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Thread: Quasi-Identical Relations: Stories and Experiences

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    Default Quasi-Identical Relations: Stories and Experiences

    I been starting to think that quasi-identical relationships are the best. Both people will certainly feel awkward, but with open 2 way communication and acting constructively upon that communication, you will become a better person. This is because you are subconsiously expected to play the role of your conflicting partner.

    For example, if you are ENTj, to keep your ENTp partner happy, you have to act like an ISFp. If you are ENTp, to keep your ENTj partner happy, you have to act like an ISFj.

    The important elements in the relationship would be the same as for any other relation - for example communication and patience.

    DISCUSS

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    I been starting to think that quasi-identical relationships are the best. Both people will certainly feel awkward, but with open 2 way communication and acting constructively upon that communication, you will become a better person.
    But what are you supposed to do then, after you have successfully learnt how to act like your conflictor? How will for example your dual react to your new personality? And how do you solve the biggest and most irritating problem in quasi-identical relationships: how to understand you quasi-identical, and how to make him or her understand you?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Phaedrus
    But what are you supposed to do then, after you have successfully learnt how to act like your conflictor? How will for example your dual react to your new personality?
    By acting like your conflictor, you are reaching out to your weaknesses and struggling against them. Duality maintains your weaknesses, quasi indentical relations don't.

    And how do you solve the biggest and most irritating problem in quasi-identical relationships: how to understand you quasi-identical, and how to make him or her understand you?
    Open two way communication.

    In addition, quasi-identical relationships are a blessing in disguise. Your quasi identical partner will not agree with everything you say, and this is very good. They will have an insight that is different to yours, which if you take constructively, can be beneficial to you.

    There is a big down side if people agree with you all the time. Although people agreeing with you makes you feel good, it is not helpful in seeing other perspectives.

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    acting like your conflictor is unhealthy

    quasis are good for training the ability to win and disprove in arguments

    you want it to be the best relation because you want to have a romantic relationship with an INTp. of course I cannot prove this but I don't need to.
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    One thing: the change isn't always mutual. It's usually the percieving partner that will tend to try and accomodate the judging partner, at least from my experience. And one won't necessarily change to act like one's conflictor - in fact, I think more people would tend to act more easily like the activity partner when faced with the quasi-identical.

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    i actually get along rather well with INTjs. my dad is certainly an INTj and although sometimes I get impatient with his inability to figure certain things out and his absurd arguments (like during a political discussion when he starts talking about how abrahamic religions will fall apart as a result of contact with aliens).

    however, on the whole we have a fairly good relationship.


    i have also heard various times that quasi-identicals are much worse for ethical types.

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    My ENFj dad and I fight a bit. He seems very inflexible to me. And he's a bit too into drama for me.

    I would drive my ISTp husband crazy if I acted more like my dad.
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    My own theory is that quasi-identicals may be the best companions when you are under extreme stress; otherwise trying to act like your conflictor will make you stressed.

    My brother is an ENTp and we have - always had - a non-relationship. We have some common interests and can make small talk about them, and even do each other favors, but there is no connection at all.

    I can't imagine how trying to act more like an ISFp would be good for me. I would just be a fraud, a pathetic one at that.
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    My father is also an INTj, and we have a fairly good relationship, even though it is in some ways a non-connecting relationship of the kind Expat describes. He has some irrational, unscientific beliefs (in my opinion), and of course he fits into the subjectivist, relativistic camp in philosophy, but he might be slightly more intelligent than I am, and we can have really stimulating intellectual discussions.

    The thing that frustrates me most is that neither of us seem to be able to understand the other at a deeper level and accept his arguments. The consequence of that, I think, is that two quasi-identicals might experience the other as less intelligent than he or she really is.

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    In my experience, Quasi-Identical relations can provide interesting and productive discussions, but I can't see how QI would be ideal for psychologically-close, long-term relations, especially if it required you to act in a most foreign and uncomfortable manner.

    Duals do not reinforce weaknesses, they cover weaknesses by providing for your weak area in a preferred manner. The PoLR and HA work as a pair. In Herzy's PoLR thread, she pointed out how she uses to compensate for this weakness. That's what happens with the PoLR and HA. To continue with our example: and are not totally distinct functions. Ethics is the base, and it's oriented to introversion or extraversion. Both and deal with the same symbols, but in different manners. For an ExTp, is very uncomfortable; , however, isn't uncomfortable, and achieves the same goal.

    The Role/DS functions go the same way, though (to me at least) the DS function seems more independant of the Role than the HA seems independant of the PoLR.

