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    Default socionics research journals

    for the people who still think socionics hasn't been scientifically investigated.

    here are the sites with journals.

    http://www.socionics.ibc.com.ua/ej/index.html

    http://www.socionics.ibc.com.ua/ejpsy/index.html

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    Jarno's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ashton View Post
    where da controlled experimentz at?
    click any of the left side journals and many are named under 'research'.

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    the flying pig Capitalist Pig's Avatar
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    These publications belong to "institutes" that are not officially accredited academic institutions. Moreover, diplomas in Socionics are provided by these same institutions as part of a degree mill operation. Your websites are about as credible as the Discovery Institute, a popular intelligent design think tank.

    Try again.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Capitalist Pig View Post
    These publications belong to "institutes" that are not officially accredited academic institutions. Moreover, diplomas in Socionics are provided by these same institutions as part of a degree mill operation. Your websites are about as credible as the Discovery Institute, a popular intelligent design think tank.

    Try again.
    so all these professors are amateurs who don't know what they are doing? please go tell them that they are participating in a non scientific event comparable to intelligent design, and don't forget to report back to me how hard you got laughed at.


    Alexandre Boukalov, Ph.D. in Psychology, Ph.D. in Socionics, Director of International Socionics Institute

    Grigory Bukalov, Doctor of Technical Sciences, Professor;

    Elena Donchenko, Doctor of Sociology, Kiev Institute of Sociology of Ukraine National Academy of Sciences

    Semen Churumov, Ph.D. in Psychology;

    Valerij Hrycak, Dr., Professor of London University;

    Ivan Zyazyun, Ph.D., Professor, Academician of Ukraine Academy of Pedagogical Sciences, Director of Institute of Pedagogic and Psychology of Professional Education

    Dmitry Ivanov, Ph.D.,

    Leonid Marakhovsky, Doctor of Technical Sciences, Professor of the Computer Faculty of Kiev National Economical University

    Victor Novikov, President of International Academy of Psychology, Doctor of Psychology, professor

    Nikolay Obozov, Academician of International Academy of Psychology, Doctor of Psychology, Professor

    Yury Saenko, Doctor of Economics, Chief of the Department of Kiev Institute of Sociology of the Ukraine National Academy of Sciences

    Grigory Reynin, Ph.D. in Psychology, Ph.D. in Socionics, the Real Member of International Academy of Informatization (IASC)

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    the flying pig Capitalist Pig's Avatar
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    Look, I don't have time to research these individuals and the basis for their credentials. It doesn't list when or where they obtained their degrees making the effort of tracking down their academic fidelity difficult (after all, their "legitimate" degrees could have been authorized by seemingly official institutions that obtained their accreditation from an accreditation mill). It doesn't really matter either way, just because you have a legitimate doctorate in something doesn't mean you can't be a quack. Michael Behe is the only prominent advocate of Intelligent Design who has an authentic Ph.D in biology, yet he is still considered a quack for his unconventional views on evolutionary biology. The people listed with Ph.Ds in Socionics are probably quacks as well, because there are no officially accredited academic institutions offering proper courses in the study of Socionics. Socionics is not a widely accepted field of scientific or social science inquiry. Again, I refer you to the Wikipedia article on diploma mills.

    I could make a website for a non-profit organization that claims the Earth is flat and list a bunch of people with important-sounding degrees and write articles for journals self-published by the institute and give off a veneer of authenticity, too. It doesn't mean that the idea of a flat Earth isn't a half-baked falsehood.

    You are falling victim to the same style of tactics utilized by Biblical creationists in the United States whose agenda is to take evolution out of science classrooms, or at least present it alongside "alternative" theories like Intelligent Design. They even create euphemisms like "creation science" in an effort to give an air of authority to their dumbass theories that have no basis in reality. Socionics in Russia is apparently no different.

    Try again.
    Last edited by Capitalist Pig; 04-02-2011 at 12:50 AM.

