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Thread: Fi vs Fe, do you find the other side suspicious?

  1. #1
    Creepy-male

    Default Fi vs Fe, do you find the other side suspicious?

    As per the title. As a Merry or Serious quadra member, do you find the way the other side of the dichotomies expresses emotions or feelings to be suspicious or untrustowrthy, or "off" in any way?

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    Um, I wouldn't say Fe comes off as "suspicious" as much as I would call it clueless. Fe valuers can seem very oblivious to my inner workings, like they see what I consider to be immovable as a mutable object that can be played with. They can seem too eager to change how I feel about something without considering the meaning or reason behind that feeling.

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    The word I would use is "insincere". Sometimes it feels like they're trying to sell me on something they think I wouldn't be happy with unless they presented it a certain way.

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    seems a little dry, maybe?

    Suspicious? Nah. Off? Sometimes.
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    betas should be kept in zoos for children to stare and throw pop corn at.

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    It can seem insincere, fake. Sometimes it just feels as over the top and unescessary.
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    Fe and Fi are the same right? Just in two different worlds.

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    High Priestess glam's Avatar
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    Fi types don't like to let people get too excited or riled up. it often feels dishonest to me.

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    I met this IEE a while ago. At present he seems a bit overeager to get to know me and seems inappropriately friendly. It's just really weird to me. Then again this EIE girl out of nowhere decided she was my best friend and biggest supporter and was totally out to help me do the impossible and kick reason to the curb. I'm about equally suspicious of both, so maybe I'm just naturally very slow to trust people of unclear motive?

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    I think something that's important for people to remember is that an attitude towards a certain function is not type dependent. It's based on your experiences, imo. I grew up in a house where both Fe and Fi were prioritized, maybe a little more on the Fe side. I can see how someone who didn't have much exposure to Fx will find it suspicious since usually you'd find one or the other as a more convincing way to gauge interpersonal relationships. People who focus on Fe are able to create "loving" environments a lot faster that Fi people, who tend to undervalue and are hesitant of free expression of gay emotions in the environment. It seems to me that those who prioritize Fi create unnecessary rules before being open to emotionally express themselves in their environment, which is something that feels really good if you just let go. However, it doesn't mean that I won't find it annoying when I'm in a group that solely focuses on Fe, because it feels empty to me. The combination of both is really nice, when you can appreciate what both contribute.

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    Quote Originally Posted by glamourama View Post
    Fi types don't like to let people get too excited or riled up. it often feels dishonest to me.
    At least to me it just makes me uncomfortable since I can't gauge well what's going on. There's a lot of uncertainty about what the people might really be feeling underneath.

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    Quote Originally Posted by glamourama View Post
    Fi types don't like to let people get too excited or riled up. it often feels dishonest to me.
    This is why it comes off as dry & boring to me. It almost seems like Fi types become grumpy & put up a wall when you're having too much fun, so you kind of have to monitor yourself to be more restrained around them. This is why I think it's funny that Fi types see Fe as fake & insincere, while in reality a Fe type holding back would actually be acting less true to themselves & what they're feeling.
    Quote Originally Posted by jxrtes View Post
    betas should be kept in zoos for children to stare and throw pop corn at.

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    Fe valuers can seem very oblivious to my inner workings, like they see what I consider to be immovable as a mutable object that can be played with. They can seem too eager to change how I feel about something without considering the meaning or reason behind that feeling.
    I seem too eager to change how you're feeling, because you always seem sad and kinda self-hating to me. And I guess that's why I want to empower you. But clearly, you're too stubborn in that. I don't know. To me it's like, why would anybody want to hold onto their pain like it means something? So I have this instinctive urge to lighten you up, because it also makes ME lighten up. I won't do that anymore though if it bothers you. (but I admit it will be hard for me and like I have to always monitor my reactions to you which might be too hard and make me feel like I'm walking on eggshells)

    You can feel however you want to feel, I just don't understand why anybody wants to be so critical all the time. For me, it's pretty draining and I start to feel guilty over what I said. Not that I want everybody to be hippie nice all the time. But sometimes, I think if you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all. I can't imagine that you were treated so poorly in your life (not just you but all fi-valuers) to have such a critical view of people. You always end up apologizing if you have hurt somebody's feelings, because you are human....but it's like why even go there to begin with?

    I do consider the meaning or reason why you feel how you feel, and I think I understand it pretty well. I just sort of think it's irrelevant and that you should 'get over that' because in a way, I actually do care about you and just want to see you happy. I know that might seem strange from somebody you barely know online....but it's just the way I feel. =D

    I know to you, you think your 'inner workings' are probably more nuanced and complicated than that, and like you want to argue about it. But to me, you're just basically sad- and I want to lift you up. What is interesting though, is that you obviously don't like being bullied either.

