New to Socionics, found out I'm in an IEI-ILE Illusionary relationship

[PistolShrimp]

-cut out embarrassing freak-out, thanks for the help everyone!-

.....

After learning about our relationship type according to Socionics, I fear that we may not be able to fully satisfy each other, or that we may be better off or happier with our duals, and...I don't know how to take this because really I love and admire him (he feels the same about me). He is my best friend. Any advice for a newbie?

[Radio]

Socionics doesn't dictate your love life, you and your behavior and your tendencies form the basis for socionics. If you're an IEI happily in love with an ILE then maybe socionics needs to be challenged, not your affection or love.

[Slacker]

There are a lot of non-socionic-related factors in relationships. I wouldn't worry about it. Just enjoy your relationship. It is not at all doomed to failure, and dual relationships are not guaranteed to be successful.

[LostinTime]

Self-fulfilling prophecy much? Just relax and enjoy your time with him. Socionics gives guidelines, it's not the Bible of life or anything. And if you leave this guy because of what socionics claims your relationship with him is supposed to be like, then how are you so sure you'll even find a dual with whom things will be "amazing"?

[Creepy-bg]

real life feelings and respect > what socionics says should be happening

[mu4]

Live together, see how it goes.

Illusion relationships are good just they get boring for long term day to day interaction, it's not really a bad relationship or mediocre, just prone to spouts of boredom.

[Absurd]

Better ditch him, or you're going to die.

[Suz]

Hi all!

I've spent almost a year studying MBTI, and started looking into Socionics a few days ago because the theories of intertype relations interested me. I've typed as a definite INFJ on MBTI, 6w5 sp/sx, and am almost positive I am Socionics IEI because I identify strongly with .

I said the SAME exact thing back when i started out with socionics about 2 years ago. SAME EXACT THING, verbatim. Turns out I was not IEI, but IEE. only one letter off but a WORLD of difference.

Be cautious before settling on a socionic type coming from MBTI. The socionic functions are different and it's entirely possible to THINK you identify with IEs when you actually have no idea how they are supposed to manifest. So, sit down, stay awhile, interact with the different quadras here and see if you REALLY fit IEI or not. It took me about 2 months to realize something was very very wrong with my self-typing.

[mu4]

Another thing.

Never give up a good relationship you have because of socionics, because that's not worthwhile. Be honest about the quality of the relationship to yourself and each other.

[Absurd]

Never give up a good relationship you have because of socionics, because that's not worthwhile. Be honest about the quality of the relationship to yourself and each other.

Don't listen to him, he is your illusionary.

[Creepy-bg]

really I love and admire him (he feels the same about me), and I don't want to leave him. He is my best friend.

this is what matters.

[Absurd]

this is what matters.

Mountain LSE tempted me to crack open a beer, but I actually agree with this. No need to flush it when it works for you, I think.

[Suz]

yeah and anyway, illusionary is a good relation! Actually one of the IEEs here who recently stopped posting (Pianosinger) is in a very happy, fulfilling marriage with her illusionary (ILI). There are many non-type related factors that make a relationship.

[Gilly]

Sounds like you don't belong here, for your own good.

[Absurd]

Sounds like you don't belong here, for your own good.

Don't listen to him as well, he is your illusionary.

[Slacker]

Don't get too invested in this theory. Don't make life choices around it. It might be wrong, or you might have people typed wrong, or both. It's just too risky.

It's something interesting to read about, and it's healthy to understand that people you don't get along with might just be different and equally valuable and equally annoyed by you. I think it can give you a healthy outlook if you only use it to stop being annoyed by people being themselves. I don't think it is at ALL helpful to break up with someone because you read something online.

[Kim]

My dual relationship ended with a break-up (mostly due to circumstances and different life plans) and now I am in a IEE-SLE relationship. We have been socionically doomed for five years.

[squark]

We've been dating for almost a year now and generally get along very well, laugh a lot together, have similar senses of humor, and often just "get" what the other is saying without effort. I love him very much and love having him in my life. . . . I love and admire him (he feels the same about me), and I don't want to leave him. He is my best friend. Any advice for a newbie?

Be happy that you have a good relationship. Enjoy it. Enjoy each other. Don't let some stupid theory make you question your relationship. BTW, there's a forum member Blaze (ILE) that's in a very happy relationship last I heard with an IEI, and it's been at least a few years they've been together.

