Purpose in society

[Hays]

...

[Suz]

I think this is a really interesting topic, thanks for bringing it up! i feel like there is definitely truth to this. i definitely agree with you about the mother, father, student, ideas person, etc thing you said, and i'll go even further and say that i suspect this concept functions on a deeper level than, say, somebody's chosen profession or job. IME people in any one profession can be of any type, but bringing different strengths to the table, and different emphases in their practice of that particular job/profession.

[Galen]

Same w/ @Ashton. Whatever "role" I fulfill within society is merely a coincidence based off of what I personally want to achieve in the first place.

[Creepy-Snaps]

Interesting topic, Shayley. I know there are 'common social roles' already posted on Wikisocion, and I feel the need to post them for reference as this topic develops further:

ILE:

The debater who will argue about anything with anyone.
The career guru who is constantly building his already lengthy resume through the planned acquisition of relevant experience.
The clown who is always being silly and frivolous.
The outgoing nerd who makes jokes about things like parabolas, loves gadgets and wears things like fisherman's vests to work and to parties because all the pockets are convenient for holding stuff.

SEI:

The person who always lightens things up, smooths the rough edges and sharp words of group communication and discussion, making people laugh, relax, and take things less seriously.
The lazy hedonist with a short attention span who loves to consume movies, music, shows, food, and drink and sees no reason to strain himself in life.
The aesthetic connoisseur who demonstrates incredible taste in art, in cuisine, or in fashion and lives for aesthetic pleasure.

ESE:

The social organizer who is always getting everyone together to do fun things and is so enthusiastic about everything that it's embarrassing.
The doting grandmother or aunt who is always ready to spoil the kids with some food.
The arbiter of fun who has a highly developed sense of what is (objectively) enjoyable and is willing to force it down people's throats if need be (because who doesn't like fun?).

LII:

The lone repository of truth — the last stalwart in a crazy world of illogic and delusion.
The self-sacrificing workaholic who works hard, not in order to earn money, but because he doesn't want to give anything less than 100%.
Mr. or Ms. Literal, who says exactly what (s)he means, and trusts that you will too.
The book worm who spends every moment of every day reading.
The smart aleck who never lets authorities tell him what to think and always finds a way to get the last word.
The specialist who devotes every waking moment to excelling in an extremely narrow but highly competitive technical field.

EIE:

The exalted prophet who is constantly telling people about what will happen or is happening unnoticebly and driving home how wonderful or how awful that is.
The true servant of the arts who has lost himself or herself in artistic expression and is ever an artist/poet/actor/musician, no matter where he is or whom he is with.
The player or yuppie who rises to the top in corporations where "walking the walk" and "talking the talk" is most prized, especially by optimizing the impression of his performance.
The hypochondriac who is constantly ill with some strange and menacing illness that cannot be seen.
The motivational speaker who uses his personal charisma to get people fired up about the things that really matter.

LSI:

The policeman or referee who keeps a sharp eye on how well people are adhering to the rules and takes it upon himself to correct or punish deviants.
The career bureaucrat or administrator who rises through the ranks of traditional administrative structures (government organs, large corporations, and other large, hierarchical structures), carefully performing his duties and winning in the long run.
The rational artist who sees music, film, or visual art as a language to be deciphered.
The cult devotee who is swayed by the rhetoric of visionaries, and becomes devoted to executing their plans.
The logistics analyst who rigorously but realistically devises the optimal operating procedure for any given task.

SLE:

The alpha male (or female) who is constantly preoccupied with his territory and social status, threats to that territory, and making sure everyone recognizes his leadership and status.
The challenger or revolutionary who rejects existing authority and organizational structures and tries to overturn them and establish his own system, or simply overturn them for fun without putting anything else in their place.
The rogue artist who revels in his or her own naughtiness, likes to shock and appall audiences, and doesn't take his own work too seriously.

IEI:

The poet who becomes enamored of expressing his idiosyncratic vision of life, taking no interest in the quotidian affairs of man.
The survivor who, by maintaining good relations with all factions simultaneously, always survives political or corporate upheavals.
The good-natured tag-along who likes to be attached to groups and provides constant comic relief.