    So, a dual covers weak functions without causing stress. A QI doesn't deal strongly in your weak areas, and by your theory, cause you to be expected to act in an uncomfortable and unnatural way. Now, why again is QI better than dual?
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    Default Re: Quasi-identical relations are the best relationships?

    Quote Originally Posted by gaypog
    I been starting to think that quasi-identical relationships are the best. Both people will certainly feel awkward, but with open 2 way communication and acting constructively upon that communication, you will become a better person. This is because you are subconsiously expected to play the role of your conflicting partner.

    For example, if you are ENTj, to keep your ENTp partner happy, you have to act like an ISFp. If you are ENTp, to keep your ENTj partner happy, you have to act like an ISFj.

    The important elements in the relationship would be the same as for any other relation - for example communication and patience.

    DISCUSS
    Acting like your conflict partners weakens your psyche, while acting like you dual strengthens it. Acting like your conflict partner really is not the brightest of ideas for obvious reasons.

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    Default Re: Quasi-identical relations are the best relationships?

    Quote Originally Posted by gaypog
    I been starting to think that quasi-identical relationships are the best. Both people will certainly feel awkward, but with open 2 way communication and acting constructively upon that communication, you will become a better person. This is because you are subconsiously expected to play the role of your conflicting partner.

    For example, if you are ENTj, to keep your ENTp partner happy, you have to act like an ISFp. If you are ENTp, to keep your ENTj partner happy, you have to act like an ISFj.

    The important elements in the relationship would be the same as for any other relation - for example communication and patience.

    DISCUSS
    You're wrong, when it comes to my world.


    You think that I, acting like an ESFp, for an female INTp, would work out well? No chance.


    Look, I have learned from my conflicts - and I agree that you can learn things. But when it comes to relationships, I WOULD NOT advise this sort of thinking at all. People don't know how to manage relationships as it is, and having to have some sort of pre-set role like that wouldn't help


    .......that is, speaking in terms how how most "americans" view relationships.

    The bottom line is, people don't know what they are doing. I think for the avarage joe, Socionics or at least MBTI would be good for relationships. But as for my personal situation (in reagards to your positd theroy) and socionics...... no, not at all.


    I would spend too much time having to try to be something I'm not to please someone who I am not initially attracted to.



    However, personal development and progress should not stop or be forgotten about - I do like that aspect of the situation. I do not think that could be best done with a QI relationship, though, at least not in my opinion. Unless it was an INTp dedicated to the ideal in the same way I was, I don't see that working out.

    So perhaps the bottom line is:
    I like your essence, the concept you were going for, in terms of personal development and progress, but I do not think that is a good way to go about it. At least for myself I would not be inclined to excell in that situation. Perhaps it is different for E types.



    Both people will certainly feel awkward, but with open 2 way communication and acting constructively upon that communication, you will become a better person.
    Hell, that's important for any relationship, even a dual relationship.


    This is because you are subconsiously expected to play the role of your conflicting partner.
    One thing I've realized is that no matter how much you try to improve yourself or be completely capable, etc, your still human by default, and as humans there is a 'need', somewhat for others. Our strength is in society, etc.

    Also, I would much rather have someone's strengths compliment my weaknesses naturally. I would be able to have more confidence in my partner if they were inherently a certain way, as opposed to, for instance, an INTp trying to act like an ESFj. I could still make adjustments in how I deal with the situation, but I still don't like the idea.

    Also, as per duality, I feel confident in terms of being with an ESFj about logic and such, where as with an INTp, I would feel more rivaled. And as before, I'd be worried about someone dealing with the ESF parts of the world, because they certainly aren't my inherent inclinations. Also, me trying to emulate my conflict is not really super healthy for my well being. I've tried it.

    But I will close by reiterating that I think personal development and progress - growth- is very important. I do not think QI relationships are the best,necessarily, for such. Growth is very important, though. I am not sure, really, if duality is the best place for such or not, but I do believe that proper growth requires the right conditions. And as QI relationships go, at least in my world, those are not optimal conditions for my growth.

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    I had an ENFJ girlfriend. It did not work out even though we enjoyed much of the same things and shared similar taste. We would spend lots of time explaining ourselves to each other. She would make all these plans for things to do and I would feel like a dog jumping through hoops trying to accomodate her. We are so much better as friends. In in closer relationships its just a bunch of confusion, supicsions and disappointments.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Topaz
    In in closer relationships its just a bunch of confusion, supicsions and disappointments.
    I think that's where socionics will help fill in the confusion. It will help demystify the relationship, and help progress.

