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Thread: Engineering Ethos

  1. #1
    Creepy-male

    Default Engineering Ethos

    Majority Party => Rational-Te

    Minority Party 1 => Alpha NT's
    Minority Party 2 => Beta ST's
    Minority Party 3 => Irrational-Te

    Rare => SF Club

    Ultra Rare => NF Club

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    what do you mean by this

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    rare is bettarr
    <Crispy> what subt doesnt understand is that a healthy reaction to "FUCK YOU" is and not

  4. #4
    Creepy-male

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    The types of the people who compose up the engineering fields.

    The majority being Rational-Te... then you have the minority parties which come into play to a lesser extent but form a small grouping... then you have the types you will rarely find...... and the types you will very very rarely find.

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    The saddest ESFj

    ...

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    i hate engineering. I would be slaughtered by the Te'ness

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    I agree for the most part. I've/I known/know tons of engineers. I think usually it's a good ratio of NT to ST dominated the programs(ST in Mech-e, more NT in Chem-e for sure, elec-e a good mix), certainly more ST than in my non-engineering physical sciences major. I do think you see plenty of NF though, as there are plenty of NFs who aren't in humanities, especially at my school where there are a lot of Delta types in general, and plenty of delta NF males are engineers simply because it's part of their family, or because all of their delta ST friends are in engineering, and it seemed the natural path. Also alot of the foreign students i meet strike me as NT or NF more often than ST and they certainly are in every branch of academia including engineering. Certainly the stereotype of the aggressive and problem solving engineering fits under Rational-Te. Like, the kind that's dying to unfold their graph paper for all of their homework.
    asd

  8. #8
    Creepy-male

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    lol who here hates engineering?

    I've noticed this division between

    Language, Literature, Arts, Humanities, Social Science

    and

    Engineers, Mathematicians, Science

    and

    Business, Political Science, History

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    Quote Originally Posted by HaveLucidDreamz View Post
    lol who here hates engineering?

    I've noticed this division between

    Language, Literature, Arts, Humanities, Social Science

    and

    Engineers, Mathematicians, Science

    and

    Business, Political Science, History

    Naaah that's kind of stereotypical. Although I do think engineering seems quite boring, I would have studied physics if I had chosen physical science.
    Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit

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    the engineers I've known tended to be:

    ISTj, ISTp, INTp, INFp, ISFp

    I was disappointed to find a fair amount of ISTjs (who I initially thought might be ISTps).

    I've known quite a few ISTps who were in all types (mech, electrical, computer,etc.)

    I knew two ENFp guys also, but they tended to end up in the people/negotiating role more often. Same w/ an ESTj I knew. He had a similar role.

    I was surprised to find so many INFps and ISFps.

    My ex typed a few of his co-workers and found an ENTj, ISFp, INFp and ISTp -- which pretty much matches my experience minus the ENTj.
    Hi! I'm an ENFP. :-)

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    Quote Originally Posted by HaveLucidDreamz View Post
    lol who here hates engineering?

    I've noticed this division between

    Language, Literature, Arts, Humanities, Social Science

    and

    Engineers, Mathematicians, Science

    and

    Business, Political Science, History
    I think you find that people of highly developed intelligence can take interest in all of these simultaneously, or at least appreciate them for what they provide. I think you meet some scientists(more often science students) with skepticism and disregard for humanities and soft sciences. Yes, you can't derive a number and describe the social construct system quantitatively, oftentimes because the systems are so complex that they are ill-defined/excessively broad. However, that doesn't discredit the social sphere, or the work done in it. To me, it generates ideas about what we think of human life beyond mechanics that are confusing but with the aid of knowledge acquired by others concerning the social sphere we can gain a better understanding. I don't necessarily think hard science provides a better picture as much as a different picture. The disconnect between all of listed subjects is really beyond me.
    asd

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    that's awesome you're so open minded heath! I wish more people shared that attitude.
    Hi! I'm an ENFP. :-)

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    *ahem* I'm in the ultra-rare group.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lobo View Post
    *ahem* I'm in the ultra-rare group.
    What about female and NF?

    Ceci n'est pas une eii.




