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Thread: Wake up INFjs

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    both sides, now wacey's Avatar
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    Default Wake up INFjs

    We do not need saving.
    We do not need someone to take care of us.
    We can make a living ourselves.
    We are kind and extremely understanding of people and human nature in general, just how our psyches operate.
    We do not require a dual to be happy - that is the old superstition of needing someone else (who is perfect omg - sarcasm) so that we can be happy, cast in a new light of"duality".
    We are smart, we are perfectly capable of "doing for ourselves".
    We like action, once motivated, get the hell out of our way, nothing stops us from reaching our goals (we even do it without stepping on your toes!).
    We are likable, and even if you do not like us, we understand that too.
    We are serious, but do not need to "dump" our problems on others, we handle things by ourselves and a small choosen few (if you are one of the choosen that gets to see that private inner world, respect it! If not, you will never see it again, ever).
    We are perfectly capable, thank-you very much.
    We are something different for each person we know - because we are adabtable.

    So wake up EII's, you want something, go and get it, do not wait for anything or anyone!
    You know how unique you are.

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    Quote Originally Posted by WaceysShoulder View Post
    We are something different for each person we know - because we are adaptable.
    In before Abbie!
    Johari/Nohari

    "Tell someone you love them today, because life is short; shout it at them in German, because life is also terrifying."

    Fruit, the fluffy kitty.

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    EII SUPREMACY!!!

    EDIT: I think it's pretty obvious that those "image/motivational campaigns" always show that the author already acknowledges the prejudices which are refuted in them. It's like all that "women are strong, stfu everyone"-propaganda.
    Last edited by Pa3s; 06-22-2012 at 07:10 PM.
    „Man can do what he wants but he cannot want what he wants.“
    – Arthur Schopenhauer

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    On a more serious note: Wacey, I get that you're trying to be inspiring and motivational, and you mean well. However, I don't get the impression that most of the EIIs here have the views you're telling us to shed. Do we get stereotyped as such? Sure, but you'll find threads scattered around the forum where we talk about how we don't fit those stereotypes.
    Johari/Nohari

    "Tell someone you love them today, because life is short; shout it at them in German, because life is also terrifying."

    Fruit, the fluffy kitty.

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    Quote Originally Posted by WaceysShoulder View Post
    We do not need saving.
    We do not need someone to take care of us.
    We can make a living ourselves.
    We are kind and extremely understanding of people and human nature in general, just how our psyches operate.
    We do not require a dual to be happy - that is the old superstition of needing someone else (who is perfect omg - sarcasm) so that we can be happy, cast in a new light of"duality".
    We are smart, we are perfectly capable of "doing for ourselves".
    We like action, once motivated, get the hell out of our way, nothing stops us from reaching our goals (we even do it without stepping on your toes!).
    We are likable, and even if you do not like us, we understand that too.
    We are serious, but do not need to "dump" our problems on others, we handle things by ourselves and a small choosen few (if you are one of the choosen that gets to see that private inner world, respect it! If not, you will never see it again, ever).
    We are perfectly capable, thank-you very much.
    We are something different for each person we know - because we are adabtable.

    So wake up EII's, you want something, go and get it, do not wait for anything or anyone!
    You know how unique you are.
    Umm, sorry, no.

    You're nice and all though.
    “I tell you, freedom and human rights in America are doomed. The U.S. government will lead the American people in — and the West in general — into an unbearable hell and a choking life. - Osama bin Laden

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    Don't you think the fact that we (you?) need to continuously try to convince ourselves that we are capable of taking care of ourselves and blahblah tells something about our level of this capability?
    I don't know about you guys, but I sure as hell am not able to take care of myself when it comes to practical stuff. The last time I had a dual save me was five minutes ago when I realised this weekend is a public holiday and there is no public transport to the airport (that's over 15km away) before my flight leaves early in the morning. I don't really know anyone from this city that could've helped me and coud in no way have afforded a taxi, but she promised to figure something out and, well, I have a lift now. She also arranged accommodation & food for me for this night (the shops are also closed), my original plan was to find a park and sleep under a tree.. And this is by no means a single occasion, similar things happen to me almost weekly..