SEE:

The player who is always busy conquering people of the opposite sex and bragging of his or her social and sexual prowess.
The aggressive trainer who likes to whip people into shape physically or socially and make them be more effective in society.

ILI:

The computer geek who lives in virtual reality and understands computers and Internet communication, but lacks experience in real-life social situations.
The mystic or spiritual philosopher who is into all things mystical, esoteric, or eastern and makes little sense to the material-minded.
The encyclopedist or librarian type who knows literally all there is to know about vast areas of knowledge, but does not use his or her knowledge at work.
The office introvert who will not let a sentence mean anything but what was technically said, and doesn't care about how uncomfortable he is making his co-workers.

LIE:

The entrepreneur or speculator who is constantly thinking of how to turn everything into money, yet continues to count pennies and make sacrifices even after he or she has become wealthy.
The job-hopper or independent contractor who is constantly changing jobs or locations in order to progress or out of a fear of stagnation, to the sacrifice of his personal life, which will be settled "some day".
The maverick politician or activist who defends positions politically unpalatable to the conventional wisdom of the time, either rising to power when his positions are later seen as correct, or remaining a niche politician with a limited number of followers.
The know-it-all windbag who has lots of information about many subjects, and helpfully or annoyingly is always ready to share it with those around him, equally ready to correct the erroneous remarks made by anyone else, always with pitiless courtesy.

ESI:

The moralist who is quick to judge people for good and bad behavior, finds fault easily, and punishes just as easily.
The devoted worker who quietly and unfailingly fulfills his or her duty and expects the same from others.
The sentimental yet tenacious achiever who has a very strong motivation to achieve a specific prestigious career goal, yet has a great deal of interpersonal sensitivity and often insecurity.

LSE:

The social protestor who campaigns against deceit, mismanagement, injustice, or disorder in society, without necessarily offering a clear solution.
The busy worker bee who spends considerable effort on the quotidian details of work, while neglecting the "big picture".

EII:

The person who is always exemplary and perfect in all he or she does, but is far more focused on achieving his internal ideal of perfection than achieving more concrete goals in life.
The self-sacrificing martyr who hasn't found protection and refuge in life, and becomes the servant of a failing and hopeless cause.

IEE:

The self-appointed psychologist who shows interest in everyone's personal, relationship, and career problems in order to figure out what might be the matter and offer pertinent advice.
The social connector who knows lots of people in completely different areas of life and is constantly trying to hook people up with others who share their interests.
The nonpartisan who knows that everybody can be right, and likes to explain people's differing points of view to each other without taking sides.

SLI:

The quiet individualist who marches to his or her own drumbeat, cultivating eccentric, yet enjoyable interests and pretty much ignoring everything else.
Mr. or Mrs. down-to-earth, who takes a dry and simple attitude towards everything, deflating all excitement and elevated emotions and sentiments.

[JWC3]

I'm pretty sure the SEE purpose is to be awesome, or to dye trying so as to serve as the harbinger of doom for others who want to be awesome and so instead do something more productive.

[Galen]

The self-appointed psychologist who shows interest in everyone's personal, relationship, and career problems in order to figure out what might be the matter and offer pertinent advice.

Well I wouldn't say I'm interested in "everybody's" personal life, but yeah I love to play the personal psychologist lol. Dicking around with brains ftw

The social connector who knows lots of people in completely different areas of life and is constantly trying to hook people up with others who share their interests.

That would require me knowing people

The nonpartisan who knows that everybody can be right, and likes to explain people's differing points of view to each other without taking sides.

I dunno if I'd say everybody can be "right" per se, but I do like to clear up instances of interpersonal misunderstanding.

[Creepy-male]

I'm a useless human being that if I died today no one would care -- thats the role I fill in society to the vast majority of people, if I said anything different I'd think myself as being overly arrogant.

I have a better time at this point in life seeing my potential in what roles I could fill versus what roles I do fill, unfortunately. The good news is I'm not dead yet so I can still find a way to elevate my status from "useless human being".

