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Thread: ESI-SLE Supervision Relations (ISFj and ESTp)

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    Default ESI-SLE Supervision Relations (ISFj and ESTp)

    I just realized I know FOUR SLE-ESI marriages, all of which are male SLEs with female ESIs. The sad thing is, they are all (well three for certain) unhappy. One couple is divorced. Anyway, but I was thinking how interesting it is that I know more SLE-ESI marriages than I do SLE-IEI. I'm wondering if it's because ESIs are kinda bitchy and hard to get so SLEs see them as a challenge. Also, the ESI takes care of the Fi for the SLE. And if the ESI is a fighter at all, the SLE sees them as a worthy opponent.

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    The SLE I know best is dating/living with an ESI. It's funny to watch her correct him on Fi things, but I feel kinda bad for him too. But the way he's living his life, it's gonna turn out that he'll need someone who will follow his ideals more than someone perfectly psychologically compatible, so all's well that ends well I suppose.

    In this case it wasn't a bitchy/hard to get thing. They were both just really invested in being in a relationship, and a good/long-term one, and they met each other and sharing the same goals and such, they got together. It's funny how much he focuses on his obligations to her. Perhaps a result of frequent polr hits? Shrug.
    Not a rule, just a trend.

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    SLEs an LIEs can superficially be quite similar. I've had my fair share of "mutual interest" with IEIs too (although probably victim-victim is much harder to start when compared to aggressor-aggressor). I'm not really sure if I'd consider ESIs hard to get when compared to IEIs, since the latter tends to be "+ infinity" wrt that characteristic

    IDK though I think an SLE-Se can get along sufficiently well with an ESI, although of course they won't provide each other any - however they would probably be OK if they had a certain number of dual close friends.
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    I would say yeah, because like you said the ESI female wants to take care of the Fi in the male SLE, and the SLE unfortunately just goes along with it (and they both fall for it, that theme), and even wants to prove himself solely to the girl at first (think of introverted supervision as different from extroverted supervision). I would suspect male ESI and female SLE are not as common either, but I don't know for sure.

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    perhaps supervision marriages happen more frequently because the supervisor mistakes the supervisee for their dual.

    sounds like a good theory about male SLE's and female ESI's though.

    my SLE ex had an ESI actual supervisor at work. he used to call her pumpkinhead because slamming her appearance was the only tool he had....he was basically rendered somewhat useless under her baleful eye.

    lol

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    I think it is because the supervisee sees the supervisor as a very good match at least initially and actively pursues them. The supervisor is flattered by the attention and gives in. I've seen an IEI guy pursue an LIE girl, she was like a high value target for him, but fortunately she kept a close distance so that relationship never got off the ground.

    An ILE I've dated would get impressed by EIIs all the time and actively pursue them. He had pretty high self esteem and a good dose of self-confidence when it came to relationships, so he would go for girls whom he felt to be a worthy match for himself. He was considering moving to another country for work and at the same time corresponding with an EII over facebook. He said he considered her to be the best match he could ever get plus he was moving to a new country and he said he was scared to go there alone without a partner. So it was mostly a logical decision for him. Now a year into his marriage he is already not that happy, but she is pregnant so I guess he will be staying in these supervisory relations for a long while.
    Last edited by silke; 12-24-2013 at 06:37 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by siuntal View Post
    He said he considered her to be the best match he could ever get plus he was moving to a new country and he said he was scared to go there alone without a partner. So it was mostly a logical decision for him. Now a year into his marriage he is already not that happy, but she is pregnant so I guess he will be staying in these supervisory relations for a long while.
    that's kinda what I think happened in these other relationships. They were ready to settle down and it made sense logically. They acquired what they considered at first to be partners who were a bit unattainable. They felt like they were marrying "up" and then over time....
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    What happened with my parents is that Mum found Dad really charming and exciting. Later I think she decided she could "fix" him and so stuck with it... then stuck around for my sake before finally just giving up.

