The Atlantic-Arabian War

[tcaudilllg]

That appears to be what the period from 2001 to the defeat of Iran is likely to be remembered as. First Afghanistan, then Iraq, then Lybia, next Syria and finally Iran: the struggle of the Euro-American democratic MDCs against the pseudo-fascist Arabian dictatorship MDCs.

If you are male and live in America, Great Britain, or France, you should probably consider a rifle training course, because it seems probable that with America inexorably tied down in Afghanistan and drained at $100 billion/yr, the leading NATO nations will resort to a draft to hold Iran once its armor has been destroyed. Syria will probably be policed by UN peacekeepers, further straining the French and British armies, although Turkey is also likely to participate (but if Turkey has a particularly strong presence, the insurgency will be particularly fierce).

And get a gas mask and be careful when you are in the subway, because Bashar Assad will do anything to stay in power. America is probably safe, but I don't think the French can make the same claim.... Obviously the English Channel subway is a link between Britain and France, so if you are a British citizen who frequently travels to France -- or to Belgium -- you should consider carrying a gas mask in your bag.

But I also counsel you to look below the surface, because there is something far more sinister afoot than even these dictatorial regimes, I'm afraid.

[somavision]

That appears to be what the period from 2001 to the defeat of Iran is likely to be remembered as. First Afghanistan, then Iraq, then Lybia, next Syria and finally Iran: the struggle of the Euro-American democratic MDCs against the pseudo-fascist Arabian dictatorship MDCs.

If you are male and live in America, Great Britain, or France, you should probably consider a rifle training course, because it seems probable that with America inexorably tied down in Afghanistan and drained at $100 billion/yr, the leading NATO nations will resort to a draft to hold Iran once its armor has been destroyed. Syria will probably be policed by UN peacekeepers, further straining the French and British armies, although Turkey is also likely to participate (but if Turkey has a particularly strong presence, the insurgency will be particularly fierce).

And get a gas mask and be careful when you are in the subway, because Bashar Assad will do anything to stay in power. America is probably safe, but I don't think the French can make the same claim.... Obviously the English Channel subway is a link between Britain and France, so if you are a British citizen who frequently travels to France -- or to Belgium -- you should consider carrying a gas mask in your bag.

But I also counsel you to look below the surface, because there is something far more sinister afoot than even these dictatorial regimes, I'm afraid.

So is it the Syrians that will gas France?

[tcaudilllg]

That appears to be what the period from 2001 to the defeat of Iran is likely to be remembered as. First Afghanistan, then Iraq, then Lybia, next Syria and finally Iran: the struggle of the Euro-American democratic MDCs against the pseudo-fascist Arabian dictatorship MDCs.

If you are male and live in America, Great Britain, or France, you should probably consider a rifle training course, because it seems probable that with America inexorably tied down in Afghanistan and drained at $100 billion/yr, the leading NATO nations will resort to a draft to hold Iran once its armor has been destroyed. Syria will probably be policed by UN peacekeepers, further straining the French and British armies, although Turkey is also likely to participate (but if Turkey has a particularly strong presence, the insurgency will be particularly fierce).

And get a gas mask and be careful when you are in the subway, because Bashar Assad will do anything to stay in power. America is probably safe, but I don't think the French can make the same claim.... Obviously the English Channel subway is a link between Britain and France, so if you are a British citizen who frequently travels to France -- or to Belgium -- you should consider carrying a gas mask in your bag.

But I also counsel you to look below the surface, because there is something far more sinister afoot than even these dictatorial regimes, I'm afraid.

So is it the Syrians that will gas France?

Most likely. I think the Iranians prefer a nuclear touch.

[somavision]

So is it the Syrians that will gas France?

Most likely. I think the Iranians prefer a nuclear touch.

Certainly this could be a possibility, do you really think though that this is the 'likely' outcome?

What sort of time scales are you thinking?

What do you anticipate for the magnitude of these attack/s?

Do you really think that there could be an attack on the channel tunnel? Would this make sense in the light of the high level of security on this international service?

[tcaudilllg]

[quote=somavision;805094]

Most likely. I think the Iranians prefer a nuclear touch.

Certainly this could be a possibility, do you really think though that this is the 'likely' outcome?

What sort of time scales are you thinking?

They are looking for a green light from the Libyan NTC. When Libya is deemed "finished", the Syrian opposition will begin coordinating the end to the protests in Syria and the formal beginning of the rebellion there. As such, I expect the first wave of strikes to begin before Thanksgiving. The thing is, Assad is an LII: he knows how to control people. He has those weapons for a reason. He'll solicit other beleaguered regimes for help before giving in.