[redbaron]

Be happy that you have a good relationship. Enjoy it. Enjoy each other. Don't let some stupid theory make you question your relationship. BTW, there's a forum member Blaze (ILE) that's in a very happy relationship last I heard with an IEI, and it's been at least a few years they've been together.

yes, we should let her speak for herself (it's been a bit up and down, from what I understand). On the other hand, I love ILEs. I could see myself with one. (shush to those of you who think I'm SEI. )

[Lobo]

Live together, see how it goes.

Illusion relationships are good just they get boring for long term day to day interaction, it's not really a bad relationship or mediocre, just prone to spouts of boredom.

Yup, that's how I've experienced it too. I find myself attracted to a lot of ESEs, but sometimes we don't have things to talk about and it seems like it could boring after a while of doing the same thing.

PstolShrimp, I do think socionics helps you more or less find who is mentally compatible to you for a relationship depending on what you are looking in a relationship. Based on what you're saying, it seems like you found an ILE who is your match. For me, LSEs doesn't work that well, there are ups and downs to deep relationships with any type. I see myself being with an ESE some day, if I ever get to be in a looongterm type of thing.

[PistolShrimp]

Wow, thank you everyone for replying! I really appreciate the feedback and support; you guys all knocked some sense into me.

I think I was mostly upset because the concept of an "illusionary" love sounds like The Saddest Thing to me, and I don't want either of us to be deluded about our relationship while subconsciously seeking something more. It is a good relationship, and way healthier and more entertaining than the Identity relationship I was in for almost 3 years before this one. The descriptions of duality just seem to suggest that everything else is inferior and involves warping one's personality away from its authentic form in order to get along. The thought of relying on a "role" function in order to fully satisfy an Illusionary partner's dual-seeking function is just...ugh. That sounds like putting on the front of being Mr. or Ms. Right but not actually being them.

Better ditch him, or you're going to die.

Thanks for the chuckle, I needed it!

Be cautious before settling on a socionic type coming from MBTI. The socionic functions are different and it's entirely possible to THINK you identify with IEs when you actually have no idea how they are supposed to manifest. So, sit down, stay awhile, interact with the different quadras here and see if you REALLY fit IEI or not. It took me about 2 months to realize something was very very wrong with my self-typing.

Thank you for the suggestion! I am not 100% certain about my type, though I'm fairly certain, and I will definitely look into the differences in functions more thoroughly.

Sounds like you don't belong here, for your own good.

I had the same thought. All the idealization of duality might just make me depressed or cause me to search for "greener pastures" that may not really exist. I might stick around to verify my own type, though, and to understand a different perspective of Jung's work from that of MBTI.

It is better to view socionics intertype relations as something that was created and that exists in the context of quadra progression - a dry theoretical abstracted concept that is rather removed from one's actual day-to-day living experience. It is not about finding love, friendship, 'soulmates', etc. - it is about peculiarities of communication that leave a certain faint imprint on your interactions with other people.

I find this more realistic and encouraging. My boyfriend and I have a completely open line of communication, and can talk to each other about absolutely anything in a mature way. Communication isn't the issue; action is. It's so hard to get out and do something productive sometimes; that part of the relationship description rang true for me. I don't want to hinder him from achieving any of his goals, or for him to hinder mine. So far, so good, though; I've actually gained the momentum needed for pursuing a job change since I've started dating him. is inspiring.

[woofwoofl]

an awesome ILE > a shitty SLE

Being in the same quadra's nice to make communication easier and stuff like that, but if something works, it works; there's no going against "works"...

[Eliza Thomason]

I think if its not broken don't fix it! You are both happy. My Dad was also my "Dual" but I never sought his type specifically - till recently - subconsciously?? He and my Mom were in a Benefit relationship and both were happy and faithful to the end. I was in an unhappy benefit relationship in my marriage, and often looked to them enviously. They truly looked forward to begin with each other, and didn't like being apart. My Mom was [is] difficult - bossy, invalidating, and I think she was off mentally because of a post-partum medical procedure, so, never quite right. I often think I "married my mother" as my ex was close in type to her, and he was bossy, controlling, and invalidating. Makes sense, you marry your unresolved issues so you can resolve them,it has been said. So, well, they are resolved now, and now I met my dual. I think. Lord-willing. Had I met him many years ago, would I have recognized him? Maybe not. There is a time for every season under heaven. I would guess the relationship you are in is the one you are supposed to be in because it feel right. And knowing the drawbacks of illusionary relationships you can know where to make adjustments beyond your comfort zone when things begin to get stale - adjustments that you know will be worth the effort because you have the inside-info to know they will do some good.

