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Thread: Philosphical question:

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    Default Philosphical question:

    I have a book. And I offer to you to read it. Ofcourse you are curious what it says.

    The book contains only one page and it reads:

    "Who ever reads this, has to kill another person who has read this page, but who has refused to kill a person. There are plenty of them around since a lot of people have been reading this text and some have killed after that, but plenty have refused. Ofcourse when you've killed the person, you are free again to do what you want and will not be on the hitlist of some next person who reads this text. But if you refuse to kill, others are allowed to kill you."

    Are you going to kill as ordered, or will you refuse?

    You are ofcourse allowed to explain your answer. For example how did you feel after reading the book.
    Last edited by Jarno; 04-29-2011 at 12:20 AM.

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    just dont kill the person, and if someone tries to kill you.. kill them.
    Pretty simple

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    No, because I don't live in Africa or believe in the Ninja Jesus.

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    I'd kill you then burn the book.

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    I'd definitely refuse it. It would be murder if I kill someone, no matter if a book told me to do it or if might get into danger myself. If some other person killed me because of this reason, I can't do anything about it. If I managed to fight back and kill them, it would be over, but I wouldn't attack. (like crazedrat said)
    „Man can do what he wants but he cannot want what he wants.“
    – Arthur Schopenhauer

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bionicgoat View Post
    I'd kill you then burn the book.
    haha.

    that's oke, because I didn't kill anyone, so you acted as the book ordered you.

    Unfortunately there are a couple of copies of this book around, so you didn't solve that problem if that was your intention.

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    Quote Originally Posted by poli View Post
    No, because I don't live in Africa or believe in the Ninja Jesus.
    I can assure you that this situation has happened in some form in real life.

    You don't have to believe in Ninja Jesus for that.

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    I will give the answer and intention of my question, tomorrow evening.

    I hope more people will participate in the meanwhile.

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    i'd probably just re-use the book in some sort of collage or something. bam. no one after me in the murder train. or i'd get paranoid and destroy it in case some creeper who saw the collage decided to kill me

    ooh, burning it as performance art.
    Last edited by Lotus; 04-28-2011 at 11:58 PM.
    maybe a saint is just a dead prick with a good publicist
    maybe tommorow's statues are insecure without their foes
    go ask the frog what the scorpion knows

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarno View Post
    haha.

    that's oke, because I didn't kill anyone, so you acted as the book ordered you.

    Unfortunately there are a couple of copies of this book around, so you didn't solve that problem if that was your intention.
    but i solved the problem of the book, or you, knowing that I didn't kill the last person who refused.

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    Quote Originally Posted by borderline View Post
    i'd probably just re-use the book in some sort of collage or something. bam. no one after me in the murder train. or i'd get paranoid and destroy it in case some creeper who saw the collage decided to kill me

    ooh, burning it as performance art.
    but remember there are already a lot of people who've read the book and need to kill a refuser.

    You are now a refuser and therefor on their hitlist.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bionicgoat View Post
    but i solved the problem of the book, or you, knowing that I didn't kill the last person who refused.
    yes but do you see what effect the book has had on you. You've become a killer. Just by reading a bit of text.

    you think you've outsmarted the book, but the books intention is just to force you to become a killer. And it won.

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    i thought people only kill those who read the book before them? not after... and how do they know i didn't kill someone? is everyone watching me? what is going on???
    maybe a saint is just a dead prick with a good publicist
    maybe tommorow's statues are insecure without their foes
    go ask the frog what the scorpion knows

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    When you put a context tomorrow evening, just don't forget that the answers without the context will become meaningless.

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    Quote Originally Posted by borderline View Post
    i thought people only kill those who read the book before them? not after... and how do they know i didn't kill someone? is everyone watching me? what is going on???
    ofcourse it's difficult to put all the rules in this thread. So to not make it complicated let's assume that when you've killed someone, it is simply known by the rest.

    And if you don't... they will also know, and sharpen their knives.

    I will edit a part to make it clear it are not just people who read it before you, it's simply killers vs refusers.

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    well if this is becoming some serious cult thing i'd go to the media, the FBI etc. or something. they'd go apeshit
    maybe a saint is just a dead prick with a good publicist
    maybe tommorow's statues are insecure without their foes
    go ask the frog what the scorpion knows

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    Quote Originally Posted by crazedratsshadow View Post
    just dont kill the person, and if someone tries to kill you.. kill them.
    Pretty simple
    And if the killer uses a sharpshooting rifle. You won't see it coming.

