ISTps under stress

[jewels]

Please add to the list, or comment.

These are things I notice:

being short-tempered
saying critical things, or picking something apart. (i.e. you did this wrong! It should be done another way)
not being sympathetic/empathetic (having a "deal with it" attitude)
becoming bossy about how things should be done/giving advice, and getting mad if their advice isn't taken

spending hours playing video games, or "researching" things that don't really need to be looked into, or aren't priorities. Like reading about other types of stereo speakers, after already buying some.

Or zoning out in front of the tv for long periods of time.

talking about being very "busy" but not really doing anything

Not noticing the usual Si things, like not being aware they are hungry, or just taking tylenol if they have a bad cold instead of resting/not taking care of their health/eating junk food.

staying in all of the time, and not wanting to go out

wearing the same thing every day, even when it's old

becoming freaked out if something is thrown away, such as an old towel that is ratty and stained. But they're like "that towel was originally expensive when I bought it (x number of years ago)

Becoming obsessed w/ small amounts of money, and trying to save twelve cents on cheese.

not working out

no longer working towards goals, or working apathetically towards them.

focusing only on their own needs/wants, ignoring other people's. Then getting angry and telling others they are "selfish" if they express any.

having a "poor me" attitude, but in a silent sulking way.

stonewalling.

being drawn to something totally different as an "escape." Such as picking up and moving to the Alps. Or anything not very practical.

So they basically become their opposite, with low Si and Te. And become less practical.

And I wonder if IEEs become their opposite under stress, in that we don't see new possibilities and don't encourage relationships to grow?

[Creepy-male]

I can relate to a fair bit of that.

EDIT

I hear that Rick wrote an article describing how different base functions act when under stress. I think Si bases will tend to become very controlling when stressed out.

[krieger]

being short-tempered
saying critical things, or picking something apart. (i.e. you did this wrong! It should be done another way)
not being sympathetic/empathetic (having a "deal with it" attitude)
becoming bossy about how things should be done/giving advice, and getting mad if their advice isn't taken

[CILi]

...So [SLIs] basically become their opposite, with low Si and Te. And become less practical.

If stress supresses the Ego, do you think it also increases use of some other pair of functions?

Is a stressed SLI more like IEE, EIE, or something else?

I have seen lots of your "list" in stressed SLIs I've known, but I wonder if some of that's just the natural fall-out of depression (or a similar state), regardless of type. In other words, a "stressed IEE" may look a whole lot like the "stressed SLI" above.

Or maybe not.

[Lobo]

Sounds like he has an issue that's bothering him and probably needs confrontation. The only thing I can think of when I read all that is he might need someone to call him on all of his bs, which will probably make him angry and explode/externalize whatever it is that's bothering him and let it all out once and for all.

[Words]

Sounds like he has an issue that's bothering him and probably needs confrontation. The only thing I can think of when I read all that is he might need someone to call him on all of his bs, which will probably make him angry and explode/externalize whatever it is that's bothering him and let it all out once and for all.

You'd make a good friend if you'd let a person as you say externalise all this. I know I've needed one sometimes.

[humblepie]

Sounds like he has an issue that's bothering him and probably needs confrontation. The only thing I can think of when I read all that is he might need someone to call him on all of his bs, which will probably make him angry and explode/externalize whatever it is that's bothering him and let it all out once and for all.

oh my god! that is my boyfriend. i called him on it (kicked him out) and now he's back to his old self. who knew being a bitch was actually a good thing!

ha ha you learn something new every day.

[Lobo]

I know how nice and sweet IEEs can be, and some might not see that the most effective way to deal with someone like that is to give them tough love and stand by them, but letting them know that you will not be fucked around with in the process.

[humblepie]

I know how nice and sweet IEEs can be, and some might not see that the most effective way to deal with someone like that is to give them tough love and stand by them, but letting them know that you will not be fucked around with in the process.

yeah that's kind of what i did. i kicked him out but i texted him to say that i'd wait for him to come to his senses. i actually said i'd wait for the rest of my life for him to cop on. i told him if i had to go without sex for 10 years i would but that i wouldn't have to wait that long cos he's cleverer than that. it only took him four days. bless his clever little head.

[Park]

YouTube - Smokey this is not 'Nam, this is bowling. There are rules

LOL, OWNED

[Park]

and jewel's list is hilarious... because it's right on the money

[Cyrano]

LOL, OWNED

Parkster, What do you make of Jewel's list? I think I exhibit many of those behaviors, but I thought I handled stress better than that

[Words]

Parkster, What do you make of Jewel's list? I think I exhibit many of those behaviors, but I thought I handled stress better than that

I'm not Parkster, but I think jewels list is on the money and demonstrates the parts of me I continue to battle against.