  15. #15
    Creepy-male

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    Quote Originally Posted by heath View Post
    I think you find that people of highly developed intelligence can take interest in all of these simultaneously, or at least appreciate them for what they provide. I think you meet some scientists(more often science students) with skepticism and disregard for humanities and soft sciences. Yes, you can't derive a number and describe the social construct system quantitatively, oftentimes because the systems are so complex that they are ill-defined/excessively broad. However, that doesn't discredit the social sphere, or the work done in it. To me, it generates ideas about what we think of human life beyond mechanics that are confusing but with the aid of knowledge acquired by others concerning the social sphere we can gain a better understanding. I don't necessarily think hard science provides a better picture as much as a different picture. The disconnect between all of listed subjects is really beyond me.
    I agree with you, however, I was saying this on the basis of stereotypes I've typically seen.

    I've ran across many people who have a specific subject set they like and a specific subject set they dislike.

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    Quote Originally Posted by HaveLucidDreamz View Post
    I agree with you, however, I was saying this on the basis of stereotypes I've typically seen.

    I've ran across many people who have a specific subject set they like and a specific subject set they dislike.
    yeah, you're right. I even have that problem, for sure. I typically tend to disregard political policy because it is not scientifically sound, and have little regard for people who develop more ideology than methods and results. But politics is still obviously incredibly important.
    asd

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    I considered being an architectural engineer so I could build roller coasters for a living!

    Then on a whim I changed to music. Then psychology. Now Japanese.
    "And above all, watch with glittering eyes the whole world around you because the greatest secrets are always hidden in the most unlikely places. Those who don't believe in magic will never find it." -Roald Dahl

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  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arctures View Post
    I considered being an architectural engineer so I could build roller coasters for a living!

    Then on a whim I changed to music. Then psychology. Now Japanese.
    dude i bet you can get some leet jobs if you learn japanese really well.
    asd

  19. #19
    Creepy-male

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    I do engineering and physics...

    The problem is ima bout to graduate and I dread the day I take up the professional role of an engineer. Call me elitist and self-centered but I just feel there is more potential in me than that and want to take a chance and try to go further in life, afterall an engineer degree isn't a bad thing to have laying around if you need to pick up a job to make some cash, but I definitally don't want to get stuck in a rut at some dead end job, its my biggest anxiety right now. Something about number crunching all day long in an isolated cubicle as being my purpose to society makes me want to painfully vomit, but I know if that day comes I'll just force it back down into my stomach and walk around constantly feeling sick.

    Its like I enjoy engineering but I know the reality of the commercial world is getting put into a cubicle, getting assigned tasks and due dates, and performing. There is hardly any room for creativity in ones ideas and hardly any room to disintiguish yourself with great work.

    It seems like to the ESTj mentality great works are a waste. They want X accomplished by Y time using Z method. If you go overboard or use a different method, even if what you come up with is cutting edge and brilliant, you've failed in there eyes. You only merely do what is required of you and nothing more. That kind of work ethic is just........ well dehumanizing. There is no craftsmenship in thinking, art, or skill. Its like your a washing machine used to do loads of laundry, and your supposed to be pleased by the fact you can get a paycheck to go out to walmart and buy a big screen TV to watch porn on while real women and real work you can feel some sort of purpose for is out there fading away while you ignorantly flip through the channels and those possibilities disappear.

    One day your TV breaks down and your forced to leave your little materialistic illusion and you come across the ruins of those possibilities years later and you shake your head in regret, but when someone ask for advice from you, you lead them back on that same path.

    Personally I'm considering graduate school, which doesn't 100% satisfy me, I don't think I'll be satisfied until I can utilize my creativity to come up with some novel idea or peice of work. The kind of thing you created because it captivated your attention and the kind of thing people will come across and acknowledge as useful and well constructed/made.

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    Why ditch engineering when you can be paid what you're worth?
    Best Undergrad College Degrees By Salary
    ILI (FINAL ANSWER)

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    wow, economics pays a lot in the US.

    50'200 $ mean starting salary? I suppose it's before taxes
    Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit

  22. #22
    Creepy-male

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    Yea Engineering is a Golden Ticket into being eligible for jobs with high salaries, but I'm fascinated with designing new technology over having a huge salary.