    If this is your final choice, wear body armor all day.

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    Quote Originally Posted by borderline View Post
    well if this is becoming some serious cult thing i'd go to the media, the FBI etc. or something. they'd go apeshit
    I can assure you, people have done this.

    Went to the FBI.

    FBI actually takes it serious, but doesn't know who all the people are who've read the book and are planning a murder. They are civilians like you and me. Especially you, since you've read it now '-)

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    i hate you
    maybe a saint is just a dead prick with a good publicist
    maybe tommorow's statues are insecure without their foes
    go ask the frog what the scorpion knows

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    Don't kill anyone. It's not like I left my name and address on the page.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ritella View Post
    Over here, we'll put up with (almost) all of your crap. You just have to use the secret phrase: "I don't value it. It's related to <insert random element here>, which is not in my quadra."
    Quote Originally Posted by Aquagraph View Post
    Abbie is so boring and rigid it's awesome instead of boring and rigid. She seems so practical and down-to-the-ground.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Director Abbie View Post
    Don't kill anyone. It's not like I left my name and address on the page.
    yes, unfortunately, some people might watch you from a distance.

    Actually, there are already some people in this thread, who now know you've read the text. And they are desperately looking for a victim, since they don't want to be killed themselves.

    Now what abbie?

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    The commands given in a book obligate or constrain no one. I would not kill another person who has read the book but not killed anyone, nor would I expect a reasonable person to read the book and then kill me because I read the book and then did not kill someone. Only foolish people would do such a thing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarno View Post
    Now what abbie?
    I don't kill anyone, of course. Low chance someone will read it, low chance someone will obey it, low chance they'll target me, and even if they did it'd wind up with them in prison and me in heaven.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ritella View Post
    Over here, we'll put up with (almost) all of your crap. You just have to use the secret phrase: "I don't value it. It's related to <insert random element here>, which is not in my quadra."
    Quote Originally Posted by Aquagraph View Post
    Abbie is so boring and rigid it's awesome instead of boring and rigid. She seems so practical and down-to-the-ground.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nil View Post
    The commands given in a book obligate or constrain no one. I would not kill another person who has read the book but not killed anyone, nor would I expect a reasonable person to read the book and then kill me because I read the book and then did not kill someone. Only foolish people would do such a thing.
    hmm so you think this world doesn't contain foolish people?

    Maybe that's even more foolish to assume. I better watch out if I were you since this means your killers are less foolish (smarter) than you.

    Some people even fly in buildings just to get 77 virgins.

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    I'd hand it back to you and say, "I'm sorry, but I can't read. Enjoy your book."

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    Quote Originally Posted by Director Abbie View Post
    I don't kill anyone, of course. Low chance someone will read it, low chance someone will obey it, low chance they'll target me, and even if they did it'd wind up with them in prison and me in heaven.
    Yes I agree, there is a low chance they target you. You got me there. (although some people have really been killed, I'm not joking)

    Now I know you are smart and very brave, but I also would like to know, what do you think about the persuasion method of the book.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarno View Post
    hmm so you think this world doesn't contain foolish people?

    Maybe that's even more foolish to assume. I better watch out if I were you since this means your killers are less foolish (smarter) than you.
    True, foolish people exist, but it's not that important really. If I die, I die. It is not worth definitely killing another for the possibility of one's own life being taken. Abbie's last post was excellent, by the way.

    I fail to see how the whole process would start anyway. The first person who read the book did not have anyone to kill. He must have died. But the first person to read the book was the person who wrote it. Why would he do that?

    You just enjoy random pockets of chaos in the order and structure of civilized society, don't you Jarno?

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    Quote Originally Posted by squark View Post
    I'd hand it back to you and say, "I'm sorry, but I can't read. Enjoy your book."
    Smart thinking. I like that.

    Though then I would read it out loud to you. Running away won't help cause it would mean you confirm to be aware of the text already.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nil View Post
    True, foolish people exist, but it's not that important really. If I die, I die. It is not worth definitely killing another for the possibility of one's own life being taken. Abbie's last post was excellent, by the way.

    I fail to see how the whole process would start anyway. The first person who read the book did not have anyone to kill. He must have died. But the first person to read the book was the person who wrote it. Why would he do that?