    One explanation could be that I lack life experience and dualisation, and that older infjs are less helpless.. At least I really want to believe they are.
    Last edited by willekeurig; 06-22-2012 at 08:34 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by 1981slater View Post
    Axis of Evil: Iran, Iraq, North Korea and Agarina
    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa Darmandzhyan
    Agarina does not like human beings; she just wants a pretty boy toy.
    Johari Nohari

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    Quote Originally Posted by Agarina View Post
    Don't you think the fact that we (you?) need to continuously try to convince ourselves that we are capable of taking care of ourselves and blahblah tells something about our level of this capability?
    I don't know about you guys, but I sure as hell am not able to take care of myself when it comes to practical stuff. The last time I had a dual save me was five minutes ago when I realised this weekend is a public holiday and there is no public transport to the airport (that's over 15km away) before my flight leaves early in the morning. I don't really know anyone from this city that could've helped me and coud in no way have afforded a taxi, but she promised to figure something out and, well, I have a lift now. She also arranged accommodation & food for me for this night (the shops are also closed), my original plan was to find a park and sleep under a tree.. And this is by no means a single occasion, similar things happen to me almost weekly..

    One explanation could be that I lack both, life experience and dualisation, and that older infjs are less helpless.. At least I really want to believe they are.
    obviously i don't know you, but i get the impression you're in a period of life where you're just comfortable kind of floating around and not really worrying about practical concerns. i seriously doubt you're incapable. if you were put in a situation tomorrow where you absolutely had to settle down with a stable job and living arrangements and everything i'm totally sure you could pull it off. it's just a matter of prioritization. i'm sorry if this comes of belittling of how you feel, i don't intend for that, its just that i think sometimes people in general don't know what they can do until they have to.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Agarina View Post
    my original plan was to find a park and sleep under a tree
    seriously?

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    Quote Originally Posted by lungs View Post
    obviously i don't know you, but i get the impression you're in a period of life where you're just comfortable kind of floating around and not really worrying about practical concerns.i seriously doubt you're incapable. if you were put in a situation tomorrow where you absolutely had to settle down with a stable job and living arrangements and everything i'm totally sure you could pull it off. it's just a matter of prioritization. i'm sorry if this comes of belittling of how you feel, i don't intend for that, its just that i think sometimes people in general don't know what they can do until they have to.
    I'm comfortable doing this just now because I'm still very young and it's considered cool/normal by most (so people don't mind helping me out), but the thought that in a few years pretty much everyone else will have settled down really keeps me up at night. I find it hard to believe I'd ever get a degree (I could barely finish high school) or manage to keep a job for more than a few moths maybe (I've gotten fired from every job I've ever had), be in a relationship, take care of an apartment, car, money etc..
    I don't know how much of this is socionics related tho, sounds more like an enneagram 4 thing to me..? A lot of EIIs I know seem to do just fine, especially E1s.
    Quote Originally Posted by 1981slater View Post
    Axis of Evil: Iran, Iraq, North Korea and Agarina
    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa Darmandzhyan
    Agarina does not like human beings; she just wants a pretty boy toy.
    Johari Nohari

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    Quote Originally Posted by jennifer View Post
    seriously?
    Yup. This is a relatively safe country and I think especially some secluded parks in suburb areas would've been just fine. The sun doesn't even set here this time of the year so I see no problem other than cold and the morning dew.
    Quote Originally Posted by 1981slater View Post
    Axis of Evil: Iran, Iraq, North Korea and Agarina
    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa Darmandzhyan
    Agarina does not like human beings; she just wants a pretty boy toy.
    Johari Nohari

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    ok then.down here you can't help being paranoid about that stuff.

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    When I read this I kind of miss this time of my life when I could sleep under a tree. I'm still completeley unsettled as for my age and I'm sometimes really ashamed of that. On one hand I'm really trying hard to do something about it, but there's one part of me that doesn't want to settle down. I really love freedom, I quess that's one of the most important values to me in my life.
    It's so weird. I'm 28 now and I sometimes wish I had a husband and a baby and everything was smooth and safe and good... but there's a part of me which really wants to get to know the life, to travel somewhere, live with indigenous people, learn new things, rebel etc.
    And there's a part of me who's afraid to do that.
    I just don't get it.

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    That song "I want candy" should be renamed to "I want EIIs", some of them, that is.

