Results 1 to 25 of 25

Thread: Pride - the main motive of LSEs-ESTjs?

  1. #1
    Banned
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    TIM
    TiNe
    Posts
    7,967
    Mentioned
    11 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default Pride - the main motive of LSEs-ESTjs?

    Yes or no?

  2. #2
    Ti centric krieger's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    5,983
    Mentioned
    80 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    not the first thing that comes to mind. one ESTj blogger i'm currently reading up on explicitly stresses the importance of modesty and humility in what he does:

    http://investorandtrader.blogspot.co...emotional.html

  3. #3
    Banned
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    TIM
    TiNe
    Posts
    7,967
    Mentioned
    11 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Right but, ESTJs work their ass off. They absolutely want something in return.

    And, they don't exactly look too kindly on people who they feel aren't pulling their share of the work. Not least because they feel a responsibility to make sure the job get's done.

    My point is, all this dedication and self-sacrifice requires a compensation.

  4. #4
    when you see the booty Galen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    everywhere at once
    Posts
    8,449
    Mentioned
    203 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    No, that's just how EJs function. My ESFj aunt and dad are constantly doing things just because the way their energy works requires them to keep moving.
    "And above all, watch with glittering eyes the whole world around you because the greatest secrets are always hidden in the most unlikely places. Those who don't believe in magic will never find it." -Roald Dahl

    http://forum.socionix.com/
    It's pretty cool

  5. #5
    Lobo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    TIM
    EII 6w5
    Posts
    2,080
    Mentioned
    6 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    I wouldn't say that pride is what makes them do things. The LSE I work with likes to do things because he genuinely believes that he is going to do a better job than other people. I used to get annoyed at this attitude, but then I realized that he actually reduces my workload by being that way, so I don't bother correcting his impression of me . Other LSEs just like to get things done. I've met a lot of LSEs, and pride doesn't seem to be their motive. I do find that they tend to be proud people though.

  6. #6
    lump's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    TIM
    Fi/Te 641 sp/sx
    Posts
    12,613
    Mentioned
    632 Post(s)
    Tagged
    3 Thread(s)

    Default

    i thought this prime motive stuff was more like enneagram stuff. when i think pride + type i think 2s.

    would motive in socionics be related to superid or something maybe? or not.

  7. #7
    Darn Socks Director Abbie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Southwest USA
    TIM
    LSE
    Posts
    6,724
    Mentioned
    237 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by tcaudilllg View Post
    Not least because they feel a responsibility to make sure the job get's done.
    If I were a mod, I would fix this abomination.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lobo View Post
    LSE...genuinely believes that he is going to do a better job than other people.

    ESTj
    1w2 sp/so 1-2-6
    Brilliand's Younger Sister
    Squishy's Older Sister

    Johari Nohari

    Quote Originally Posted by Ritella View Post
    Over here, we'll put up with (almost) all of your crap. You just have to use the secret phrase: "I don't value it. It's related to <insert random element here>, which is not in my quadra."
    Quote Originally Posted by Aquagraph View Post
    Abbie is so boring and rigid it's awesome instead of boring and rigid. She seems so practical and down-to-the-ground.

  8. #8
    lump's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    TIM
    Fi/Te 641 sp/sx
    Posts
    12,613
    Mentioned
    632 Post(s)
    Tagged
    3 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Director Abbie View Post
    If I were a mod, I would fix this abomination.
    why?

  9. #9

  10. #10
    Haikus Beautiful sky's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    EII land
    TIM
    EII INFj
    Posts
    22,740
    Mentioned
    531 Post(s)
    Tagged
    6 Thread(s)

    Default

    My LSE boyfriend says it's not the prime motive, but it is important. Wait, he's texting me more information....tbc.

    He says "revenge"; I don't know why...it's part joking around. I'm trying to get the facts about why. Revenge at everyone who's ever underestimated him and his tallent. I suspect this doesn't hold true for every LSE, but remember, they are extraverts and if they don't have enough external support, things might sink in emotionally that may be tied to their self-esteem (needing relationships and getting self affirmation from external world).

    He loves attention although is anti-social and doesn't always want to interact with others; wants to be recognized and admired (to leave something behind to be remembered for would be nice).

    He says HA, being perfect and being loved make sense.
    Last edited by Beautiful sky; 05-23-2011 at 06:02 AM.

  11. #11
    UDP's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    East Coast West Coast Dirty South
    TIM
    LSE
    Posts
    14,826
    Mentioned
    33 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa33 View Post
    My LSE boyfriend says it's not the prime motive, but it is important. Wait, he's texting me more information....tbc.

    He says "revenge"; I don't know why...it's part joking around. I'm trying to get the facts about why. Revenge at everyone who's ever underestimated him and his tallent.
    I don't relate to revenge. I don't care enough about what other people think for that.

    I suspect this doesn't hold true for every LSE, but remember, they are extraverts and if they don't have enough external support, things might sink in emotionally that may be tied to their self-esteem (needing relationships and getting self affirmation from external world).
    that's true for me, although i wish it weren't so at times. Like right now, actually.


