Faces of Consensus - ENTp (Don Quixote)
The following pictures depict the Eastern Consensus (75%-100% convergence) of the type ENTp. Full methodology, and additional data can be be found at the source:
http://translate.googleusercontent.c...XyVl5ddkbpG3lg
Note: It seems ILE socionists don't like high resolution pictures of themselves.
Ausra Augusta
Niels Bohr
Alexander Boukalov
Galileo Galilei
Karl Marx
Dmitri Mendeleev
Prokofiev Tatiana
Sigmund Freud
Konstantin Tsiolkovsky
Albert Einstein
ILI (FINAL ANSWER)
I'm surprised to see Bohr as ILE, I'd have said ILI (and rather not the same type as Einstein). Is there an easy way to find whose those 6 typings were?
I wish there was a source for it, so we'd actually know in which cases did they consider it a mistake. It could be an echo of this bias.Originally Posted by Wikisocion
ILE bias
The ILE bias comes from Augusta herself and is closely related to the one above. According to Augusta's original conception of type roles, ILEs were seen as being a type that sees the hidden roots of phenomena (supposedly) and arranges them into a system or theory (
). For many years Augusta and her associates assumed that scientists and thinkers who generated new theories (like Einstein, Bohr, Newton, and Darwin) were ILEs. Later, she and others seemed to recognize this mistake, but the ILE bias has still not been completely undone. Just as "health" does not equate exactly to
, "theory" does not equate exactly to
ETA: also, http://www.socionics.us/practice/benchmark.shtml .
Last edited by Aiss; 01-03-2011 at 12:29 AM.
There are ways of seeing which socionists converged with the list the most, but I have yet to see a list of who typed who.
ILI (FINAL ANSWER)
Man... more pictures of old guys... the pictures of the younger people are really small, or prehistoric. Any chance of an ILE consensus for someone who hasn't become famous through a scientific breakthrough? Or... (scrolls up again and sees Karl Marx) a sociological breakthrough? Psychology? (Hi Freud...)
Aren't there pictures of ILE celebrities people agree about? I just think more modern-day people would help understand ILE better, because you read more about their personal lives. Reading old biographies of famous people takes some of the personality and understanding out of them... but if you were posting simply more for VI purposes, this helps a bit, thank you.
(realizes this is under VI forum) Yes... I meant to say 'thank you' and just that.
I wasn't critical at all... *runs and hides*
I understand that George Carlin was an ENTP.
That helps?
The truth is there is no sense in living your life without this. To make the journey and not fall deeply in love - well, you haven't lived a life at all. You have to try. Because if you haven't tried, you haven't lived. -William Parrish
I actually put this under famous peoples but it seems to have been moved to VI. I guess it makes sense since I made it about pictures but that main purpose is to visually examine the Eastern consensus so we can have a foundation of the type's role in past and present.
ILI (FINAL ANSWER)
This one's for black people, because it's kinda hard to compare with a white one:
Did Filatova do these for every type, or just ILE?
This one's for black people, because it's kinda hard to compare with a white one:
I think just ILE. Filatova took the ILE bias to the extreme and decided that all minorities were ILE as well because they were open to the possibilities of not being born white.
ILI (FINAL ANSWER)
George Carlin was ENFj.I understand that George Carlin was an ENTP.
That helps?
What do these signs mean—,
, etc.? Why cannot socionists use symbols Ne, Ni etc. as in MBTI? Just because they have somewhat different meaning. Socionics and MBTI, each in its own way, have slightly modified the original Jung's description of his 8 psychological types. For this reason,
Just one example: in MBTI, Se (extraverted sensing) is associated with life pleasures, excitement etc. By contrast, the socionic function(extraverted sensing) is first and foremost associated with control and expansion of personal space (which sometimes can manifest in excessive aagression, but often also manifests in a capability of managing lots of people and things).
For this reason, we consider comparison between MBTI types and socionic types by functions to be rather useless than useful.
-Victor Gulenko, Dmitri Lytov
LOL hahahaha
This one's for black people, because it's kinda hard to compare with a white one:
ILE "Searcher"
Socionics: ENTp
DCNH: Dominant
--> perhaps Normalizing
Enneagram: 7w6 "Enthusiast"
MBTI: ENTJ "Field Marshall" or ENTP "Inventor"
Astrological sign: Aquarius
To learn, read. To know, write. To master, teach.
bohr is definitely an ILI and freud isnt an ILE either.
No, he was ILE. Arguably Ne, but IMO indisputably Fi-PoLR. You don't go to his show to get inspired, encouraged, optimistic, to create bonds with people but pessimistic instead, brutally discouraged, to painfully put your prejudice and hypocrisy along with the naked truth and cold facts. Hear this, to refresh your memory:
"Fuck hope" means exactly "I'm for sure not an EXE"I'm happy to tell you there is very little in this world that I believe in. Listening to the comedians who comment on political, social, and cultural issues, I notice most of their material reflects an underlying belief that somehow things were better once and that with just a little effort we could set them right again. They're looking for solutions, and rooting for particular results, and I think that necessarily limits the tone and substance of what they say. They're talented and funny people, but they're nothing more than cheerleaders attached to a specific, wished-for outcome.