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    Quote Originally Posted by redbaron View Post
    I just realized I know FOUR SLE-ESI marriages, all of which are male SLEs with female ESIs. The sad thing is, they are all (well three for certain) unhappy. One couple is divorced. Anyway, but I was thinking how interesting it is that I know more SLE-ESI marriages than I do SLE-IEI. I'm wondering if it's because ESIs are kinda bitchy and hard to get so SLEs see them as a challenge. Also, the ESI takes care of the Fi for the SLE. And if the ESI is a fighter at all, the SLE sees them as a worthy opponent.

    Never. SLE don't like playing games like this and having a "challenge"; they want the person they find attractive, bottom line. Don't feel sad about this situation Redbaron. Find an SLE anywhere and email them; you make the Fi bond/approach, just pretend you like them and want to get to know them. They will go to you no matter where they live. Because I'm an Fi and I'm not afraid to make contacts, SLE think that I want to establish a relationship with them, when I'm only trying to be nice and friendly. That helps them think that I can help them strengthen their PoLR. So go for it, be bold and make the first move.
    Last edited by Beautiful sky; 03-04-2011 at 05:57 AM.

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    SLE's older sister is ESI. Growing up he used to call her Godzilla if he did anything wrong she'd beat his ass.

    Now that they're older he describes her as being too set in her morals & that she's too much of a prude. He's constantly going on about how she needs to get laid, ect (of course he'd never tell her that to her face). He says she's too serious & that she constantly scolds him on his moral behavior. Apparently, he's not even aloud to curse around her. lol
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa33 View Post
    Never. SLE don't like playing games like this and having a "challenge"; they want the person they find attractive, bottom line. Don't feel sad about this situation Redbaron. Find an SLE anywhere and email them; you make the Fi bond/approach, just pretend you like them and want to get to know them. They will go to you no matter where they live. Because I'm an Fi and I'm not afraid to make contacts, SLE think that I want to establish a relationship with them, when I'm only trying to be nice and friendly. That helps them think that I can help them strengthen their PoLR. So go for it, be bold and make the first move.
    If this were the case then they'd have a lot of problems getting with their oh so allusive dual, IEI. lol
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    Quote Originally Posted by Starfall View Post
    If this were the case then they'd have a lot of problems getting with their oh so allusive dual, IEI. lol
    They have no problems getting with me. All I have to do is drop a line and say "Hi" and if they find me attractive they open the door. You've found this to be true as well. Most are quite mature in their understanding of relations and people.

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    I'm sure they don't have problems getting with you Maritsa. Guys in general do have problems getting with me, though.

    What I'm saying is that they're aggressors and do enjoy the thrill of chasing, which is what they usually have to do in order to be with their dual.
    Quote Originally Posted by jxrtes View Post
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    Quote Originally Posted by Starfall View Post
    I'm sure they don't have problems getting with you Maritsa. Guys in general do have problems getting with me, though.

    What I'm saying is that they're aggressors and do enjoy the thrill of chasing, which is what they usually have to do in order to be with their dual.
    That just hasn't been consistent with SLE and what you're describing Starfall. At least not in my case. My conflictors want and have been open and willing to jump into a relationship with me almost impulsively, even flying hundreds of miles to date me. I never had to put on any sort of a chase for them.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Starfall View Post
    Apparently, he's not even aloud to curse around her. lol
    There's a simple solution: keep on doing it. They'll eventually get used to it, and start being less rigid. It's similar to neurolinguistic programming, or cognitive behavioral theory. I can see though how a Fi PoLR might be more sensitive towards being scolded, compared to Fi dual-seeking.
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    I posted this before, but here is a clip from the show Merlin in which Guinevere (ESI) supervises Arthur (SLE). It's a very interesting dynamic, as the big bad SLE is basically helpless to defend against her Fi laser beams, despite the fact that she is a lowly servant and he is the prince.

    And remember, they end up marrying, and she eventually cheats on him with Lancelot (in the show he seems SLI or ILI). I think this relation occurs because male SLEs represent the traditional idea of a blundering, insensitive male who needs a strong, chiding woman to wrangle him in. In essence, these relationships develop out of a commonly held sense of cultural propriety.

