video games were so much cooler back in the day

[Hot Scalding Gayser]

I can't believe how much fun I've been having on super mario land 2: six golden coins on my new nintendo 3ds compared to newer titles.

It's a black and white title for the original game boy that game out in 1992. The music on the space level is so narcissistically perfect:

New video games are just too preppy, mainstream and ...business-y. It makes me want to vomit.

You have to have the balls to be artistic. You have to say "This is who I really am. You either love me or hate me."

Newer video games just loses its subjective emotional magical faggy touch or something. and it becomes all about money.

money is important because money offers security. But security is overrated. Sometimes you also need to be genuine to who you are and what you love no matter if anybody else likes it. Not even me, don't try to impress other people all the time JUST BE YOURSELF.

I remember the old glitches in the first final fantasy and how cute and funny and human it was. Newer games might try to replicate this by having fake-glitches but it just isn't the same. Something can have a lot of mistakes in it and still be good. Nowadays everything is so controlled, and bottled up and tightly wound and screwed on so tightly.

Let things breathe for fucking sake. Let the beer spill over your chest and don't give a fuck. Be a wild animal that doesn't care what ppl think and just wants what you want. This doesn't mean you have to turn into a disrespectful person. It just means you are expressing what you really love.

okay I'm sorry lol rant over. I had to get that out of my system.

[717495]

It's partly because video games are looking closer to reality, and like you said mainstream. If they try to think outside to box while utilizing these good graphics (and not try to make everything so literally perfect and plastic like a starbucks coffee to go with every combo) then they'll achieve the best of both worlds.

I tend to dream up new interesting video games/graphics. One I just thought of with a basic feel is you're this holy warrior that goes around this dreamscape slaying undead in swift leaps with a whispering sword, and the whole place is like this spiritual aura of field and cemetary, and is like a virtual reality work-out for your body. Maybe the other half is you play as this undead detective from the other side trying to solve the case. I love those multilayered games, alright obviously I just thought of this in 2 seconds but I like it kinda. Omg I so want in on this if someone decides to read this and make it.

[717495]

There's the issue of what goes around comes around. So everything starts to blend together, until someone who is personally familiar with a piece history brings back something fresh and new again, yet really gets translated as their own vision deep down. It's kinda ironic but soulful.

[717495]

I tend to dream up new interesting video games/graphics. One I just thought of with a basic feel is you're this holy warrior that goes around this dreamscape slaying undead in swift leaps with a whispering sword, and the whole place is like this spiritual aura of field and cemetary, and is like a virtual reality work-out for your body. Maybe the other half is you play as this undead detective from the other side trying to solve the case. I love those multilayered games, alright obviously I just thought of this in 2 seconds but I like it kinda. Omg I so want in on this if someone decides to read this and make it.

But it turns out it's really the dectective imagining it all as the gameplay progresses, and wanting to become this force himself, a force against evil, but later you learn he was really having visions of the real hero as he comes from the other world and the detective gains firmer evidence (it seems so real). The detective ends up working out his fate through dream and delivers his own unfortunate ends through sheer belief, but the visitor emerges in the future to save him, to essentially take his own life and chance that was he the hero's mission, and the undead gains a soul and remembers: the hero of his dreams was really himself and the visitor was the holy spirit giving him privilege and insight. Then the sequel to the game is like neo in the next movie, he's pretty much unstoppable and can control all the elements of this world, as a sort of gate keeper.

[noid]

Agree with what have been said here, especially on the lack of fun. This is especially true for "big public" game.
Anyway, I dont think VG now lack creativity : take for example Skyrim, WOW, the 2 last Zelda (big !) , some free FPS oriented more on the gameplay than technical tunning. The stuff is that these game, wich are not especially funny, need some involvement (if not massive one). Thats a difference with 2D old school game wich was creative and at the same time fun, without the need of forgetting your real self. And often new one lack simple but pleasant emotionnalism wich shine in a zelda , mario, even Starcraft, ie where the ambiance, universe and character was really worked and creative.

Imo where the worst have happened is into the FPS genre. I find that many well know FPS now lack the fun, the difficulty and the good-natured player/developper community that was characteristic of this genre. I find more pleasure now to play FPS based on the old Q3 engine (the use of the well know "circle jump" bug are probably one of the best FPS gameplay never finded), than current FPS that are supposedly good (call of duty (boring community, boring movement engine), left4dead (simply boring after 1 month of playing)).
The fact its now quasi-impossible for independant developper to create mod or map for a specific game have ruined all possible creativity too. Quake3 stay one of the most moded game in the history, and this have added big longevity and fun.

this vidz sum up all ("What if Quake was done today"):

[noid]

I tend to dream up new interesting video games/graphics. One I just thought of with a basic feel is you're this holy warrior that goes around this dreamscape slaying undead in swift leaps with a whispering sword, and the whole place is like this spiritual aura of field and cemetary, and is like a virtual reality work-out for your body. Maybe the other half is you play as this undead detective from the other side trying to solve the case. I love those multilayered games, alright obviously I just thought of this in 2 seconds but I like it kinda. Omg I so want in on this if someone decides to read this and make it.