I don't feel so confined. I frankly don't give a fuck how it all turns out in this country - or anywhere else, for that matter. I think the human game was up a long time ago (when the high priests and traders took over), and now we're just playing out the string. And that is, of course, precisely what I find so amusing: the slow circling of the drain by a once promising species, and the sappy, ever-more-desperate belief in this country that there is actually some sort of "American Dream", which has merely been misplaced.
The decay and disintegration of this culture is astonishingly amusing if you are emotionally detached from it. I have always viewed it from a safe distance, knowing I don't belong; it doesn't include me, and it never has. No matter how you care to define it, I do not identify with the local group. Planet, species, race, nation, state, religion, party, union, club, association, neighborhood, improvement committee; I have no interest in any of it. I love and treasure individuals as I meet them, I loathe and despise the groups they identify with and belong to.
So, if you hear something in this book that sounds like advocacy of a particular political point of view, please reject the notion. My interest in "issues" is merely to point out how badly we're doing, not to suggest a way we might do better. Don't confuse me with those who cling to hope. I enjoy describing how things are, I have no interest in how they "ought to be." And I certainly have no interest in fixing them. I sincerely believe that if you think there's a solution, you're part of the problem. My motto: Fuck Hope!.
That really sounds more like just Fi-devaluing -- you seem to have a propensity to mistake the two. From his bio he seemed EJ-temperament, and his motivation was more than anything to provoke a reaction, to entertain people -- he got off on it. That and his coke problems point to Si-PoLR.No, he was ILE. Arguably Ne, but IMO indisputably Fi-PoLR. You don't go to his show to get inspired, encouraged, optimistic, to create bonds with people but pessimistic instead, brutally discouraged, to painfully put your prejudice and hypocrisy along with the naked truth and cold facts. Hear this, to refresh your memory:
YouTube - George Carlin - Fuck Hope
"Fuck hope" means exactly "I'm for sure not an EXE"
If he was Fi-PoLR though, he was probably SLE.
What do these signs mean—
Just one example: in MBTI, Se (extraverted sensing) is associated with life pleasures, excitement etc. By contrast, the socionic function
For this reason, we consider comparison between MBTI types and socionic types by functions to be rather useless than useful.
-Victor Gulenko, Dmitri Lytov
Seriously dude, just stop that kind of crap because nobody will ever listen a single word you say if you add crap like that to your reasoning.
Looking for an Archnemesis. Willing applicants contact via PM.
ENFp - Fi 7w6 sp/sx
The Ineffable IEI
The Einstein ENTp
johari nohari
http://www.mypersonality.info/ssmall/
Yeah I should have probably explained myself better. It's not just coke problems -- he seriously had issues taking care of himself, and didn't seem to care. He would stay up for days on end, taking coke so he could postpone the time when he'd have to go to sleep, he'd sing himself hoarse then get laringytis and miss whole strings of concerts, and so on. He was a disaster in the early 70s. There's an entire chapter in his bio (High on the Hill) dedicated to that.
What do these signs mean—
Just one example: in MBTI, Se (extraverted sensing) is associated with life pleasures, excitement etc. By contrast, the socionic function
For this reason, we consider comparison between MBTI types and socionic types by functions to be rather useless than useful.
-Victor Gulenko, Dmitri Lytov
Carlin is awesome. The EIE suggestion is ridiculous. The previous 2 sentences are unrelated.
“Whether we fall by ambition, blood, or lust, like diamonds we are cut with our own dust.”
When ya gonna post ILI, Crispy??
(i)NTFS
An ILI at rest tends to remain at rest
and an ILI in motion is probably not an ILI
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My work on Inert/Contact subtypes
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Fidei Defensor
Totally wrong to accept that he can be EIE. A such "anti-hope" person to be Fe-Base (the quintessence of optimism in Socionics) and Ni-Creative (confident and visionary types for who there's always a way out in the future)? His traits - that I exposed in my other post - basically exclude EIE firstly! Then you remove all the Ej's, actually, not cause I say so but based on their traits - to claim that someone so cynical is Ej, types with goals, visions, solutions, purpose, who look forward to the future and accomplishments is absolutely outrageous. What descriptions do you use?
It is true that if you assume that all was a fake to entertain the public he could be anything, but that's baseless. There's no evidence that I know of that he actually had a different view IRL - even less likely since he often tells his observations along the time and how he came to certain conclusions.
And FYI, I'm by far the person who sleeps the least that I know of - I can put numerous old posts that can demonstrate this. I don't remember whether this is written in the descriptions, but IME Ne Irrationals are the people with the worst sleep patterns and who often waste nights just because they can't help it, not because they need to get something done (which is normally applicable to Ej).
---
I'm not trying to nitpick you - I usually relate to your views, but this is totally and obviously wrong, and I urge you to find where the error comes from, or whatever. I suspect that you narrowed down your focus on some secondary and basically irrelevant traits of EIE/Ej.
Soon, after I get off my lazy streak.
ILI (FINAL ANSWER)
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