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    both sides, now wacey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lungs View Post
    obviously i don't know you, but i get the impression you're in a period of life where you're just comfortable kind of floating around and not really worrying about practical concerns. i seriously doubt you're incapable. if you were put in a situation tomorrow where you absolutely had to settle down with a stable job and living arrangements and everything i'm totally sure you could pull it off. it's just a matter of prioritization. i'm sorry if this comes of belittling of how you feel, i don't intend for that, its just that i think sometimes people in general don't know what they can do until they have to.
    I own a house. I own three huskies, I was going to university. I live in northern British Columbia . Not even remotly sure what you are talking about. The only thing I worry about in life is practical affairs. My whole point was no one is coming to save us. We have to do for ouselves. If that means taking out the trash, mowing the lawn, changing the vehicle oil, completeing a work assingment, orginizing the basement, planning dinner, MAKING dinner, all the other stuff of life, or planning ones finances: then do it yourself! Who else will? This is where the duality idea has become twisted imo.

    A "Dual" is facets of your phsyce projected into another human body-mind organism. Your dual is your placement of information elements personified in the body of another human being. That person may not even like you. As an EII, ones life may be in such a shambles that an LSE would take one look at you and your life and walk away. So don't wait EII, get out and get something. I am speaking from experince.
    Last edited by wacey; 06-25-2012 at 09:25 PM. Reason: Comperhensibility (sp)

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    Quote Originally Posted by WaceysShoulder View Post
    We do not need saving.
    We do not need someone to take care of us.
    We can make a living ourselves.
    We are kind and extremely understanding of people and human nature in general, just how our psyches operate.
    We do not require a dual to be happy - that is the old superstition of needing someone else (who is perfect omg - sarcasm) so that we can be happy, cast in a new light of"duality".
    We are smart, we are perfectly capable of "doing for ourselves".
    We like action, once motivated, get the hell out of our way, nothing stops us from reaching our goals (we even do it without stepping on your toes!).
    We are likable, and even if you do not like us, we understand that too.
    We are serious, but do not need to "dump" our problems on others, we handle things by ourselves and a small choosen few (if you are one of the choosen that gets to see that private inner world, respect it! If not, you will never see it again, ever).
    We are perfectly capable, thank-you very much.
    We are something different for each person we know - because we are adabtable.

    So wake up EII's, you want something, go and get it, do not wait for anything or anyone!
    You know how unique you are.
    I do everything except take care of the organization

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryene Astraelis View Post
    On a more serious note: Wacey, I get that you're trying to be inspiring and motivational, and you mean well. However, I don't get the impression that most of the EIIs here have the views you're telling us to shed. Do we get stereotyped as such? Sure, but you'll find threads scattered around the forum where we talk about how we don't fit those stereotypes.
    Thank-you for enlightening me. I was refering to the "chores" thread, and the underlying idea that a dual will save you from the mountain of worldy cares. No one is coming to save us.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aquagraph View Post
    Umm, sorry, no.

    You're nice and all though.
    No what?

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    Quote Originally Posted by WaceysShoulder View Post
    I own a house. I own three huskies, I go to university. I live in Northern British Columbia. Not even remotly sure what you are talking about.
    Oops, I'm such an ass. You where referring to someone elses post. I am really sorry about that. I speed read too much in life. Jokes, not quotes.

    Yes, I sincerly belive EII need encouragement. I know I do, of course I do. And if we all have faith that socio-types are indeed real, then why not reiterated how great our personality "type" is. So think of what I posted as a manifesto. First mahatma ghandi, then Obama said "We are the ones we've been waiting for".

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    Wacey, I get that you're trying to pass on some hope, strength and encouragement as the model of your idealism; it's inspiring.

    I relate completely and it's nice (oh God, my judgement...sorry ).

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    If a random person would come to me and tell me that I'm not weak, but very strong in my own way, I might start to question whether I actually have some visible weak sides since that person had to tell me otherwise to console me.

    Somebody said something similar itt.
    “I tell you, freedom and human rights in America are doomed. The U.S. government will lead the American people in — and the West in general — into an unbearable hell and a choking life. - Osama bin Laden

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    Quote Originally Posted by WaceysShoulder View Post
    I own three huskies
    I own two huskies Is it type related ?

