John Frusciante, Red Hot Chili Peppers

[sar]

[Not A Communist Shill]

I get IEE, IEI, and EII as impressions I guess...he reminds me from those of Tim Booth from the band James, who I had thought might be IEE, but not in any definitive way.

[sar]

interesting. yeah, someone brought up iee somewhere else and I thought that was interesting... i don't know why but these three particular types can be really confusing for me. ieis and eii because...well, they seem very similar and iee because they are supposed to be the most "introverted" extroverts...anyways, i'm fairly certain he's introverted...it doesn't quite come across in these clips but in others when he's in a group i think it's sort of obvious...

[woofwoofl]

Here's an interview with IEI Kurt Cobain for a comparison - notice the extremely similar mannerisms

Also, what he says (excerpt from the beginning of the first interview):

John Frusciante - "um... well, I think... y, you know... I think the... that, um... the force that created us is expressing itself through our existence - I don't believe that a musical idea starts in your brain, I believe that it starts at a place before that that we don't have any direct contact with, and um... and, and I believe that everything that we do, everything, everything that we create is, is nature expressing itself the same way that a, that a flower grows out of the ground, or a tree grows out of the ground, it's nature expressing itself, and you... you might say that the tree is expressing itself by the way its branches move out, but it's the force of, it's the force that drives nature that's uh... that's, that... that we don't... the tree is... the tree is the visible, uh... the visible appear... the visible thing that appears to our five, to our senses, but um... but I don't believe it's why all the source of everything is perpetuated all the time..."

If that's not /, then I don't know what the hell is!

F>T is pretty obvious too, as is Introtim>Extratim...

IEI it is, your Identity person and my Semi-dual!

[sar]

woofwoofl, you're fucking awesome. yeah...i knew there had to be some reason why he was my favorite artist in ever... i'm fairly certain he's IEI aswell...but, honestly, on one of my last posts you figured out MY type very quickly...how exactly did you do that? it sort of freaked me out... and left me like:

[sar]

p.s. kurt is also one of my favorite artists in ever! nevermind was the sh*t! ...okay...i'll stop now...

[stanprollyright]

After watching both of those videos as well I'm gonna restate IEE. Definitely intuitive, seems irrational as well. He seems to be comfortably being expressive and emotional, but he describes things in a relatively straightforward way without dramatization, so definitely Fi > Fe. He also does this thing that i've noticed myself and other Fi creatives do where he just HAS to get all is facts straight. Weak, but valued Te. He HAS to remember Pythagorus, he HAS to get that year right in the other interview in the other thread, even though it doesn't matter. When describing a scenario or asked a question he gives a lot of unnecessary background information (another Te mobilizing/Ti PoLR trait). Ne/Si is pretty obvious, he describes his view about music by making connections and creating a big picture, about the inherent potential of music in nature (is there anything more Ne/Si than that?). In the other interview he can't seem to get comfortable at first, but then once he gets on a roll talking he completely ignores the way he is sitting (weak Si, probably valued, gets ignored in favor of Ne).

While I get some Fi/Te (esp Te HA) I get more Ne than anything, and it seems to be an area where he speaks with a lot of confidence. And the interview follows a reductionist approach instead of expansionist (-Ne instead of +Ne). He seems too scattered to be rational (even though he's probably on drugs...). His philosophy itself is irrational, at the end he talks about how he had to just everything go and let creative inspiration come to him.

So yeah. IEE.

[sar]

I just...don't see extroversion...or for that matter...Or rather, I see much more...

[Gilly]

After watching both of those videos as well I'm gonna restate IEE. Definitely intuitive, seems irrational as well. He seems to be comfortably being expressive and emotional, but he describes things in a relatively straightforward way without dramatization, so definitely Fi > Fe. He also does this thing that i've noticed myself and other Fi creatives do where he just HAS to get all is facts straight. Weak, but valued Te. He HAS to remember Pythagorus, he HAS to get that year right in the other interview in the other thread, even though it doesn't matter. When describing a scenario or asked a question he gives a lot of unnecessary background information (another Te mobilizing/Ti PoLR trait). Ne/Si is pretty obvious, he describes his view about music by making connections and creating a big picture, about the inherent potential of music in nature (is there anything more Ne/Si than that?). In the other interview he can't seem to get comfortable at first, but then once he gets on a roll talking he completely ignores the way he is sitting (weak Si, probably valued, gets ignored in favor of Ne).

