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Thread: Let's look at Role function

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    Default Let's look at Role function

    Talk to me about your own role function and how you think it manifests itself in your life. Don't just spew descriptions from wiki but feel free to illustrate them with real life examples!

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    Quote Originally Posted by redbaron View Post
    Don't just spew descriptions from wiki but feel free to illustrate them with real life examples!
    Never!

    riodically work on their role function in order to correct imbalances in their life and improve their weak areas. However, these attempts are generally sporadic and are forgotten as soon as the perceived problem begins to go away and the person once again becomes carried away with their usual lifestyle which is dominated b

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    nice spew.

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    With me, it manifests as pretending to be IEI so that I can be duals an SLE.

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    Quote Originally Posted by INTjVsINTpArticle View Post
    Not attentive to relationships with people, and as a safeguard is over-actively over-friendly and under-conflicting when it comes to people (Ti suppresses Fi).
    Like that
    ILI (FINAL ANSWER)

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    When I'm by myself, I can focus on my body very well. I can catch the vibe of my body and it's very relaxing and comfortable. I can sort of work the tension out of my body and get into better body-soul harmony or whatevercrap. I can make myself feel more comfortable with my body. But I can't do anything to apply it to other people. Like, nothing. I can sometimes slip into that mindset, like if I'm cleaning my house I can make myself think in terms of what would make the house more comfortable and cozy. But I don't like to talk in terms of that. In other words, the role function is something that I'm capable of thinking in terms of, but not speaking in terms of, if that makes sense. It's a place where I can direct my energy but not tell other people about, or something like that.
    Not a rule, just a trend.

    IEI. Probably Fe subtype. Pretty sure I'm E4, sexual instinctual type, fairly confident that I'm a 3 wing now, so: IEI-Fe E4w3 sx/so. Considering 3w4 now, but pretty sure that 4 fits the best.

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    ILE's role function is Se.

    I think for me, it's just generally a lack of Se-discipline. I've always had issues with my LSI mom who preaches a lifestyle of routine and discipline. Pretty much I've never been able to stick rigidly to a routine, I just go in odd directions in my life based on whatever I feel like doing. Usually its Ne-based, looking for opportunity etc.

    Occasionally I've looked at myself and thought, I should be more disciplined... and I will be ultra disciplined for like 2-3 days but then I get bored of it and my routine unravels. So really I've become used to living in a way where mostly I'm undisciplined, but occasionally I'll learn to be temporarily disciplined for 1-2 days if a situation demands it, like in school if I know I have a test that week, I'll study hard, be disciplined, eat right, be structured... before the test I'll do an all-nighter, ace it, then go out with friends, and spend the next 2 days relaxing and doing whatever, going back to unstructured life.

    Also I resent people who force me to do things I see no use in. Usually I prefer to know why I should do something, and then willing choose to do it, rather than simply be forced into doing things without explanation. I'm not completely bad in this respect and will usually still do things without explanation but usually I'll ask questions, challenge other people's authority, or find loopholes.

    In non-socionics.... people have in the past described me as "one who doesn't do things if they don't feel like doing them", "stubborn/strong-willed", "argumentative/debate".

    Usually this only comes up in conflict with Se ego types, and there labels are usually the result of their experience with my Se-superego, little do they know its Alpha-NT nature.

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    drains me. When I'm around a hyper ESE for long, I get drained. Like my energy is gone, but I'm not sleepy. My own can also drain me if I use it too much. I once said that I have a switch to turn on and off. It's like changing characters in the blink of an eye. A little is good for variety. More than that is just plain rude. PDAs are rude.

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    Abbie is so boring and rigid it's awesome instead of boring and rigid. She seems so practical and down-to-the-ground.

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    I like the shape of . Although I am partial to the black triangle, I suppose at times, I am able to plan out my life, but even then, I get bored of it.
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    Quote Originally Posted by redbaron View Post
    Talk to me about your own role function and how you think it manifests itself in your life. Don't just spew descriptions from wiki but feel free to illustrate them with real life examples!
    For me as an SLI it's , Ni, the estimation of time, forecasting. I like to be on time and am rarely late, even by minutes, but planning by calendar is beyond me. I couldn't tell you what the next holiday is.

    Might be because I'm married and my IEE wife tends the social schedule, but I really do live in the moment. Being time challenged works out because I don't really plan many social events. In fact, my calendar is free.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kamajama View Post
    I like the shape of . Although I am partial to the black triangle, I suppose at times, I am able to plan out my life, but even then, I get bored of it.
    As a fellow we should plan something...
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    Sometimes I have to:


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    I can get emotional and excited about things in an emotional manner but it cannot be sustained for long, and it only happens if needed. Too much of will make me feel extremely tired. This is one big problem of living in a place which values so much in personal interactions of any sort. If you´re just non-emotional and objective you´re taken for rude.

