Thinker or feeler?

[scissors]

Hi
I need some help identifying my type.

Apparently there seems to be quite a discrepancy between the way my partner, friends and family see me and the way I see myself.

Here is a list of traits that seem to be consistent - either as seen by others or as experienced by me.

According to other people

1.
I am a very distinct person - people seem to think that I am very clear about what I think and who I am
(keep hearing this from all sorts of people both family and people I hardly know)

2.
I am brutaly honest
(I don't think so myself as I frequently adjust my answers to soften the blow but if people ask my opinion I will give it - I will very seldom lie. After all - if I ask other people their opinion I want a truthful answer)

3.
I am confrontational - will not back down from conflict
(I don't like to engage in confrontations but I will if I must)

4
I can be commanding and give orders easily
(I don't know, perhaps I do this but it is only to help and get people off their asses)

5
I am very analytical and organized
(yes and no, I do analyze anything and eaily see flaws in both thinking and plans - I am also very organized at work, but quite messy at home)

6
I am very independent and dislike asking for help
(very true - asking for help makes me feel weak)

--------------------------------------------------------

How I experience myself in private

1
I dislike showing my emotions in public
(I never do If I can help it - except for anger)

2
I dislike outward displays of emotions - except the normal standard greetings and such.
(I get uncomfortable when people are very emotional and it also kinda pisses me off. I see it as overacting and emotinal manipulation. Sincerely dislike whiny people, martyrs and victims, no patience at all for that.
I am also troubled by emails an text that contains what I would call "emotional praise" - such as; Great job - hug! I don't mind the great job, but the hug? Whats up with that? It makes me mad when people do that because I don't see it as relevant and I really don't know how to respond.
Am I supposed to say "hug" in return? I don't want to, it would be insincere.)

3
I have very strong internal emotions
(They often appear to be completely out of proportion - these superstrong emotions mainly seem to be triggered by acts of cruelty done to innocent beings such as kids and animals etc. I know this is normal, but I can get severly upset for days and feel like I loose faith in God and human kind. I tend to avoid all news and stories about these things because of this.
I can be rather unfeeling about the faith of human kind otherwise, I tend to think that once grown up you are responible for your own actions and that it is naive to expect life to be fair.)

4
I believe in a higher power and I have a strong spiritual side but I abhor any form of organized religion.
(This is a private side of mine, one I never show in public like my emotions.)

5
I can have pretty wild mood swings
(Dark to light but I usually just wait them out and do something constructive like take a walk. I have learned never that they soon will pass and I don't let them interfer with my work)

6
I used to completely ignore my feelings
(With age I have learned that I need to experience them as in actually feel them - and that they do provide information if I allow them to be what they are.)

What confuses me is that how I appear and act seems to be consistend with an extroverted thinker or at least someone with thinking in the first or second position.

But I think it is all at odds with my strong emotions and also my spiritual side, not to mention the fact that I work in an artistic field. Should that not point to a feeling type?!

What does the experts at this board think?

[golden]

Enneagram 8?

ESTp (SLE)?

ENTj (LIE)?

ENTp (ILE)?

ENFj (EIE)?

[Galen]

I wouldn't let the fact that you "strong emotions" and a "spiritual side" determine whether or not you're any sort of T or F ego, as any type can exhibit those character traits. From what little I can see, you sound like a possible E8 > E5 (assuming you know anything about enneagram), maybe some T ego, but there isn't really enough of the right kind of information to make any definite conclusions.

[Exodus]

Basically the top stuff says you're probably LSI or maybe SLE. , , , , . The private stuff is somewhat subjective and mostly not type-related.

I also feel like I experience large mood swings, but looking at types, it's obvious that they are more influenced by their emotions than I am.
"I frequently adjust my answers to soften the blow" - see, this is just a super-ego compensation mechanism (). The fact that you phrase it like this just makes it more likely that your default mode is more blunt than not. It's very easy to look at your leading or creative function and say "oh, that's just me being a normal person, right?" But if you get a second opinion you might be surprised. What is your gender, by the way?