    What if you positively encouraged somebody , about a trait you don't like instead of criticizing them for it? I think they would take it a lot better and actually start doing what you wanted them to do. But that's where you're 'helpless' and 'victimy' to me, you don't like to think you have that sort of influence. But I just don't believe that.

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    High Priestess glam's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Starfall View Post
    This is why it comes off as dry & boring to me. It almost seems like Fi types become grumpy & put up a wall when you're having too much fun, so you kind of have to monitor yourself to be more restrained around them. This is why I think it's funny that Fi types see Fe as fake & insincere, while in reality a Fe type holding back would actually be acting less true to themselves & what they're feeling.
    yes, exactly!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by aixelsyd View Post
    I do, in general. If not, I just get irritated by it.

    Sometimes it also feels like 'join the fun but keep your personal feelings, if they are different, out of it because we don't care how you personally feel unless you hold influence over the group and over their feelings, meaning, if you are Person A or B who everyone loves because they gush Fe and their real feelings matter and yours don't.' And that I cannot stand. Dancing to all y'all's tune is just annoying. So I don't. Unless I express my feelings in the similar effusive style and make them loud and clear, it's like they are ignored. It goes against my natural style of picking up on subtle things from people I am with and bringing them out but in a comfortably understated way.
    But that's when you're dealing with people who don't see any value in Fi matters... People who are self-aware and aren't limited to their own way of looking at things won't be like that.

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    It almost seems like Fi types become grumpy & put up a wall when you're having too much fun, so you kind of have to monitor yourself to be more restrained around them. This is why I think it's funny that Fi types see Fe as fake & insincere, while in reality a Fe type holding back would actually be less true to themselves.
    I agree... I also don't understand avoiding social situations that have a lot of group fun because you want a more 'intimate connection' as if an intimate connection is only possible with you and one other person. I'm more comfortable one on one myself, but I also feel the joy of group orgies. I just don't see group love as diminishing the 'specialness' that people have. But Fi valuers have gotten really super annoyed when I've shared our inside jokes with the outside world.

    I'm naturally going to disconnect personally with people, if I try to get close to one person we're just going to fail, so it's like I have to reach out.

    Also I can be incredibly fake and shallow. But that doesn't mean that I'm wrong. If I think you can do something sort of preppy and 'celebrity-ish' to improve your appeal and charisma/likeability to other people, I'm going to say it. It doesn't mean that I don't like you- to me it's a lot nicer to criticize somebody for something shallow than it is to make a deep personal attack that I feel Fi-valuers do. I am being shallow. So why are you taking my shallow as depth? LOL.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by polikujm View Post
    Fe and Fi are the same right? Just in two different worlds.
    That's my interpretation,

    Fi is the introversion

    Fe is the extroversion

    of the Feeling Function....

    Introversion literally means internal facing

    Extroversion literally means external facing

    To give this some credibility check the second paragraph of Carl Jung's Psychological Types

    Quote Originally Posted by Jung
    The general-attitude types, as I have pointed out more than once, are differentiated by their
    particular attitude to the object. The introvert's attitude to the object is an abstracting one; at
    bottom, he is always facing the problem of how libido can be withdrawn from the object, as
    though an attempted ascendancy on. the part of the object had to be continually frustrated. The
    extravert, on the contrary, maintains a positive relation to the object. To such an extent does he
    affirm its importance that his subjective attitude is continually being orientated by, and related to
    the object
    . An fond, the object can never have sufficient value; for him, therefore, its importance
    must always be paramount.
    This is rather accurate...

    Fi seeks to withdraw libido from an object which they feel for

    Fe seeks to have their subjective attitude oriented by and related to an object which they feel for

    Fi seeks to draw feelings inward from an object

    Fe seeks to orient their feelings based on interactions with an object

    Both are FEELINGS, but one seeks to draw these inward, facing into them... the other seeks to draw themselves out to the object, outward, relating/orienting themselves to it.

  17. #17
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    I don't have a problem with Fi, most of the times it can be translated into Fe... the biggest problem is with the serious attitude Fi types can have occasionally... especially with moral sentiment that conflicts with a fun mood, and kind of misunderstanding the spirit or mood in a setting because their internal environment is different than the external one.

    One big problem with Fi's is that by withdrawing feelings from things into themselves... they tend to have a much stronger structural understanding of their values, but they are less fluid. It requires them a longer time to really let their feeling work in them before they can make sense of something emotionally.

    In Fe's, this is nearly instant, they pick up on the mood or feeling quickly, but they suffer vertigo occasionally, being unable to correctly orient themselves, because they are relating themselves externally to something they see, they are drawing themselves out to the object and observing the comparison between that object and themselves, too much orientation and they can get hazy emotionally.