[jewels]

awesome! I love that the ISTps here can relate

I've tried a few approaches. Ignoring it (which eventually annoys me). Making fun of it (I've called one ISTp a "grumpy crab" w/ crab hand motions which seems to work well. And also I've tried just saying "You're wrong!! wrong. wrong." Because I usually am all about the gray area/seeing other's perspectives, which gets confusing. But when I notice they are full of crap and say "you're wrong" that can get an apology.

Not sure of a long term solution though.

[Park]

Parkster, What do you make of Jewel's list? I think I exhibit many of those behaviors, but I thought I handled stress better than that

Well yeah, me too, but only to a certain degree. Once the line is crossed, I'm all those things... and then some.

And sometimes when I've really had it, I can act pretty much like "the dude"s friend. (from the video)

[Cyrano]

I'm not Parkster, but I think jewels list is on the money and demonstrates the parts of me I continue to battle against.

Yeah, but she still doesn't know the secret handshake.

[humblepie]

awesome! I love that the ISTps here can relate

I've tried a few approaches. Ignoring it (which eventually annoys me). Making fun of it (I've called one ISTp a "grumpy crab" w/ crab hand motions which seems to work well. And also I've tried just saying "You're wrong!! wrong. wrong." Because I usually am all about the gray area/seeing other's perspectives, which gets confusing. But when I notice they are full of crap and say "you're wrong" that can get an apology.

Not sure of a long term solution though.

ha ha a grumpy crab! sounds about right. i might steal that one the next time he starts up. i usually just call him a selfish prick, grumpy crab is alot kinder.

[Words]

awesome! I love that the ISTps here can relate

I've tried a few approaches. Ignoring it (which eventually annoys me). Making fun of it (I've called one ISTp a "grumpy crab" w/ crab hand motions which seems to work well. And also I've tried just saying "You're wrong!! wrong. wrong." Because I usually am all about the gray area/seeing other's perspectives, which gets confusing. But when I notice they are full of crap and say "you're wrong" that can get an apology.

Not sure of a long term solution though.

I'm curious, wouldn't you rather cut an ISTp loose than put up with all that? I guess if not, why, if it's ok to ask?

[Words]

Yeah, but she still doesn't know the secret handshake.

Or the special straight face, we have many....

[humblepie]

I'm curious, wouldn't you rather cut an ISTp loose than put up with all that? I guess if not, why, if it's ok to ask?

well if it continued after you put your foot down you would have no choice but to walk away. you would be harming both yourself and them by staying and allowing them to carry on.

[jewels]

well that's only the list of negatives. And there is a longer list of positives in fact, interspersed between that list.

I've been depressed before and wasn't a picnic to be around (but then again I didn't go out of my way to cut people down either -- but I'm also not an ISTp). I'm going to give it a while and see what happens. But I definitely spend less time w/ ISTps who are being like that...

[humblepie]

yeah i've been depressed before too and did things an istp would NEVER do so i suppose you just have to forgive them don't ya! i was actually depressed for the entire duration of his depression for reasons i wont go into and it made it very difficult to see the wood for the trees and not get upset.

something snapped in me a few weeks ago and i promised myself i was going to be happy. i had a shitload of work to get through and i think it was because my mind was focused elsewhere and i was able to step back (and i felt good for getting all the horrible yocky work done) that i was able to see what was going on. i saw beyond the hurtful comments and realised he was hurting. i knew the reason he was hurting was that he wasn't giving himself the chance to deal with the things that were bothering him. i knew the only way for him to deal with it was for me to go. he was never going to face things if i kept ignoring the problem.

[Suz]

Is this between you and your newlywed husband, or another ISTp? Isn't it too early to be fighting like this?

[jewels]

ya, it's kinda disappointing. But I'm going to wait and see. He may just be under a lot of pressure at the moment, and is feeling pretty down on himself. And he's willing to go talk to a therapist. Obviously if this didn't improve it'd be a serious problem however!!

[ashlesha]

yeah, a lot of the stuff on that list looks familiar. as i read it, i was like..OH yeah.

it's pretty great that he's willing to talk to a therapist..that can be intimidating for a lot of people, but i imagine it would be a really big thing for most SLIs.