Back in the days Ive done that too, dreamed about ultra-realistical FPS wich include element of MMORPG, and peculiar ambiance. Current reality is that it have approximately happen. My deduction is that satisfaction in dream > satisfaction when dream come true. Thats obvious, thats shit.

[mu4]

I think most of the old school gaming experiences is being created by casual and indie gaming companies. Casual gaming can and probably will make more money than hardcore gaming in the future.

Zynga is a example of that.

Indie gaming is also gaining a bigger market as well.

Gaming is becoming sort of separated into the generic blockbuster mega-games(movie equivilant) and the casual play with family and friends(tv show) games with a side of hipster obscure indie games.

Gaming is also very much about the advancement of technology and pushing the bleeding edge of engine technology and special effect technology , a lot of developers just do things because they can and they're at that bleeding edge where they feel it's ok to recycle a classic game style with bigger and badder explosions.

Also there are games now like Dark Soul and PS3 network games like http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Journey_(2011_video_game) that are pushing some game-play experiences only possible with mass multiplayer console gaming and removing the social aspect but providing a trace element of that individual. Little interaction, full anonymity and unpredictable individuals meeting in a strange lands.

The money men think the best way to turn make money off of games is to turn them into addictions, ala MMO, WOW, Word with Friends, Farmville, etc. I think that model has a limited audience of "addicts", and most people don't want that experience, however it is a very high margin and predictable business model. It's a bad direction but I don't see companies avoiding that direction, but if you explore PS3 network or Xbox Live games, I think the experiences is out there. You just gotta be the obsessive no life nerd you were as a teenager and socially awkward.

I think the different audiences in gaming are going to continue to diverge. I'm a AAA blockbuster gamer, and I tend to only play single player AAA blockbusters, because ultimately I'm a technologist, and I want to see what is possible with that.

[Creepy-Snaps]

I don't think video games have become worse... maybe you have become nostalgic. I agree, I enjoy older games, and perhaps there is something more enjoyable in their basic simplicity. But perhaps the kids growing up nowadays, will say the games of this time period are better than the ones in 20 years.

[Cat King Cole]

Nah, games are getting worse. Japan is dead and the US market is dominated by EA and Activision who only care about yearly hack releases to turn a dime from gamers. Consoles are largely to blame, because they provide a high barrier to entry for development, meaning only the big empires and established publishers have the means to produce games for them.

[Pa3s]

I agree with the OP. Many game series are just stupid cash cows and eventually degenerate to mainstream shit. I'm glad that I played some really good stuff when I was younger (like Super Mario Land 2 for example).

something interesting:

[EyeSeeCold]

Even the THPS series are still remnants from a golden era. Neversoft was a small scale developer that added a ton of in-jokes in their games, apparently enjoying themselves while in the process of creating them. The greatest thing about the series was that although it was based on a real-life sport, they never (initially) attempted to replicate reality and were just focused making something you could get a kick out of, maybe with a buddy or two.

[Absurd]

I liked Duke Nukem, that was my first game on PC.

[Creepy-bg]

the last truly memorable games for me were the late 90s and early 2000s. right when graphics and processing were getting good enough for some really interesting games, but not good enough for them to waste all their development on "realism" and fx. also... it seemed like things were more gender bending and original then.

some of my favorites from the period...

black and white (the sequal was really boring imo, they took out all the interesting bits and replaced them with insane micromanagement, definately felt like it had lost the magic.)







also, as for fps, imo they went downhill after Unreal. Dune > Quake > Quake 2 > Unreal. after that it seemed as they regressed as far as immersion, bots, and originality.

[Creepy-bg]

i remember how disappointed i was to play the new generation of tomb raider games. they used to be about Being Lara Croft, the movement system was such that getting through the game involved real skill and mastery of moving her character and the points in the game where the cinimatic music kicked in were always amazing. the newer engines ruined the movement where it felt like you were mostly fighting the quirks of the camera movement. the finesse was gone.