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    Quote Originally Posted by gaypog
    Quote Originally Posted by Topaz
    In in closer relationships its just a bunch of confusion, supicsions and disappointments.
    I think that's where socionics will help fill in the confusion. It will help demystify the relationship, and help progress.
    Not really. After we broke up I learned about socionics. After reconsidering what went wrong and rethinking things I got back together with her. She is a fine, intelligent and fun person, but guess what? ... the same problems began to manifest themselves over again only even faster than before. I would not want to put someone through that kind of thing again nor would I want to subject myself to it again either. I did learn some valuable things about myself and others though. There is some validity to intertype relations. I dont believe that you should try to force realtionships that are uncomfortable. Why try and stuff a square peg into a round hole? (.......get your mind out of the gutter )

    Topaz
    The artifact which is the source of my power will not be kept on the Mountain of Despair beyond the River of Fire guarded by the Dragons of Eternity. It will be in my safe-deposit box. The same applies to the object which is my one weakness.

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    Default Experiences with Quasi-Identical Relations

    I may have asked this question before, but I'm having difficulty understanding why Socionics claims quasi-identical relations are so bad. I love INFjs - some of my closest friends have been INFjs, my therapist is an INFj, and I've admired many INFjs from afar. Granted, I get along with some better than others, but overall I've enjoyed the time I've spent with them. Even though we have different perspectives and disagree every now and then, I find that we often end up helping, enriching, and even complementing each other - it feels like mirror relations more than anything else (and no, I'm not ENFp, and I've clarified that the friends I'm talking about are INFjs). So , I'm confused. Does anyone else here like his/her quasi-identical and not understand what all the fuss is about? Am I missing something?

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    INFjs tend to be wonderful people. I actually just told one they were such right now.
    Pre-2013 post are written with incomplete understanding.

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    Quote Originally Posted by UDP III
    INFjs tend to be wonderful people. I actually just told one they were such right now.
    But your quasi-identical is the INTp.

    As to the question --

    One way to look at it is this: your quasi-identical's dual is your conflictor, and your dual is their conflictor. So the kind of person you most prefer to interact with is exactly the kind of person that the quasi-identical prefers to avoid, and vice-versa.

    In one-to-one situations it can work fine with the quasi-identicals at the level of mutual interests (since the club is the same). But in social situations with more people, it becomes clear that you prefer very different kinds of company and social interactipons. Very simplistically, you can't stand the quasi-identical's friends and vice-versa.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
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    If you don't mind never ending debates (often to find that you actually agree and the whole 2 hour discussion was pointless), they're interesting. If neither of you are the type to debate or "talk" something over, this may be less true... instead there will be a lot of unresolved misunderstandings.
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    My point I went over in my mind but not on the forum was that it may be easier for some quasis to get along better than others.

    But then again perhaps not.
    Pre-2013 post are written with incomplete understanding.

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    My experiences with real life INTjs (and some of the INTjs on this forum) are almost exactly as the quasi-identical relation is described in Socionics. And that is not too bad, but the relations tend to remain neutral or fade away. Not threatening, but not very promising either.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Expat
    Quote Originally Posted by UDP III
    INFjs tend to be wonderful people. I actually just told one they were such right now.
    But your quasi-identical is the INTp.

    As to the question --

    One way to look at it is this: your quasi-identical's dual is your conflictor, and your dual is their conflictor. So the kind of person you most prefer to interact with is exactly the kind of person that the quasi-identical prefers to avoid, and vice-versa.

    In one-to-one situations it can work fine with the quasi-identicals at the level of mutual interests (since the club is the same). But in social situations with more people, it becomes clear that you prefer very different kinds of company and social interactipons. Very simplistically, you can't stand the quasi-identical's friends and vice-versa.
    precisely. i have never really seen anything at all from any quasi-identical relationships to suggest that quasi-identicals get along poorly. rather, they can be very interesting intellectually given mutual interests.

    i also think that quasi-identical relations can have an aspect of "what's wrong with this guy?" i have noticed this in collaborative projects where i have been forced to work with LIIs (in classes such as health which i couldn't care less about that were very conducive to FeSi atmosphere). one LII in particular was very conducive to share his health problems and make them appear indomitable in a very wimpy, Fe-dual seeking way that would easily elicit the sympathies of an ESE. unfortunately for him, he was working with me, and received nothing but complete and utter apathy. the sentiments of "why isn't this guy feeling sorry for me?" and "why is this guy rambling along endlessly instead of working?" were probably mutual.


    god did that class suck. it was taught by a highly obese ESE woman who had a meatball in place of her brain.