[Absurd]

1a - check,
2a - check,
3a - check,
5a - check,
6a - check,

1b - check,
2b - check,
6b - check.

Welcome, mate.

EDIT: although not sure bout 5a, don't have much patience for that.

[Galen]

1a - check,
2a - check,
3a - check,
5a - check,
6a - check,

1b - check,
2b - check,
6b - check.

lol what do you mean by that?

[Words]

What confuses me is that how I appear and act seems to be consistend with an extroverted thinker or at least someone with thinking in the first or second position.

But I think it is all at odds with my strong emotions and also my spiritual side, not to mention the fact that I work in an artistic field. Should that not point to a feeling type?!

Everyones got feelings so I doubt that is particularly type related here.

The stuff you say definately sounds like someone with thinking in the leading position, probably Ti but maybe Te, I think you'd need to post a bit more to be more sure if you ar Ti or Te leading. Well I could write more but i'm sure other people will have heaps to say.

[scissors]

"I frequently adjust my answers to soften the blow" - see, this is just a super-ego compensation mechanism (). The fact that you phrase it like this just makes it more likely that your default mode is more blunt than not. It's very easy to look at your leading or creative function and say "oh, that's just me being a normal person, right?" But if you get a second opinion you might be surprised. What is your gender, by the way?

You're probably right. I do think I am just being normal yet people tell me I am blunt. It's wierd, it seems like whatever I do naturally is a complete blind spot to me.

I have taken this supershort enneagram test in the past and ended up an 8.

Did not like the answer and had my sister and my partner answer the test for me - still got an 8.

I am female.

[Galen]

You're probably right. I do think I am just being normal yet people tell me I am blunt. It's wierd, it seems like whatever I do naturally is a complete blind spot to me.

I have taken this supershort enneagram test in the past and ended up an 8.

Did not like the answer and had my sister and my partner answer the test for me - still got an 8.

I am female.

The last line was so out of left-field it made me laugh
But yeah, E8 doesn't sound like too bad of a typing at an initial glance. If so then you're more likely than not to be an extrovert. But again, it's too early to make any hard decisions as of yet.

[golden]

Scissors, why did you dislike the E8 typing? Did you just think it didn't fit you well, or did you dislike the description per se? I mean, Enneagram descriptions are all potentially uncomfortable because they point to problems and shortcomings--everyone's. I happen to like E8s very much, because I have a sort of soft spot for their weaknesses and respond well to their strengths.

[Absurd]

lol what do you mean by that?

Sorry, I was afk.

That's somewhat of an E8 trait, I think. Blame me, I can be wrong on all counts plus I've never gone deeply into Socionics nor enneagram. The only time I, actually, do blab about it is, when I am on here.

What I am trying to say is, I wouldn't know what to do with "it" in the real world.

Has it helped me doing money - no. Getting rich quickly - no.

Etc...

[ashlesha]

i'm not an "expert" but you jump out at me as quite clearly being logical. i hope you stick around because you seem like an interesting person and i am curious to see which exact type you end up pinning down.

also, i heart "distinct" people.

[scissors]

I usually score 50/50 on introversion/extroversion.

What did I not like about the type 8 description? Good question - I think the answer is twofold

1:It does not fit with my idealized type - females in the creative field are usually intuitive or sensing feeling types. I guess I want to be this type but when I spend time people who fit this description I experience myself as rock solid, super organized with a crystal clear brain.

2: I have ben critizied since childhood for being too blunt, too domeneering, too commanding, too direct, too opinionated, too independet etc. I guess I associate most 8 traits with negative traits. Not to mention that they aren't exactly feminine.

What makes up the difference between introverted and extroverted thinking? How would it play out in real life?

[golden]

I usually score 50/50 on introversion/extroversion.