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    Dog ownership isn't type related

    If I could, I would own an army of dogs, all different breeds.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aquagraph View Post
    If a random person would come to me and tell me that I'm not weak, but very strong in my own way, I might start to question whether I actually have some visible weak sides since that person had to tell me otherwise to console me.

    Somebody said something similar itt.
    Or, you could just take what they said at face value and say "yes that's true for me"....or, "no that is not true for me", and then watch your own reaction to either thought. How do you react when you think the thought: "Maybe they think I have some kind of weakness and cannot do things for myself, and that is why they are offering encouragment?" Then ask, 'is it true they are thinking I have a weakness"? Does it feel stressfull? (Stress defined as any feeling/ emotion that argues with reality) Put another way, is it comfortable to believe that person thinks you are weak? No. It is not. And that person might not have even be intending to be judging your inabilities. I certainly was not. I can only judge myself. But only always. We all have visible weak sides. Kind people know this, because they know their own weaknesses.

    Anyways, maybe I was just consoling myself. I was feeling particularily motivated at that moment in time of the first post. I apologise if others were "offended" by the positive affirmation. All good in this neighborhood.

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    Quote Originally Posted by WaceysShoulder View Post
    We do not need saving.
    We do not need someone to take care of us.
    We can make a living ourselves.
    We are kind and extremely understanding of people and human nature in general, just how our psyches operate.
    We do not require a dual to be happy - that is the old superstition of needing someone else (who is perfect omg - sarcasm) so that we can be happy, cast in a new light of"duality".
    We are smart, we are perfectly capable of "doing for ourselves".
    We like action, once motivated, get the hell out of our way, nothing stops us from reaching our goals (we even do it without stepping on your toes!).
    We are likable, and even if you do not like us, we understand that too.
    We are serious, but do not need to "dump" our problems on others, we handle things by ourselves and a small choosen few (if you are one of the choosen that gets to see that private inner world, respect it! If not, you will never see it again, ever).
    We are perfectly capable, thank-you very much.
    We are something different for each person we know - because we are adabtable.

    So wake up EII's, you want something, go and get it, do not wait for anything or anyone!
    You know how unique you are.
    Thanks Wacey! This is a nice little pep talk for us IEE's!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eliza Thomason View Post
    Thanks Wacey! This is a nice little pep talk for us IEE's!
    that's for EIIs

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    @Radio: Ignore Wacey. You don't have to stay awake.

    ESTj
    1w2 sp/so 1-2-6
    Brilliand's Younger Sister
    Squishy's Older Sister

    Johari Nohari

    Quote Originally Posted by Ritella View Post
    Over here, we'll put up with (almost) all of your crap. You just have to use the secret phrase: "I don't value it. It's related to <insert random element here>, which is not in my quadra."
    Quote Originally Posted by Aquagraph View Post
    Abbie is so boring and rigid it's awesome instead of boring and rigid. She seems so practical and down-to-the-ground.

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    ^

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa Darmandzhyan View Post
    that's for EIIs
    LOL, Yes. It sounded like it was for me!

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    Quote Originally Posted by WaceysShoulder View Post
    We do not need saving.
    We do not need someone to take care of us.
    We can make a living ourselves.
    We are kind and extremely understanding of people and human nature in general, just how our psyches operate.
    We do not require a dual to be happy - that is the old superstition of needing someone else (who is perfect omg - sarcasm) so that we can be happy, cast in a new light of"duality".
    We are smart, we are perfectly capable of "doing for ourselves".
    We like action, once motivated, get the hell out of our way, nothing stops us from reaching our goals (we even do it without stepping on your toes!).
    We are likable, and even if you do not like us, we understand that too.
    We are serious, but do not need to "dump" our problems on others, we handle things by ourselves and a small choosen few (if you are one of the choosen that gets to see that private inner world, respect it! If not, you will never see it again, ever).
    We are perfectly capable, thank-you very much.
    We are something different for each person we know - because we are adabtable.

    So wake up EII's, you want something, go and get it, do not wait for anything or anyone!
    You know how unique you are.
    *genuine concern* Whats wrong hommie? Someone upset you?
    Easy Day

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    Quote Originally Posted by WaceysShoulder View Post
    So wake up EII's, you want something, go and get it, do not wait for anything or anyone!
    But I thought I had to be the change I want to see in the world D: Apparently I was supposed to go and get it. I wasted all my time for nothing!