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    I really like the INFps I have known IRL. Sometimes I wish that I can be like them in terms of . We seem to be able to connect when we first met each other due to our similarities, but the more we get to know each other, the more we realize our differences. INFps are more idealistic, enjoyment-oriented, and less practical. One girl I know really loves to talk about fairies, anime and fantasy-oriented subjects, so much so that I find it rather impractical and irritating.

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    i think in many ways your quasi is like your activity partner from the opposite quadra <3

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    My biggest problem with ENFjs is that they drive my husband crazy. I don't personally mind them. Although my ENFj dad and I argue a bit.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joy
    If you don't mind never ending debates (often to find that you actually agree and the whole 2 hour discussion was pointless), they're interesting.
    Exactly. (Except I don't find them all that interesting.)

    I wouldn't recommend living with one's Quasi-Identical. Lots of petty (but hardly intense) arguments.

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    Quote Originally Posted by niffweed17
    precisely. i have never really seen anything at all from any quasi-identical relationships to suggest that quasi-identicals get along poorly. rather, they can be very interesting intellectually given mutual interests.

    i also think that quasi-identical relations can have an aspect of "what's wrong with this guy?" i have noticed this in collaborative projects where i have been forced to work with LIIs (in classes such as health which i couldn't care less about that were very conducive to FeSi atmosphere). one LII in particular was very conducive to share his health problems and make them appear indomitable in a very wimpy, Fe-dual seeking way that would easily elicit the sympathies of an ESE. unfortunately for him, he was working with me, and received nothing but complete and utter apathy. the sentiments of "why isn't this guy feeling sorry for me?" and "why is this guy rambling along endlessly instead of working?" were probably mutual.
    i had an LII roommate sort of do this and i think he was upset that i wasn't immediately aware of his physical state? like i do not think that INTps/ENTjs make the best "caregivers" in these situations. he was expecting me to react like an ESE and be like aw poor baby.
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    no socionic relation is "good" or "bad" ; LII and ILI would simply understand each other's informations poorly.

    Rick said those relations can be interesting (for a limited time) for non-socionic reasons, such as shared interests or infatuation.

    but I think they can also because you simply like to understand others ; this is why, for example, I can get along well with an LIE.

    I stipulated in my website that "same quadra = high compatibility" "adjacent quadra = medium compatibility" and "opposite quadra = low compatibility". compatibility in an IM sense, because a Beta can get along with a Delta, if he really wants to.

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    I am pretty new to the socionic understanding of personality types, although more familiar with myers-briggs. Recently, I started doing some research because I found out that a past relationship I had, fit the label for quasi-identical. Of course, I am still trying to work through some of those issues I had and after reading about "mutual misunderstandings" I thought to myself wow, that was exactly how things were like between us. Even though we had this cosmic connection and spoke to each other very symbolically (lots of double entendres), we still had so much trouble understanding each other.

    I had always felt so mistreated or misunderstood (feelings), but in trying to analyze it (thinking), never felt that miscommunications came from any sense that s/he was ever trying to hurt me. But I experienced this as extremely frustrating and also recognized that I was also causing these same feelings in the other. This was painful because I felt a deep connection to this person but also realized that I cannot provide what is needed. For a long time I believed, that we could make it work. But eventually, came to see that our efforts were pointless.

    Can anyone recommend or direct me to any other sources that explains this quasi-identical phenomena? Sometimes, I wonder if we had known more about the personality types we could have handle our issues with each other better.

    Another thing that definitely happened quite a bit was we both perceived each other as different types then we actually were! Both of us were NF's yet because of the different strengths of each, experienced the other as opposite-- N changed to S and F changed over to T. Has anyone else experienced anything similar or can give any insights?

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    i can say pretty quickly i'd rather hang out with my quasi-identical or contrary on a long term basis than my conflictor/superego on a long term basis. so in that way, they're not bad at all.

    Quote Originally Posted by Expat
    One way to look at it is this: your quasi-identical's dual is your conflictor, and your dual is their conflictor. So the kind of person you most prefer to interact with is exactly the kind of person that the quasi-identical prefers to avoid, and vice-versa.

    In one-to-one situations it can work fine with the quasi-identicals at the level of mutual interests (since the club is the same). But in social situations with more people, it becomes clear that you prefer very different kinds of company and social interactipons. Very simplistically, you can't stand the quasi-identical's friends and vice-versa.

    i thought of this problem initially, too. i don't know that it poses a huge issue unless, say, you marry your quasi-identical and her kid from a previous marriage, or her father, or some such thing is your conflictor. it's the "close relationship" aspect where it becomes messy, i believe.

