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Thread: ILE 8w1

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    Default ILE 8w1

    What is the likelihood of being an ILE-Ti 8w1?
    "Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checkered by failure, than to take rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much, because they live in the gray twilight that knows not victory nor defeat."
    --Theodore Roosevelt

    "Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover."
    -- Mark Twain

    "Man who stand on hill with mouth open will wait long time for roast duck to drop in."
    -- Confucius

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    Let's fly now Gilly's Avatar
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    impossible, being that 8 can only be w9 or w7.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly View Post
    impossible, being that 8 can only be w9 or w7.
    oh, I thought it could go to one also...

    okay, well, forget that!
    "Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checkered by failure, than to take rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much, because they live in the gray twilight that knows not victory nor defeat."
    --Theodore Roosevelt

    "Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover."
    -- Mark Twain

    "Man who stand on hill with mouth open will wait long time for roast duck to drop in."
    -- Confucius

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    There need to be degrees of zero.

    The likelihood of an ILE 8wAnything most definitely is or is very near to zero.

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    Jimbean you are LSI-Ti 6w5 sp/sx, get over it.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly View Post
    impossible, being that 8 can only be w9 or w7.
    ^This.
    What do these signs mean—, , etc.? Why cannot socionists use symbols Ne, Ni etc. as in MBTI? Just because they have somewhat different meaning. Socionics and MBTI, each in its own way, have slightly modified the original Jung's description of his 8 psychological types. For this reason, (Ne) is not exactly the same as Ne in MBTI.

    Just one example: in MBTI, Se (extraverted sensing) is associated with life pleasures, excitement etc. By contrast, the socionic function (extraverted sensing) is first and foremost associated with control and expansion of personal space (which sometimes can manifest in excessive aagression, but often also manifests in a capability of managing lots of people and things).

    For this reason, we consider comparison between MBTI types and socionic types by functions to be rather useless than useful.

    -Victor Gulenko, Dmitri Lytov

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    Very much agree what Thanks Arthur said. 7w8 maybe, but both 8 and 1 are probably the least likely e-types for an ILE to have.
    You can do anything with a bayonet except sit on it.

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    Im no ILE but I dont think 8 is unlikely for ILEs. I knew a woman who claimed to be one. Type 1 is unliklely though IMO.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Typhon View Post
    Im no ILE but I dont think 8 is unlikely for ILEs. I knew a woman who claimed to be one. Type 1 is unliklely though IMO.
    Why do e-types correlate with socionics? Why can I not be a one or eight and ILE?
    "Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checkered by failure, than to take rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much, because they live in the gray twilight that knows not victory nor defeat."
    --Theodore Roosevelt

    "Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover."
    -- Mark Twain

    "Man who stand on hill with mouth open will wait long time for roast duck to drop in."
    -- Confucius

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimbean View Post
    Why do e-types correlate with socionics? Why can I not be a one or eight and ILE?
    There is no correlation. But, you know, it's unlikely that an ILE would develop the defense mechanisms and outlook of an E8.

    Put it another way... E8 and ILE are rather incompatible. Why do you consider yourself E8? Why do you consider yourself ILE? While it is possible that you are an ILE E8, it is far more likely that one or the other (or both) are wrong.

    EDIT

    Think of it this way...

    One interpretation of etypes is that they're how you cope with childhood traumas. Your etype is your ego setting itself up to defend against threats it has learned to expect from the environment, and emotional threats that come from within. Positive Outlook types, for instance, need to not feel bad, so they are chronic emotional self-soothers.

    One lesson we can draw from Socionics is that one can only perceive reality through their subjective relationship with it. So for instance an environment that might breed an E5 ILE would produce an E9 if it were an SEI instead. That would be my rough guess at a justification for why some etypes and sociotypes are incompatible.

    Another way of looking at it is that each Socionics type has an inclination to one or more etypes, and several etypes are just nonsensical for some sociotypes (like an ESE E5, or, in lay English "an extraverted, social, emotionally intense people's person who is withdrawn, unsociable, and deeply uncomfortable to the extent of avoidance of their own feelings"--you see the contradiction).
    Last edited by male; 10-07-2010 at 04:53 AM.