I'm extremely cynical about status in society anyways... everyone bends over backwards to project some kind of status to others they want them to acknowledge.... LOOK AT ME I DO THIS!!!!!!! GAHHH!!!!!!!!!! THIS IS MY ROLE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I AM THIS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ACKNOWLEDGE IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!! GAH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

confidence games...... acknowledge my role and it will be so! I'm the best because you all believe it... LOOK AT ME I AM TONY ROBBINS...... My role is to sell you my role and therefore become that role so that I may then teach you to become this role which you will never become because you are too busy buying my role to be it... nahhhh nahhh nahhhhhhhhhhhhh.

Yep quite a problem to break through from for me.

[tcaudilllg]

The Role function is called what it is for a reason. The base function is a workhorse to serve this function. Honestly, when the role function is nearing an ideal state, a person won't know what to do with themselves until they perceive the function's state as no longer ideal.

[Radio]

 

"Imagine a puddle waking up one morning and thinking, " This is an interesting world I find myself in — an interesting hole I find myself in — fits me rather neatly, doesn't it? In fact it fits me staggeringly well, must have been made to have me in it!" This is such a powerful idea that as the sun rises in the sky and the air heats up and as, gradually, the puddle gets smaller and smaller, it's still frantically hanging on to the notion that everything's going to be alright, because this world was meant to have him in it, was built to have him in it; so the moment he disappears catches him rather by surprise."

[Aquagraph]

ILE: to bring humanity this

[Hot Scalding Gayser]

I'm a useless human being that if I died today no one would care --

Oh come on. If you died I would totally care. I'm not sure it would make me not lazy enough to go to the funeral, but I'd care! I love a lot of your quips, granted, most of which only fuel my narcissism, but it's good to be a giver!

[anndelise]

In a tribal/village environment, I would likely be the type of person being accused of causing trouble because I'd be trying to help myself and others break out of the status quo. Women aren't allowed to touch weapons? Oh yeah? *touch* or...make my own, nya nya nya.

I would also likely place myself in the position of being a protector for the down-trodden of the tribe.

I'd also be wanting to try out everyone's jobs/tasks, and then helping with connecting people with the jobs/tasks or sub-society's they wanted or were good at.

I would also most definitely be a village gossip. (except that things told in complete secrecy would more likely be kept secret....because if I blabbed it, I wouldn't be trusted with the sweetest bits!!)

I would also want to tag along with the traveling salesman or other traveling groups. Those who travel between tribes, pick up stories, news, and discoveries from other tribes and pass it along. Omg that would be a friggin blast!!

Unfortunately, these activities would also mean that I'd likely get into trouble with my tribe for being a rather unproductive member. My best bet for survival would be the traveling storyteller thing.

----

In a medieval type society, I'd probably be a wandering bard/storyteller type, or a barmaid. Again with the story/gossip access.

----
In current society, I tend to take on similar roles.

[Suz]

I simply saw the OP topic as "each type brings a different emphasis to the table" in any setting. It doesn't have to be about what role one is playing in the vast world society. A society on a less macroscopic scale can be your friends & acquaintances, your work group, the company you work for, etc. Those are still societies.

[anndelise]

I simply saw the OP topic as "each type brings a different emphasis to the table" in any setting. It doesn't have to be about what role one is playing in the vast world society. A society on a less macroscopic scale can be your friends & acquaintances, your work group, the company you work for, etc. Those are still societies.

What was this post directed at? Or rather, what was it in response to?

[Gilly]

Dude those LSE ones are horrible

I smell niffweed's handiwork

[Suz]

What was this post directed at? Or rather, what was it in response to?

oh sorry... it was directed at multiple people's posts referring to types' role in (a big nebulous) society and how difficult it is to really pinpoint that.
That's why i didn't quote anyone in particular.

Your post was actually closer to what i had in mind, so i didn't mean to imply that i was contesting you.. sorry if it came across that way..

[Suz]

Dude those LSE ones are horrible

I smell niffweed's handiwork

Yeah a bunch of them seemed a bit iffy to me. The alpha ones seemed ok though...