    I was impressed that in Germany and Austria I could relax a lot more and just be my rational self when approaching people I didn´t know, if I smiled or seemed emotional when approaching them, they´d look at me like 'is this person insane?', very much the opposite of what happens here.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Airborne View Post
    I can get emotional and excited about things in an emotional manner but it cannot be sustained for long, and it only happens if needed. Too much of will make me feel extremely tired. This is one big problem of living in a place which values so much in personal interactions of any sort. If you´re just non-emotional and objective you´re taken for rude.

    I was impressed that in Germany and Austria I could relax a lot more and just be my rational self when approaching people I didn´t know, if I smiled or seemed emotional when approaching them, they´d look at me like 'is this person insane?', very much the opposite of what happens here.
    lol you sure, germany seems fairly Fe > Fi in some ways. Also be careful, with a picture of a nazi as your avatar and you saying this it makes you look like a bit of a nazi. While cultures do have identities... the fact is you will find all types of people in various cultures. I'm sure germany has its share of Fe nutjobs who pummel you with constant emotional stimulation until your enthusiasm tank is bone dry.

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    I use my Ti role fuction to set up boudaries and rules when I approach people when I consider them for (relationships).

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    hmmmmm good question. i will try to answer based on reality not socionics.

    i can be very organized and goal oriented. i stack tasks and make them happen. i push others to get with the program and do their part. i can be forceful in my pursuit of a goal. a recent example would be the whole get my house ready to sell, sell it, pack, move, negotiate, get into the new house trip i was just on. done almost single handedly. if i get overly stressed with goals and discipline, i may come across as more angry than an Se leading would though, since it definitely is work, especially to keep up on over a long time frame. so in a nutshell, i can DO Se type of things.

    however, i don't PERCEIVE Se type of information well. i don't pick up on all the details or notice how much power or will other people have. when they don't move the way i expect them to, due to their own lack of will, i might become frustrated instead of noticing what would properly motivate them or backing off till a better time. it's almost like i have to generate a lot of energy to push things forward myself so i can't let up on it or i'll just give up and not get things done. and this pressure could come out on others.

    the other thing is that i will revolt against being told what to do or against any judgment others make against my random chaotic way of being. my father, EII, used to say when i was young "it's easy to get you to do something...i just tell you to do the opposite of what i want you to do, then, you do what i want." so true i am embarrassed to say. it's kind of like i'm inherently oppositional or devil's advocate...it's quite automatic, sometimes i hardly even notice that i'm doing it. but perhaps this is NeTi more than it is Se role.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa33 View Post
    I use my Ti role fuction to set up boudaries and rules when I approach people when I consider them for (relationships).
    how do you think that makes other people feel

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    Quote Originally Posted by redbaron View Post
    Talk to me about your own role function and how you think it manifests itself in your life. Don't just spew descriptions from wiki but feel free to illustrate them with real life examples!
    My role function is Fi. I don't really get how to interact with people in some situations, so I just smile, remain friendly, and don't say a lot. Once I figure out something that seems to have good results, I put it in my arsenal to use again later. I don't think about whether or not I like most people, and will say I like anyone I'm asked about unless they've made a really bad impression. I'm neutral about most people, and don't enjoy being on bad terms with someone. I'm also unsure how anyone feels about me, unless they make it really clear, and reassure me somehow fairly regularly. Even then, I sometimes think they're just kidding or will abruptly change their mind, until time shows me that's unlikely. I want to trust everyone, but I'm simultaneously suspicious of everyone's motives.

    Role function especially kicks in when DS is absent. They have, ime a balancing effect on each other. Your role gets weirder and less sane the longer you're without the DS. This probably shows up especially well with Fi role, because without Fe, anxiety continues to build regarding your relationships with others. With the support of Fe, the importance of Fi diminishes and you feel more content and less concerned about all your other relationships as well as the one from which you're getting Fe.

    It's possible I'm stretching the theory to fit what is just natural human response, not at all unique to Fi role. If that's the case, I apologize for getting carried away

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    My Fi Role Function kicks in when I start to feel guilty about saying or doing certain things. It seems to be related to the dual-seeking function, like we're scared we won't get any DS unless we are good at our Role.

    After using Ti/Se for a long period of time, I tend to suddenly get paranoid that I went too far and that people are actually mad at me for something I may have said or done. I can either pull back and try to show some Fi awareness, which usually leaves me unsatisfied, or I can keep relentlessly pushing forward with the Fi ignoring, which tends to eventually result in people thinking I'm a bastard.