What do you anticipate for the magnitude of these attack/s?

Standard Hezbollah fare. Could be worse closer to the Middle East, though.

Do you really think that there could be an attack on the channel tunnel? Would this make sense in the light of the high level of security on this international service?

I don't know. Actually I think Turkey might be a softer target.

This war seems to be about control vs freedom... but the struggles of control vs freedom are really just a symptom of the supremacy of efficiency over ethic.

[krieger]

there won't be a draft in any north american or european country. that'll send people rioting in the streets outright.

[tcaudilllg]

there won't be a draft in any north american or european country. that'll send people rioting in the streets outright.

Then they will

• increase the size of the army.
• put a silent hiring freeze on young males, to drive them into it.

These are nefarious and hideously evil people, who have tightly rationalized their control of the nation's capital and opportunities. I trust you have read the news articles on the financial websites... it just gets worse and worse and worse.

[Simon Ssmall]

there won't be a draft in any north american or european country. that'll send people rioting in the streets outright.

Then they will

• increase the size of the army.
• put a silent hiring freeze on young males, to drive them into it.

These are nefarious and hideously evil people, who have tightly rationalized their control of the nation's capital and opportunities. I trust you have read the news articles on the financial websites... it just gets worse and worse and worse.

It is great you are aware of what is going on around the world. You, as always, are way ahead of everyone else. Me and my wife are "polishing" my "rifle" as we speak and moving to France to fight some gas leaking Syrians.

[tcaudilllg]

I'd reply to ssmall, but it's beneath me.

Oh my god... is Ssmall comparing himself to Einstein? Who does he think he's fooling?

[tcaudilllg]

Apparently Gadhafi has escaped to Algeria. That's seems to be the implication of his reported retreat from Tripoli in an armored convoy. Khamis is apparently dead... apparently in a bid to divert attention from the convoy on behalf of his sister, who was about to give birth. We assume Muammar is also in Algeria as an honored guest of the local warlord.

I swear it seems easier to just gas the country outright, rather than to let them kill each other slowly over many years. This farce of a war has no end in sight. Maybe they should just irradiate the land with a dirty bomb and force the inhabitants to flee outside the country. Problem solved.

[somavision]

Seriously though, it's highly unlikely that there would be any kind of draft in the U.K., there is no appetite for such a thing whatsoever let alone another war in the middle east. The may of course be a limited intervention in Syria, however there's no capacity or budget for any significant ground forces, beyond observers.
The M.O.D will not allow conscription or natonal service as it undermines the professionalism of the British armed forces, although it is perhaps worth noting that there is a currently a process underway where the size of the professional army is being reduced, whilst increasing the size of the reserve forces. This is due to expansive cuts in the defense budget.

Of course what action France takes may be another matter, however it is worth noting that Turkey and France are unlikely to provide ground troops without the U.S.. I very much doubtr this will happen.

History and sense suggest that no action will be taken in Iran unless it is to support a revolution of it's own. I have seen no evidence of this taking place.

[Simon Ssmall]

Oh my god... is Ssmall comparing himself to Einstein? Who does he think he's fooling?

Trust me I deffo don't want to be compared to Einstein, yet people do that sometimes. But let's not derail your serious thread further.

[tcaudilllg]

It is looking for all the world like the U.S. is headed towards a cataclysmic internal confrontation:

http://www.mcclatchydc.com/2011/08/3...#ixzz1WfKjmaQS

And not between the left and right either; no, this is mostly a battle between wings of the left.

http://www.democraticunderground.com...ss=102x4981088

I'll bet that raid/coverup is just the tip of the iceberg of the crimes described in those cables.

[somavision]

It is looking for all the world like the U.S. is headed towards a cataclysmic internal confrontation:

http://www.mcclatchydc.com/2011/08/3...#ixzz1WfKjmaQS

And not between the left and right either; no, this is mostly a battle between wings of the left.

http://www.democraticunderground.com...ss=102x4981088

I'll bet that raid/coverup is just the tip of the iceberg of the crimes described in those cables.

This is bad, some people do bad things in conflict situations. Broader picture this seems to me to be less of an issue than the Abu Graib (this may be misspelt sorry) incidents, as despite any cover up, it could be considered an isolated case even within a broader context if other similar incidents surface, whereas the Abu Graib situation was clearly institutionalised. War is not clean, and these things happen, whatever your politics, that is unfortunately the way people are.