[humblepie]

ya, it's kinda disappointing. But I'm going to wait and see. He may just be under a lot of pressure at the moment, and is feeling pretty down on himself. And he's willing to go talk to a therapist. Obviously if this didn't improve it'd be a serious problem however!!

have you tried talking to him about it? i suppose you are probably met with a giant wall of resistance?

[jewels]

have you tried talking to him about it? i suppose you are probably met with a giant wall of resistance?

ya, he switches between saying "I'm sorry" or getting defensive and telling me it's all my fault because I'm too sensitive, or whatever his defense of the moment happens to be.

[Words]

ya, he switches between saying "I'm sorry" or getting defensive and telling me it's all my fault because I'm too sensitive, or whatever his defense of the moment happens to be.

I am reluctant to give advice, because hey what if it's wrong and also what if it goes wrong! However, when i've been like the way you've mentioned, sometimes i've even cut the person off, what i've found is that when i've had some time to myself to contemplate it all, like perhaps a week or two, that I realise the things I am missing and that I have been a douchebag and it makes me want to change and make amends, sort of like the not appreciating the water till the wells run dry. So I was going to suggest you go on vacation/work trip or something on your own or with friends, give him some time to himself. You could arrange this after his next outburst, tell him what you think of it, and remind him of it too (ie he was acting terribly, he is supposed to be a man and should know better, the truth).

[Lobo]

Idk, I'm kind of at a point in my life, where I just can't see myself putting up with someone who is self-centered like what you are describing jewels, without getting really pissed off and confrontational... Whenever there is tension, there is almost always a climax that I just want to get to as soon as possible. Granted, I'm also a pretty anxious person, so maybe there is something in my "extreme" that is applicable to what you're dealing with, or possibly good advice. Reading about your issue, I can only think that it's only a matter of time until something pivotal happens, because you can't just be dragging things like this for a long time... It will drain you through out and when the resolution finally comes (be what it is) you might find yourself considering if all that was worth it.

It seems like your hubby, like other people sometimes do, has taken advantage of the relationship status you have and has taken the liberty of being an asshole, because there is no consequence that he is afraid of... Unfortunately, some people don't realize how awful it is to be taken advantage of in this way, and bring you to taking steps like ignoring him for some time, maybe leaving him, which go against what your idea of a good relationship is, and might simply not be in your nature to do. Having to think about potentially drastic/uncomfortable measures to handle people like what you are describing must be terrible, especially if you are afraid of being treated badly by someone you love. I think this is especially true for infantiles, who will end up putting up with a lot out of fear of being abandoned, even if the person is a complete douche.

I still believe that the kind of situation you are dealing with will be better resolved from a feeling of anger, and not from something "peaceful" and patient. I think it's extremely important for delta infantiles to set clear boundaries and show that you will not be fucked around with, as in you will not have your emotional energy drained that way... I'm not saying that you should just be carrying a bat with you all the time, but to carry one with a smile on your face. The strange thing is, and obviously you shouldn't be doing for this reason, is that I bet it might end up turning him on if you become a hardass (there's something about you becoming a hardass that delta STs find attractive). None of that "try to make him laugh" thing to keep things all nice and sweet, when someone's being a pussy (which is what it sounds like) they just need some whoop ass .

[Creepy-male]

And don't be afraid of getting angry because it might end things. If things break down once you get angry, then I am of the staunch opinion that they needed to end.

[jewels]

I've never been one to yell at people, or insult people, because I believe you can't "take back" insults and they poison a relationship.

However, funny several of you mentioned that, because I did start yelling at him and letting him have it. I called him a jackass. And I also looked at getting my own place, and said I might go see a place that afternoon.

Then I told him whenever he acts like a jackass I'm going to yell at him until he stops it.

He agreed to go to a therapist and the doctor, and I told him I'd give him a little time, but couldn't promise how long.

I also started not really "accepting" his "arguments" (that are full of crap), and I just tell him what he said was stupid and made no sense and he's full of crap.

At first he stormed off, and then he came back furious and looked like he might be about to tear the house apart, and the he tried to blame me for all of his problems (which made no sense), and then he finally apolgized.

He was surprisingly not mad at me for yelling at him, but instead seemed to appreciate it. However, the response pissed me off, as the last thing I need is more insults/negativity from him.

We'll see how it goes...I have already started to do a lot of things during the week without him (taking classes at night, etc.), working more, volunteering, etc. and will probably add a few more as well.

[humblepie]

I've never been one to yell at people, or insult people, because I believe you can't "take back" insults and they poison a relationship.