    He loves attention although is anti-social and doesn't always want to interact with others; wants to be recognized and admired (to leave something behind to be remembered for would be nice).

    He says HA, being perfect and being loved make sense.
    I sort of relate to that.
    For me it's more, I want to be able to do things that bring about the 'right' or 'best' results, and I want other people to be happy about that, heh. If I'm working for a specific result, and achieve it, that's 'good' and I'd like other people to also feel that way.




    To add my own stuff...
    Pride is important/a factor, but for me it's very personalized. I am my own master of what results are feasible and what is possible - (yes, even if I don't do well in regard to time/intuition). If those results aren't met, that's not as good as it could be. If they are met, then that's good, and I feel like I have every reason to be happy.

    When other people around me aren't meeting their results, I can get ancy. I can become overwhelmed by a desire to do something or influence them, negatively or positively, to get the results done. Often at the expense of relationship quality or intimacy, unfortunately. I get tired of poor results over time, or an inability for things to 'function well'.

    I like control; the ability to manipulate things to a desired outcome. If I don't have control, I feel less secure in having a specific outcome.

  12. #12
    Haikus Beautiful sky's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    EII land
    TIM
    EII INFj
    Posts
    22,740
    Mentioned
    531 Post(s)
    Tagged
    6 Thread(s)

    Default

    He's a lot more routine than you are UPD and he's trying to be spontaneous, which tells you a lot about his strict regimented organization and trying to manage time to make things secure and predictable. I just don't see you doing that. I don't see you being anything like him, which is tense, scheduled, planned and not wasting time. You're very relaxed and very Si focused.
    Last edited by Beautiful sky; 05-24-2011 at 04:44 AM.

  13. #13
    UDP's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    East Coast West Coast Dirty South
    TIM
    LSE
    Posts
    14,826
    Mentioned
    33 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Sounds like he's Te subtype, sure. Maybe also a 1w2 or 3w2, eh?

    but I'm not sure exactly what you know of me being regimented or organized or not... I'm rather much that way. And also fairly predictable, too. But I'm sure that's because I'm "SLI" to you.

  14. #14
    Haikus Beautiful sky's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    EII land
    TIM
    EII INFj
    Posts
    22,740
    Mentioned
    531 Post(s)
    Tagged
    6 Thread(s)

    Default

    He never misunderstands me, never twists my emotions (a result of Fe PoLR, which has often resulted from you); he's not mistrustful of people (as are most introverts) and does not require someone to gain his trust (as you did when I first signed on this site); you don't share yourself, your opinion or your feelings with people you don't know; my boyfriend holds a positive attitude towards people and shares his feelings and opinions when solicited, openly, generously (as does DJ- who claims he's not an Extravert, although holds a positive attitude towards all people, which is not likely to be the same for introverts, who are much more selective).

  15. #15
    UDP's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    East Coast West Coast Dirty South
    TIM
    LSE
    Posts
    14,826
    Mentioned
    33 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    your boyfriend sounds more like an ESE heh, but I assume that's more because of your idealizations.

  16. #16
    Haikus Beautiful sky's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    EII land
    TIM
    EII INFj
    Posts
    22,740
    Mentioned
    531 Post(s)
    Tagged
    6 Thread(s)

    Default

    One MAJOR THING:

    HE'S VERY PROTECTIVE OF ME. A major aspect of an LSE type, which is not your trait.

    "They may, however, show brief flashes of protectiveness and confrontation if they have been attacked in any way.
    LSEs have a clear awareness of how they look to those around them."

    Someone attacked our relationship and you should have seen him react. He told this person off, severed ties, and didn't care how long he know him or how "important" this person was.
    Last edited by Beautiful sky; 05-24-2011 at 05:20 AM.

  17. #17
    UDP's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    East Coast West Coast Dirty South
    TIM
    LSE
    Posts
    14,826
    Mentioned
    33 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    I'm not 'protective' of you on the forum because I disagree with your take on socionics.

  18. #18
    Haikus Beautiful sky's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    EII land
    TIM
    EII INFj
    Posts
    22,740
    Mentioned
    531 Post(s)
    Tagged
    6 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by UDP View Post
    I'm not 'protective' of you on the forum because I disagree with your take on socionics.
    You don't seem to get it. I'm an Ne type and weakest Se, which means I can't defend my interests and I love my ideas (for which I need support for). Which means I need a strong willed person, a protective person. That isn't you. You haven't taken that role. I don't know how I look to others around me (as Dj has pointed out several times before). This is another reason why I need to be protected as I concentrate not on how I come off but what the content of my ideas are.

    Duals do it naturally. Especially LSE protect those who are seen as weak and incapable of defending themselves. I believe you've generously stood by and let me be trembled in all sorts of ways.

    Sorry, you're not my dual.