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    Ti centric krieger's Avatar
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    Grigory Reynin, Ph.D. in Psychology, Ph.D. in Socionics

    lol

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    Quote Originally Posted by Capitalist Pig View Post
    Look, I don't have time to research these individuals and the basis for their credentials. It doesn't list when or where they obtained their degrees making the effort of tracking down their academic fidelity difficult (after all, their "legitimate" degrees could have been authorized by seemingly official institutions that obtained their accreditation from an accreditation mill). It doesn't really matter either way, just because you have a legitimate doctorate in something doesn't mean you can't be a quack. Michael Behe is the only prominent advocate of Intelligent Design who has an authentic Ph.D in biology, yet he is still considered a quack for his unconventional views on evolutionary biology. The people listed with Ph.Ds in Socionics are probably quacks as well, because there are no officially accredited academic institutions offering proper courses in the study of Socionics. Socionics is not a widely accepted field of scientific or social science inquiry. Again, I refer you to the Wikipedia article on diploma mills.

    I could make a website for a non-profit organization that claims the Earth is flat and list a bunch of people with important-sounding degrees and write articles for journals self-published by the institute and give off a veneer of authenticity, too. It doesn't mean that the idea of a flat Earth isn't a half-baked falsehood.

    You are falling victim to the same style of tactics utilized by Biblical creationists in the United States whose agenda is to take evolution out of science classrooms, or at least present it alongside "alternative" theories like Intelligent Design. They even create euphemisms like "creation science" in an effort to give an air of authority to their dumbass theories that have no basis in reality. Socionics in Russia is apparently no different.

    Try again.
    But the Earth is flat! There is even a society dedicated to it with research so it must be true: Flat Earth Society.

    They have a list of articles and even a book written by a guy with a PhD! Research.
    “No psychologist should pretend to understand what he does not understand... Only fools and charlatans know everything and understand nothing.” -Anton Chekhov

    http://kevan.org/johari?name=Bardia0
    http://kevan.org/nohari?name=Bardia0

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    the flying pig Capitalist Pig's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by labcoat View Post
    Grigory Reynin, Ph.D. in Psychology, Ph.D. in Socionics

    lol
    haha, I know right?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bardia View Post
    But the Earth is flat! There is even a society dedicated to it with research so it must be true: Flat Earth Society.

    They have a list of articles and even a book written by a guy with a PhD! Research.
    Oops, well there goes my logic!

    Jarno, you're not going to convince anybody until you can produce a research paper published in a mainstream, peer-reviewed psychology journal that is funded and published independently of so-called Socionics institutes, who clearly have an agenda in legitimatizing Socionics -- or at least making it appear legitimate -- and who profit from dubious corporate consulting services and by offering people worthless pieces of paper that "ceritfy" them in the made-up study of Socionics.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Capitalist Pig View Post
    Jarno, you're not going to convince anybody until you can produce a research paper published in a mainstream, peer-reviewed psychology journal that is funded and published independently of so-called Socionics institutes, who clearly have an agenda in legitimatizing Socionics -- or at least making it appear legitimate -- and who profit from dubious corporate consulting services and by offering people worthless pieces of paper that "ceritfy" them in the made-up study of Socionics.
    there are probably a lot of false certifications around of numerous branches. That doesn't immediately make that branche unscientific.

    Socionics meets a lot of criteria for the demarcation problem to be called scientific. MBTI has been proven with scientific tests many times. Why would socionics be different.

    If you want to know whether it meets your specific criteria, why don't you ask Boukalov. He probably has no problem supplying you the right information.
    Last edited by Jarno; 04-03-2011 at 12:54 AM.

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    the flying pig Capitalist Pig's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarno View Post
    there are probably a lot of false certifications around of numerous branches. That doesn't immediately make that branche unscientific.
    But the entire "branch" often isn't made up entirely out of thin air.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jarno View Post
    Socionics meets a lot of criteria for the demarcation problem to be called scientific.
    No, it hasn't.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jarno View Post
    MBTI has been proven with scientific tests many times. Why would socionics be different.
    The MBTI isn't science, nor is it based on science, and psychometrics never claimed to be anything more than a statistical tool that looks for consistent results. However, the consistency of results =/= science, or that there is an empirical foundation, and MBTI barely yields reliable results as it is. The fact of the matter is there is no experiment that lends credence to the theory of Jung's psychological types, or the Myers-Briggs Type Indicator. The existence of types has never been proven. Jungian "psychology" as a whole is not fucking science.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jarno View Post
    If you want to know whether it meets your specific criteria, why don't you ask Boukalov. He probably has no problem supplying you the right information.
    Yeah, I'll get right on that.