However, funny several of you mentioned that, because I did start yelling at him and letting him have it. I called him a jackass. And I also looked at getting my own place, and said I might go see a place that afternoon.

Then I told him whenever he acts like a jackass I'm going to yell at him until he stops it.

He agreed to go to a therapist and the doctor, and I told him I'd give him a little time, but couldn't promise how long.

I also started not really "accepting" his "arguments" (that are full of crap), and I just tell him what he said was stupid and made no sense and he's full of crap.

At first he stormed off, and then he came back furious and looked like he might be about to tear the house apart, and the he tried to blame me for all of his problems (which made no sense), and then he finally apolgized.

He was surprisingly not mad at me for yelling at him, but instead seemed to appreciate it. However, the response pissed me off, as the last thing I need is more insults/negativity from him.

We'll see how it goes...I have already started to do a lot of things during the week without him (taking classes at night, etc.), working more, volunteering, etc. and will probably add a few more as well.

good girl!

[Lobo]

I've never been one to yell at people, or insult people, because I believe you can't "take back" insults and they poison a relationship.

I agree, but it depends on what you say too. Sometimes you can be driven to such anger that it's hard to not do any of that.

[humblepie]

I've never been one to yell at people, or insult people, because I believe you can't "take back" insults and they poison a relationship.

However, funny several of you mentioned that, because I did start yelling at him and letting him have it. I called him a jackass. And I also looked at getting my own place, and said I might go see a place that afternoon.

Then I told him whenever he acts like a jackass I'm going to yell at him until he stops it.

He agreed to go to a therapist and the doctor, and I told him I'd give him a little time, but couldn't promise how long.

I also started not really "accepting" his "arguments" (that are full of crap), and I just tell him what he said was stupid and made no sense and he's full of crap.

At first he stormed off, and then he came back furious and looked like he might be about to tear the house apart, and the he tried to blame me for all of his problems (which made no sense), and then he finally apolgized.

He was surprisingly not mad at me for yelling at him, but instead seemed to appreciate it. However, the response pissed me off, as the last thing I need is more insults/negativity from him.

We'll see how it goes...I have already started to do a lot of things during the week without him (taking classes at night, etc.), working more, volunteering, etc. and will probably add a few more as well.

you know he'll respect you alot more if you stand up to him and tell him what he is doing is wrong. he will get it eventually when he steps back and looks at his behaviour objectively. if you think about it, if you were acting like an asshole and he didn't pull you up on it, how would you feel towards him when you later realised how wrong you were and he did nothing to stop you. personally i wouldn't respect someone who let me get away with being an asshole. i think if he's making you angry you should let it out, it's the healthier option, and it might help him to release some of his pent up aggression. like i said earlier sometimes being a bitch can be a good thing. embrace your inner bitch! we don't get to usually being cursed with so much damn empathy and all.

[Creepy-male]

He was surprisingly not mad at me for yelling at him, but instead seemed to appreciate it. However, the response pissed me off, as the last thing I need is more insults/negativity from him.

Having been on the appreciative side of this sort of ordeal myself, I can't help but wonder if he's feeling manipulated or disrespected or something. This was what happened in my case.

It may be an unreasonable extension then to think that perhaps his bad behaviour is passive-aggressive acting out against him seeing you as manipulating or not being straight with him, or somesuch.

Please be very careful to not use what I just said to rationalise his acting out. The more you excuse someone's poor behaviour, the less healthy your relationship becomes, and the less able you become to adequately gauge if you need to leave. Instead, think of it as a suggestion that you perhaps need to think about how to get at what part you're perhaps playing in causing this, if any (that is an important if!! Even worse than rationalising is shifting the blame onto yourself)

[Words]

I've never been one to yell at people, or insult people, because I believe you can't "take back" insults and they poison a relationship.

However, funny several of you mentioned that, because I did start yelling at him and letting him have it. I called him a jackass. And I also looked at getting my own place, and said I might go see a place that afternoon.

Then I told him whenever he acts like a jackass I'm going to yell at him until he stops it.

He agreed to go to a therapist and the doctor, and I told him I'd give him a little time, but couldn't promise how long.

I also started not really "accepting" his "arguments" (that are full of crap), and I just tell him what he said was stupid and made no sense and he's full of crap.

At first he stormed off, and then he came back furious and looked like he might be about to tear the house apart, and the he tried to blame me for all of his problems (which made no sense), and then he finally apolgized.