[WVBRY]

Well why is that depressing? Alot of socionists beleive that illusionary relations are good, some dont. I would say its a favorable relation though I dont know many married illusionary couples. Come to think of it I dont know any.

[Aquagraph]

IEI-ILE relationships tend to work out well. I might be more of an ILE than a SLE and my taste in partners is very XEI, mostly IEIs. Socionics, as all models, are incomplete descriptions of our truth/perception.

[glam]

Alot of socionists beleive that illusionary relations are good, some dont. I would say its a favorable relation though I dont know many married illusionary couples. Come to think of it I dont know any.

some Gulenko article i read recently mentioned that Illusion is better for Irrational types, and Semi-duality is better for Rationals. not sure how it goes for other people, but it's true in my case.

[mu4]

Maybe incompatibility with rational functions, since relationships generally are a rational topic.

[silke]

some Gulenko article i read recently mentioned that Illusion is better for Irrational types, and Semi-duality is better for Rationals. not sure how it goes for other people, but it's true in my case.

It was this one: link. He says it is because in irrational mirage and rational semi-duality one partner is F-type and the other is T-type and this works out better than when both are F or T as is the case with rational mirage and irrational semi-duality. I would say this is true for me as well, mirage is somehow more attractive than semi-duality so I agree with this.

[WVBRY]

It was this one: link. He says it is because in irrational mirage and rational semi-duality one partner is F-type and the other is T-type and this works out better than when both are F or T as is the case with rational mirage and irrational semi-duality. I would say this is true for me as well, mirage is somehow more attractive than semi-duality so I agree with this.

I dunno...in rational mirage one partner is a S type and another is an N type, whereas in irrational mirage they are both S or both N so there is a complementing that rational mirage has that irrational mirage doesnt have. They are the same relation regardless of rationality/irrationality. I find mirage more attractive than semi-duality though I guess these relations are not related to what you find most attarctive as this is irrelavant. If anything Gulenko should be taking into account the erotic attitudes and such which would make rational mirage more compatible in romance, if only to a slight degree.

[PistolShrimp]

Might have jumped the gun here, as people in the What's my Type subforum seem to think I'm LII or SEI and not IEI at all, which makes this thread kind of embarrassing. Thank you everyone for the help and advice anyway!

[WVBRY]

What do you think you are?

[PistolShrimp]

What do you think you are?

I have no clue, really. I know I value and , but other than that it's still up in the air. Perhaps the fact that I need to think about it so much points to LII.

[WVBRY]

Perhaps the fact that I need to think about it so much points to LII.

No, it does not. Thats a misconception I've seen more than one beginner have...

If that were the case, I would be LII. But thats ridiculous. "Thinking" in and of itself doesnt point to anything, its just thinking. It says nothing about your specific cognitive process.

[PistolShrimp]

No, it does not. Thats a misconception I've seen more than one beginner have...

If that were the case, I would be LII. But thats ridiculous. "Thinking" in and of itself doesnt point to anything, its just thinking. It says nothing about your specific cognitive process.

Thanks for clarifying! It's probably pretty obvious how clueless I still am about these things.

[Pookie]

[QUOTE=PistolShrimp;835328]

I like nerdy, sweet, intellectual, funny, romantic men, and most SLE descriptions I've read don't paint that picture. My ENTp is all of these, yet from what I understand Socionics says our relationship is doomed to failure or mediocrity.

Also, my SLE dad has been happily married to my SEI mother (possibly ESI and definitely not IEI) for almost 30 years now, and they both still seem very much in love. Is that an illusion as well??
QUOTE]

Illusionary is one of the top 3 intertype relationships. And in my opinion the #2 if you're already attracted to him. Semi-dual becomes #2 if you agree with their conclusions naturally. Thats what SE does for you anyway, it creates attraction and comfort by saying things that stimulate you into response. Also, Illusionary is the most intellectual stimulating of all inter-types. You guys see life in the same way, but act and react differently to it. With introspection and a daring attitude, you should not have a problem stimulating each other.

Also; Nerdy, sweet, intellectual, funny, romantic... your describing IEI. Your own type. So maybe you find that attractive, cognitively, because thats how you've shaped yourself into an attractive person. Or even vice versa, You are an IEI who likes who you are, and so you see those traits as attactive, because you agree with those qualities in people. After all, that is who you made yourself to be.