While I get some Fi/Te (esp Te HA) I get more Ne than anything, and it seems to be an area where he speaks with a lot of confidence. And the interview follows a reductionist approach instead of expansionist (-Ne instead of +Ne). He seems too scattered to be rational (even though he's probably on drugs...). His philosophy itself is irrational, at the end he talks about how he had to just everything go and let creative inspiration come to him.

So yeah. IEE.

You wiiiiisssh

"Fe types need to be dramatic, blah blah wahh wahh"

You're probabvly a Beta, anyways.

[sar]

what do you think, gilly? also, here is another interview where i think you can sort of spot the introversion more clearly...also, i have a hunch that the lead singer of the band (the one who talks most in this interview) is an ENFp...

[Gilly]

Frusciante is IEI, Keidis is SLE. RHCP are Beta as fuck, the lyrics Keidis writes wreak of Ni and Se.

[stanprollyright]

You wiiiiisssh

Doesn't mean it's not true

I just...don't see extroversion...or for that matter...Or rather, I see much more...

Sorry I didn't give you the answer you wanted to hear...

As I said in the other thread, extroversion/introversion isn't really a dichotomy. And as for Ne vs. Ni: Explain.

[sar]

cool. obviously i totally agree with frusciante...i thought keidis was an extrovert..at least he pretends to be one anyways...very interesting typing of him..i don't think i've heard that one before. as for the chilis being "beta as fuck"...yeah...gonna agree with you on that one aswell

[Gilly]

Doesn't mean it's not true



Sorry I didn't give you the answer you wanted to hear...

As I said in the other thread, extroversion/introversion isn't really a dichotomy. And as for Ne vs. Ni: Explain.

You are IEI

[stanprollyright]

Heh. Maybe.

[sar]

i think your getting lost in the particulars and aren't seeing the big picture...he's obviously introverted...don't know what else to say on that...also, lol how sure are you of your own type? i'm just wondering

[Slacker]

that guy is beta NF.

[stanprollyright]

i think your getting lost in the particulars and aren't seeing the big picture...he's obviously introverted...don't know what else to say on that...also, lol how sure are you of your own type? i'm just wondering

For the third time: introverted isn't really a thing in soconics.

http://socionist.blogspot.com/2008/0...traverted.html

re: my self type: I'm relatively sure, but I'm open to debate. Gilly isn't the only one who thinks I'm beta.

[The Ineffable]

Ne type IMO, I guess ILE > IEE > XII.

[Galen]

Just from pictures I would say Beta irrational, INFp > ESTp.

[woofwoofl]

woofwoofl, you're fucking awesome. yeah...i knew there had to be some reason why he was my favorite artist in ever... i'm fairly certain he's IEI aswell...but, honestly, on one of my last posts you figured out MY type very quickly...how exactly did you do that? it sort of freaked me out... and left me like:

Thanks!

As for your posts, the "what if socionics was b.s.? thread you made had a first post that was absolutely overflowing with and Beta NF vibes!

I also got a vague impression of the Vortical-Synergistic cognitive style at work - Positivist seemed likely in that you were going forward with an idea boldly instead of doing the "two sides to every story", or the "commitment to uncertainty" kinda thing the Negativists do (I wish I had a better way of explaining this, but I don't ), and your way of thinking is more holistic, and less blatantly linear, than that which is found in us Causal-Deterministic people...

Also, your posts just flat-out looked like, and gave me the same vibe that the IEI posts around here give me - IEIs have a certain provocativeness to them that I can spot

Also, this:

i think your getting lost in the particulars and aren't seeing the big picture...he's obviously introverted...don't know what else to say on that...also, lol how sure are you of your own type? i'm just wondering

The bolded part points you towards a Result type as well

Also, type interactions - I know when I find a Semi-dual, we get along very well BulletsAndDoves, another IEI, pointed this out quite a bit, and I noticed it too...