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    First note: Ashton thoughtfully typed me as LSI-Ti 6w5

    I believe that I am ILE-Ti 8w9 because I think Fi POLR fits best as a POLR for me, and I think my Ne is a little stronger than my Se, although I still think it is possible for me to be Se ego. I am an eight because the attitude of fixating around strength and overcoming obstacles fits me that way; I am also always competing with others and think in terms of degrees of conflict that I have with every situation. I sometimes have an impulse of wanting to attack, but I am also quite capable of thinking logically about how to build a defense. Ashton once told me that eights are gut instinct thinkers, while sixes are cognitive thinkers. I think I am 50/50 between both of those.
    "Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checkered by failure, than to take rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much, because they live in the gray twilight that knows not victory nor defeat."
    --Theodore Roosevelt

    "Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover."
    -- Mark Twain

    "Man who stand on hill with mouth open will wait long time for roast duck to drop in."
    -- Confucius

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimbean View Post
    I believe that I am ILE-Ti 8w9 because I think Fi POLR fits best as a POLR for me, and I think my Ne is a little stronger than my Se, although I still think it is possible for me to be Se ego.
    Alright, but none of what you said means anything yet.

    Why do you think Fi PoLR fits best? Or to be more specific, what is your conception of Fi PoLR, and how does it apply to you?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jimbean View Post
    I am an eight because the attitude of fixating around strength and overcoming obstacles fits me that way; I am also always competing with others and think in terms of degrees of conflict that I have with every situation. I sometimes have an impulse of wanting to attack, but I am also quite capable of thinking logically about how to build a defense. Ashton once told me that eights are gut instinct thinkers, while sixes are cognitive thinkers. I think I am 50/50 between both of those.
    What you have described is deeply incompatible with weak Se, and especially weak and unvalued Se (as in an ILE). Se role simply would not perceive things in such terms, as it lacks the acuity to do so, and is often not used in favour of the Base function, unless somehow pressured due to external demands.

    The above paragraph is also rife with Se vocabulary and concepts, such as attack and defence, obstacles and overcoming them, competition, and conflict.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Thanks Arthur View Post
    Alright, but none of what you said means anything yet.

    Why do you think Fi PoLR fits best? Or to be more specific, what is your conception of Fi PoLR, and how does it apply to you?



    What you have described is deeply incompatible with weak Se, and especially weak and unvalued Se (as in an ILE). Se role simply would not perceive things in such terms, as it lacks the acuity to do so, and is often not used in favour of the Base function, unless somehow pressured due to external demands.

    The above paragraph is also rife with Se vocabulary and concepts, such as attack and defence, obstacles and overcoming them, competition, and conflict.
    Fact: I am Fi POLR and not Se base.

    Therefore ILE-Ti 8w9 fits best considering all of my personality motives.
    "Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checkered by failure, than to take rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much, because they live in the gray twilight that knows not victory nor defeat."
    --Theodore Roosevelt

    "Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover."
    -- Mark Twain

    "Man who stand on hill with mouth open will wait long time for roast duck to drop in."
    -- Confucius

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    Fact: you are not an Alpha, and most certainly not an ILE.

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    yeah why do you not think Se base? Jimbean, maybe you're SLE-Ti. that'd give you a nice dose of Fi polr.
    IEI-Fe 4w3

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    I'm no expert, just to clarify, however i'll give you my impression: I've read some of your posts, and I think you seem very mechanistic to be ENTp.

    Also for what it's worth, your very methodical with your logic, systematic Ti with S, .... and you come across as somewhat methodical in your politeness, something like how an Fi role can display itself in an LSI. Careful to remember your manners, respect for authority which seems to come natural to you, like for instance respect for Rick who's an 'important busy man'.

    A decent solid well adapted LSI.

    As to your Enneagram, I don't know.

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    Jimbean in my experience with you on cam, you do not have the solid sort of presence that E8s tend to have; while you can be firm and challenging, you also tend to sort of crumble and give ground when a lot of emotional pressure is put on you; this is consistent with E6, whose attachment object-relation increases their level of investment and energy as confrontation escalates, and internal compliant strategy tends to either concede or withdraw their hand from a fight under too much pressure, even if they still hold their same opinion or disagree. This is as opposed to E8s object frustration relation, which causes them to divest emotional energy when a conflict escalates, and assertive social strategy, which gives them the tendency to hold their ground no matter what.

    This is why you see me (E3) and Ashton (E8) get into so many headbutting matches: we are both Assertive strategy, and I am Attachment whereas he is Frustration, which winds up with me chasing him around with endless objections and never letting up, and him offering one-line rebuttals that attempt to end the conflict and refusing to give ground.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

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    Also E6s are the most likely to be alarmist nutjobs.
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Thanks Arthur View Post
    Fact: you are not an Alpha, and most certainly not an ILE.
    I thought you said there were no facts in socionics?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly View Post
    Also E6s are the most likely to be alarmist nutjobs.
    IEI-Fe 4w3

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly View Post
    Also E6s are the most likely to be alarmist nutjobs.
    Do you think this might also be as a result of weak Ni?

    ie weak and valued Ni, the mobilising function etc

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    Quote Originally Posted by Words View Post
    Do you think this might also be as a result of weak Ni?
    oooh, good point. a bit obsessed with the future, etc.
    IEI-Fe 4w3

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    Quote Originally Posted by Thanks Arthur View Post
    Fact: you are not an Alpha, and most certainly not an ILE.
    fact: nobody cares what other people declare as fact

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    Quote Originally Posted by ilikesex View Post
    fact: nobody cares what other people declare as fact
    So you don't like sex....