    You also have to consider the connection between Fi and Fe and the Auxillary Functions.... Fi with Ne is so so different from Fi with Se; as is Fe with Si and Fe with Ni. The auxillary functions help the Fi type become more fluid and the Fe type become less confused.

    This is why I don't find ENFp's so off putting, I really like the Ne a lot -- they adapt quickly to intuition of possibilities, so they always seem more open minded than the stereotypes of Fi... ENFp-ness is like my gateway to understanding Fi. Even though its not model A, I always feel when I get more emotional and progress across quadras, my alphaness goes to ENFp @ delta and to INFp @ beta.... gamma is foreign territory, I've never ever felt like an ESFp or ISFj... that's practically foreign land for me.

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    I guess that I currently am just wanting to say that the most important thing is BE A DECENT PERSON.

    If someone is going to be an ass, I guess I'd prefer they be an Fe ass, because I'm better equipped to handle that.

    Fi jackassery is like a minefield to me. Not knowing where things stand, nothing explicit, but something crappy roiling under the surface? No, thanks.

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    No. In my experience, my judgments about people's sincerity is not type-related.

    I'd say the person whose expressed emotions I question most often happens to be an IEE (and if I pry, I find that I'm correct in my suspicions).

    I guess some Fi types could have problems with what they perceive as dramatics from Fe types. If I do think an Fe type is "playing something up," I tend to think about whether their motivations in doing so are pure.

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    Fi jackassery? Examples?
    (i)NTFS

    An ILI at rest tends to remain at rest
    and an ILI in motion is probably not an ILI

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    Quote Originally Posted by Golden View Post
    I guess that I currently am just wanting to say that the most important thing is BE A DECENT PERSON.

    If someone is going to be an ass, I guess I'd prefer they be an Fe ass, because I'm better equipped to handle that.

    Fi jackassery is like a minefield to me. Not knowing where things stand, nothing explicit, but something crappy roiling under the surface? No, thanks.
    I hate that too. I'd rather know if someone has something against me, just be out with it, and let's get it over with.

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    no.

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    Quote Originally Posted by EyeSeeCold View Post
    Fi jackassery? Examples?
    Really, just people who are doing shitty things and happen to be Fi-types. There's no cause-effect here. And I don't want to give examples--too much personal stuff.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Golden View Post
    Really, just people who are doing shitty things and happen to be Fi-types. There's no cause-effect here. And I don't want to give examples--too much personal stuff.
    C'mon man, generalizations? I don't want actual happenings.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thanks Arthur View Post
    As per the title. As a Merry or Serious quadra member, do you find the way the other side of the dichotomies expresses emotions or feelings to be suspicious or untrustowrthy, or "off" in any way?
    Sometimes I feel like I don't understand how they're feeling, which makes it a lot more difficult to communicate. Some types just seem brain-dead when it comes to communication. Most of the time I don't really have a problem with it though. It's only when the person decides that they don't like me that the trouble starts. (This may happen without them telling me too.)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ssmall View Post
    It can seem insincere, fake. Sometimes it just feels as over the top and unescessary.
    This is how i see it too. Sometimes it's just funny too, and I laugh at it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Thanks Arthur View Post
    I met this IEE a while ago. At present he seems a bit overeager to get to know me and seems inappropriately friendly. It's just really weird to me. Then again this EIE girl out of nowhere decided she was my best friend and biggest supporter and was totally out to help me do the impossible and kick reason to the curb. I'm about equally suspicious of both, so maybe I'm just naturally very slow to trust people of unclear motive?
    I've noticed that when i first meet people, especially if we get along well, I can pump up the Fe for a little while. But if you get to know me, after a while, i will go back to being my quieter, more subdued self.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Golden View Post
    I guess that I currently am just wanting to say that the most important thing is BE A DECENT PERSON.
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    I like how my horrible work computer keeps freezing at just the right time, multiple times a day as i have it stuck over Golden's signature. That's fun. OMG wut is this? Fi??

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    Quote Originally Posted by glamourama View Post
    Fi types don't like to let people get too excited or riled up. it often feels dishonest to me.
    I generally appreciate Fe types' effort in been open about their emotions and feelings towards others. However, my other impression of Fe types whom I have known IRL (especially the Alpha SFs) is that they tend to say things which people like to hear during conversations with others, rather than been brutally honest when the need arises. Some of my Alpha SF friends would say something as if they agree with and empathize with the other party to make him/her feel better, even though they don't necessarily feel the same way. At times, I feel that some of them lack their individualism as a result as they seem to agree with anything that the other person said.