[MisterNi]

It is looking for all the world like the U.S. is headed towards a cataclysmic internal confrontation:

http://www.mcclatchydc.com/2011/08/3...#ixzz1WfKjmaQS

And not between the left and right either; no, this is mostly a battle between wings of the left.

http://www.democraticunderground.com...ss=102x4981088

I'll bet that raid/coverup is just the tip of the iceberg of the crimes described in those cables.

Wow, that's terrible. I don't want to blindly defend US actions in Iraq, especially if there's a chance this might be the work of the US military but the one glaring aspect of the first story is that the people were handcuffed.

As far as I know, US soldiers don't carry handcuffs. That's something the police (say the Iraqi police) would carry. I can't say US soldiers don't carry handcuffs for a fact, but this situation does seem very suspicious. This is still definitely a grim.

[tcaudilllg]

It is looking for all the world like the U.S. is headed towards a cataclysmic internal confrontation:

http://www.mcclatchydc.com/2011/08/3...#ixzz1WfKjmaQS

And not between the left and right either; no, this is mostly a battle between wings of the left.

http://www.democraticunderground.com...ss=102x4981088

I'll bet that raid/coverup is just the tip of the iceberg of the crimes described in those cables.

This is bad, some people do bad things in conflict situations. Broader picture this seems to me to be less of an issue than the Abu Graib (this may be misspelt sorry) incidents, as despite any cover up, it could be considered an isolated case even within a broader context if other similar incidents surface, whereas the Abu Graib situation was clearly institutionalised. War is not clean, and these things happen, whatever your politics, that is unfortunately the way people are.

It's the second uncovered instance... make that the third. There was the massacre by one team -- that got prosecuted -- and a helicopter-based strafing that killed a reporter. And now this.

I don't see why Americans wouldn't be allowed to carry handcuffs as a means of taking prisoners. Seems a lot safer than just following behind them with a gun.

[MisterNi]

This is bad, some people do bad things in conflict situations. Broader picture this seems to me to be less of an issue than the Abu Graib (this may be misspelt sorry) incidents, as despite any cover up, it could be considered an isolated case even within a broader context if other similar incidents surface, whereas the Abu Graib situation was clearly institutionalised. War is not clean, and these things happen, whatever your politics, that is unfortunately the way people are.

It's the second uncovered instance... make that the third. There was the massacre by one team -- that got prosecuted -- and a helicopter-based strafing that killed a reporter. And now this.

Yeah that's true. There have been violent incidents in both Iraq and Afghanistan involving US soldiers.

I don't see why Americans would be allowed to carry handcuffs as a means of taking prisoners. Seems a lot safer than just following behind them with a gun.

Again, don't quote me on this, but I always thought they carried zip-ties for incarceration purposes. I could be wrong about that though.

[tcaudilllg]

A zip tie would risk cutting off circulation to the hands.

[somavision]

This is bad, some people do bad things in conflict situations. Broader picture this seems to me to be less of an issue than the Abu Graib (this may be misspelt sorry) incidents, as despite any cover up, it could be considered an isolated case even within a broader context if other similar incidents surface, whereas the Abu Graib situation was clearly institutionalised. War is not clean, and these things happen, whatever your politics, that is unfortunately the way people are.

It's the second uncovered instance... make that the third. There was the massacre by one team -- that got prosecuted -- and a helicopter-based strafing that killed a reporter. And now this.

I don't see why Americans wouldn't be allowed to carry handcuffs as a means of taking prisoners. Seems a lot safer than just following behind them with a gun.

Yes, I was aware of these. The point is that within the context of the war, these exist as isolated incidents, that do not appear to follow a pattern of official erndorsment, despite any secrecy or cover up that follows them. And I am sure that there are many more instances, however the actions of a soldier or a group of soldiers will be influenced rather than determined by the force which they represent and as such, even if America are the 'good guys' attrocities like this will happen.

[Korpsy Knievel]

A zip tie would risk cutting off circulation to the hands.

Civil and military security forces make routine use of zip ties, especially when it's necessary to restrain large groups of people. They're inexpensive and their compact nature allows several to be carried without creating a bulky encumbrance.

[tcaudilllg]

Word on the street is Gadhafi skipped to Niger.

[tcaudilllg]

Now apparently his son skipped to Niger, so that he can invest all of the assets in Sirte's bank towards the end of creating Gadhafi, Ltd., the proceeds of which will be charitably donated to the Qadifa tribe.

In other news, looks like the Qadifa are kicking ass. I think it's funny that the new media are referring to the Qadifa as "Gadhafi loyalists", as though the American people still trust them at all anyway. Can't wait to hear FOX News got bombed.