    You just enjoy random pockets of chaos in the order and structure of civilized society, don't you Jarno?
    hey don't shoot the messenger! Although that may sounds ironically in this thread.

    I don't enjoy this chaos, I'm just posting a philosophical question. As I said, I will explain my intention tomorrow evening. Though I find the responses fascinating. Let it be clear that I sincerely hope nobody gets killed.

    Why the first person wrote it, I don't know, I'm sorry I can't answer that, I would like to know that also actually.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarno View Post
    And if the killer uses a sharpshooting rifle. You won't see it coming.

    If this is your final choice, wear body armor all day.
    If they want to put that amount of effort into killing me they can. But I don't believe they will, since no one really has that level of motivation. They'd probably do it half ass, like everything else. So I am fine walking around and not giving a fuck about this stupid game.

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    Quote Originally Posted by squark View Post
    I'd hand it back to you and say, "I'm sorry, but I can't read. Enjoy your book."


    Quote Originally Posted by Jarno View Post
    Yes I agree, there is a low chance they target you. You got me there. (although some people have really been killed, I'm not joking)

    Now I know you are smart and very brave, but I also would like to know, what do you think about the persuasion method of the book.
    The "join our secret club" part is more persuasive than the "do or die" part.

    ESTj
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ritella View Post
    Over here, we'll put up with (almost) all of your crap. You just have to use the secret phrase: "I don't value it. It's related to <insert random element here>, which is not in my quadra."
    Quote Originally Posted by Aquagraph View Post
    Abbie is so boring and rigid it's awesome instead of boring and rigid. She seems so practical and down-to-the-ground.

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    Quote Originally Posted by crazedratsshadow View Post
    If they want to put that amount of effort into killing me they can. But I don't believe they will, since no one really has that level of motivation.
    Maybe I'm repeating myself, but some people get even motivated enough to crash a plane in a building, without getting anything in return. Yeah 77 ficticious virgins :-d

    How motivated will someone be if he can escape a death sentence.

    Though I like your bravery. It's probably the right attitude to respond to this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Director Abbie View Post
    The "join or secret club" part is more persuasive than the "do or die" part.
    interesting point!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarno View Post
    Smart thinking. I like that.

    Though then I would read it out loud to you. Running away won't help cause it would mean you confirm to be aware of the text already.
    I'd sigh, pat your shoulder and say, "sucks to be you man," because you just read it.

    Seriously though, I wouldn't kill anyone, and would probably assume it was just a joke.

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    Quote Originally Posted by squark View Post
    Seriously though, I wouldn't kill anyone, and would probably assume it was just a joke.
    hmm assumptions can be dangerous.

    Especially when you realize that your assumption was wrong when someone with a knife in his hand wakes you up during your sleep.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarno View Post
    yes but do you see what effect the book has had on you. You've become a killer. Just by reading a bit of text.

    you think you've outsmarted the book, but the books intention is just to force you to become a killer. And it won.
    but nobody else has to be a killer because of that book, or moreso you for presenting the book to people, after i burn it and kill you.

    also, you assume that I'm not already a killer

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bionicgoat View Post
    i burn it.
    Genius.

    ESTj
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ritella View Post
    Over here, we'll put up with (almost) all of your crap. You just have to use the secret phrase: "I don't value it. It's related to <insert random element here>, which is not in my quadra."
    Quote Originally Posted by Aquagraph View Post
    Abbie is so boring and rigid it's awesome instead of boring and rigid. She seems so practical and down-to-the-ground.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bionicgoat View Post
    but nobody else has to be a killer because of that book, or moreso you for presenting the book to people, after i burn it and kill you.

    also, you assume that I'm not already a killer
    Quote Originally Posted by Director Abbie View Post
    Genius.
    It's not the only book around unfortunately. I wish it were that simple.

    There are copies...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarno View Post
    It's not the only book around unfortunately. I wish it were that simple.
    k. i read the title page and blow up the publisher after i burn the book and kill you. before i blow up the publisher though I look through their files and find the master list of book distributers so that I can kill them too (and burn their books).

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarno View Post
    hmm assumptions can be dangerous.

    Especially when you realize that your assumption was wrong when someone with a knife in his hand wakes you up during your sleep.
    I'd be easier to kill if he let me sleep. Waking me up gives me too much of a chance to live, why risk it?

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