[Gilly]

Yeah a bunch of them seemed a bit iffy to me. The alpha ones seemed ok though...

ehhhhh, some of the LII ones sound more like LSI; the ILE ones are pretty good though.

@ the ESE one, what the fuck is "objectively" enjoyable? Maybe "universally" would be better. SEI ones aren't bad but not exceptional.

[munenori2]

I am the Batman.

[aixelsyd]

My legacy is probably related to art, social commentary, activism, something involving leadership, or else going insane and committing mass homicide. Time will tell. Though, at the moment, I'm thinking my role in society is to promote ridiculous shit.

[Creepy-male]

Oh come on. If you died I would totally care. I'm not sure it would make me not lazy enough to go to the funeral, but I'd care! I love a lot of your quips, granted, most of which only fuel my narcissism, but it's good to be a giver!

That's sad to hear HaveLucidDreamz as I hope someone would care when your time to die comes around. Though I have those thoughts of no-one really caring also and I often think of myself as a failure in this world.

I don't think it's arrogant in this thread to say what roles you play or have played in life and I don't really see these roles linked to status. For in the end we are all playing little ant like roles anyway.

Lol I didn't mean that serious, I am just attempting to think realistically what role I fill currently.

I think what role I would fill if I had a healthy relationship with society at large would be as a professor or as an inventor of some sorts. This I think is rather in line with an LII or ILE. Other roles I could also see myself filling, but I think those roles are the most telling of Ne and Ti.

Someone mentioned medieval society I think the roles I'd fill in that setting would either be a davinci/gallelio like artisan/inventor/scholar or an ascetic philosopher/king -- those two are probably the most I'd relate to.

In simple social settings, I usually do a good job at throwing out mind stimulating conversation... though sometimes I find it can be hard to engage random people in social settings because the conversation is a little flat and won't really go anywhere stimulating and it just becomes a sort of "shoot the shit" kind of thing. In social setting with activities if I have more mastery at the activity I usually try to teach and if I have less mastery I usually focus on learning as fast as possible. Idk there isn't much else to do with people other than activities and conversation.

[ClownsandEntropy]

I kind of like the LII descriptions, although it's interesting to compare the LII and ILI ones - they seem much more similar than any other quasi-identities.

LII:
The lone repository of truth — the last stalwart in a crazy world of illogic and delusion.
The self-sacrificing workaholic who works hard, not in order to earn money, but because he doesn't want to give anything less than 100%.
Mr. or Ms. Literal, who says exactly what (s)he means, and trusts that you will too.
The book worm who spends every moment of every day reading.
The smart aleck who never lets authorities tell him what to think and always finds a way to get the last word.
The specialist who devotes every waking moment to excelling in an extremely narrow but highly competitive technical field.

ILI:

The computer geek who lives in virtual reality and understands computers and Internet communication, but lacks experience in real-life social situations.
The mystic or spiritual philosopher who is into all things mystical, esoteric, or eastern and makes little sense to the material-minded.
The encyclopedist or librarian type who knows literally all there is to know about vast areas of knowledge, but does not use his or her knowledge at work.
The office introvert who will not let a sentence mean anything but what was technically said, and doesn't care about how uncomfortable he is making his co-workers.

Perhaps they're somewhat more based around how types see themselves, and what roles they believe they fill. Which probably then affects how they act and what they expect of themselves, which then affects what roles their fill, I guess.

Also, the alpha ones seem a lot more generous (i.e. forgiving i.e. alpha's are displayed more positively) than the non-alpha ones

[Beautiful sky]

My purpose in society is to remind people of humanity. I look at people across race and religious lines, across cast and class lines and see how people should be treated in actuality.

[Aquagraph]

My purpose in society is to remind people of humanity. I look at people across race and religious lines, across cast and class lines and see how people should be treated in actuality.

But you don't look them across your lack of cultural/moral relativism.

[Beautiful sky]

But you don't look them across your lack of cultural/moral relativism.

I'm not judging people by the terms of their culture but an absolute, you're correct.

