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Thread: Opposing quadras and Aristocracy/Democracy

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    High Priestess glam's Avatar
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    Default Opposing quadras and Aristocracy/Democracy

    a tight-knit circle of friends of mine from school:

    EIE f
    IEI f (me)
    EII f
    IEE f

    ILE m
    LSI m
    IEI m
    SLE m
    LSE m

    this group is largely made up of Aristocrats (exception is ILE m), and NF females & ST males (exceptions are ILE m and IEI m). we are friends because of shared academic activities & interests, similar or related areas of study, etc.

    i noticed that 8/9 of us are Aristocrats after i had already typed everyone, so i don't believe i was "biased" towards typing people any one way. still, i don't expect anyone to take my typings for granted - but has anyone else observed opposing quadras coming together like this?

    are there certain environments, interests, activities, etc. that are more attractive to Aristocrats or to Democrats? due to the nature of it, is it just an Aristocratic thing, or are there groups where Democrats may predominate as well? have you noticed lines being split among Clubs, Ethics/Logic (or some other dichotomy), etc. between males and females in a group?

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    Decadent Charlatan Aquagraph's Avatar
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    Hello, I'm an aristocratic ILE.
    “I tell you, freedom and human rights in America are doomed. The U.S. government will lead the American people in — and the West in general — into an unbearable hell and a choking life. - Osama bin Laden

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    Decadent Charlatan Aquagraph's Avatar
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    Most of my closest friends are Judicious but, obviously, that just makes sense due to Si/Ne appreciation.

    This shared Aristocracy/Democracy is interesting. I think some youth subcultures might often have it like that. There are subcultures with a greater emphasis on us versus them thinking (like neonazi skinheads) and then there are subcultures with more welcoming approach to the individual with lesser interest in their reference groups (like hippies).
    “I tell you, freedom and human rights in America are doomed. The U.S. government will lead the American people in — and the West in general — into an unbearable hell and a choking life. - Osama bin Laden

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    Do the same on this forum and get democrats who sound like aristocracts and vice versa.

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    Let's fly now Gilly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aquagraph View Post
    Hello, I'm an aristocratic ILE.
    Yeah that's what I thought at first. For myself.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

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    High Priestess glam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Absurd View Post
    Do the same on this forum and get democrats who sound like aristocracts and vice versa.
    what do you mean?

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    not a bumblebee octo's Avatar
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    That's interesting, glam. Do you find that the IEE and EII (and the IEI and EIE) hang out together more? Or does opposite temperament make it split less easily along quadra lines? Or are there more non-socionics factors that influence who tends to side together, and which people are a tad closer?
    Quote Originally Posted by Agee The Great View Post
    Nobody here...besides me, seems to know what SLE is except for maybe Maritsa.

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    Glorious Member mu4's Avatar
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    I find that clubs NF/ST/SF/NT tend to congregate due to similar strong/weak functions. This is why often you will find individuals of opposing quadras in the same environments, once they're in that environment they naturally form a dialectic which is open for a adjacent quadra to create a synthesis. But generally the adjacent quadra individual is still a sort of a outsider to that dialectic and can either entirely transform that activity or simply leave and start their own vision for that activity.

    You can see this in the NT dominated tech field where Steve Jobs(Beta NF) was able to create a synthesis in Apple, this was after more or less being kicked out for a while but once he came back he changed the entire landscape.

    Also if a activity transforms enough, opposing quadra members can enter into that scenario and create a new dialectic which will be the dominant dialectic which will introduce new opportunities for synthesis.

    This is of course a hegelian interpretation, but i believe it is appropriate.

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    High Priestess glam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by octo View Post
    That's interesting, glam. Do you find that the IEE and EII (and the IEI and EIE) hang out together more? Or does opposite temperament make it split less easily along quadra lines? Or are there more non-socionics factors that influence who tends to side together, and which people are a tad closer?
    i first became friends with the IEE, and we've worked together a lot in various activities over the past year or so. the EII joined us later, and i've noticed that over time, the IEE and EII have become closer, and i think that some of the things the IEE used to prefer doing with me, she now does with the EII. they are also closer in age.

    i think the EIE f gets along best the IEI m, and probably also myself. though, the thing is that she can be pretty obnoxiously loud, which doesn't really go along with the general vibe of our group. thus i think some people can find her a bit irritating. i think her loudness and her personality are not easy to handle. she is also younger than most of us.

    i would say the IEE f, ILE m and SLE m take on leadership positions within the group. they are the ones who tend to take charge, plan things, set the direction, etc. they are also the eldest, which may have something to do with it, besides their Extraversion perhaps.

    the ILE m and SLE m work well together, which i guess can be expected from Business relations. they generally want to accomplish the same thing, but often come at it from different angles, which is good - all the bases are covered this way. they both like to joke around, but ILE has a more lighthearted sense of humor, while the SLE is more hard-hitting.

    the ILE m and IEI m are very close, maybe the closest friendship in the group despite the age gap, since they've known each other a long time.

    the SLE m and IEE f are friends around the same age. i can tell the way the SLE jokes around makes the IEE uncomfortable or unsure of herself sometimes. for instance, he makes fun of her for being recently elected head of this certain organization at our university by calling her "Queen" and asking her where her throne room is. i don't think she likes it much, but i think it's hilarious. (i laugh at almost everything he says, to be honest...)

    the LSI m and EII f are closer because they are attracted to each other. if anything ever happens between them, i kind of hope i'm wrong about their types. i think they might idealize each other a bit - not that the attraction isn't real.

    the LSE m is the youngest guy in the group, an eager-to-please type. i can tell the IEE f, who is older and a mother, likes him a lot. she says he reminds her of her own sons. the EII f also gets along with him well, and she has said before that "he'll do anything i say!"

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    Snomunegot munenori2's Avatar
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    This might be more aristocratic. Not sure I've noticed alphas and gammas hanging out so much.

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    Quote Originally Posted by glam View Post
    what do you mean?
    Easy. You've got the example above. I've seen this on this forum in various individuals claiming to be democratic. I have this tackled already. Didn't bother with it before but seeing it gets larger and spreads it aroused my curiosity. And it looks really bad. It's like a growing cancer that you know is there - you can see what it is doing, docs can see it as well and it doesn't stop, so the only to stop it is...
    Last edited by Absurd; 07-01-2012 at 09:40 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by hkkmr View Post
    I find that clubs NF/ST/SF/NT tend to congregate due to similar strong/weak functions. This is why often you will find individuals of opposing quadras in the same environments, once they're in that environment they naturally form a dialectic which is open for a adjacent quadra to create a synthesis. But generally the adjacent quadra individual is still a sort of a outsider to that dialectic and can either entirely transform that activity or simply leave and start their own vision for that activity.
    Being NT makes me think about me when I'm hanging out with gamma nerds.
    Also if a activity transforms enough, opposing quadra members can enter into that scenario and create a new dialectic which will be the dominant dialectic which will introduce new opportunities for synthesis.
    “I tell you, freedom and human rights in America are doomed. The U.S. government will lead the American people in — and the West in general — into an unbearable hell and a choking life. - Osama bin Laden

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