Also with John Frusciante, I noticed a similarity in the vocal delivery with IEIs, in that it's very emotionally expressive in a certain way (often at the expense of hitting the "correct" notes, which I don't mind at all ) - here's some comparisons:

John Frusciante - Smile From The Streets You Hold
Nirvana - Negative Creep (vocal track only)
Smashing Pumpkins - Bodies (Billy Corgan is Beta NF and probably IEI)
The Cure - Just Like Heaven (Robert Smith is another almost, if not completely, definite IEI)

[The Ineffable]

John Frusciante - "um... well, I think... y, you know... I think the... that, um... the force that created us is expressing itself through our existence - I don't believe that a musical idea starts in your brain, I believe that it starts at a place before that that we don't have any direct contact with, and um... and, and I believe that everything that we do, everything, everything that we create is, is nature expressing itself the same way that a, that a flower grows out of the ground, or a tree grows out of the ground, it's nature expressing itself, and you... you might say that the tree is expressing itself by the way its branches move out, but it's the force of, it's the force that drives nature that's uh... that's, that... that we don't... the tree is... the tree is the visible, uh... the visible appear... the visible thing that appears to our five, to our senses, but um... but I don't believe it's why all the source of everything is perpetuated all the time..."

If that's not /, then I don't know what the hell is!

Certainly not Se, but Ni if anything like that. I relate to that, btw - and he sounds like Ne, has no cursivity in ideas, these Ni artists I hear tell these things like a poetry or something, it's consistent and polished, not like you've just seen an alien world you can't explain . Ne Irrationals talk like that, I mean *real* Ne Irrationals.

Edit: I'm talking about the 2nd interview.

[sar]

thanks everyone for responding...i think my hunch is right about mr. frusciante but the different perspective are always interesting. woofwoofl, VERY interesting stuff as to how you figured all that out...btw I've met a semi-dual...she's one of my best friends and she is absolutely the shit! can't get mad at her...it's basically impossible...only thing that sucks is that i think she has anxiety problems...I wonder if that's common among ESFps...hmm...anyways...again, thanks everyone!

p.s. smile from the streets you hold is one of my favorite songs from him! and i f*cking love robert smith!

[sar]

The Ineffable, i'm fairly certain he's not ILE...my brother is ILE and the two seem pretty different to me...

[Beautiful sky]

SLI...why not? They can be activated by Fi, seeming both like EII and IEI. Look at the whole picture. What is demonstrated briefly in one video is not a good indication of type, unless you can VI (like me ).

Ni can be base, creative, activating, demonstrative and make the person look like all of these types at once.

You seem to have weak Ne.

[woofwoofl]

thanks everyone for responding...i think my hunch is right about mr. frusciante but the different perspective are always interesting. woofwoofl, VERY interesting stuff as to how you figured all that out...btw I've met a semi-dual...she's one of my best friends and she is absolutely the shit! can't get mad at her...it's basically impossible...only thing that sucks is that i think she has anxiety problems...I wonder if that's common among ESFps...hmm...anyways...again, thanks everyone!

p.s. smile from the streets you hold is one of my favorite songs from him! and i f*cking love robert smith!

Thanks! yep, us SEEs are pretty damn awesome Galen mentioned something about people with in their Ego block to be a bit on the shyer side, and that makes sense to me - I'm not shy, per se, but I can be pretty reserved at times, which probably clashes a lot with what enters a lot of minds when the term "ESFp", and the idea of an Extratim, Sensor, Ethical, and Irrational, all in one person, comes up...

And yes... Robert Smith is... so amazing

The Ineffable, i'm fairly certain he's not ILE...my brother is ILE and the two seem pretty different to me...

Here's some ILEs in music! I picked examples where the ILEs had a huge say in the turnout of the music:

Dead Kennedys - Jock-O-Rama (the ILE Jello Biafra seems to really dislike a lot, and relentlessly mocks large displays of it)
Primus - Golden Boy
"Weird Al" Yankovic - White & Nerdy

[sar]

Maritsa33...there are so many little things I find irritating in your one little message that it's difficult for me not to ... i've heard about you on here...and i've heard "wonderful" things about your VI methods... i've been told by various people to either a) ignore you or b) just tell you straight up to shut the f*ck up...but i won't do either since i don't know you and want to believe you mean well and instead i'll resort to asking that you please "chill"

[Beautiful sky]

That's funny you should say that. So, what's irritating about my post? The fact that I don't agree with you?