  19. #19
    Darn Socks Director Abbie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Southwest USA
    TIM
    LSE
    Posts
    6,724
    Mentioned
    237 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    I'm not protective of duals on the forum. I can't tell whether they want to be protected.


    Pride is a side-effect, not a cause.

    ESTj
    1w2 sp/so 1-2-6
    Brilliand's Younger Sister
    Squishy's Older Sister

    Johari Nohari

    Quote Originally Posted by Ritella View Post
    Over here, we'll put up with (almost) all of your crap. You just have to use the secret phrase: "I don't value it. It's related to <insert random element here>, which is not in my quadra."
    Quote Originally Posted by Aquagraph View Post
    Abbie is so boring and rigid it's awesome instead of boring and rigid. She seems so practical and down-to-the-ground.

  20. #20
    So fluffeh. Cuddly McFluffles's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    TIM
    ESI
    Posts
    2,780
    Mentioned
    28 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    UDP said it already, but I would think of an LSE's pride as a sense of satisfaction over doing something well. That's not a bad thing, within reason.
    Johari/Nohari

    "Tell someone you love them today, because life is short; shout it at them in German, because life is also terrifying."

    Fruit, the fluffy kitty.

  21. #21
    UDP's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    East Coast West Coast Dirty South
    TIM
    LSE
    Posts
    14,826
    Mentioned
    33 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Ryene Astraelis View Post
    UDP said it already, but I would think of an LSE's pride as a sense of satisfaction over doing something well. That's not a bad thing, within reason.
    I have no idea why, but, my mind is connecting that (above) to this:

    8w9's are more likely to let anger build up within themselves, which may manifest in constant bitterness and harshness. Like 8w7's, they view conflict as a way of life, but do not enjoy it as much, since when they are in rebellion against the outside world, they are also in rebellion against a part of themselves that would rather do without the hassle and zone out. They are slow to conflict - they would often rather stand "en garde" and wait for their adversary to "cross the line" - but when they involve themselves in conflict, their hostility has a relentless, sado-masochistic quality to it. They willfully numb their tender feelings, and show a tough face to the world. 8w9's are conspicuously sensitive to the issue of personal boundaries - both their own and everyone else's. "Stay out of my business, and I'll stay out of yours," they will often say in a measured tone that conveys great respect for the other while making it subtly clear that they will not be crossed. When they lighten up, they can be intensely devoted to the protection of others, especially defenseless people whom they have affection for. However, trust does not come easily to them. "Every person's survival is his own business."
    And to this:



    ~the first two minutes when Seprihoth loses it.
    I'm not saying Sephiroth the character is LSE or 8w9. It just triggered a connection.

  22. #22
    Marie84's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Toronto, Canada
    TIM
    EII
    Posts
    2,359
    Mentioned
    4 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    it actually makes sense if you read the LSE parts as LSI, Ij temperament instead of Ej (referring to Maritsa's posts)
    EII INFj
    Forum status: retired

  23. #23
    Banned
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    TIM
    LSE
    Posts
    18,006
    Mentioned
    162 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Marie84 View Post
    it actually makes sense if you read the LSE parts as LSI, Ij temperament instead of Ej (referring to Maritsa's posts)
    All is alright, then. Down the rabbit hole we go.

  24. #24
    UDP's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    East Coast West Coast Dirty South
    TIM
    LSE
    Posts
    14,826
    Mentioned
    33 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Advice on how to properly show appreciation... to me at least. ....


    Recognize what I have pride in
    Absolutely refrain from flattery about the matter or any sort of over-graciousness or lofty praise, unless you know me very well, and even then, use this rarely.
    Instead of verbally praising me, demonstrate in your actions and perceptions that you understand why I take pride in something (like, being a good _____), and that you also see the value in it.
    Comment not "that I'm a good _____", but that I do XXXX well. If you can specifically demonstrate why I did something well (which involves being aware of what happened, what was possible, and the before and after of things), then I'll respect that awareness on your part very much.

    If you attempt to flatter me without demonstrating to me in very real terms that you understand what it is that took place and why it matters to me, then it's actually worse than you saying nothing at all.

    But if you do understand, and you do see, and then you feel like actually expressing it, then I'll actually feel good.


    Even if I come off like "well, you should have known that before" or " ...('duh'.....)", it will mean a lot. I'll likely respond with "well, it's just a matter of course" or "sure". And say very matter of factly that I appreciate that you were able to acknowledge it. But it does mean a lot, when it's real.


    It may be pretty hard to genuinely accept a compliment or praise about something very serious or that I take great pride in, and I feel very personally awkward about how to 'show appreciation' for such praise, because I usually don't like it and think it's fake or an attempt at trying to butter me up. But, if I can see that you appreciate "the work" in and of itself, then I'll feel more open to accepting whatever you present me with, praise or criticism or dismay.

  25. #25
    UDP's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    East Coast West Coast Dirty South
    TIM
    LSE
    Posts
    14,826
    Mentioned
    33 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Really good wholesome food and baked good also helps, too

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •