I've got an MBTI ISTP on my ass

[Fermi]

Howdy!

I am in this discussion when this ISTP (ISTj) is bugging me and saying that socionics is a twisted and abused version of MBTI!

He says some things that I, which don't know all that much about socionics, cant really answer.

The arguments he puts forth is:

They have switched the valuation function P,J. Why? He and another guy have said earlier something like "I am a P, me and my P friends go and improvise everything! Yeah! My room is a total disaster but I know where everything is!!" Dunno about this, "we" dont see P,J as a function, right?

He critizised when I said that "Another thing about socionics is that it's easier knowing Why/how and it is mostly the relations that is interesting. I can sometimes type someone really quick with just knowing my type and recognizing the relation I had with that person"
He thinks that is not a benefit. It is like a little hobby-psychologist kit. Everything is quick and easy. It won't work on a theoretical basis, the theories are there for each one to interpret and turn into your own practice.
He also brought up the usual, "you even mix into appearance and clothing"

He won't buy the socionics theories because they have tried to make concrete and general conclusions. And in addition they've tried to "pare up" different types and then pre-decide relationships that's absurd in his eyes.

another thing you could explain to me..
The J,P differences is wheter your main functions is directed outwards or inwards.

Well, it might be a bit unstructured but I'll hope I can get some realizations and increase my knowledge further and put that socionics hater where he belong!

[Mariano Rajoy]

Howdy!

I am in this discussion when this ISTP (ISTj) is bugging me and saying that socionics is a twisted and abused version of MBTI!

He says some things that I, which don't know all that much about socionics, cant really answer.

The arguments he puts forth is:

They have switched the valuation function P,J. Why? He and another guy have said earlier something like "I am a P, me and my P friends go and improvise everything! Yeah! My room is a total disaster but I know where everything is!!" Dunno about this, "we" dont see P,J as a function, right?

He critizised when I said that "Another thing about socionics is that it's easier knowing Why/how and it is mostly the relations that is interesting. I can sometimes type someone really quick with just knowing my type and recognizing the relation I had with that person"
He thinks that is not a benefit. It is like a little hobby-psychologist kit. Everything is quick and easy. It won't work on a theoretical basis, the theories are there for each one to interpret and turn into your own practice.
He also brought up the usual, "you even mix into appearance and clothing"

He won't buy the socionics theories because they have tried to make concrete and general conclusions. And in addition they've tried to "pare up" different types and then pre-decide relationships that's absurd in his eyes.

another thing you could explain to me..
The J,P differences is wheter your main functions is directed outwards or inwards.

Well, it might be a bit unstructured but I'll hope I can get some realizations and increase my knowledge further and put that socionics hater where he belong!

p or j are not functions in themsleves, rationality or irrationality are just ways to classify the functions. s/n are irrational, f/t are rational.

as if mbti isn't pop-psychology. it is as much of a "fun bag" as anything else.

that guy sounds like a douche. only enthusiasts can pick on socionics.

[Fermi]

What the hell is a douche?

[Creepy-aurora_faerie]

What the hell is a douche?

Ahoy!!!



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Douche

[UDP]

AH, finally, the proper way to describe MBTI-- "pop psychology". I was looking for a good term like that.

[Mariano Rajoy]

fifi

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fifi_%2...rbation_aid%29

[Fermi]

Isnt there a rational/irrational group?
Where can I read more about it? There should be something

[UDP]

What the hell is a douche?

Ahoy!!!



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Douche

Slang uses

The term "douche bag" can be used as an exasperated exclamation to describe or insult another person, e.g. "That guy is such a douche bag!"

Terms such as douche bag, douche nozzle, douche cake and just plain douche are also popular derogatory terms of insult or ridicule in North America. These terms have become popular in the comedic media, and can mean a variety of different insults:

* Someone who is annoying, bossy or embarrassing.
* Someone who is stupid, intellectually challenged or mentally deranged but less than clinically insane.
* Someone who is unintelligently lying or scamming.
* Someone who is arrogant, elitist or snobby.
* Someone whom you don't like.
* Someone who is socially inept.
* Someone whos vagina is particularly clean and orderly.

Hmm, I never considered it as a sort of backhanded compliment...

[Fermi]

Come on here! this is a battle versus the MBTI losers!

Let's bring up the best and crush those bastards!! Let's make use of our superior knowledge of their PoLR!! or something...

[Jonathan]

They have switched the valuation function P,J. Why? He and another guy have said earlier something like "I am a P, me and my P friends go and improvise everything! Yeah! My room is a total disaster but I know where everything is!!" Dunno about this, "we" dont see P,J as a function, right?

Actually, if you read more, you'll find that it's not as simple as switching P/J. If you look at many sites on Socionics, you'll see that they tend to have information about what are seen as characteristics of irrational and rational types. These descriptions sound very much like the MBTI descriptions of P and J.

However, Socionics involves a slightly different model of behavior. In the Myers-Briggs theory, the terms Perceiving and Judging are used to describe whether the person's extraverted function (whether dominant or auxillary) is rational (T/F) or irrational (N/S). In Socionics, P/J are used to describe if a person's dominant function is rational or irrational.

Bottom line: Socionics believes that an introvert whose first two functions are and will display behaviors such as orderliness, decisiveness, a tendency to want decisions to be fixed etc., whereas MBTI would predict behaviors such as flexibility, open-endedness, etc.

Note that the definitions of what consititutes the dominant (first) function, as well as the definitions of all of the functions and pretty much everything, are slightly different between the two theories.

By the way, how do you know the person is an ISTP or ISTj?

[Fermi]

He told me so..

[Topaz]

He told me so..

Superman, send this guy over to Delta. We'll deal with him.