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    Glorious Member mu4's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Capitalist Pig View Post
    These publications belong to "institutes" that are not officially accredited academic institutions. Moreover, diplomas in Socionics are provided by these same institutions as part of a degree mill operation. Your websites are about as credible as the Discovery Institute, a popular intelligent design think tank..

    SOOOOOOO IRONIC...


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    the flying pig Capitalist Pig's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hkkmr View Post
    SOOOOOOO IRONIC...


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    this is retarded
    maybe a saint is just a dead prick with a good publicist
    maybe tommorow's statues are insecure without their foes
    go ask the frog what the scorpion knows

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    Jarno's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Capitalist Pig View Post
    The fact of the matter is there is no experiment that lends credence to the theory of Jung's psychological types, or the Myers-Briggs Type Indicator. The existence of types has never been proven.
    There have been numerious scientific experiments done for mbti. You're probably just not aware of them.

    Cowan 1989
    Devito 1985
    Mccrae & Costa 1989
    Hanewitz 1978
    Apostal 1991
    Murray & Johnson 2001
    Barrineau 2005
    Stilwell Wallick Thal & Burleson 2000
    Harrington & Loffredo 2001
    Mathew & Bhatewara 2006
    Huifang & Shuming 2004
    Loffredo & Opt 2006
    Carlson & Levy 1973
    Gram Dunn & Ellis 2005
    Carlson 1980

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    And pray, tell, what journals were these experiments published in?
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    Quote Originally Posted by tereg View Post
    And pray, tell, what journals were these experiments published in?
    pray? are you referring to me? who's pray?

    if you are referring to me, those experiments were published in international journals. for example costa and mcrae are the ones who also made the theory of 'the big five'.

    I have my information from the book theories of personality, it's from a course in psychology.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarno View Post
    pray? are you referring to me? who's pray?
    http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/pray_tell
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    Quote Originally Posted by tereg View Post
    ah oke.

    I hope I've provided the requested information in my former post.

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    I did see a research paper published to Journal of Personality and Social Psychology in 1989 by McCrae and Costa called "The structure of interpersonal traits: Wiggins's circumplex and the five-factor model"

    Is this the example you would be referring to?
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    Devito 1985
    DeVito, A J (1985) [Review of Myers-Bnggs Type Indicator] InJ V Mitchell, Jr
    (Ed), Ninth mental measurements yearbook (Vol 2, pp 1030-1032) Lincoln University of Nebraska Press

    Hanewitz 1978
    http://www.eric.ed.gov/ERICWebPortal...accno=EJ177178

    Published in something called "Crime and Delinquincy" which as far as I can tell http://cad.sagepub.com/ is "a policy-oriented journal offering a wide range of research and analysis for the scholar and professional in criminology and criminal justice."

    Gram Dunn & Ellis 2005
    I found http://www.aptinternational.org/asse..._1105_apti.pdf this which was published in the Journal of Psychological Type, a journal edited by proponents of MBTI

    Should I keep digging?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarno View Post
    Harrington & Loffredo 2001
    The relationship between life satisfaction, self-consciousness, and the Myers-Briggs type inventory dimensions.
    by R Harrington, D A Loffredo The Journal of Psychology (2001)

    Mathew & Bhatewara 2006
    Mathew, P., & Bhatewara, S. (2006). Personality differences and preferred styles of conflict
    management among managers. Abhigyan, 23, 38-45.

    "Abhigyan: The quarterly journal of Foundation of Organizational Research and Education"

    "ABHIGYAN is the quest for identity of institutions and people. In Sanskrit it means direct perception aided by prior knowledge."
    http://www.connectjournals.com/subsc...mark=CJ-002598
    Last edited by tereg; 04-03-2011 at 07:28 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarno View Post
    Barrineau 2005
    Barrineau, P. (2005). Personality Types Among Undergraduates who Withdraw from Liberal Arts Colleges: Journal of Psychological Type Vol 65(4) Oct 2005, 27-32.