    Its not so much that I am absolutely sure I'll get a bad job, but they are out there in engineering and sciences. Working in labs and cubicals, doing tedious number crunching for corporate agendas, long hours, little exposure to other people. Either way you'll bring a hefty salary back with you, but its not particularly rewarding work. Its just a huge challenge to get into a rewarding career, and most of the people who realistically have these oppurtunities are the "boyscouts". I'm not really a "boyscout", I just don't take school that seriously, and I'm too busy to invest my time into some academic project that can show my worth. I only get tiny morsels of time, which I squander on things like visting this forum and meandering in other activities like writing music.

    also I realize this sounds like alot of emo-whining, but whenever I start writing or thinking about this stuff, I accidentally make it sound more over-dramatic than it probably is. Yes I realize other people have it way worse, but a problem is still a problem, I am just saying I realize other people have it way worse, for the record, and I don't mean to over-dramatize my situation.
    Last edited by male; 04-22-2010 at 07:20 AM.

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    I don't see you as whining, HaveLucidDreamz. I'm in my second year and I'm already starting to wonder/worry about the future. All I know is I plan to go to graduate school, but I also have to work out in the field for about four years to obtain that lucrative P.Eng that many professional engineers whom I have spoken with out of university have suggested. Time, oh time...
    Ceci n'est pas une eii.




  24. #24
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    When I first found that list I was going to major in Computer Science. Now I'm headed towards Biochemistry. I can already feel the thousands of dollars I'm potentially losing, at least in the short-run.

    Quote Originally Posted by FDG View Post
    wow, economics pays a lot in the US.

    50'200 $ mean starting salary? I suppose it's before taxes
    I was good at economics, so I thought about taking that for awhile, but Macro is so borrrring.
    ILI (FINAL ANSWER)

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    Glorious Member mu4's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HaveLucidDreamz View Post
    I do engineering and physics...

    The problem is ima bout to graduate and I dread the day I take up the professional role of an engineer. Call me elitist and self-centered but I just feel there is more potential in me than that and want to take a chance and try to go further in life, afterall an engineer degree isn't a bad thing to have laying around if you need to pick up a job to make some cash, but I definitally don't want to get stuck in a rut at some dead end job, its my biggest anxiety right now. Something about number crunching all day long in an isolated cubicle as being my purpose to society makes me want to painfully vomit, but I know if that day comes I'll just force it back down into my stomach and walk around constantly feeling sick.

    Its like I enjoy engineering but I know the reality of the commercial world is getting put into a cubicle, getting assigned tasks and due dates, and performing. There is hardly any room for creativity in ones ideas and hardly any room to disintiguish yourself with great work.

    It seems like to the ESTj mentality great works are a waste. They want X accomplished by Y time using Z method. If you go overboard or use a different method, even if what you come up with is cutting edge and brilliant, you've failed in there eyes. You only merely do what is required of you and nothing more. That kind of work ethic is just........ well dehumanizing. There is no craftsmenship in thinking, art, or skill. Its like your a washing machine used to do loads of laundry, and your supposed to be pleased by the fact you can get a paycheck to go out to walmart and buy a big screen TV to watch porn on while real women and real work you can feel some sort of purpose for is out there fading away while you ignorantly flip through the channels and those possibilities disappear.

    One day your TV breaks down and your forced to leave your little materialistic illusion and you come across the ruins of those possibilities years later and you shake your head in regret, but when someone ask for advice from you, you lead them back on that same path.

    Personally I'm considering graduate school, which doesn't 100% satisfy me, I don't think I'll be satisfied until I can utilize my creativity to come up with some novel idea or peice of work. The kind of thing you created because it captivated your attention and the kind of thing people will come across and acknowledge as useful and well constructed/made.
    It's just a job, and if you're already having second thoughts, engineering probably isn't a field for you. I don't particularly enjoy engineering but I like being paid.

    If you think there's no craftsmanship in engineering or whatnot, that's where you are wrong. This is one of the fields where your true ability and dedication will take you where you want to go. The people that whine about engineering are people that simply can't cut it. Most engineers that wash out of engineering and end up in management and some other career. Well they're usually better managers too.

