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Thread: Quadra Agendas

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    Default Quadra Agendas

    Do you identify with those quadra agendas?

    Alpha - to reflect and to delight in
    Beta - to suffer and to conquer
    Gamma - to collaborate and to acquire
    Delta - to protect and to help
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    I haven't worked this out yet, but it seems as though there are 4 different "essences" represented. Alpha first, very pure and raw: ESFj emotion, INTj thinking, etc. (Or perhaps INTJ logic, ENTP Intutition, ESFJ Ethics, ISFP Sensing). But this carries out throughout the rest of the types and sort of "evolves" over the progression of the quadras/types. Perhaps that sort of concept already exists, though.


    As for what you list.....

    "I guess so"
    The differentiation isn't initially clear between quadras.

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    i agree with alpha. i would also suggest contemplation as it implies a certain delight/devotion. the other 3 quadras sound good to me.
    LII
    that is what i was getting at. if there is an inescapable appropriation that is required in the act of understanding, this brings into question the validity of socionics in describing what is real, and hence stubborn contradictions that continue to plague me.

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    Sure, I could go with the Beta one. I guess my agenda would be to get through all obstacles by whatever means, and to get what I want to get (whether it be a thing, or a state of something, etc.).
    , Se-sub
    8w8-3w8-7w8 sx/sx

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    IEI subtype

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    I think such things are too overall and tell you very little. I would find adjectives to describe each function. Like I did down here in this example.

    New ideas, sarcasm, psychological analysis of people, philosphy, warning if others ideas have or don't have potential, giving advice about who has the right capability for the right job.

    Truth, plans, structure, criticism.

    Laughter, selling your ideas, entertainment, showing empathy, need to change others mood into positive, to be a friend for all.

    Comfort, feeling good psychologically, making comfort out from simple and cheap things, making sure that things don't wear out, finding best leasure activity, designing beautifull enviroment.
    Semiotical process

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    I'm either beta or gamma.

    Delta seems kinda too nice, even though I used to have a habit of giving some money to the homeless whenever I had the chance. (I stopped when I heard about the possible long-term consequences of doing so).
    EIE, ENFj, intuitive subtype.
    E3 (probably 3w4)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kristiina
    I'm either beta or gamma.

    Delta seems kinda too nice, even though I used to have a habit of giving some money to the homeless whenever I had the chance. (I stopped when I heard about the possible long-term consequences of doing so).
    what would those be?
    , Se-sub
    8w8-3w8-7w8 sx/sx

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kraus
    Quote Originally Posted by Kristiina
    I'm either beta or gamma.

    Delta seems kinda too nice, even though I used to have a habit of giving some money to the homeless whenever I had the chance. (I stopped when I heard about the possible long-term consequences of doing so).
    what would those be?
    they buy drugs
    Entp
    ILE

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    More to help than to protect. I identify with "delight in" from Alpha too.
    It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.
    -Mark Twain


    You can't wake a person who is pretending to be asleep.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kristiina
    I'm either beta or gamma.

    Delta seems kinda too nice, even though I used to have a habit of giving some money to the homeless whenever I had the chance. (I stopped when I heard about the possible long-term consequences of doing so).
    i always do this if i can afford it. i don't throw wads and wads of cash at them, but i am not going to die if i spare a dollar.

    i identify the most with gamma or delta. sometimes with alpha.
    6w5 sx
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    If someone asks me for money, I usually have some change in my pocket and I give it to them. I don't give a lot of money but I do give a bit.
    It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.
    -Mark Twain


    You can't wake a person who is pretending to be asleep.

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    I dunno, but the second Alpha description is one I can somewhat identify with.
    thing.

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    Delta, but also a little of Alpha and Gamma. I like to reflect on things, to savor their qualities, and I like to collaborate, to work as a team to achieve a goal. But protecting and especially helping seem to be deeper drives and ones that end up giving me the most personal satisfaction. Occasionally I'll find myself with the Beta agendas, but it never lasts long.
    INFj / EII / FiNe
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    Definitely alpha.
    "To become is just like falling asleep. You never know exactly when it happens, the transition, the magic, and you think, if you could only recall that exact moment of crossing the line then you would understand everything; you would see it all"

    "Angels dancing on the head of a pin dissolve into nothingness at the bedside of a dying child."

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    I identify with both Alpha and Delta equally. (My aspirations are closer to Delta but Alpha feels closer to what I am.)
    “Whether we fall by ambition, blood, or lust, like diamonds we are cut with our own dust.”

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    You've done yourself a huge favor developmentally by mustering the balls to do something really fucking scary... in about the most vulnerable situation possible.

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    I've never given the homeless money... but I have given them drugs, cigs, and food. A friend once tried giving one a counterfit $100 bill but I harrassed him into going back and admitting to it. The bum didn't care but still, I thought that was a dick thing to do to the guy, at least without warning him.

    I think the Delta description fits.

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    all of them
    "Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checkered by failure, than to take rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much, because they live in the gray twilight that knows not victory nor defeat."
    --Theodore Roosevelt

    "Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover."
    -- Mark Twain

    "Man who stand on hill with mouth open will wait long time for roast duck to drop in."
    -- Confucius

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    I affiliate most with the values: to reflect and to help
    "Nothing happens until the pain of staying the same outweighs the pain of change."

    Ne-IEE
    6w7 sp/sx
    6w7-4w5-9w1

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    =)

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    Default Re: Quadra Agendas

    Quote Originally Posted by Expat
    Do you identify with those quadra agendas?

    Alpha - to reflect and to delight in
    Beta - to suffer and to conquer
    Gamma - to collaborate and to acquire
    Delta - to protect and to help
    yeah i identify with the quadra for the most part, but i think its true that my aggressive subconscious functions play a part in my motivations for action.

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    yup, a good description for Quadras, I think)
    But, maybe, for Delta 'pity' fits more, 'cause of
    And for my home Beta you could add hierarchy,' cause of and dreaming, because of Other two are very exact! =)
    ---------
    INFp - The Lyrist - subtype

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kraus
    Quote Originally Posted by Kristiina
    I'm either beta or gamma.

    Delta seems kinda too nice, even though I used to have a habit of giving some money to the homeless whenever I had the chance. (I stopped when I heard about the possible long-term consequences of doing so).
    what would those be?
    Where I grew up, some people would actually rent children, give them something like a sleeping pill, and then stand on the corner and beg for money.
    Having lived in a tent/car for a brief portion of my life, I will only give money /food to someone who either looks like they really need it but aren't asking for it, or have a pet with them. Loyalty to pets wins my heart because one can't take their pet into a shelter, and it's tough trying to work when you don't have a safe place to keep your pet. And for some people, a pet is all they have to keep them going.
    IEE 649 sx/sp cp

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    Default Re: Quadra Agendas

    Quote Originally Posted by Expat
    Do you identify with those quadra agendas?

    Alpha - to reflect and to delight in
    Beta - to suffer and to conquer
    Gamma - to collaborate and to acquire
    Delta - to protect and to help
    I can't stand the concept of "protect" in regards to myself. Advocate fits better imo. (Actually, there is a better term that for the life of me I can't spit out... right there on the tip of my tongue... aargh.)
    IEE 649 sx/sp cp

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    You know, I have always believed that, like most things that deal with the mind, that the lines that separate different mentalities (or in socionics, types) are very thin. We only become so different over time, like two planes flying in two different, but close trajectories. The different “trajectory” is what one sees in oneself, but after growing oneself a balance starts to take place. Taking Tansigent’s definitions of quadra agendas: people who become more than what they started will eventually become not too competent, not too practical, not too witty,or not too naive.
    "Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checkered by failure, than to take rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much, because they live in the gray twilight that knows not victory nor defeat."
    --Theodore Roosevelt

    "Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover."
    -- Mark Twain

    "Man who stand on hill with mouth open will wait long time for roast duck to drop in."
    -- Confucius

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    I agree with "advocate" or something along those lines more than "protect." But I think the ISTps and ESTjs might be more protector types.

    I was going to say "encourage" but maybe something stronger than that, but "advocate" works too.
    It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.
    -Mark Twain


    You can't wake a person who is pretending to be asleep.

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    There's something about Alpha that sounds good to me- though Delta I also like.
    MAYBE I'LL BREAK DOWN!!!


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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicky
    I agree with "advocate" or something along those lines more than "protect." But I think the ISTps and ESTjs might be more protector types.

    I was going to say "encourage" but maybe something stronger than that, but "advocate" works too.
    "Advocate" includes "protect" & "help". There is a better term though, and I still can't get it out of my head.

    though, the more I think about it, the more one could technically say that each of the 16 types advocates SOMEthing.
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    These all sound nice but lets face it, you can only get so much out of two word descriptions. :wink: I still go with Delta.

    Topaz
    The artifact which is the source of my power will not be kept on the Mountain of Despair beyond the River of Fire guarded by the Dragons of Eternity. It will be in my safe-deposit box. The same applies to the object which is my one weakness.

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    Associated with quadra agendas, quadra rallying points:

    Alpha - an idea
    Beta - a person
    Gamma - a principle
    Delta - an institution

    Alpha's idea comes out of a way of living cut free from the institutional life of Delta. It relies on the stability provided by the shelter Delta has provided. They are practical for the next world, impractical for this one. Inspiration is the vector to Beta.

    Aristocratic Beta's rallying point is more a realized Ni archetype of a person than a person. A monarch, a god in the flesh. In Sex Pistol's God Save the Queen we can tell Johnny Rotten really means it, and unironicaly:

    God save the queen her fascist regime
    It made you a moron a potential h bomb !

    God save the queen she aint no human being
    There is no future in englands dreaming

    Dont be told what you want dont be told what you need
    Theres no future no future no future for you

    God save the queen we mean it man (God save window leen)
    We love our queen God saves (God save... human beings)

    God save the queen cos tourists are money
    And our figurehead is not what she seems
    Oh God save history God save your mad parade
    Oh lord God have mercy all crimes are paid

    When theres no future how can there be sin
    Were the flowers in the dustbin
    Were the poison in your human machine
    Were the future your future

    God save the queen we mean it man
    There is no future in englands dreaming

    No future for you no future for me
    No future no future for you
    Mythology is the vector to Gamma.

    Gammas principles are the concretized archetype of Beta re-abstracted to a set of personal beliefs and practices. For this world they are much more practical than Alphas ideas, for the next world (envisioned in such Gamma art as high fantasy) they are much less. Stories and intrigue are the vector to Delta.

    Delta's institutions result from the structure implicity created from the victories of the practical strategies of the winning Gamma archetypes. It solidifies this structure, providing the stability and safety needed for the next cycle.

    This is part of the way I see it...

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    Alpha - to reflect and to delight in
    Beta - to suffer and to conquer
    Gamma - to collaborate and to acquire
    Delta - to protect and to help

    Not alpha. Absolutely not gamma. To suffer is correct, to conquer very occasionally, to protect maybe, to help yes...
    INFP

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    Alpha - to reflect and to delight in
    Beta - to suffer and to conquer
    Gamma - to collaborate and to acquire
    Delta - to protect and to help
    The thing about these quadra definitions is that I always identify with Alpha in them. So many other things about me might suggest Gamma, but when you put it this way, I'm Alpha all the way.

    Then again, it seems that a lot of INTps are Alpha by these definitions, and a lot of INTjs are Gamma....

    I mean, the people going around reflecting about things, and discussing ideas in an open-ended fashion....these tend to be INTps, but their quadra description always seems wrong.

    Of course, Delta ("to protect and to help") sounds a lot like ISFj, or other SF types...none of which can be Delta.

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    The thing about these quadra definitions is that I always identify with Alpha in them. So many other things about me might suggest Gamma, but when you put it this way, I'm Alpha all the way.
    There is definitely something not entirely right about the quadra descriptions, because it seems very easy for an INTp to identify with Alpha. I do that too, but not "all the way", and I can also see that I fit Gamma. My point is that if one uses the quadras to identify someone's type, one can easily make incorrect typings. It is not a very reliable typing method.

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    I identify with alpha and beta.

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