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    Default Experiences with quasi-identical relations

    Please post your experiences here.

    personally I believe i know one Te INTp and she is very pleasant, helpful (I like her=she seems very pleasant) but won't really speak unless spoken to. We can chit chat. She may be an ENTj or ISTp though. I don't think ISTp (seems very unaware of her body) and seems very Ixxp.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ms. Kensington View Post
    Please post your experiences here.

    personally I believe i know one Te INTp and she is very pleasant, helpful (I like her=she seems very pleasant) but won't really speak unless spoken to. We can chit chat. She may be an ENTj or ISTp though. I don't think ISTp (seems very unaware of her body) and seems very Ixxp.
    Exciting, highly social at first, but slowly degrading for both.

  33. #33
    Hot Message FDG's Avatar
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    They're generally good for me, even though we tend to get out of touch over longer periods of time. Very good for working toghether on a given project, though.
    Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hostage_Child View Post
    While I have felt a certain degree of respect more or less from my quasi that would go both ways, I generally want to be liked by them and accepted, but I feel intimidated by them and rubbed the wrong way. I have found the feeling to be mutual.

    I guess I would describe it as somewhat of a love, more hate relationship.

    Sorry, can't say much positive things about my experience, though I have been attracted to one on one occasion....and found myself in revulsion at the same time and of course extremely disappointed.

    I feel like I have to prove my worth to them and believe they are better people than me. For that, I loathe them. Not easy to talk to either.

    you've nailed this one. exactly.

    ILE

    those who are easily shocked.....should be shocked more often

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    The only bad experiences I've had with ENFjs were ones whose personalities were wildly out of control and they behaved like total primadonnas. The other ones I liked, but I got a sense that there would eventually be an expectation that I couldn't live up to, like I should conform to social norms more or something. The underlying value clash would eventually come out with too much closeness. Slowly degrading is a good description. But hanging out in groups and chit chatting with once in a while, we have a good time.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hostage_Child View Post
    While I have felt a certain degree of respect more or less from my quasi that would go both ways, I generally want to be liked by them and accepted, but I feel intimidated by them and rubbed the wrong way. I have found the feeling to be mutual.

    I guess I would describe it as somewhat of a love, more hate relationship.

    Sorry, can't say much positive things about my experience, though I have been attracted to one on one occasion....and found myself in revulsion at the same time and of course extremely disappointed.

    I feel like I have to prove my worth to them and believe they are better people than me. For that, I loathe them. Not easy to talk to either.
    QTF

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    I had words here once, but I didn't feed them Khola's Avatar
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    Oh dear. I had previously assumed my hubby was ESFj, as he refused to test and I had to go by my own assumptions.....he tested tonight as an ENFj and the explanations were spot-on. Our relationship is great about 95&#37; of the time, with the other 5% spiralling out of control or with a level of ignorance from both sides. We have kind-of accepted after 7 years together that we can say almost the exact same things and mean something completely different, or completely misunderstand what the other is trying to say. I find it exhausting sometimes, but I also really love him and know he is a nice person. This explains a lot.
    Hello, my name is Bee. Pleased to meet you .



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    Quote Originally Posted by bee View Post
    Oh dear. I had previously assumed my hubby was ESFj, as he refused to test and I had to go by my own assumptions.....he tested tonight as an ENFj and the explanations were spot-on. Our relationship is great about 95% of the time, with the other 5% spiralling out of control or with a level of ignorance from both sides. We have kind-of accepted after 7 years together that we can say almost the exact same things and mean something completely different, or completely misunderstand what the other is trying to say. I find it exhausting sometimes, but I also really love him and know he is a nice person. This explains a lot.
    Types will change a thousand times in your mind before you think you've figured it all out. And even then you still won't be able to trust what you have come to because there are so many factors outside of socionics and ways in which people fit into different types and categories some of the time that it makes it hard to peg any behavior. Anyway best not to think about socionics too much within relationships in my opinion, especially at early stages of understanding socionics, and even at later stages hehe.....: )
    Suomea

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    My brother is my quasi-identical.

    I think the best way to put it is -- very impressed by his abilities, while at the same time thinking he's got his priorities all wrong.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

  40. #40
    I had words here once, but I didn't feed them Khola's Avatar
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    I sometimes feel the same way about my hubby, but I still love him to bits, and although we have some very different priorities at times, I think both of our actions come from an honourable (if not somewhat misunderstood) place most of the time.
    Hello, my name is Bee. Pleased to meet you .



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