What did I not like about the type 8 description? Good question - I think the answer is twofold

1:It does not fit with my idealized type - females in the creative field are usually intuitive or sensing feeling types. I guess I want to be this type but when I spend time people who fit this description I experience myself as rock solid, super organized with a crystal clear brain.

Speaking as one of those intuitive/feeling women, please know how much I value women like you! I will, however, stop short of the cyber-hug.

2: I have ben critizied since childhood for being too blunt, too domeneering, too commanding, too direct, too opinionated, too independet etc. I guess I associate most 8 traits with negative traits. Not to mention that they aren't exactly feminine.

Understood. That said, we are what we are. I have sometimes cringed at much of what's written about E4s and at some of the IEI descriptions, too, but I've gradually gotten over it. The traits that these type descriptions identify don't really give you a sense of the whole and individualized person, unique, loved, etc.

What makes up the difference between introverted and extroverted thinking? How would it play out in real life?

Setting aside real life for a moment, you can read about the information elements here:

Socionics :: Information Elements

Here's an older thread on Te and Ti:

http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...269-te-ti.html

I guess I see Te as very practical and cause-and-effect-oriented, and Ti as more systems-of-logic-oriented. Te seems linear to me, and Ti seems circular or self-serving, in a way.

Like, my former partner used Te all the time. "I've identified three problems, and I will solve them by doing X, Y, and Z. I've formed three goals, and I will take the following practical steps to achieve them ..."--that sort of thing. He could use Ti also, but it was usually in service to some kind of Te worldview, the theoretical background to his actions. Not an end in itself. When we'd discuss ideas, he'd sometimes say, "Um, you're sort of philosophical." He saw me as more purely intellectual than him, although I'm not all that intellectual in my own self-rating.

I use very little Te and more Ti. But I don't have any kind of T in my first or second element positions. My Ti is mostly related to the aforementioned philosophical pondering, critical thinking regarding an artwork, stuff like that. I like to analyze things.

I'd say different types will manifest Te and Ti somewhat differently. People with stronger Ti than mine (thinking over feeling), I still understand what they're saying but I wouldn't take things so far into the theoretical zone.

But anyway, I'm no expert, and if other people conceive of Te and Ti differently, I welcome their correction.

[redbaron]

can we VI you?

[scissors]

I don't believe in VI - that would make all twins share the same personality type and I don't think that is very likely.

Tried the elimination method using only the dichotomies I am 100% sure about and ended up as either an SLE or ESI.


Results of Mizami test

Test results
SLE Your result
LSE These types might also be considered
SLI
LSI
ILE These types are not very likely
LIE
ILI
LII
SEE These types are quite unlikely
ESE
SEI
ESI
IEE these types are extremely unlikely
EIE
IEI
EII

Still not 100% convinced - might be LSE.

[golden]

Still not 100% convinced - might be LSE.

In which case, your question about Te versus Ti was an important one.

The LSE I know best is not an E8. So I don't want to get confused by how you seem to differ from an E3 LSE, for example. And to me, SLEs who happen to be E8 are the ones who come closest to fitting the sort of stereotypical descriptions of SLE. But being E8 is not gonna automatically point to SLE.

LSE belongs to Delta quadra, and SLE to Beta. Have you read any descriptions of the quadras? Since they're opposing quadras, it might not be too hard to identify with one over the other.

I'm sure the smart-n-friendly people here can come up with some good questions for you if you want to theoretically and temporarily narrow things down to SLE versus LSE. They're not too much alike, these two types, really.

http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...le-vs-lse.html

And socionics.us, again, good quadra descriptions:

http://www.socionics.us/theory/quadras.shtml

[April]

I'd guess LSI. If you don't feel like E8 fits, you could check out E1.

[scissors]

Thanks for the links Golden
I am pretty sure I'm Delta over Beta.

I did find this section of the "SLE vs LSE" a bit confusing though.

LSEs are Te-valuers, and want to be seen as "correct". SLEs are Fe-valuers, and want to be seen as "nice". Both things could make them seem "polite". It depends more on what kind of politeness she used. Was she more "nice" (Fe) or more "correct" (Te).