[Aquagraph]

I'm not judging people by the terms of their culture but an absolute, you're correct.

No offence but your kind is the reason why world sucks ime.
Do you use the Bible as a measuring stick or the primal disgust you feel when you hear about something being not nice?

[anndelise]

No offence but your kind is the reason why world sucks ime.
Do you use the Bible as a measuring stick or the primal disgust you feel when you hear about something being not nice?

Yesterday I watched a not-so-greatly-made movie called Sirens. It was about a painter who used nude models in lustful scenarios...he showed women enjoying and desring sensuality. The church sent a 'liberal' preacher to convince the painter to tone his work down. During the movie, as the preacher is arguing with the painter, the preacher's wife is becoming more daring in her desire to observe the models, and learn how to be more sensual and enjoy her body. The preacher catches her, and gets kinda pissy. In the end, though, he gains benefits of his wife's newfound desires.

Anyways, the painter reminded me of you. He encouraged the models to accept themselves, and they in turn caused chaos in the very uptight..er..upright..town. It was kind of like the devil and his handmaidens, lol. I can see you playing that kind of role in a town...while being at odds with the small-town religious fanatics judging every move you make and them bitching about how you are ruining their town (certainly couldn't be their hate-mongering).

Anyways...this interaction in this particular thread topic reminded me of that, heh.

[Aquagraph]

Yesterday I watched a not-so-greatly-made movie called Sirens. It was about a painter who used nude models in lustful scenarios...he showed women enjoying and desring sensuality. The church sent a 'liberal' preacher to convince the painter to tone his work down. During the movie, as the preacher is arguing with the painter, the preacher's wife is becoming more daring in her desire to observe the models, and learn how to be more sensual and enjoy her body. The preacher catches her, and gets kinda pissy. In the end, though, he gains benefits of his wife's newfound desires.

Anyways, the painter reminded me of you. He encouraged the models to accept themselves, and they in turn caused chaos in the very uptight..er..upright..town. It was kind of like the devil and his handmaidens, lol. I can see you playing that kind of role in a town...while being at odds with the small-town religious fanatics judging every move you make and them bitching about how you are ruining their town (certainly couldn't be their hate-mongering).

Anyways...this interaction in this particular thread topic reminded me of that, heh.

Awesome..! That's pretty much how I wanna perceive myself as.

I have the touch of Midas when it comes to opening people up to something that others used to be afraid of and I truly am one of those people your mama warned you about.
But the reason I'm offering you people my share of decadence is not because I'm tainted. It's because you're tainted too. Let us see how.

And this is how I have seen myself as. Very often I'm the one that brings the unexpected side of things to people with lust for novelty and adventure.
This seems to be my purpose in society along with being the person who kills the restrains of the society build by white Christian nuclear families.

[Gilly]

<3 Aqua sometimes I think we are the same person, but I think you are even more of a pure Dionysian.

[PistolShrimp]

I'm a weird hybrid of the SEI/IEI roles from Wikisocion: an introspective, lazy hedonist with good aesthetic taste who likes to be attached to groups and provides constant comic relief.

Generally, I feel like my role is to facilitate introspection; I can't help but ask people questions about who they are and where they're going in life. When I was a photojournalist, my naive vision of my role was that of "waking people up" with my pictures, of getting them to feel something and spurring them to action. Now I view a part of my role as being sort of background support to enacting change in the world, which is why I'm looking for a career as a grant writer for non-profit agencies. They come up with the project ideas to help people, and I try to get the money to help them put those ideas into action. I don't care for the limelight; I just want to help.

[Pa3s]

The quiet individualist who marches to his or her own drumbeat, cultivating eccentric, yet enjoyable interests and pretty much ignoring everything else.

I like this one, because it's more general and doesn't focus on the stereotypical things people have in mind when they think of SLIs. The description fits me well.

[Beautiful sky]

No offence but your kind is the reason why world sucks ime.
Do you use the Bible as a measuring stick or the primal disgust you feel when you hear about something being not nice?