[sar]

no...because several people on here disagreed with me...(see above)...it's the WAY you present your information that irritates me...such arrogance, like a giant turd sandwich...a) don't try typing me...i didn't ask to be typed...and you're failing. b) don't act so certain about the little thoughts that pop into your brain. have some sense of humility c) frusciante is iei. (lol, just throwing that one in there) d) you are, once again, the mother of all whores.

"I'm suggesting Ne to you so that tells me that you have weak Ne. The question is will you pick up on my suggestion (which would indicate you being Ne activation type). HUMMMMM .....Socionics is interesting stuff."

i don't even know what this sentence means. were on the internet...seriously, get real...you don't even know me. the only person that was able to type me correctly on here was woolfwoolf...and that's just cause...he's fucking the shit.

[Beautiful sky]

no...because several people on here disagreed with me...(see above)...it's the WAY you present your information that irritates me...such arrogance, like a giant turd sandwich...a) don't try typing me...i didn't ask to be typed...and you're failing. b) don't act so certain about the little thoughts that pop into your brain. have some sense of humility c) frusciante is iei. (lol, just throwing that one in there) d) you are, once again, the mother of all whores.

I hope that gets you banned.

But, if it doesn't, IDK; I do what I want and if you'll notice, I don't put people down in the process of doing so.

If you're IEI than you would have weak Ne.

[sar]

yeah...that'll probably get me banned...but it's all good. it's been fun. I was angry...couldn't help it...someone needed to say it...for what it's worth i feel bad... i apologize maritsa...

[sar]

and it's recently occured to me i misunderstood what you were saying...yep...i'm fucking stupid... again, sorry...

[stanprollyright]

If you're IEI than you would have weak Ne.

Uh...ignoring is a strong function...

[woofwoofl]

no...because several people on here disagreed with me...(see above)...it's the WAY you present your information that irritates me...such arrogance, like a giant turd sandwich...

Look at this thread (and go to the bottom if you want to hop to my post) to see the virtues of EII rationale and writing style

d) you are, once again, the mother of all whores.

Ouch! Now that wasn't very nice and who would post that on two threads?

A person with Fe subtype, I say!

the only person that was able to type me correctly on here was woolfwoolf...and that's just cause...he's fucking the shit.

Awesome thanks

A big reason why that is, though, is because I fumbled up a good amount of times along the way, and the people around me here let me know when that happened the more you get comfortable with Socionics, the more you'll know when and where lots of someone's mental goldmine lays - everyone's got them, and you don't want to miss out on the prize...

And NFs don't need to be taking poops on each other - we'll save that crazy business for the cross-quadra NTs! they're absolutely relentless...

yeah...that'll probably get me banned...but it's all good. it's been fun. I was angry...couldn't help it...someone needed to say it...for what it's worth i feel bad... i apologize maritsa...

Maritsa's pretty awesome as for any agitation here, I wouldn't lose too much sleep over it - this board's seen far worse things, and without any apologies being offered too...

[sar]

woofwoofl...you even got my subtype correct....what a ridiculously awesomely awesome typer you are. i like ridiculously awesomely awesome typers . I feel really stupid about all of this...I just misunderstood some stuff and just really have a problem with her "writing style"...meh....

[The Ineffable]

Here's some ILEs in music! I picked examples where the ILEs had a huge say in the turnout of the music:

Dead Kennedys - Jock-O-Rama (the ILE Jello Biafra seems to really dislike a lot, and relentlessly mocks large displays of it)
Primus - Golden Boy
"Weird Al" Yankovic - White & Nerdy

You're misrepresenting this type - including me - you're not the only one though, it's a common prejudice. It is amateurish to type someone as ILE because he's "crazy" or hilarious, ILEs can relate and make profound - and "serious" - music, in fact ILEs are often deeply philosophical, existentialists, pensive, and so on. Weird Al is likely ILE, but Primus seems Ni/Se Irrational, your criterion of typing musician as ILE for "crazy happy music" is retarded (as perhaps 90% of the posts in the "Alpha music" thread).

[Absurd]

ILEs are often deeply philosophical, existentialists, pensive

Haha, you're philosophical, existentialist and pensive.

[roger557]

Bump.





He gives me a similar vibe to Johnny Depp. IEI-Ni ?