    There's no easy way to cope with the Role Function. It will always haunt you for as long as you live, although I have found some relief in simply having a sense of humor about it and not taking it personally when someone strong in it corrects you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by discojoe View Post
    My Fi Role Function kicks in when I start to feel guilty about saying or doing certain things. It seems to be related to the dual-seeking function, like we're scared we won't get any DS unless we are good at our Role.
    I agree with this.

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    Even though my is strong and I should feel confident about it, I think the very nature of it makes me feel vulnerable when I talk about it and show it too much. It's too "me". It exposes me. I want to be a naked soul, but it's scary sometimes.

    I feel like is a mask that I wear to cover up my . I feel somewhat proud of myself when I can "trick" people into thinking I'm oh so logical. At work, I'm the stubborn, rational girl who will argue my point until my coworkers see what I see. Little do they know I'm thinking, "Please respect me for this, and don't step on my sensitivity during the process. I love you. :redface:"

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    The dominant and role seem to go pretty well hand in hand, granted that the dominant is still the dominant. I'd like to think that in accessing these meditative states or long periods of thought and reflection, that I also want comfort, be in the right nook for the job, have the right sources of nourishment. I do often neglect and and forget that I may need to eat or hydrate, or that someone will tell me that I should do this instead (fill in the blank) because I'll be more comfortable or enjoy myself more in the long run, which most of the time I'm stubborn and don't believe them, and I go abouts sort of putting on autopilot, where elements of the function are never too stretched or open. This seems to be a normal theme of the role function. I do have periods of semi-valued insight, where I can realize a certain change in my routine affecting my body and mood, and I will sort of update this and be closer to remembering to use it when the time comes. I can affect others states, not too shabbily, and go out of my way to provide comfort for them, but only sometimes do I really think of doing this, let's say if I have my turned on and appreciating how others want to be relaxed like me, the atmosphere all of a sudden becomes much more positive (but not when there's mixed in). It would usually be when I feel naturally more open and loose, more social or extroverted, willing to just feel my surroundings, and willing to sense its affect on others. Most of the time, however, I am lost in my thoughts or plans, and I don't get around to appreciate it much, or what I do appreciate is necessary for me to have mental independence. I usually get around to appreciate it at my friend's house, because the atmosphere is so relaxed and there are often "favorite utilities of lazy leisure" and things to just lazily wrap one's mind around without much outer distortion or interruption, so fits this natural state of inertia. For an ILI or SLI, I think a typically natural state is privacy, quiet, and low-keyness.
    Last edited by 717495; 07-21-2010 at 01:26 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mercutio View Post
    how do you think that makes other people feel
    Not very good I'm sure, but what can I do about that. I know your strategy already. It's actually doing it, but that is hard to do. That again is where my will-power fails me.

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    Well Fi is the values function. I use it a lot because as a creative sub it's the gateway to Ne. It's actually rather EII-like in that way: the value is the motivation which leads to the idea, which leads to the knowledge by which the idea is fulfilled, the motivation satisfied and the value upheld. (Fi -> Ne -> Ti, so that others may use the Ti to realize Ne, which is the sign of obedience to Fi, which covers for the PoLR). Yeah it all comes down to Se anxiety. So long as I can secure my access to needed resources and opportunities on my own, I don't need to worry about Se. But when I find that I find myself unable to achieve an egalitarian equity with everybody else, then it's time to understand the reason why. Once the reason is understood, I can do something, so I must figure out the reason I'm having trouble. More than likely the reason is something I can't do anything about alone, so the idea is to educate people about the situation so as to create a pressure which will bring about the needed changes. Alone we are weak, but together we are strong. If I can just deduce the situational forces holding us back, then our thinking can be adjusted to cope with the existence of these forces. This in turn brings about better adaptation to the real situation. Having modified the Ti base, the idea spectrum is also changed, all of which is focused on fulfilling Fi in the name of Se. I focus on knowledge that becomes of the base for the ideas that bring about the leveling of the playing field my myself and others. Of course there is the question of if the playing field is really not level or if it just appears that way due to a temporary environmental flux... that's what the Ne investigation is all about.
    Last edited by tcaudilllg; 07-21-2010 at 02:36 AM.

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    lol I like this.....

    Quote Originally Posted by tcaudilllg View Post
    Well Fi is the values function. I use it a lot because as a creative sub it's the gateway to Ne. It's actually rather EII-like in that way: the value is the motivation which leads to the idea, which leads to the knowledge by which the idea is fulfilled, the motivation satisfied and the value upheld. (Fi -> Ne -> Ti, so that others may use the Ti to realize Ne, which is the sign of obedience to Fi, which covers for the PoLR). Yeah it all comes down to Se anxiety.
    is not

    Quote Originally Posted by redbaron View Post
    ...illustrate them with real life examples!

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    Quote Originally Posted by he died with a felafel View Post
    Hmm, don't know about Airborne's avatar, but i don't see how him simply stating he feels comfortable in interacting w/people in Germany et al makes him come across as a nazi sympathizer...(?).
    lol it doesn't but still I wonder what his thing with germany is.. I think I've seen this happen before on another thread with him where he talks about how he likes germany and such and he got criticized for having a swastika as an avatar. I'm just giving him a heads up that it seems suspicious.

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    @HLD: your new avatar keeps mixing you up with Lobo in my mind.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sirena View Post
    @HLD: your new avatar keeps mixing you up with Lobo in my mind.
    he's using a wolf too, ahh man, I think I've finally settled on a good avatar for a while and its used...

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    Quote Originally Posted by HaveLucidDreamz View Post
    he's using a wolf too, ahh man, I think I've finally settled on a good avatar for a while and its used...
    Well, lobo means wolf in Spanish, so.....

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    Quote Originally Posted by redbaron View Post
    Don't just spew descriptions from wiki but feel free to illustrate them with real life examples!
    Now that I think about it:

    I was walking going home one day on this busy street and saw this beautiful lady coming from the other direction. Our eyes met, smiled, and we passed by each other. I wanted to meet her, but couldn't get myself to do at first. Now I have been in situations like that before and most of the time nothing happens, but what erased that thought was realizing this was a different day and that the past is the past and "this day" is today, not the past, and anything could happen. I also knew the only way to find out was to do something about it because by not doing anything I will for sure not know anything, so I stopped, turned back, and went up to meet her.

    ... We ended up together for the rest of the day.


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    In addition to relating to what squark and discojoe said, I want to add that I try hard to follow the norms of politeness but I can come across as overly formal and unnatural, especially with new and unfamiliar people.

    I want to know the *appropriate* thing to say and do in social situations but I'm not always sure and second guess myself.

    When a relative of a work colleague passes away, we are all supposed to sign a sympathy card. The problem is, I'm never sure what to write for my message. Other people seem good at coming up with personal, heartfelt messages that also reflect their individuality. I can't come up with much better than the stock "I'm sorry for your loss and take care" response.

    I value the importance of maintaining relationships but I'm nowhere near as good at this as an Fi base would be. As a result, there is a natural tendency for my friendships to fade over time.

    I care about being tactful and diplomatic with others. I try to do the ethically sound thing.
    LII-Ne with strong EII tendencies, 6w7-9w1-3w4 so/sp/sx, INxP



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    Quote Originally Posted by tcaudilllg View Post
    Well Fi is the values function. I use it a lot because as a creative sub it's the gateway to Ne. It's actually rather EII-like in that way: the value is the motivation which leads to the idea, which leads to the knowledge by which the idea is fulfilled, the motivation satisfied and the value upheld. (Fi -> Ne -> Ti, so that others may use the Ti to realize Ne, which is the sign of obedience to Fi, which covers for the PoLR). Yeah it all comes down to Se anxiety. So long as I can secure my access to needed resources and opportunities on my own, I don't need to worry about Se. But when I find that I find myself unable to achieve an egalitarian equity with everybody else, then it's time to understand the reason why. Once the reason is understood, I can do something, so I must figure out the reason I'm having trouble. More than likely the reason is something I can't do anything about alone, so the idea is to educate people about the situation so as to create a pressure which will bring about the needed changes. Alone we are weak, but together we are strong. If I can just deduce the situational forces holding us back, then our thinking can be adjusted to cope with the existence of these forces. This in turn brings about better adaptation to the real situation. Having modified the Ti base, the idea spectrum is also changed, all of which is focused on fulfilling Fi in the name of Se. I focus on knowledge that becomes of the base for the ideas that bring about the leveling of the playing field my myself and others. Of course there is the question of if the playing field is really not level or if it just appears that way due to a temporary environmental flux... that's what the Ne investigation is all about.
    It doesn't always happen the way we plan it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by HaveLucidDreamz View Post
    Pretty much I've never been able to stick rigidly to a routine, I just go in odd directions in my life based on whatever I feel like doing. Usually its Ne-based, looking for opportunity etc.

    Occasionally I've looked at myself and thought, I should be more disciplined... and I will be ultra disciplined for like 2-3 days but then I get bored of it and my routine unravels. So really I've become used to living in a way where mostly I'm undisciplined, but occasionally I'll learn to be temporarily disciplined for 1-2 days if a situation demands it, like in school if I know I have a test that week, I'll study hard, be disciplined, eat right, be structured... before the test I'll do an all-nighter, ace it, then go out with friends, and spend the next 2 days relaxing and doing whatever, going back to unstructured life.

    Also I resent people who force me to do things I see no use in. Usually I prefer to know why I should do something, and then willing choose to do it, rather than simply be forced into doing things without explanation. I'm not completely bad in this respect and will usually still do things without explanation but usually I'll ask questions, challenge other people's authority, or find loopholes.
    Wow. It's amazing how much I actually relate to all this.
    “Whether we fall by ambition, blood, or lust, like diamonds we are cut with our own dust.”

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    You've done yourself a huge favor developmentally by mustering the balls to do something really fucking scary... in about the most vulnerable situation possible.

  34. #34
    redbaron's Avatar
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    I made this thread and now I don't feel like posting in it.

    oh well.

  35. #35
    I've been waiting for you Satan's Avatar
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    aern't you meant ot be sleeping?

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    Quote Originally Posted by HaveLucidDreamz View Post
    lol you sure, germany seems fairly Fe > Fi in some ways. Also be careful, with a picture of a nazi as your avatar and you saying this it makes you look like a bit of a nazi. While cultures do have identities... the fact is you will find all types of people in various cultures. I'm sure germany has its share of Fe nutjobs who pummel you with constant emotional stimulation until your enthusiasm tank is bone dry.
    it is Fe over Fi in Germany, but compared to Brazil I felt like there´s very little of both Fe and Fi there.

    but anyway whoever reads my posts sees I´m not a 'nazi', I like hip-hop and reggae and many other stuff which a nazi would probably not like.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Airborne View Post
    it is Fe over Fi in Germany, but compared to Brazil I felt like there´s very little of both Fe and Fi there.

    but anyway whoever reads my posts sees I´m not a 'nazi', I like hip-hop and reggae and many other stuff which a nazi would probably not like.
    You are a liar, I am a nazi and I like hip-hop and reggae.

  38. #38
    "Information without energy is useless" Nowisthetime's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kamajama View Post
    I like the shape of . Although I am partial to the black triangle, I suppose at times, I am able to plan out my life, but even then, I get bored of it.
    I would like to know more about how we use Ni. I'm not sure if I'm able to analyze this correctly but I've understood that Ni role in SEI is not about planning. It more about letting situations take care of themselves, "everything's gonna work out fine, somehow, some day". Childish in a way, but this is how I usually percieve time and change. It is a way to protect my Te polr so I don't have to face the hard facts.

    I've always been very optimistic about the future. The future is never clear, it's fuzzy and exciting, and good

    However, this has change a little as I've grown older, since I've learned through experience that for some strange reason things don't always turn out the way they should turn out. But time hasn't stopped and things are still changing so I keep my optimistic attitude. "SEIs appreciate time".

    If someone with more Socionics knowledge than myself would like to educate me more or correct me about this I am very willing to listen. It's very interesting.

  39. #39
    ~~rubicon~~ Rubicon's Avatar
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    I am also strangely optimistic about the future, without having any real reasons for being so. I'm not sure if this is Ni Role, but sometimes I plan things with my head in the sand. Like this is what I've decided to do, but I'm not sure why or if it's the best thing and ahhhh if I think about it too much perhaps I'll find too many reasons not to do it because this thing is built on straw, but what else should I do instead? So I focus my energies on planning it out. Also, if I have to prepare myself for something, I don't like looking ahead to see whether I'm on target or not, because I tell myself that I'm expending as much energy as I want to on this thing as it is.. which is rather naive I guess. So I sometimes end up going a bit mental at the last minute - having to do all this stuff, or just waking up to the fact that I won't be able to make it.
    "Language is the Rubicon that divides man from beast."

  40. #40
    Haikus Beautiful sky's Avatar
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    If Ti means making systems, rules and rules for approaching everything in the outside world and in the process, eliminating contradictions and reconciling information under one system, then my Ti role manifests in me often approach the outside world and people with my personal ideals/values. I often have doubts about these rules and laws, because I see the individual nature of the human being and I believe that not all rules and laws can be uniformly applied to every individual as outside and individual circumstances drive human behavior and action. I do make systems but I find that I can easily bend them adapting them to situations and people, yet striving for consistency and overall good quality.

    I can easily get frustrated when I’ve settled into a system that works and some outside person or source constantly tries to disrupt my routine, although I can be very forgiving, just as long as it’s not habitual.

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