[Absurd]

[EyeSeeCold]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H6JcZv3wPuU

"Time to kick ass and chew bubblegum...and I'm all out of gum"

[mu4]

I think gaming underwent it's hardware/graphics focused push already. (Very realistic games are a more or less solved problem for game developers, I can buy a engine or rent a engine and get a competitive platform easily and this cost is always dropping). Also artistic style > pixels, WOW proved that. The games being made are already so graphically real that it's hard to improve on it with graphics alone. I think the biggest problem with producing a AAA blockbuster is art department costs, getting the textures, levels, etc. Journey is a game that is attempting to overcome that thru imaginative ways.

Also take a game like the Witcher 2, this is a game made by a relatively small development team for a tiny market(PC), but they had one of the most graphically realistic games and artistic games out there, or Farcry(before crysis), same sort of thing.

Also games went cinematic, where the passive elements, the story/storytelling was highlighted instead of the game. There's a lot of people where game play is secondary, and they just want the cinematic experience with them in the drivers seat.

The dominant gaming movements are controls(wii, kinetic, move, touch), casual(minecraft, words for friends, farmville, wii), and really original gameplay advancements(Dark Soul, Journey. Braid, Mine Craft, Shadow of the Colossus).

I mean I think a lot of folks just aren't paying attention to all the great games that are coming out right now. The industry is poised to enter a golden age of indie games and gameplay oriented games being viable due to the success of digital distribution, it's also going into a era of unprecedented greed and addiction based statbuilder gaming that will steal your soul.

A lot of old school games are great, and remain great, but there's a lot of innovation occurring in the industry.

If there is a game right now that is hot right now, it is Minecraft, you can still break all the rules
.

[noid]

If there is a game right now that is hot right now, it is Minecraft, you can still break all the rules
.

thread can be closed

[mu4]

I'm not sure if you're sarcastic or not, but I don't think gaming has gotten worse. In gaming, it's more, why did my favorite developer XXX turn into a soul sucking business entity. For sure EA, Blizzard, Zynga have become the epitome of soul sucking.

[Leader]

80s-90s, everything (games/movies/music) was better than now. More substance. Today most things lack quality (depth).

[glam]

haha... i've often wondered if my fading interest in video games was due to me "growing up" or the video games themselves.


now a clip from Secret of Evermore, one of my favorite old RPGs whose soundtrack i still listen to (ignore the first 10 seconds):

[blahmonkey]

There are still a lot of independent developers out there that make some really creative games.

Check out Limbo, and generally anything on the Indie tab in steam :-P

Its these huge soul sucking companies that keep us from seeing the small ones, but theyre still there

[Sam Rockwell]

Games, movies, and even music today are all expected to be these imaginative fantasias complete with close-to-life graphics, orchestrated soundtracks, and deep commentaries on the laws of the universe in its stories reminiscent of those found in Academy Award-winning films. The whole entertainment industry has developed such a massive tolerance to deep storytelling, creative art direction, innovative gameplay and the like, that it needs to top itself consistently. 3D screens and touchpads weren't essential to enjoying a session of gaming at one point, but now every developer has to find a way to compete against themselves and each other in order to keep up with the times.

I think that it largely has to do with the integration of the "average gamer". As I understand it, video games used to be part of a subculture. It was relegated to a minority. Now everybody and their grandmother has to be able to enjoy a game.

[Creepy-male]

Yea at the OP, video games have gone downhill a lot of it is flash now and very little substance, its actually the gameplay that counts.

In terms of RPGs the market is dominated by MMORPGs and WoW is like the Walmart of MMORPGs... any time any little guy tries to make a new MMORPG with a good idea, "Walmart" will just absorb its unique aspects into its mega-store so shoppers won't be tempted to go somewhere else. You have more than enough blizzard fanboys too to ensure WoW stays alive.

More disgusting is how Blizzard has gone downhill because of the shitloads of publicity and money they get from WoW, you used to have fun games like SC and Diablo II, but when Blizzard released SCII, it was almost exactly the same damn game, they removed one or two units and the single player they have a little bullshitty story. The art is heavily borrow from WoW in cinematics. It's like all Blizzard knows how to do is feed a bunch of 30 yr old overweight mamas boys living in their parents basement servings of world of warcraft. I'm sure when they make diablo 3, they will pretty much copy d2 but make it shittier in gameplay with a watered down plot and the graphics will look like WoW.

That's just RPGs, FPS has gone downhill imo save for TF2 (which was a sequel which actually reinvented good old team fortress and made it better and interesting). I especially hate modern warfare, its like tailor built for a bunch of 16 yr old jock types with xboxes still living with their moms to feel like a soldier and talk shit on the internet like a keyboard warrior and has very little value in the way of gameplay. I would much rather play bf2 or bf1942 over modern warfare.