    Last edited by discojoe; 03-04-2011 at 03:51 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa33 View Post
    That just hasn't been consistent with SLE and what you're describing Starfall. At least not in my case. My conflictors want and have been open and willing to jump into a relationship with me almost impulsively, even flying hundreds of miles to date me. I never had to put on any sort of a chase for them.
    I won't argue with you on the area of impulsiveness. There is also their drive you have to factor into this. SLE's will go to the end of the earth in order to obtain what they want. If this wasn't the case I'd never be with one of them in the first place. IEI's need that push, they need the other person to prove themselves worthy, and SLE's find that to be enticing.

    I've also noticed that if a person is too easy & throwing themselves at the SLE, then the SLE will take it as more of a fling than anything. It's boring for them. They basically "hit it then quit it" more often then not. Don't get me wrong, they love it; it's a good boost to their ego. I've seen it go both ways... I've noticed that a lot of people view SLE's as playthings.

    Quote Originally Posted by FDG View Post
    There's a simple solution: keep on doing it. They'll eventually get used to it, and start being less rigid. It's similar to neurolinguistic programming, or cognitive behavioral theory. I can see though how a Fi PoLR might be more sensitive towards being scolded, compared to Fi dual-seeking.
    haha I believe that from a young age it was cognitively programed into his brain that he'd get his ass beat if he messed up around her.
    Last edited by Starfall; 03-04-2011 at 04:18 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by jxrtes View Post
    betas should be kept in zoos for children to stare and throw pop corn at.

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    In response to OP, this is not uncommon at all. It has little to do with the particular types; Supervision is one of the most common relation types in romantic relationships. Conflict is rather common as well.

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    yeah I remember you posting that before, Peter. It's a good example!

    And I agree that supervision can be pretty common. It's just sad to watch it after awhile sink slowly down the drain.

    Funny what you said about your SLE and his sister, Starfall. I've heard an SLE say the same things about his ESI wife. And it's hilarious how different he acts around people he can be himself with, his language changes, he's suddenly relaxed and takes his guard down, becomes way funnier, etc. I think he's learned to be very guarded around the ESI and feels complete relief when he's not around her.
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    Quote Originally Posted by redbaron View Post
    I just realized I know FOUR SLE-ESI marriages, all of which are male SLEs with female ESIs.
    My grandparents. They've been together a long time and seem to care about each other. She does things behind his back, like giving their kids birthday presents.

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    Abbie is so boring and rigid it's awesome instead of boring and rigid. She seems so practical and down-to-the-ground.

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    it's hard to be with someone for that long and not at least care about each other.
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    " an Aggressor sees attraction to another person as a static state, which he feels it is up to him to change in the direction more in agreement to his preference."

    so maybe the agressor is the most prone to stay in a supervision relationship? if the agressor thinks that the partner's attraction for him is upon him to change, then maybe he will put more efforts in "changing" the assymetry and conquesting the hard-to-get supervisor. plus it could be harder for him than for other types to see/accept the incompatibility, assymetry and failure instead of trying to conquer sb until they are conquered.

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    Default any ESI's here have experience dating SLE's?

    Tell me your experiences, what went right? what went wrong?
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    Nope, sorry. The thought of it sounds like it would be difficult, though.
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    My ESI (won't say who for um, you get it) was in love with an SLE before she moved and had to discontinue the relationship. Anyway, he was really good looking and had a lot of Se bam, which she liked; I mean he wasn't shy and inactive; he was very active and sometimes just get up and did things without thinking about it. What bothered the SLE was her emotionality; she is serious and melancholic at times, but doesn't lack a sense of humor; what he liked was that she took control, was a get done it type and strict, could get not only herself but others to stick with their responsibilities; ESI is mistrustful, critical, and demanding.


    Joking around with each other hardly worked as Fi tended to get in the way and her feelings would get hurt easily, leaving him bewildered and at times confused.

