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Default

    at SisterOfNight

    I think you're Sp/sx and I don't see why you're repelled by this Stack (in the sense of refusing to consider you may belong there ...otherwise you're obviously drawn to sp/sx content). Just consider the fact that you only show up on the forum to comment in bits and pieces on our Enneagram threads -- that doesn't look like a So first fixation tbh. You seem to have a quite narrow mental focus --on what you find, say, fascinating ..not on connecting within a well-defined group.
    Besides everything about you vibes E 4 sp/sx ..a sense of lonesome ("in your own world") embellished by some sort of mysterious allure.

  34. #34
    Fembot Olimpia's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    TIM
    IEI-1Ni
    Posts
    6,536
    Mentioned
    537 Post(s)
    Tagged
    5 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Agni View Post
    at SisterOfNight

    I think you're Sp/sx and I don't see why you're repelled by this Stack (in the sense of refusing to consider you may belong there ...otherwise you're obviously drawn to sp/sx content). Just consider the fact that you only show up on the forum to comment in bits and pieces on our Enneagram threads -- that doesn't look like a So first fixation tbh. You seem to have a quite narrow mental focus --on what you find, say, fascinating ..not on connecting within a well-defined group.
    Besides everything about you vibes E 4 sp/sx ..a sense of lonesome ("in your own world") embellished by some sort of mysterious allure.

    I have considered being Sp first before, but have realized that I have great difficulties with caring for Sp matters. It does not come naturally to me, I find it to be bothersome and a weak spot. I do feel like being the "eternal child", cut off from practical living.
    I see my purpose in contributing to humanity, in some creative form.

    The main reason I mostly comment on Enneagram threads here is the fact I am fairly new to Socionics. I have known about the Enneagram (and MBTI) for quite more time, not so Socionics. I am still learning about it.
    I am part of many typology groups on Facebook, and am known in one or two of them. I do reach out to people, but because I am very withdrawn (459 tritype), I also retreat on occasion.


    Besides, this description does fit me well:

    darkside so/sx (weakside soc) - shifts to sx/sp (secondary) - borrows sx energy to bolster sx second
    darksiders on the other hand seem eager to prove their soc isn't in full control, so they typically test the boundaries of traditional soc values. maybe knee-jerk reactions against sheepish herd behavior, group mentalities, or warmside strategies for making connections. they aren't any less healthy by definition, but can seem that way due to their darker, more confrontational manner. they use highly customized interactive tactics like all so/sx's, but in a more uncompromising "keeping it real" way, owing to the active tension between "good" soc and "bad" sx. some examples are woody harrelson, frank zappa, jack nicholson, lauryn hill, judy garland, chris rock, eminem, george carlin, andy warhol.

  35. #35
    Haikus
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Location
    Berlin
    TIM
    LSI 5w6 sx/so
    Posts
    5,421
    Mentioned
    144 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by SisOfNight View Post
    I have considered being Sp first before, but have realized that I have great difficulties with caring for Sp matters. It does not come naturally to me, I find it to be bothersome and a weak spot. I do feel like being the "eternal child", cut off from practical living.
    I see my purpose in contributing to humanity, in some creative form.

    The main reason I mostly comment on Enneagram threads here is the fact I am fairly new to Socionics. I have known about the Enneagram (and MBTI) for quite more time, not so Socionics. I am still learning about it.
    I am part of many typology groups on Facebook, and am known in one or two of them. I do reach out to people, but because I am very withdrawn (459 tritype), I also retreat on occasion.


    Besides, this description does fit me well:

    You can say whatever you wish, you are textbook withdrawn sp/sx --- obviously one in denial, but that's your pb. Compare yourself to Aylen who types Sx 459. She's way more multidimensionally active on the forum, but doesn't necessarily touch base with "the community" (So first). Instead she focuses on a few members she prolly has some energetic connection to. Your feeling cut off from practical stuff can be due to being Ni base and Se inferior. All in all So/sx is way more fluffy, chaotic and bouncy (also charming in a rather feminine way, ofc). You feel quite grounded and steady ...as someone who stays on one track doing their own thing without much deviation. I'm not sure how you perceive your creative contribution to humanity ..maybe there are things about your life unknown to me and you switch to a completely distinct personality online.

  36. #36
    Fembot Olimpia's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    TIM
    IEI-1Ni
    Posts
    6,536
    Mentioned
    537 Post(s)
    Tagged
    5 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Agni View Post
    You can say whatever you wish, you are textbook withdrawn sp/sx --- obviously one in denial, but that's your pb. Compare yourself to Aylen who types Sx 459. She's way more multidimensionally active on the forum, but doesn't necessarily touch base with "the community" (So first). Instead she focuses on a few members she prolly has some energetic connection to. Your feeling cut off from practical stuff can be due to being Ni base and Se inferior. All in all So/sx is way more fluffy, chaotic and bouncy (also charming in a rather feminine way, ofc). You feel quite grounded and steady ...as someone who stays on one track doing their own thing without much deviation. I'm not sure how you perceive your creative contribution to humanity ..maybe there are things about your life unknown to me and you switch to a completely distinct personality online.
    I do mostly attribute to feeling cut off from practical stuff due to being Ni base.
    I am in no denial whatsoever. I can agree with the possibility that seeming sp/sx could indeed be my online persona in one way or the other. In company of others, I do behave more chaotically and bouncy, though I tend to try to hide it sometimes, because it makes people take me less seriously.

    The most poignant way I know that I must be a Social 4 is the fact that I am a very shameful person, and it took me a long time to deal with this. (For example, I used to have a form of social anxiety due to severe social shame a year ago or so.)
    4s with a Social blindspot are the most shameless, and I cannot say that applies to me. I am in no way "reckless or dauntless", as Ichazo describes the Sp 4.

    Social Fours: The Outsider (Ichazo's "Social Shame")
    (…) They enjoy expressing their individuality and sense of style in a more public way, although they also attempt to conceal the extent of their feelings of social inadequacy or shame. Social Fours may work hard to develop a public persona through which they can communicate the depths of their feelings, but this persona is usually more glamorous and free than they actually feel. Social Fours are acutely aware of the artifice of their persona, but they use it nonetheless as a way of finding some sense of belonging and involvement in the world. When they are more troubled, Social Fours fear social humiliation to such a degree that they may retreat from much social contact, becoming isolated and reclusive. They may also develop a personal style cultivated to show the world how wounded and different they feel.

    P.S: This thread is not about me. If you want to continue discussing my stacking, you can create a new thread for that.
    Last edited by Olimpia; 11-19-2014 at 07:18 PM.

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •