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Thread: Some observations

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    Default Some observations.

    Having grappled with certain questions for quite a while now, I am finally ready to come out with certain things I believe are important issues with Socionics and MBTI in general.

    First, how was the data gathered? Which methods? Case study? Were people observed without knowing? Were the functions uncovered by employment of bare-bones rationalism? My theory is that Mr. Jung was a very intuitive person who sat around at home and thought this system up using his own personal logic. I see nothing wrong with this, but what it means is that Socionics and MBTI are naturally vague and abstract. The mind is a hazy, diffucult-to-define concept which cannot be fully explained. It is self-evident to many people familiar with the system that there are various problems/disagreements associated with it (e.g., j/p, VI, Intertype Relations, and temperament theory).

    If you read any Socionics or MBTI website, you will see a plethora of information on each of the 16 types, but what you will not see is proof. Even what Socionics.com uses as arguments is laughably ineffective when used as empirical data. This is all just intuitive theory. And it's great. It's wonderful. But most importantly, it's malleable. It is something Intuitives can use as a sort of clay to sculpt their understanding of others for themselves to see. We don't understand Intuition, so there needs to be some sort of vague, hazy system for people who are driven by it to be creative in, and this is that system.

    Think about this, what need is there for S types to understand the system? All they need is for a Counselling Psychologist to tell them to act a certain way to realize improvement in their relationships, and they will follow the advice, because "doc knows best." If they read the profiles they will probably take them literally, and not see the patterns and principles underneath the words, which may have untold consequences. Additionally, wouldn't S types be perfectly content explaining away some social/personal/psychological dilema with a "concrete" explanation? "Some people just ain't right." I think this system is by intuitives, for intuitives. The S's who dabble in it are only contributing observations, which don't work well here because trying to explain human behavior with reasoning based entirely on observations would be one hilarious endeavor.

    I believe that there is an "underground" level of human communication that only certain people strongly participate in. It cannot be fully expressed in words, nor can it be justified with empirical evidence. But the people who share in it know its merits and are drawn together whenever a well-made system created from it appears. I believe Carl Jung may have had a conscious intent when he began his journey into the human mind, but it was his intuition that started him off and guided him along, and unless I am wrong and there is some way to scientifically verify that type theory is more than theory, what is Socionics if not simply "Club Intuition?"

    Also, I believe that I am an ENTp, although only my intuition has had a say.


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    Default Re: Some observations.

    Edited for gayness.

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    All knowledge seems to start out that way. Descartes advised not studying something that was not knowable lest by attempting it too soon you just added to the general murkiness and moved in the direction opposite the truth. It's just a matter of where you fall I guess. Jung did base his ideas off observation however. He observed people with mental disorders and came up with two types the Introverted Thinker and the Extraverted Feeler. I think the intuition was used more in ferreting out the other types. I for one am not a proponent of observation but by no means do I support intuition as the means of attaining knowledge either. However I will say it is a good place to start, a place of fining inspiration not knowledge. Troublesome and useful but a tool that should be used, wisely and with a good amount of discretion.

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    FWIW, sometimes I think intuitive is not the best way to be (even though you may not have a choice).

    S types run things.

    Ultimately, it's facta and data which convinces most people.
    Entp
    ILE

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    Quote Originally Posted by Blaze
    S types run things.
    Not if you have them all killed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by discojoe
    Quote Originally Posted by Blaze
    S types run things.
    Not if you have them all killed.
    That might be hard to do, though. Unless you are a ruthless psycho nazi!
    Entp
    ILE

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    I agree with everything you said.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Blaze
    Quote Originally Posted by discojoe
    Quote Originally Posted by Blaze
    S types run things.
    Not if you have them all killed.
    That might be hard to do, though. Unless you are a ruthless psycho nazi!
    of course he is, he's an entp just like hitler
    i have played in every toilet

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    Edited for gayness.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Transigent
    Quote Originally Posted by trey
    of course he is, he's an entp just like hitler
    No way possible in hell and creation that Hitler was a Logical type. Slim chance of Extraversion also.
    Heh. What do you think? isfj?

    sorry, just kidding.
    Entp
    ILE

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    Edited for gayness.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Transigent
    Quote Originally Posted by Blaze
    Heh. What do you think? isfj?

    sorry, just kidding.
    Actually, I think INFj.
    Naaah!

    Maybe estp?
    Entp
    ILE

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blaze
    Maybe estp?
    No, notice his mustache? ESTp mustaches are thnner and wider. Also, only INFx's form fists when screaming. This combined with his angry disposition toward countries that have letters coming from the second part of the alphabet (Poland, Russia) leads me to believe he is a J type.

    Hence, INFj.

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    Edited for gayness.

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    Infj's usually don't want to hurt anybody, though.

    DEfinitely and enneagram type 8, however that connects to socionics!
    Entp
    ILE

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    Bah, you've hijacked my topic.


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    Get used to it.

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    I am bumping this for good times and further discussion.

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    Default .

    ...............

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    Default Re: .

    Quote Originally Posted by ayoforjager
    I resent that. You are an elitist. I'll tell you whats worse, intuitives reading posts like like these and blaming all of the world's problems on sensing types in order to compesate for for feelings of inferiority which stem from their own lack of ability when it comes to dealing with the world in concrete terms. I'm an ISTP, do you think you are smarter than me simply because you are an ENTP? If so, you are just as bad as the sensing types you assume are so simple.
    hurrah you've saved your internet self, and vague conceptual lettering from certain e-embarassment. you are a hero to unknowing billions.

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    Default .

    yeah whatever

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