    EDIT: Ok, that was a joke >.< But really it just doesn't make me happy to live for myself.

    By the way, who is this "we" you keep talking about? Just, people in general?
    All the good are friends of one another. (Zeno of Citium)
    EII (INFj) - 9w1 - INFP - Scorpio - Hufflepuff
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  33. #33
    both sides, now wacey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Taknamay View Post
    But I thought I had to be the change I want to see in the world D: Apparently I was supposed to go and get it. I wasted all my time for nothing!

    EDIT: Ok, that was a joke >.< But really it just doesn't make me happy to live for myself.

    By the way, who is this "we" you keep talking about? Just, people in general?

    Anyone who lives for others, in a complete way, is somewhat dilisuional. Living for one's own business is extremely healthy. I can say this with an authority because of the following reasons.

    I worked my ass off to pull my life out of dibilitating poverty, you try living for others when your back is breaking and your fingers ach and you know that your constiution isn't made of rock. You live for others when you loose your vehicle in a car accident, then work a full-time job, and a part-time job as well, all while keeping encouraged enough to put yourself through school. Live for others when you are saving up for a mortgage so you can own your own home. Live for others when you try to garner financing for your own vehicle because talking the buss is NOT always practical, and lets face it, riding the bus sucks. Live for others when you build your own house with your partner, with your own hands and haul in your own water because you do have your own well yet. Live for others when its minus 30 degree C. and you have to start you truck and plow your driveway 4:30 in the morning to be at work at 6:00am. Live for other people when you are taking one of your dogs to the vetrinarian and paying the exorborent vet bills. Live for others when you are preparing your own helathy meals because you are trying to take care of your own body. Live for others when illness and physical pain sweep through your life and make you worry for your won wellbeing. Live for others when your mind wakes you at four in the moring with that special kind of fear and dread that you know is the most twisted part of your personality telling you that you are not doing enough with your time.

    Live for others you say? I say to you, the most "selfless" people are often the most selfish. I would rather let people alone, and try to impove my own lifes situation.

    I lived for others too, as a Paramedic, and a crisis line volunteer, as well as a youth worker in a gay youth group and through groups in the YMCA. Living for others is exhausting. I say, leave the world how it is. And wake up to your own world. Does that mean ignore others who cross your path needing help? Of course not. By all means help in your own way. Because it feels good to do so, and others are in different places on their paths. But remember, beleiving someone or something is going to "save" you from the work is naive. You have to do the work yourself.

    Yes I was talking to EII's. The ones who are adults and have moved away and have known the special kind of pain of wanting something better, and knowing that shit is not just given to you, you have to work for it. I am painfully aware of my own shortcomings, and feel other people whose psyces follow an EII pattern feel the same way about themselves sometimes too.

    To abbie. Thanks for saying ignore me, personally, and not the message I wrote. Coming onto the 16 types after a month in camp and seeing what you wrote has confused me. I actually regrett this whole post, because what I meant to espouse was the philosophy of "rise above" your life. But I really feel that by writing in response to some of the responses posted here has had the effect of simply bringing me down.

    Things are great right now though. Just keep encouraged everyone. Helen Kellers says turn your face to the sun. Do it today, literally stand in the sun.

  34. #34
    both sides, now wacey's Avatar
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    wow, just read that from yesterday. glad I got that outta my system. socionics from now on. and I will take my own medicine and leave the EII's alone.

  35. #35
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    Wake up EIIs, WaceysShoulder is leaving you alone. Sound the alarm or something.

  36. #36
    Éminence grise mikemex's Avatar
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    Well I'm not EII but I also share this pessimistic view in which I'll end up homeless and die from hunger and cold in a dark alley.
    [] | NP | 3[6w5]8 so/sp | Type thread | My typing of forum members | Johari (Strengths) | Nohari (Weaknesses)

    You know what? You're an individual, and that makes people nervous. And it's gonna keep making people nervous for the rest of your life.
    - Ole Golly from Harriet, the spy.