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly View Post
    Jimbean in my experience with you on cam, you do not have the solid sort of presence that E8s tend to have; while you can be firm and challenging, you also tend to sort of crumble and give ground when a lot of emotional pressure is put on you; this is consistent with E6, whose attachment object-relation increases their level of investment and energy as confrontation escalates, and internal compliant strategy tends to either concede or withdraw their hand from a fight under too much pressure, even if they still hold their same opinion or disagree. This is as opposed to E8s object frustration relation, which causes them to divest emotional energy when a conflict escalates, and assertive social strategy, which gives them the tendency to hold their ground no matter what.

    This is why you see me (E3) and Ashton (E8) get into so many headbutting matches: we are both Assertive strategy, and I am Attachment whereas he is Frustration, which winds up with me chasing him around with endless objections and never letting up, and him offering one-line rebuttals that attempt to end the conflict and refusing to give ground.
    This is a very good observation. I had not even noticed this myself in that way.

    So you think E6's tend to be alarmists? Is this written anywhere or is this in your experience?
    "Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checkered by failure, than to take rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much, because they live in the gray twilight that knows not victory nor defeat."
    --Theodore Roosevelt

    "Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover."
    -- Mark Twain

    "Man who stand on hill with mouth open will wait long time for roast duck to drop in."
    -- Confucius

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    Quote Originally Posted by Words View Post
    So you don't like sex....
    you are retarded

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    Just parroting here that anything not Ej or ESXp is incredibly unlikely for E8.
    "And above all, watch with glittering eyes the whole world around you because the greatest secrets are always hidden in the most unlikely places. Those who don't believe in magic will never find it." -Roald Dahl

    http://forum.socionix.com/
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimbean View Post
    First note: Ashton thoughtfully typed me as LSI-Ti 6w5

    I believe that I am ILE-Ti 8w9 because I think Fi POLR fits best as a POLR for me, and I think my Ne is a little stronger than my Se, although I still think it is possible for me to be Se ego. I am an eight because the attitude of fixating around strength and overcoming obstacles fits me that way; I am also always competing with others and think in terms of degrees of conflict that I have with every situation. I sometimes have an impulse of wanting to attack, but I am also quite capable of thinking logically about how to build a defense. Ashton once told me that eights are gut instinct thinkers, while sixes are cognitive thinkers. I think I am 50/50 between both of those.
    Dude,

    Everyone has impulses.

    You're way overthinking this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly View Post
    Jimbean in my experience with you on cam, you do not have the solid sort of presence that E8s tend to have; while you can be firm and challenging, you also tend to sort of crumble and give ground when a lot of emotional pressure is put on you; this is consistent with E6, whose attachment object-relation increases their level of investment and energy as confrontation escalates, and internal compliant strategy tends to either concede or withdraw their hand from a fight under too much pressure, even if they still hold their same opinion or disagree. This is as opposed to E8s object frustration relation, which causes them to divest emotional energy when a conflict escalates, and assertive social strategy, which gives them the tendency to hold their ground no matter what.

    This is why you see me (E3) and Ashton (E8) get into so many headbutting matches: we are both Assertive strategy, and I am Attachment whereas he is Frustration, which winds up with me chasing him around with endless objections and never letting up, and him offering one-line rebuttals that attempt to end the conflict and refusing to give ground.
    You and ashton head butt?

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    Quote Originally Posted by mercutio View Post
    Dude,

    Everyone has impulses.

    You're way overthinking this.
    no, it's more than that.

    As far as the whole emotional pressure thing, that is something that I need to overcome. If I can do that, I can be practically invincible
    "Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checkered by failure, than to take rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much, because they live in the gray twilight that knows not victory nor defeat."
    --Theodore Roosevelt

    "Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover."
    -- Mark Twain

    "Man who stand on hill with mouth open will wait long time for roast duck to drop in."
    -- Confucius