    See above.

    Stilwell Wallick Thal & Burleson 2000
    Stilwell, N. A., Wallick, M. M., Thal, S. E., & Burleson, J. A. (2000). Myers-Briggs type and medical
    specialty choice: A new look at an old question. Teaching and Learning in Medicine, 12(1),
    14-20.

    "Teaching and Learning in Medicine serves as an international forum for scholarly, state-of-the-art research on the purposes and processes of teaching and learning as they relate to the education of medical professionals."

    http://www.informaworld.com/smpp/tit...80~tab=summary
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    Quote Originally Posted by Capitalist Pig View Post
    No, it hasn't.
    while jarno is generally full of shit and his participation in this thread is full of glaring ignorance, bullshit, and dogma, there's one important point to be made here, which is that socionics makes some potentially falsifiable and testable predictions about intertype relations at a close psychological distance (presumably operationalizing types, or perhaps more realistically, quadras as the result of some clinical assessment).

    the fact that this work hasn't to my knowledge been done in any real or controlled way (regarding socionics, and not MBTI or variants thereof) doesn't suggest that it cannot represent a scientific problem.

    put more technically, rick delong described socionics as a protoscience (or potentially merely nonscience) rather than a strict pseudoscience. the more i think about how various hypotheses in socionics might be framed the more i agree with this description.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarno View Post
    Loffredo & Opt 2006
    Loffredo, D. A. & Opt, S. K. (2006). Argumentativeness and Myers-Briggs Type Indicator (MBTI). Journal of Psychological Type.

    Carlson & Levy 1973
    Carlson, R. & Levy, N. (1973). Studies of Jungian typology: I. Memory, social perception, and social action. Journal of Personality. 41(4), 559-576.

    "Journal of Personality publishes scientific investigations in the field of personality. It focuses particularly on personality and behavior dynamics, personality development, and individual differences in the cognitive, affective, and interpersonal domains. The journal reflects and stimulates interest in the growth of new theoretical and methodological approaches in personality psychology."


    Ok, so far I've looked at 9 studies listed, three of them deal directly with psychology and behavior, three of them are from a journal that is edited by MBTI proponents, one deal with education, one is a journal for criminology, and one wasn't even a journal but a university press publication
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    Jesus is the cruel sausage consentingadult's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by niffweed17 View Post
    put more technically, rick delong described socionics as a protoscience (or potentially merely nonscience) rather than a strict pseudoscience. the more i think about how various hypotheses in socionics might be framed the more i agree with this description.
    You're such an intelligent person, what took you so long?
    The future of Socionics:
    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa View Post
    Many black Americans are SEE type.

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    Quote Originally Posted by consentingadult View Post
    You're such an intelligent person, what took you so long?
    go to hell.

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    not a bumblebee octo's Avatar
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    PsycINFO basic search:

    big five: 21701 results
    MBTI: 1459 results (myers-briggs: 1440 results)
    keirsey: 87 results
    socionics: 0 results
    enneagram: 49 results
    Quote Originally Posted by Agee The Great View Post
    Nobody here...besides me, seems to know what SLE is except for maybe Maritsa.

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    Quote Originally Posted by octopuslove View Post
    PsycINFO basic search:

    big five: 21701 results
    MBTI: 1459 results (myers-briggs: 1440 results)
    keirsey: 87 results
    socionics: 0 results
    enneagram: 49 results
    maybe because you need the russian variant of psycinfo?

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    Quote Originally Posted by niffweed17 View Post
    socionics makes some potentially falsifiable and testable predictions about intertype relations at a close psychological distance
    wait, you still use falsification as a criteria for the demarcation problem? do you live in the same year as I do?