    What attracted them initially was their sense of humor, but what hurt them more in the future was also that sense of humor; when the sense of humor turned to more criticism, it became the gantlet in the relationship. Energies were comparable; they hung out and did a lot of stuff together.

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    Interesting.

    Well right now I've been hanging out with ESI for the last 5 months or so. She has this ability to melt away any anger I once had. She takes charge, which I like. She's also fucking adorable, she acts all confident and shit in public but one on one she's like an 8 year old (but so am I so its nice).

    Her sense of humor also attracts me. We make fun of each other a lot, although she's strangely insecure about some random things. She'll put on a movie, cadillac something or other (it was about blues music) and she asks me if I've heard of the movie. I said no, I don't watch a whole lot of movies very often. She started asking if I WANT to watch it. I tell her I do. Anyway its kind of odd because, she doesn't reveal her feelings to me. I've told her how I feel several times, she won't. She is very mistrustful, and on several occasions I've invaded her "trust" bubble just to stretch her bounds a little bit. I'll hug her, cuddle her etc even if she doesn't reciprocate. But then she'll start texting me like crazy the next few days, and have a lot of energy, moreso than usual. Anyway I feel bad because most of her family passed away, and I get this feeling she would feel very hurt if things went wrong between us. I want to just, date her, I want her to open up, so we can figure out if we're good for each other, before we get too close. But I feel like she's sorta controlling the distance herself, and pulling me in very very slowly. We're very close, but if she does this it feels like there's no escape.

    I've also noticed some small miscommunications. I once strung a buncha cursewords together into a text and said some aggressive randomness to her (like I always do here, just to make people laugh). I made a "yo mom" joke, and she was like, "oh yeah? well I don't have a mom anymore" and I just sorta stopped and felt guilty, I wasn't sure how to proceed, it was a little awkward.

    I don't really know if these are dealbreakers though, cuz at the same time she and I genuinely care a lot about one another.

    ps: she's almost an EXACT duplicate of Madeline Zima as far as attitude and tone.
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    o.o just don't break her trust in you, don't do anything amoral to such a degree that she'd want to murder you on the spot ^^; Fi can be a bitch and she won't show enough of what goes on emotionally inside...the reaction might be instantaneous and will blindside you.

    From what I can tell you really care about her and despite some jokes that went into a very sensitive area she still sticks around doesn't she? Its going to be a tough challenge reading her and she can probably read you loud and clear most of the time. Be straight with her and talk things out if something like that happens again, its better if she understands clearly what you meant or wanted in stead of speculating.

    ^^ good luck...I never dated an SLI so I don't know about that.

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    that's so strange .. the SLE i like is in a long time relationship with an ESI too. but in my mind they are happy and share a near incomprehensible deep bond and are productive and Te-valuing and beautiful and what else. but if that were really true he probably wouldn't pursue/flirt/or at least talk with every ESI woman who is around and and then try to talk with them about his personal problems. and stare at me from afar like i'm a magical, mystical unicorn whom he dares not to approach when i smile a bit ...

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    I dated an SLE for three years. I have an SLE brother as well. We get along okay and with maturity I've learned that 1. I want people to be happy and 2. That requires others to accept them as they are and be supportive.
    In the case with the SLE i dated for three years, i didn't trust him. And we couldn't compromise on what type of lifestyle we both wanted. I actually initiated the relationship and he was less interested. After we became serious I was probably less satisfied than him. If he wanted something he would get it whether i liked it or not. In this situation children were involved and he was a less mature representative of this type rather than a mature one. He basically said to me multiple times "it's fine for me to have a terrible lifestyle, you're here to take care of everything." Which was true. SLEs are the most likely type to pursue me. It happens all the time. Actually that's why I'm in this thread. I know supervisor relationships don't work out but one is pursuing me right now and his self promotion is off the charts but so is his ego. We speak different love languages too. He's at the point where he's ready to settle down but wants to jump head first into the relationship. I'm trying to ni lol to help him see that looking a little further into the future will help us both make better decisions. Actually it's working a little. but after the experience with my ex i think if we can learn to compromise and both get what we want out of this. It's a helluva gamble though and I'm super indecisive about this. HELP! Give the advices.