He was surprisingly not mad at me for yelling at him, but instead seemed to appreciate it. However, the response pissed me off, as the last thing I need is more insults/negativity from him.

We'll see how it goes...I have already started to do a lot of things during the week without him (taking classes at night, etc.), working more, volunteering, etc. and will probably add a few more as well.

Put up your hand as if a stop sign and say, "Look...... I don't want to hear it".

[jewels]

yes, he is being passive aggressive, but not because I've done anything manipulative -- I'm quite direct. He is not direct, which is something that bothers me, as I never know for sure what really upsets him, and what he pretends upsets him just to prove whatever point at that moment.

So, for example, he was blaming various things he forgot to do onto me in such a far-fetched way that I told him it was absurd, and then he realized what he was doing and stopped, and apologized.

I agree that the direct "stop it" thing probably will work best. I'll try that hand thing . hahah.

Lobo, yes he does cross the line and has said things that I think he regrets, but I'm still in control regardless of how angry I get. I'm very aware of the words I'm choosing. Still, not a habit I want to get into, of calling people such things!

I think I almost need to treat him like a child, and do the whole "I will turn this car around!" thing.

The other day he was wavering on whether he was going to go w/ me to an important event (because he wanted to be well rested when he hung out w/ his friends later in the week), so I told him to even think of changing his mind was extremely rude and unsupportive, and because of that I wasn't going to allow him to go w/ me at all. I said he didn't even deserve to go w/ me, and I would find someone else to go. And at that point he insisted on going and apologized again.

And then it's weird, because he insisted on going out last night when I had plans. I was looking forward to having a break from all of this! But he insisted on showing up. It was odd. He said he missed me, but I almost think it's some other reason. Who knows.

He's just very unpredictable, which I usually like when it's something good!

That said, he was really sweet the last couple of days. And took off of work just to take me out one day, since we were fighting on our "date night."

Thank you all for the advice. I'm really hoping it improves. He is very stressed/depressed, and I don't think he knows how to handle it, because things were always "easy" for him in the past.

[Kirana]

Please add to the list, or comment.

These are things I notice:

being short-tempered
saying critical things, or picking something apart. (i.e. you did this wrong! It should be done another way)
not being sympathetic/empathetic (having a "deal with it" attitude)
becoming bossy about how things should be done/giving advice, and getting mad if their advice isn't taken

spending hours playing video games, or "researching" things that don't really need to be looked into, or aren't priorities. Like reading about other types of stereo speakers, after already buying some.

Or zoning out in front of the tv for long periods of time.

talking about being very "busy" but not really doing anything

Not noticing the usual Si things, like not being aware they are hungry, or just taking tylenol if they have a bad cold instead of resting/not taking care of their health/eating junk food.

staying in all of the time, and not wanting to go out

wearing the same thing every day, even when it's old

becoming freaked out if something is thrown away, such as an old towel that is ratty and stained. But they're like "that towel was originally expensive when I bought it (x number of years ago)

Becoming obsessed w/ small amounts of money, and trying to save twelve cents on cheese.

not working out

no longer working towards goals, or working apathetically towards them.

focusing only on their own needs/wants, ignoring other people's. Then getting angry and telling others they are "selfish" if they express any.

having a "poor me" attitude, but in a silent sulking way.

stonewalling.

being drawn to something totally different as an "escape." Such as picking up and moving to the Alps. Or anything not very practical.

So they basically become their opposite, with low Si and Te. And become less practical.

And I wonder if IEEs become their opposite under stress, in that we don't see new possibilities and don't encourage relationships to grow?

yep, that's my husband all right.

[jewels]

come to think of it, when I was younger I could be pretty mean when I was stressed.

Now not so much.

But at one point where I was really worried (as I wasn't making enough money and possibly couldn't afford my bills, but needed to in order to do what I wanted in life), I remember I was so obsessed w/ that every moment, that I would just snap at family, and sometimes just yell at them, or ignore them. Or be annoyed they wouldn't just leave me alone.

So that was pretty anti-Fi.

And another time I was really depressed and couldn't see any possibilities, and wanted to throw in the towel on everything. Talk about anti-Ne.

So I guess we do the opposite when under lots of stress.

[Rubicon]

Sorry if this is too prying, but what does he have to be stressed/depressed about? I was just thinking that perhaps he needs to get involved in/find something that he loves doing. That an SLI's self-worth might go down when they feel they're not doing or contributing anything worthwhile. Maybe he feels like you're taking care of things too much. Sounds like you're busy with a lot of things while he's not up to much. :-p