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    Quote Originally Posted by tereg View Post
    Ok, so far I've looked at 9 studies listed, three of them deal directly with psychology and behavior, three of them are from a journal that is edited by MBTI proponents, one deal with education, one is a journal for criminology, and one wasn't even a journal but a university press publication
    yes they are all journals written by scientists for scientists... so? You still don't find that scientific enough? Then nothing can be scientific enough and that makes you simply unreasonable and most likely not educated enough to make a judgement about it.

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    Professional science has become a Te-dominated field. Unless it can be marketed, it doesn't get much attention anymore in the west.

    One of the shortcomings of capitalist democracy, one might expect. However, qualitative studies tend to be done by counseling psychologists in their spare time, not professional experimenters.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarno View Post
    yes they are all journals written by scientists for scientists... so? You still don't find that scientific enough? Then nothing can be scientific enough and that makes you simply unreasonable and most likely not educated enough to make a judgement about it.
    The ones that are relevant are the studies published in journals that deal directly with psychology. I don't think a study on some aspect of personality that is published in a criminology journal is one that will carry much weight.

    What I'm saying is, is that out of a handful of the studies that you've listed, some of them are published in journals that aren't even related to the topic. However, I concede that some of them do come from reputable psychological journals.
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    Quote Originally Posted by tereg View Post
    However, I concede that some of them do come from reputable psychological journals.
    thank you.

    jeez....

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    and can someone tell me the relevance of this:

    in 1995 Russia's Academy of Natural Sciences recognized socionics as a discovery, and its creator - Aušra Augustinavičiūtė - was awarded a diploma and a Peter Kapitza medal.

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    Quote Originally Posted by niffweed17 View Post
    go to hell.
    Why, are you in need of company?
    The future of Socionics:
    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa View Post
    Many black Americans are SEE type.

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    let's get the thread back on the rail.

    can someone tell me if this is relevant:

    in 1995 Russia's Academy of Natural Sciences recognized socionics as a discovery, and its creator - Aušra Augustinavičiūtė - was awarded a diploma and a Peter Kapitza medal.

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    Korpsy Knievel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarno View Post
    let's get the thread back on the rail.

    can someone tell me if this is relevant:

    in 1995 Russia's Academy of Natural Sciences recognized socionics as a discovery, and its creator - Aušra Augustinavičiūtė - was awarded a diploma and a Peter Kapitza medal.
    See for yourself.

    http://eng.tech-atlas.net/about/66/1311/
    http://www.raen.ru/

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    Quote Originally Posted by k0rpsey View Post
    It's a scientific organization with nobel prize winners... hmm something tells me that socionics might be more than astrology if they reward it with a medal...

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    I just found an article that discusses also Socionics, apparently one of the authors is from the university I'm studying at (University of Amsterdam), so this makes in official!

    http://www.google.nl/url?sa=t&source...gOq0dRSPM5lFVg
    The future of Socionics:
    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa View Post
    Many black Americans are SEE type.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jarno View Post
    It's a scientific organization with nobel prize winners... hmm something tells me that socionics might be more than astrology if they reward it with a medal...
    Their site is now here:

    http://www.raen.info

    However:

    The public organization "Russian Academy of Natural Sciences" has no relation to the Russian Academy of Sciences , and criticized a number of academics and staff of Sciences for the fact that some of its members - individuals who are far from science, not having a proper education and recognized scientific publications [3] [4 ] [5] . In particular, Academician Eduard Kruglyakov notes:

    This Academy is notorious for that, other than really honored and respected scholars, there are crooks [6] .

    http://lurkmore.ru/%D0%A0%D0%90%D0%95%D0%9D

    http://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%A0%...B0%D1%83%D0%BA

    Members:

    Azhazha, Vladimir G. - Ph.D., Soviet and Russian ufologist
    Garyaev, Peter P. - Ph.D., creator of the pseudo-scientific theory of the "wave of the genome"
    Petrik, Viktor Ivanovich - inventor, author of a number of pseudo-studies
    Chudinov, Valery A. - Ph.D., author of a pseudo- historical and philological studies
    Spines, Gennady - co-author of pseudo-scientific theory of " torsion fields "
    Fomenko, Anatoly - topologist, fringe historian
    Konovalov, Sergey - MD

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