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    My reply in bold within quote

    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa View Post
    My ESI (won't say who for um, you get it) was in love with an SLE before she moved and had to discontinue the relationship. Anyway, he was really good looking and had a lot of Se bam, which she liked;
    SAME. WE GO TO THE GYM AND HE TELLS ME TO STAY PRODUCTIVE. I DON'T ALWAYS LISTEN BUT ANY NUDGE IN THAT DIRECTION IS QUITE HELPFUL. HE'S ALL GIGANTIC AND BUFF.
    I mean he wasn't shy and inactive;
    HE'S SOMEWHAT SHY BUT STILL VERY AGGRESSOR
    he was very active and sometimes just get up and did things without thinking about it. What bothered the SLE was her emotionality;
    YEAH HE TELLS ME TO HUSH. ANNOYING.
    she is serious and melancholic at times, but doesn't lack a sense of humor; what he liked was that she took control, was a get done it type and strict, could get not only herself but others to stick with their responsibilities; ESI is mistrustful, critical, and demanding.


    Joking around with each other hardly worked as Fi tended to get in the way and her feelings
    IT WORKS FOR ME BECAUSE EXPERIENCE WITH THIS TYPE TELLS ME THEY NEED THIS TYPE OF DIFFUSION AND HE'S FUNNY.
    would get hurt easily, leaving him bewildered and at times confused.
    IT'S TO EARLY FOR ME TO SENSE IF THIS WILL HAPPEN AS IN MY PAST RELATIONS WITH THIS TYPE. ACTUALLY IT'S MORE TYPICAL FOR THIS TYPE TO BRUSH IT OFF
    What attracted them initially was their sense of humor, but what hurt them more in the future was also that sense of humor;
    HHis Needs Her Needs.
    HE LIKES ME BECAUSE I'M PRETTY AND RESPONSIBLE. END OF STORY.
    when the sense of humor turned to more criticism, it became the gantlet in the relationship. Energies were comparable; they hung out and did a lot of stuff together.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lim View Post
    that's so strange .. the SLE i like is in a long time relationship with an ESI too. but in my mind they are happy and share a near incomprehensible deep bond and are productive and Te-valuing and beautiful and what else. but if that were really true he probably wouldn't pursue/flirt/or at least talk with every ESI woman who is around and and then try to talk with them about his personal problems. and stare at me from afar like i'm a magical, mystical unicorn whom he dares not to approach when i smile a bit ...
    You like this chicks boyfriend? Lol. You dick. Yeah this type is a huge flirt so i recommended that we have an open relationship. Betas in general just seem like cheeting fucks. So anyway, I'd rather let him experience what he wants and me work on my trust issues. The honesty that comes with this type of open relationship can be a trust builder. He's pretty much against it though. With my ex, we got along best when he just said "look here, this is what I'm going to do, deal with it." it pissed me off but the more open he was, the more i respected him. He didn't have to do shit behind my back. He just made me accept what he was doing. The relationship didn't work simply because he was hella irresponsible due to cultural upbringing.

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    If we assume that Donal Trump is SLE, and if we assume that Barack Obama is ESI (and I think these are pretty safe bets), then Obama is Trump's supervisor. And they might interact like this:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Htt91G2qDwM

    Obama basically made Trump his bitch.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    If we assume that Donal Trump is SLE, and if we assume that Barack Obama is ESI (and I think these are pretty safe bets), then Obama is Trump's supervisor. And they might interact like this:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Htt91G2qDwM

    Obama basically made Trump his bitch.
    Would work for SLI and ESE too...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    If we assume that Donal Trump is SLE, and if we assume that Barack Obama is ESI (and I think these are pretty safe bets), then Obama is Trump's supervisor. And they might interact like this:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Htt91G2qDwM

