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Thread: The three Reinin quadra dichotomies

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    Default The three Reinin quadra dichotomies

    I'm talking about Judicious vs. Decisive, Merry vs. Serious, and Aristocratic vs. Democratic.

    When looking at your own Quadra, how would you "rate" these three dichotomies in importance to you, personally? Which dichotomy is most obvious vs. which are less obvious?

    I clearly, absolutely favor Serious>Merry. Between Judicious and Decisive, I am more Judicious, but it's also easy for me to relate at times to the Decisive attitude. When it comes to Democratic vs. Aristocratic, though, I'm pretty evenly split, I think; that is, it doesn't really seem to matter to me much either way.

    Maybe the above explains why I tend to like Gammas more than Alphas...because being Serious (which I have in common with Gammas) is ultimately more important to me than being Judicious (which I have in common with Alphas); and then of course Betas would be my least-favored quadra, not just because we are Opposing, but because the one dichotomy (Aristocratic) that we have in common is far less-defined in my own personality.
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    I think the Joker would be Merry, and he wonders why others are not.

    Btw, "A nose, by any other name, would still smell." = epic.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mountain Dew View Post
    Btw, "A nose, by any other name, would still smell." = epic.
    Haha, thanks. I can't take credit for its origin, though; but I don't remember where I first heard it, it's just stuck with me for years.
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    I notice them Merry>Judicious>Democratic. I think that's more a scale of understanding than a scale of importance, though.



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    Quote Originally Posted by Brilliand View Post
    I notice them Merry>Judicious>Democratic. I think that's more a scale of understanding than a scale of importance, though.
    You may be right...
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    they're all important to me, i can't say i consistently notice one more than the others. this is how the dichotomies feel to me when interacting with people (i notice them all):

    Decisive: stimulated, activated, energized
    Judicious: deactivated, understimulated

    Merry: warm, open, fun, emotionally honest, passionate
    Serious: stifling, not excitable, rubs me the wrong way

    Aristocratic: i know my place, where i stand
    Democratic: i have no one to align myself with
    Last edited by glam; 01-22-2011 at 09:20 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by pianosinger View Post
    I'm talking about Judicious vs. Decisive, Merry vs. Serious, and Aristocratic vs. Democratic.

    When looking at your own Quadra, how would you "rate" these three dichotomies in importance to you, personally? Which dichotomy is most obvious vs. which are less obvious?
    fucking interesting.

    let's see, I would rate decisive and serious as highest

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    Quote Originally Posted by glamourama View Post
    Decisive: stimulated, activated, energized
    Judicious: deactivated, understimulated

    ..

    Aristocratic: i know my place, where i stand
    Democratic: i have no one to align myself with
    I'd put them a bit differently: D/J more specific (eg what exactly stimulates Decisive types) and A/D more general (this is just one subset trait).

    I'm curious if you relate to my observations that Aristocratic + Decisive make Betas born adherents and partisans. Including IEI, btw, just don't think about yourself, but people you know.

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    Last edited by Parasite; 03-29-2011 at 09:26 AM.

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    Aristocratic > Democratic is pretty vital to me; I am kind of inherently suspicious of Democrats because they seem too sort of spiritually selfish/untrustworthy/not down for the cause. They are fine for more relaxed interactions, but I wouldn't include them in a serious endeavor unless they had something special/irreplaceable/highly advantageous to offer.

    I love Decisive people because they will actually DO the things impulsively that other people will just talk about and go "lol that'd be cool..." For example on my recent trip to Haiti, I hated all of the discussions our group would have about all of the things that needed improvement, because we weren't doing shit, weren't GOING to do shit; it was like solving these poor people's problems was just pointless chatter, something to talk about. I may or may not go back, but I refused to take part in the discussions, because they felt completely disingenuous to me.

    Merry/Serious isn't EXTREMELY important to me; I find Merry types generally easier to converse with, and are more likely to share my interests, but they seem pretentious sometimes. Serious types are a welcome relief once in a while, but I can't sustain prolonged interaction with them, it becomes taxing and I start to feel bored and pent up, plus they aren't usually interested in the same depth of conversation on spiritual/belief-oriented topics that Merry types tend to expound upon (which is the best reason to have an exchange, IMO) because they're "impractical" or "not real."
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    Pretty straightforward.