They don't even make games that are adventure anymore, which is kind of cool, they had a sale on steam for some old tomb raider games and after playing through those I kind of enjoyed the process of climbing walls and grappling things to navigate through some ancient temple. It reminded me of assassins creed... they just need a game like that. One with a massive temple or jungle environment, and I mean massive, where you just explore around, climbing cliffs and stuff. Adventure games are pretty uncommon these days, everyone wants to make these fancy mmorpgs and fps'.

Graphics and Music are getting better but gameplay is greatly suffering imo.

My current dream game I want to develop is one which takes place in a massive open environment in space - a virtual dreamworld (ike the matrix). There are small islands which have different settings on them and the islands actually rotate mechanically and defy the laws of physics, so its a bit like tetris and a puzzle. To move from one point to another you may have to flip a switch to cause this mechanism to rotate and so forth. The environments are also full of enemies with different abilities and your guy works much like a hack and slash rpg, you gain xp and learn new abilities as you overcome challenges and enemies. Each world is a dream and has a single objective that takes a while to accomplish. The plot is something like inception or the matrix. The idea is to have a world full of moving architecture and creative enemies with different strengths and weaknesses that fit within the theme of the level.

[Creepy-bg]

My current dream game I want to develop is one which takes place in a massive open environment in space - a virtual dreamworld (ike the matrix). There are small islands which have different settings on them and the islands actually rotate mechanically and defy the laws of physics, so its a bit like tetris and a puzzle. To move from one point to another you may have to flip a switch to cause this mechanism to rotate and so forth. The environments are also full of enemies with different abilities and your guy works much like a hack and slash rpg, you gain xp and learn new abilities as you overcome challenges and enemies. Each world is a dream and has a single objective that takes a while to accomplish. The plot is something like inception or the matrix. The idea is to have a world full of moving architecture and creative enemies with different strengths and weaknesses that fit within the theme of the level.

Project Nomads was a bit like this, at least with the floating "islands" in space. you had a main island that acted as your "ship" that you built up like a base and flew around to other islands on. the mental parts reminds me of psychonauts, where each persons mind that you go into is like a different enviorment/world.






(sorry. not trying to say "IT'S ALREADY BEEN DONE!". lol. just keeping the conversation going. )

[mu4]

I don't know how anyone can say that gaming has gone down hill since Wii and Kinect now exist.

It's like people who play Atari/Nintendo platformers and never realized that Wolfenstein 3d was going to change the world.

I saw this little girl, maybe 10ish dancing to this Kinetic dancing game(was shopping at the mall and decided to sit infront of the Microsoft store) and she was just going at it doing all the movies. After she had completed the sequence perfectly she ran around really happy and cheery. Game developers work hard as hell to provide this sort of enjoyment to gamers, young and old, and that's what matters.

People's nostolgia is understandable but imo, this is one of the most innovative periods in gaming since the advent of the FPS and story driven games.

Wii/Kinect/Move/touch is changing everything.

[Cat King Cole]

Welp, for all the game dev dreamers, there's something called "modding". you take someone else's game engine, and you make a mod for it. many huge games like Killing Floor, Team Fortress, and Counterstrike started life as mods.

It would be quite doable, though not necessarily easily or trivial, to make a mod that does what we want. The general candidates are UT2k4 (same engine behind killing floor, I know for a fact it can handle physics, though probably not of the mind-bending puzzling dreamz has in mind), Source (which I'd have to research), and Oblivion (would be good for poli's idea).

I'm interested in game design myself. We could get a squad going, maybe throw something together. Any further interest, drop a post on my wall and I'll get a user group together.

[Creepy-bg]

I don't know how anyone can say that gaming has gone down hill since Wii and Kinetic now exist.

It's like people who play Atari/Nintendo platformers and never realized that Wolfenstein 3d was going to change the world.

I saw this little girl, maybe 10ish dancing to this Kinetic dancing game(was shopping at the mall and decided to sit infront of the Microsoft store) and she was just going at it doing all the movies. After she had completed the sequence perfectly she ran around really happy and cheery. Game developers work hard as hell to provide this sort of enjoyment to gamers, young and old, and that's what matters.

Your nostolgia is understandable but imo, this is one of the most innovative periods in gaming since the advent of the FPS and story driven games.