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimbean View Post
    I am an eight because the attitude of fixating around strength and overcoming obstacles fits me that way; I am also always competing with others and think in terms of degrees of conflict that I have with every situation. I sometimes have an impulse of wanting to attack, but I am also quite capable of thinking logically about how to build a defense.
    That sounds equally applicable to E6, if not more so than E8. I find myself fixating on things like strength and wanting to attack, and I'm in no way E8.
    "And above all, watch with glittering eyes the whole world around you because the greatest secrets are always hidden in the most unlikely places. Those who don't believe in magic will never find it." -Roald Dahl

    http://forum.socionix.com/
    It's pretty cool

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    What is the best way to find out enneagram type?
    "Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checkered by failure, than to take rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much, because they live in the gray twilight that knows not victory nor defeat."
    --Theodore Roosevelt

    "Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover."
    -- Mark Twain

    "Man who stand on hill with mouth open will wait long time for roast duck to drop in."
    -- Confucius

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimbean View Post
    What is the best way to find out enneagram type?
    Are you still considering ILE sociotype?

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    yes, I suppose.
    "Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checkered by failure, than to take rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much, because they live in the gray twilight that knows not victory nor defeat."
    --Theodore Roosevelt

    "Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover."
    -- Mark Twain

    "Man who stand on hill with mouth open will wait long time for roast duck to drop in."
    -- Confucius

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimbean View Post
    So you think E6's tend to be alarmists? Is this written anywhere or is this in your experience?
    Well their primary characteristic is mental anxiety, which makes them susceptible to all kinds of beliefs that claim to provide a "safe bet" of some kind. Phobic 6s tend to adhere strongly to the belief systems they were brought up with or that feel safe and familiar to them, as these are, they feel, the only things that truly anchor them. Counterphobic 6s embody the same anxiety, but they tend to take the sort of "worst case scenario" viewpoint, preparing to face head-on those things which make them feel most uncertain and anxious. Phobic 6s embody the "devotee," whereas counterphobic 6s embody "the warrior." The archetype of type 8, in a similar light, would be "the hunter."
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

  36. #36

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly View Post
    Well their primary characteristic is mental anxiety, which makes them susceptible to all kinds of beliefs that claim to provide a "safe bet" of some kind. Phobic 6s tend to adhere strongly to the belief systems they were brought up with or that feel safe and familiar to them, as these are, they feel, the only things that truly anchor them. Counterphobic 6s embody the same anxiety, but they tend to take the sort of "worst case scenario" viewpoint, preparing to face head-on those things which make them feel most uncertain and anxious. Phobic 6s embody the "devotee," whereas counterphobic 6s embody "the warrior." The archetype of type 8, in a similar light, would be "the hunter."
    That could be the case.
    "Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checkered by failure, than to take rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much, because they live in the gray twilight that knows not victory nor defeat."
    --Theodore Roosevelt

    "Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover."
    -- Mark Twain

    "Man who stand on hill with mouth open will wait long time for roast duck to drop in."
    -- Confucius

  37. #37

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    So, eights only go with nines and sevens?
    "Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checkered by failure, than to take rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much, because they live in the gray twilight that knows not victory nor defeat."
    --Theodore Roosevelt

    "Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover."
    -- Mark Twain

    "Man who stand on hill with mouth open will wait long time for roast duck to drop in."
    -- Confucius

  38. #38
    Let's fly now Gilly's Avatar
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    Yes, the only two wing options for E8 are 8w9 and 8w7. If you identify with type 1, there is a good chance it could be in your tritype (everyone has one "type" from each the heart (234) head (567) and gut (891) triad that explains their general coping strategy for each kind of stress).
    But, for a certainty, back then,
    We loved so many, yet hated so much,
    We hurt others and were hurt ourselves...

    Yet even then, we ran like the wind,
    Whilst our laughter echoed,
    Under cerulean skies...

  39. #39

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly View Post
    Yes, the only two wing options for E8 are 8w9 and 8w7. If you identify with type 1, there is a good chance it could be in your tritype (everyone has one "type" from each the heart (234) head (567) and gut (891) triad that explains their general coping strategy for each kind of stress).
    I appreciate you taking the time to do this.

    The closest I can think of that is to my heart is a one, but that is not it; so I am not 234.

    If I am in my head, then I am a six, with maybe some five.

    From my gut, I think I can identify in this order from most to least: 819.
    "Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checkered by failure, than to take rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much, because they live in the gray twilight that knows not victory nor defeat."
    --Theodore Roosevelt

    "Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover."
    -- Mark Twain

    "Man who stand on hill with mouth open will wait long time for roast duck to drop in."
    -- Confucius

  40. #40

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    Should I explain to you some of my personality traits?
    "Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checkered by failure, than to take rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much, because they live in the gray twilight that knows not victory nor defeat."
    --Theodore Roosevelt

    "Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. Discover."
    -- Mark Twain

    "Man who stand on hill with mouth open will wait long time for roast duck to drop in."
    -- Confucius

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