You're not going to find those from your dual, nor really are you from you Illusionary. No other type will fulfill those roles more than your Identical. But those traits won't make a relationship work, with you. Because thats what you provide, and your partner needs to provide a complimentary function to those. Or else you run the risk of not developing yourself fully. And stagnant relationships almost always deteriorate.

Advice: forget what you think you like, view yourself internally in as few boxes as you can muster, and act in the moment when you're there. You will be attracted the most to the people that have complimentary functions to your own, as long as you don't act out of insecurity habitually, you'll steer cleer of relations that won't work.

Synopsis: If you love the guy fully and truly, accept him, and accept yourself. Love brings the world together. 1 letter difference from Duality, in no way, gurantees a bad relationship. If anything, it means that it's more likely to work than to not. Melancholy and Sanguine Temperaments need each other.

[Pookie]

I have no clue, really. I know I value and , but other than that it's still up in the air. Perhaps the fact that I need to think about it so much points to LII.

The fact that you need to think about it show much actually points to Ti hidden agenda. Which only Ixfp's have.

[WVBRY]

The fact that you need to think about it show much actually points to Ti hidden agenda.

Wrong.

[Pookie]

Do tell.

Ti Hidden Agenda will cause a person to have a NEED to mull and understand correlations between data given(our responses) and the system it falls into(socionics) Thus they seek out others who can give them reference points in this regard, so that their understanding is congruent with the system in question. Which is why Ixfp's link up with Extp's, due to Ti being their creative function and Ti being a IxFp's hidden agenda.

Compare that with the assertion of LII, where Ti is the base. Base function, the most confident function in the psyche. The function that needs the least external approval in order to feel adequate. Do you really think she would freely accept others analysis without also including her own as an LII? Nonsense. Read her post.

Ti Hidden Agenda is clear as day. I feel this way because i am also Ti hidden agenda.

[WVBRY]

Do tell.

Sure

Ti Hidden Agenda will cause a person to have a NEED to mull and understand correlations between data given(our responses) and the system it falls into(socionics) Thus they seek out others who can give them reference points in this regard, so that their understanding is congruent with the system in question. Which is why Ixfp's link up with Extp's, due to Ti being their creative function and Ti being a IxFp's hidden agenda.

This is also true for Ti dual seeking. I know because I am dual seeking.

I think its true for any Fe ego.

Compare that with the assertion of LII, where Ti is the base. Base function, the most confident function in the psyche. The function that needs the least external approval in order to feel adequate. Do you really think she would freely accept others analysis without also including her own as an LII? Nonsense. Read her post.

Ok but bear in mind that HA is something a person admits to less easily then dual seeking. Dual seeking needs help in order to make sense of information and will seek that help from others. HA isnt something one seeks help with normally, though when others do help it is very appreciated.

Ti Hidden Agenda is clear as day. I feel this way because i am also Ti hidden agenda.

You know, I dont really relate to her way of falunting Ti. This doesnt contradict what I wrote above, just that if you relate to her way of processing Ti, and I dont there is something more specific that neither of us can put words on that make her Ti HA. Its not what I explained above, which applies to both Ti HA and DS; its something else.

[PistolShrimp]

The fact that you need to think about it show much actually points to Ti hidden agenda. Which only Ixfp's have.

Do tell.

Ti Hidden Agenda will cause a person to have a NEED to mull and understand correlations between data given(our responses) and the system it falls into(socionics) Thus they seek out others who can give them reference points in this regard, so that their understanding is congruent with the system in question. Which is why Ixfp's link up with Extp's, due to Ti being their creative function and Ti being a IxFp's hidden agenda.

Compare that with the assertion of LII, where Ti is the base. Base function, the most confident function in the psyche. The function that needs the least external approval in order to feel adequate. Do you really think she would freely accept others analysis without also including her own as an LII? Nonsense. Read her post.

Ti Hidden Agenda is clear as day. I feel this way because i am also Ti hidden agenda.

Hmmm this is interesting, thank you! I can be stubborn and unyielding if I know I'm right about something and don't like being told I'm wrong, but otherwise my goal is simply to understand, hence the asking for advice from others who have a better understanding. Couldn't this also possibly be dual-seeking, though? I'm mostly looking for insight and other perspectives to assimilate into my model.

I need to mull my type over because if I've mistyped myself then I feel like I don't fully understand myself.

It's hard for me to determine my confidence level with , which is why I'm stuck between LII and SEI. I'm probably not IEI because I don't feel like my base function is at all by the Socionics definitions; too vague and related to time-sense.