Wii/Kinetic/Move/touch is changing everything.

if i wanted to move, i'd get a life.

i can see where the moving interaction thing would be fun for kids, but i've never enjoyed the sensation of them. they just made me feel like self conscious dork, and the games seemed much simplified in order to accomidate the new interaction style. i remember a star wars wii game that i played at my friends apt. yes it was kind of cool at first to do the light saber thing, but the novelty quickly wore off and then you are left with a game where you just jump from sequence of dudes attacking you to sequence of dudes attacking you while you wave the controller around to kill them. there was no adventure to it at all. (just an example of my experience, I'm sure that there are some kinetic etc... games that do it right? ehh different strokes for different folks as well.)

[krieger]

the past also had it's issues. most games were variations on tired old game concepts such as platform jump-and-runners and shoot-em-ups. originality was the exception, not the rule.

90% of everything is crud, in the past just like it is right now. the reason the past seems better is because we remember the good parts and forget the rest.

[mu4]

if i wanted to move, i'd get a life.

i can see where the moving interaction thing would be fun for kids, but i've never enjoyed the sensation of them. they just made me feel like self conscious dork, and the games seemed much simplified in order to accomidate the new interaction style. i remember a star wars wii game that i played at my friends apt. yes it was kind of cool at first to do the light saber thing, but the novelty quickly wore off and then you are left with a game where you just jump from sequence of dudes attacking you to sequence of dudes attacking you while you wave the controller around to kill them. there was no adventure to it at all. (just an example of my experience, I'm sure that there are some kinetic etc... games that do it right? ehh different strokes for different folks as well.)

It's probably not going to appeal to some people due to them not wanting to look awkward, but it hits a entire different crowd. I think they're still figuring out how to make these games more than novelty and provide a good experience.

[Creepy-male]

Welp, for all the game dev dreamers, there's something called "modding". you take someone else's game engine, and you make a mod for it. many huge games like Killing Floor, Team Fortress, and Counterstrike started life as mods.

It would be quite doable, though not necessarily easily or trivial, to make a mod that does what we want. The general candidates are UT2k4 (same engine behind killing floor, I know for a fact it can handle physics, though probably not of the mind-bending puzzling dreamz has in mind), Source (which I'd have to research), and Oblivion (would be good for poli's idea).

I'm interested in game design myself. We could get a squad going, maybe throw something together. Any further interest, drop a post on my wall and I'll get a user group together.

yea i already develop maps for source engine and I've looked over recoding basic things in hl2, I'll be doing a lot of coding in my new job so I'm definitely interested in developing a mod.

I'd want to go source personally, I'm a pro at hammer.

[Creepy-male]

the past also had it's issues. most games were variations on tired old game concepts such as platform jump-and-runners and shoot-em-ups. originality was the exception, not the rule.

90% of everything is crud, in the past just like it is right now. the reason the past seems better is because we remember the good parts and forget the rest.

Yea this is true, but I also think its very common today to have games that are flash without substance -- where as in the beginning it was hard to make a flashy game.

[EyeSeeCold]

the past also had it's issues. most games were variations on tired old game concepts such as platform jump-and-runners and shoot-em-ups. originality was the exception, not the rule.

90% of everything is crud, in the past just like it is right now. the reason the past seems better is because we remember the good parts and forget the rest.

Not really. Games actually were better back then, original or not. The slop produced today has no replay value whatsoever, unless of course it's an online game.

[Bardia]

I think it's become more difficult for me to find games I really like. I attribute it more to growing up. I still play some of my old games on my SNES, N64 and the like but I dont' enjoy them as much as when I was younger. I have to say I have really enjoyed skyward sword a lot. I just don't have as much time to play them and social opportunities > video games for me now.

[Creepy-male]

Project Nomads was a bit like this, at least with the floating "islands" in space. you had a main island that acted as your "ship" that you built up like a base and flew around to other islands on. the mental parts reminds me of psychonauts, where each persons mind that you go into is like a different enviorment/world.

(sorry. not trying to say "IT'S ALREADY BEEN DONE!". lol. just keeping the conversation going. )

Yea I'm into developing something different, here is a map I'm developing for the source engine, its running off tf2 for now, but this is an example of the feel of a dreamscape I'd have. The basic concept of this map is a long gauntlet like hall that is over lava and has doors that move side to side and can potentially crush people + other traps. I'm debating on whether to make this a deathmatch map or to make it a puzzle game.

The beginning is slow mo + music to make it a little more moody but you can skip that if its annoying to you.

[Leader]

Blame mass marketing.

[noid]

recent free online game, old gameplay





n'joy

[PistolShrimp]

This actually gave me chills:



For the most part I agree with the OP, but some new games are EPIC; something of this scale couldn't have existed years ago.

[willekeurig]

this

[rat1]

video games are on par with movie now with corporate involvement