    Obama basically made Trump his bitch.
    Adam Strange...that is interesting. I always considered Trump to be a LIE and Obama to an IEI. Definitively a supervision relationship, but with Trump as the supervisor.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tigerfadder View Post
    Would work for SLI and ESE too...
    Tigerfadder, I wonder if the supervison effect is lessened with certain types. For example, I really respect SLI (I'm and ESE). Hopefully they don't feel supervised by me.
    Last edited by sorrows; 09-24-2016 at 08:10 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sorrowsofyoungwerther View Post
    Tigerfadder, I wonder if the supervison effect is lessened with types. For example, I really respect SLI (I'm and ESE). Hopefully they don't feel supervised by me.
    My idea of how supervision works is that it is about the same for all types. IEI in general like ESE's, they admire their Se and get along well with Fe. And the rest do not really bug them that much. So it is easy and carefree. The other way around is that the ESE see that IEI have their points, the ethic elements get along well enough and everything is fine but somehow the IEI look past the ESE. So the ESE does not feel fully understood. Like, systematically not understood.

    I heard people suggest that supervision when the supervisor have the ethic element in their ego things would be more smooth. I do not know about that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tigerfadder View Post
    My idea of how supervision works is that it is about the same for all types. IEI in general like ESE's, they admire their Se and get along well with Fe. And the rest do not really bug them that much. So it is easy and carefree. The other way around is that the ESE see that IEI have their points, the ethic elements get along well enough and everything is fine but somehow the IEI look past the ESE. So the ESE does not feel fully understood. Like, systematically not understood.

    I heard people suggest that supervision when the supervisor have the ethic element in their ego things would be more smooth. I do not know about that.
    Tigerfadder, thank you for the clarification. I suspect that having ethic element would ensure smoother relations but it may not be the case. I know an EII and ILE, and the ILE looks incredibly uncomfortable around the EII and avoids her. Her body language changes quite a bit as soon as the EII is around.

    In regards to my supervisor, I tend to think the IEI is clever and admirable, and I am terrified of them, and avoid them.
    Last edited by sorrows; 09-25-2016 at 12:35 AM.

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    I think supervision is generally easier to deal with for extraverts. I mean, the introvert elements (which are always the supervisor of an extravert type) don't tend to be projected out by other people as strongly if it's even possible to do that. I'm not saying it's never rough, just that it's less rough.

    I do think a lot of things here are sort of naïvely understood. No one is going to go conquest their supervisor for the challenge, ever (most likely).

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    I've known this ESI-Se for a few years and we've always gotten along very well. (full disclosure - I happen to like her a lot. A very lot.) She recently (six months?) found an SLE-Se GF and I met the two of them today.

    They seem to get along really well. When they are close to each other, it is like a sensual Se-fest, with the ESI being more dominant and the SLE being more sensually luxurious. Somehow, the SLE seems introverted, but of course, is not. It may have to do with the SLE-Se being the supervisee in the relationship, and being vulnerable to the Fi of the ESI.

    The ESI-Se has an SEE father and an IEI mother, FWIW. (I happen to believe that people often marry the same or similar types as their parents. I did.)

    The only hints that something might be amiss between them were two glances that the ESI gave the SLE. I've never seen her look that way before, but it was like she was really pissed/angry/upset at the SLE, just for a moment, before her face fell back to normal. It was like a wolf ready to attack. And the SLE did nothing that I could tell to deserve that.

    Ah, Supervision.

    I married my Supervisor, an SLI-Te, and the relationship was pretty good for a while (I thought), almost like being married to a Mirror, until she suddenly moved out one day. I guess she finally got tired of Supervising me. Lol. When I couldn't get her to move back, I filed for divorce, and this made her very, very happy, because she could then have full control of her "half". I got the distinct impression that she was afraid I would throw away all of our money, even though she was in debt when I met her, and the steady accumulation since then must have been a bewildering accident which had nothing to do with me.

    Supervisory feelings are not rational. They are feelings not based on facts.

    I once asked her why she married me, and she said she was crazy about me. In retrospect, it might have been better if she had been normal about me.

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    I feel like you could write for penthouse adam

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