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    They are alpha. - Avoiding negative emotions and + creating good sensations. Beta is the asshole if need be.

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    I should say also that I have lots of Fe-dominant friends, and I adore them and get along with them well, so this feeling is not a strong tendency.

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    I usually find Fe inconsistent and clueless about people's real personality and motivations. It's as if they try to project images taken from their environment (or their own preconceptions/ expectations) on people without looking deeply into what makes them who they are. Fe base in particular tries to "move" others, they treat feelings or preferences as something that can be easily influenced (wait till they persuade you to actually feel something else they have in program for you). Fe base prioritizes relationships based on social status, social interest or "what would win many". Fe creative is often wrapped up in their own inner world and may prioritize just about anything based on their moods.
    Last edited by Amber; 09-26-2014 at 09:04 PM.

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    I figure if you're going to be an asshole, at least be consistent about it.

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    I like Fe types quite a bit. The good ones have this acceptance for people that I truly admire and have a way with people that I like to be around.

    I feel shy and ..self-aware when Fe types get too rowdy simply because I'm terrible at faking it and when I do actually get rowdy it's in a...different way than they do.. Idk...I feel like everything goes "deep" with me even when I don't want to such as when I want life to be superficial for a bit just to ease life/emotions ...but I'm always one foot in reality and one foot...in possibilities/worries.. and I end up reading people's intentions even when I don't want to. It's hard for me to just base everything off someone's moods. Fe friends come to me often to talk about their problems simply because they know I'll make time for them. I often like to know where I stand with people as well... but I'm working on that. It gets easier. It gets easier...


    Simply put I like to talk to people about my problems who won't give out blanket praises for every obstacle I face, "IT'LL GET BETTER I PROMISE"..because sometimes it won't get better. I do appreciate encouraging words and someone rooting for me...as it makes it feel like I'm not alone but sometimes it's nice to hear, "hey dude, you're kind of fucked. but it's okay. wanna cry?"

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    I wouldn't use the word suspicious, but that we come from different points of view or values that the other person doesn't appreciate to the point that it can sometimes be impossible to reconcile. For example, I had a problem with a roommate that couldn't relate with people on a personal level; I had this intuition that he had to try to be friendly, but I was okay with it. It was only a problem when one day, after not seeing me for months, he decided he was going to tell me to take out the trash. It pissed me off because he was talking down to me like I was a child and I barely knew this dude and he knew almost nothing about me; but his response to my being agitated was that I was rude; but I was going to throw the trash away because it wasn't that big a deal to me, except he added about 3 times the trash that was there that day to leave for me to throw away, I guess to make some point. That pissed me off and I unloaded on his contradictory behavior in a text message and what I thought about him and he did the same. Then in person he responded by saying to never "talk to him like that" and that I needed to "act like an adult", whatever he thought that was supposed to mean and I told him the same and to go fuck himself. I ended up moving out because he seemed to really hate me after that, but in the end I got the feeling that he had a disconnect with understanding why other people felt the way they did and instead wanted to replace interpersonal understanding with behavioral expectations. The thing that sucks most is that as this was going on I asked around and found out other people had the same problems with him. I guess it was a bit consoling because sometimes stuff like that can make me feel like it's my fault, if I don't know any better.

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    When I'm open about my feelings which I'm often not and when I explain to Fe types that I'm in a bad mood hence my reactions Fe types show warmth and affection which I greatly appreciate so I do not resent them. They can be caring

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    Fi feels like a minefield. I wish people would just tell me what they were feeling so that I could treat them accordingly.

    that's probably a big problem with the divide actually. neither side can read the other other side's signals as accurately, are uncertain what each gesture means.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Starfall View Post
    This is why it comes off as dry & boring to me. It almost seems like Fi types become grumpy & put up a wall when you're having too much fun, so you kind of have to monitor yourself to be more restrained around them. This is why I think it's funny that Fi types see Fe as fake & insincere, while in reality a Fe type holding back would actually be acting less true to themselves & what they're feeling.
    and *this*. + 10,000

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    I love Fe. But I need Fi. The only time I get annoyed with Fe is when it's directly opposed to Te and is "messing things up" from my perspective.
    SEE-Se, 852 sx/so

    Check out my Socionics group! https://www.facebook.com/groups/1546362349012193/

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    Suspicious? No. But i do wonder why Fi types are always so angry and moody all the time.
    I would say that ethically you are still supposed to act as if you have unilateral responsibility; but simultaneously you have to be able to see the other as a fully autonomous, free, aware person.

    Medicalizing social problems has the additional benefit of rendering society not responsible for those social ills. If it’s a disease, it’s nobody’s fault. Yay empiricism.

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