(LSEs have unconscious Fi, and can hurt other people's feelings without even knowing. SLEs have Fi PoLRs and will feel pressured if people bring up their hurt feelings (as they can't defend against them). In a heated discussion, LSEs typically keep correct and keep pointing out why they are right (disregarding that they hurt others). SLEs fight for their right to breathe, so to say, and get more emotional, since their Fi is threatened (and they can hurt others to get them off their back, since they feel pressured themselves)

I do think that I try to be more "nice" than "correct" in dealing with others.
I absolutely hate people who are rude to clerks and waitresses out of some misunderstood feeling of superiority - if your table don't have a salt shaker on it you can ask for it nicely.

On the other hand in a heated discussion I will keep correct and point out why I am right disregarding that I hurt others. This I am 100% sure of.

So far I am leaning towards LSE

Does anyone have more examples of how SLE vs LSE will manifest in real life situations?

[redbaron]

I don't believe in VI - that would make all twins share the same personality type and I don't think that is very likely.

You're right that twins do not always share the same personality type. But that doesn't mean there's nothing to VI. Even twins can have a different look in their eyes or hold their head differently, a noted upturn of the mouth or whatnot. VI is about a whole feeling which is why it takes more than just one photo to get an accurate picture. I don't think it's a good idea to type based on VI alone, but I do think it can help. My two cents.

[Exodus]

I don't believe in VI - that would make all twins share the same personality type and I don't think that is very likely.

Tried the elimination method using only the dichotomies I am 100% sure about and ended up as either an SLE or ESI.


Results of Mizami test

Test results
SLE Your result
LSE These types might also be considered
SLI
LSI

Good shit! Also, +1 to what redbaron said about VI.

[scissors]

After much reading and looking at pictures of alledged LSE types at various sites such as socionics.org and the Filatova pictures + getting a second opinion from the person who knows me best I have come to the concusion that I am an indeed an LSE.

It is an odd type to be considering my line of work - but it does fit with my personality. Even the bit about LSE not wearing much jewelry (socionics.org) - I only wear classic silver earrings, studded pearls or stones.

Are there any other LSE on this board?

[CILi]

Are there any other LSE on this board?

A couple self-typing, oft-posting LSEs:

Director Abbie
leckysupport
Ryu
Absurd

It is an odd type to be considering my line of work - but it does fit with my personality.

Beyond "artistic field," what's your line of work?

Just curious, really.

[scissors]

Thanks for the list.

I am an illustrator.

[jessica129]

You sounded an awful lot like me in your first post in this thread. Just saying. Like, word for word how I'd answer.

[Absurd]

Are there any other LSE on this board?

Absurd

Meow ?

[scissors]

You sounded an awful lot like me in your first post in this thread. Just saying. Like, word for word how I'd answer.

Hm...
I do score about 50/50 on extroversion/introversion and have a hard time deciding my preference.

The two people who know me best are torn on this matter also. They are both introverts and one claim I must be extroverted the other introverted.
It could be possible - I will have to read up on LSI.

How sure are you about your own type?

[jessica129]

Like 95% sure...not saying you have to be LSI, just saying you sounded a lot like me. I think the thing that helped me the most was finding which quadra felt like 'home' to me and that was Beta, without a doubt. That's my advice for you.

[scissors]

Like 95% sure...not saying you have to be LSI, just saying you sounded a lot like me. I think the thing that helped me the most was finding which quadra felt like 'home' to me and that was Beta, without a doubt. That's my advice for you.

I think it is hard to decide on what quadra is most home to me - initially I thought delta but I tend to overanalyze everything and look for absolute certainty in all things (which I know isn't possible but I still try).

I have a friend (female) who I am certain is SEE and I am indeed her supervisor so that would fit with LSI - the pictures I have seen of LSI could match me also, but then again so could the LSE ones.

I will have to read some more.