    Quote Originally Posted by glamourama View Post
    they're all important to me, i can't say i consistently notice one more than the others. this is how the dichotomies feel to me when interacting with people (i notice them all):

    Decisive: stimulated, activated, energized
    Judicious: deactivated, understimulated

    Merry: warm, open, fun, emotionally honest, passionate
    Serious: stifling, not excitable, rubs me the wrong way

    Aristocratic: i know my place, where i stand
    Democratic: i have no one to align myself with

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    Merry > Aristocratic > Decisive. In terms of intertype relations obviously Merry > Decisive -- the other Aristocratic quadra is my opposing.
    What do these signs mean—, , etc.? Why cannot socionists use symbols Ne, Ni etc. as in MBTI? Just because they have somewhat different meaning. Socionics and MBTI, each in its own way, have slightly modified the original Jung's description of his 8 psychological types. For this reason, (Ne) is not exactly the same as Ne in MBTI.

    Just one example: in MBTI, Se (extraverted sensing) is associated with life pleasures, excitement etc. By contrast, the socionic function (extraverted sensing) is first and foremost associated with control and expansion of personal space (which sometimes can manifest in excessive aagression, but often also manifests in a capability of managing lots of people and things).

    For this reason, we consider comparison between MBTI types and socionic types by functions to be rather useless than useful.

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    I have strong preferences on all the dichotomies that point to alpha:

    Merry, Judicious, and Democratic. Can't really rank them.
    LII-Ne with strong EII tendencies, 6w7-9w1-3w4 so/sp/sx, INxP



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    judicious > aristocratic > serious

    i think.

    i wonder if there are subtype correlations with this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by laghlagh View Post
    judicious > aristocratic > serious

    i think.

    i wonder if there are subtype correlations with this.

    Possibly. Here's my hypothesis.

    IEE-Ne would be more inclined to prefer judicious over serious. Since Ne/Si valuers are judicious.

    IEE-Fi would be more inclined to prefer serious over judicious. Fi/Te valuers being serious types.

    Not sure how aristocratic/democratic plays out.
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    I am alpha, so that relates what I say to the dichotomies you asked about.

    Merry/Serious and Decisive Judicious in my opinion are the two more important, basically shared P functions or shared J functions is how I would describe them.

    For shared J functions (beta) I would say generally communication is more straightforward and easily understood. General logical and emotional understanding, perception of other people, emotional reactions, is more similar. Atmosphere with betas tends to be a bit "sharper," more focused on cleverness and analysis. Heavily Se environments tend to make me uncomfortable, and some of the Se behaviors piss me off.

    Alternatively, with deltas (shared P functions,) I find the atmosphere tends to be more conducive and comfortable, more free flowing and fun. Understanding, but more so harmonizing with the emotional states of deltas can be tricky and somewhat confusing. They don't respond as I would expect often, or in what to me seems a logical way. The strong-willed and less fluid nature of Te/Fi can be quite annoying.

    Being around betas or deltas and gammas alone can be tricky, as they tend to focus in on their shared functions, with makes the conversation totally uninteresting to me in many cases.

    As for the aristocratic democratic dichotomy, as it stands I don't find it nearly as important in a practical sense. There is a sort of feel that betas and deltas have a sort of intensity to their desire for enforcing what they feel is best on the world, where alphas and gammas tend to take a less reactive and more idealogical view of things. In an idealogical sense, Betas and Deltas are more likely to buy each others' philosophies as are alphas and gammas. The reasoning tends to be quite different between alpha/gamma and beta/delta. The shared club thing can also be nice, but is not very significant.

    I prefer relaxing and having fun with deltas and intellectualizing/strategizing/emotionally harmonizing with betas. I don't mean to say betas can't be fun, not at all, they can be very fun, there's just always a bit of edginess to it. Romantically I think differences could be more easily reconciled with betas than with deltas, because alphas and betas tend to perceive others more similarly, and can resonate on that chord, and will tend to sense/interpret changes in each other with greater accuracy. Romance with delta would be a sort of lack/slow death of passion vs with beta it would probably be good until it explodes over (most likely) life choices, ambition, and aggression levels.

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    Merry > Democratic > Reasonable

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