  37. #37
    Haikus Beautiful sky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikemex View Post
    Well I'm not EII but I also share this pessimistic view in which I'll end up homeless and die from hunger and cold in a dark alley.

    I think that very sentiment can be shared by many people regarless of type. I can understand Negativist types who prepare and greatly consider such circumstances before hand. I don't worry about being in that condition too much because I know I have a network of very loving friends and family who will take me in and I know I will take them in in a heat beat also. So, our homes are with each other, always.

  38. #38
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    Survival is related to being able to produce. It's not wise to depend on others for that.

  39. #39
    Haikus Beautiful sky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wacey View Post
    Anyone who lives for others, in a complete way, is somewhat dilisuional. Living for one's own business is extremely healthy. I can say this with an authority because of the following reasons.

    I worked my ass off to pull my life out of dibilitating poverty, you try living for others when your back is breaking and your fingers ach and you know that your constiution isn't made of rock. You live for others when you loose your vehicle in a car accident, then work a full-time job, and a part-time job as well, all while keeping encouraged enough to put yourself through school. Live for others when you are saving up for a mortgage so you can own your own home. Live for others when you try to garner financing for your own vehicle because talking the buss is NOT always practical, and lets face it, riding the bus sucks. Live for others when you build your own house with your partner, with your own hands and haul in your own water because you do have your own well yet. Live for others when its minus 30 degree C. and you have to start you truck and plow your driveway 4:30 in the morning to be at work at 6:00am. Live for other people when you are taking one of your dogs to the vetrinarian and paying the exorborent vet bills. Live for others when you are preparing your own helathy meals because you are trying to take care of your own body. Live for others when illness and physical pain sweep through your life and make you worry for your won wellbeing. Live for others when your mind wakes you at four in the moring with that special kind of fear and dread that you know is the most twisted part of your personality telling you that you are not doing enough with your time.

    Live for others you say? I say to you, the most "selfless" people are often the most selfish. I would rather let people alone, and try to impove my own lifes situation.

    I lived for others too, as a Paramedic, and a crisis line volunteer, as well as a youth worker in a gay youth group and through groups in the YMCA. Living for others is exhausting. I say, leave the world how it is. And wake up to your own world. Does that mean ignore others who cross your path needing help? Of course not. By all means help in your own way. Because it feels good to do so, and others are in different places on their paths. But remember, beleiving someone or something is going to "save" you from the work is naive. You have to do the work yourself.

    Yes I was talking to EII's. The ones who are adults and have moved away and have known the special kind of pain of wanting something better, and knowing that shit is not just given to you, you have to work for it. I am painfully aware of my own shortcomings, and feel other people whose psyces follow an EII pattern feel the same way about themselves sometimes too.

    To abbie. Thanks for saying ignore me, personally, and not the message I wrote. Coming onto the 16 types after a month in camp and seeing what you wrote has confused me. I actually regrett this whole post, because what I meant to espouse was the philosophy of "rise above" your life. But I really feel that by writing in response to some of the responses posted here has had the effect of simply bringing me down.

    Things are great right now though. Just keep encouraged everyone. Helen Kellers says turn your face to the sun. Do it today, literally stand in the sun.
    What type are you Wacey?

  40. #40
    Creepy-pokeball

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    Quote Originally Posted by Wacey View Post
    We do not need saving.
    We do not need someone to take care of us.
    We can make a living ourselves.
    We are kind and extremely understanding of people and human nature in general, just how our psyches operate.
    We do not require a dual to be happy - that is the old superstition of needing someone else (who is perfect omg - sarcasm) so that we can be happy, cast in a new light of"duality".
    We are smart, we are perfectly capable of "doing for ourselves".
    We like action, once motivated, get the hell out of our way, nothing stops us from reaching our goals (we even do it without stepping on your toes!).
    We are likable, and even if you do not like us, we understand that too.
    We are serious, but do not need to "dump" our problems on others, we handle things by ourselves and a small choosen few (if you are one of the choosen that gets to see that private inner world, respect it! If not, you will never see it again, ever).
    We are perfectly capable, thank-you very much.
    We are something different for each person we know - because we are adabtable.

    So wake up EII's, you want something, go and get it, do not wait for anything or anyone!
    You know how unique you are.
    Hey baby, wanna dualize?

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