I beg to differ with you. My kind is the reason why the world doesn't suck, with exceptions. The world sucks because of individuals like ******, Stalin,.

I do not use the Bible as a measuring stick; I use philosophies of thought gathered from many places, minds.

[anndelise]

Awesome..! That's pretty much how I wanna perceive myself as.

I have the touch of Midas when it comes to opening people up to something that others used to be afraid of and I truly am one of those people your mama warned you about.
But the reason I'm offering you people my share of decadence is not because I'm tainted. It's because you're tainted too. Let us see how.

And this is how I have seen myself as. Very often I'm the one that brings the unexpected side of things to people with lust for novelty and adventure.
This seems to be my purpose in society along with being the person who kills the restrains of the society build by white Christian nuclear families.

The bolded is pretty much the boiled down version of the painter's argument for his works.

[Aquagraph]

The bolded is pretty much the boiled down version of the painter's argument for his works.

Perfect.

[Absurd]

Hmm, the more time I spend reading some of yous, the more I'm certain you're hot water pumped and heated by a water heater giving some of that heat from the water into the air.

Oh and I'm smart.

[willekeurig]

I feel I'm more of a burden than a help to the Society, financially at least.. but these are the Wikisocion ones I can relate to, especially the bolded parts. Most of them seem to be listed under Alpha or Delta types.

ILE:
The debater who will argue about anything with anyone.
The clown who is always being silly and frivolous.

SEI:
The lazy hedonist with a short attention span who loves to consume movies, music, shows, food, and drink and sees no reason to strain himself in life.

LII:
The smart aleck who never lets authorities tell him what to think and always finds a way to get the last word.

IEI:
The poet who becomes enamored of expressing his idiosyncratic vision of life, taking no interest in the quotidian affairs of man.

LIE:
The job-hopper or independent contractor who is constantly changing jobs or locations in order to progress or out of a fear of stagnation, to the sacrifice of his personal life, which will be settled "some day".

LSE:
The social protestor who campaigns against deceit, mismanagement, injustice, or disorder in society, without necessarily offering a clear solution.

EII:
The person who is always exemplary and perfect in all he or she does, but is far more focused on achieving his internal ideal of perfection than achieving more concrete goals in life.

IEE:
The self-appointed psychologist who shows interest in everyone's personal, relationship, and career problems in order to figure out what might be the matter and offer pertinent advice.
The social connector who knows lots of people in completely different areas of life and is constantly trying to hook people up with others who share their interests.
The nonpartisan who knows that everybody can be right, and likes to explain people's differing points of view to each other without taking sides.

SLI:
The quiet individualist who marches to his or her own drumbeat, cultivating eccentric, yet enjoyable interests and pretty much ignoring everything else.

[Beautiful sky]

I think this is a really interesting topic, thanks for bringing it up! i feel like there is definitely truth to this. i definitely agree with you about the mother, father, student, ideas person, etc thing you said, and i'll go even further and say that i suspect this concept functions on a deeper level than, say, somebody's chosen profession or job. IME people in any one profession can be of any type, but bringing different strengths to the table, and different emphases in their practice of that particular job/profession.

Which social role do you fill and in your own words how do you use this to improve society?

[Aquagraph]

I do not use the Bible as a measuring stick; I use philosophies of thought gathered from many places, minds.

WOULDN'T THAT MAKE YOU A LOGICAL TYPE BESIDES EIIS SHOULD _FEEL_ WHAT'S GOOD AND EVIL SINCE NO ONE ELSE BUT YOU THE ONLY EII IS ABLE

[Beautiful sky]

WOULDN'T THAT MAKE YOU A LOGICAL TYPE BESIDES EIIS SHOULD _FEEL_ WHAT'S GOOD AND EVIL SINCE NO ONE ELSE BUT YOU EIIS ARE ABLE

Just because an EII gathers information from those who know things and then makes up their moral views doesn't mean they are not using Fi.

[Aquagraph]

Just because an EII gathers information from those who know things and then makes up their moral views doesn't mean they are not using Fi.

Sometimes I seriously doubt you even gather information anymore.