    Luckily engineering isn't much like you're portraying it as, the schooling sucks however and probably the only area where ST's have a advantage over NT's. I see a lot of NF and SF engineers, most of them go to project management because they wash out of the hardcore stuff. Engineering is a very collaborative effort and very team oriented. You won't be alone much, I wish I was alone more. Engineering is a hands on job, you will be solving and attacking real problems in a concrete fashion and seeing the results before you eyes. Also, your job security is very good if you are good.

    The thing is that you're looking for some get rich quick or get fame quick scheme in the world, and if you want to do that, you might as well go to Hollywood and sell your ass on the casting couch.

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    No engineering for me, sorry.
    I love technology and interesting new inventions...

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    I have an engineering degree.
    INFj

    9w1 sp/sx

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    Quote Originally Posted by aixelsyd View Post
    I'm pretty much inclined to believe Alpha NTs comprise the majority party.

    Shit, I think I'd rather work for Bill Lumbergh than work as an engineer.

    Two LII fam. members study engineering sort of stuff.

    Maybe LIEs, but I can't really think of a single ILI I have met who is interested in that stuff.
    You know that ILI that I said reminds me of you? She's Electrical Engineering

    Huge Te amount of people here, although I see my fair share of Fe ego (Nearly all Alpha) girls who want to be software engineers.
    D-SEI 9w1

    This is me and my dual being scientific together

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by heath View Post
    dude i bet you can get some leet jobs if you learn japanese really well.
    Yeah, right now I'm thinking about being a translator, but really I'll take anything where I can use the language regularly. My ultimate dream is to make musics for video games, but for some reason I'm doubting the feasibility of such a profession.
    "And above all, watch with glittering eyes the whole world around you because the greatest secrets are always hidden in the most unlikely places. Those who don't believe in magic will never find it." -Roald Dahl

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    It's pretty cool

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    Quote Originally Posted by HaveLucidDreamz View Post
    Yea Engineering is a Golden Ticket into being eligible for jobs with high salaries, but I'm fascinated with designing new technology over having a huge salary.

    Its not so much that I am absolutely sure I'll get a bad job, but they are out there in engineering and sciences. Working in labs and cubicals, doing tedious number crunching for corporate agendas, long hours, little exposure to other people. Either way you'll bring a hefty salary back with you, but its not particularly rewarding work. Its just a huge challenge to get into a rewarding career, and most of the people who realistically have these oppurtunities are the "boyscouts". I'm not really a "boyscout", I just don't take school that seriously, and I'm too busy to invest my time into some academic project that can show my worth. I only get tiny morsels of time, which I squander on things like visting this forum and meandering in other activities like writing music.

    also I realize this sounds like alot of emo-whining, but whenever I start writing or thinking about this stuff, I accidentally make it sound more over-dramatic than it probably is. Yes I realize other people have it way worse, but a problem is still a problem, I am just saying I realize other people have it way worse, for the record, and I don't mean to over-dramatize my situation.
    so...you don't want a boring job crunching numbers, but rather you want an exciting job designing new technology......but you're reluctant to invest time into study...

    bioengineering? that's generally pretty cutting edge

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    Quote Originally Posted by HaveLucidDreamz View Post
    Business, Political Science, History
    I think I just vomited a little in my mouth. Maybe that's because, from the inside of History, I know that there's a division where Political/Economic Historians tend to fall into the category you've described and Social/Theory/Public Historians tend to fall into the first category you described. I don't know why people always insist on categorizing all of history by the most bland and monotonous branch of it. It gives the rest of us a bad rap

    Like I said before, I see a lot of Se egos in engineering at my school. Especially Beta STs. Overall, it depends on the stream though. I've probably run into at least one of most sociotypes in engineering. I can't think of any Delta NFs off the top of my head, but that might be more because they don't tend to associate with the majority of the engineers who float around our campus.

    Quite frankly I think most types can find a place in most jobs. People have a tendency to over generalize what information elements are best suited to a job. The nature of most fields is that there are different approaches and methods that can appeal to different types. It would be more valuable to attach types to specific approaches in a field than to the field itself.

    I've thought about writing an article about how that applies to something like history, but I've been too busy doing history to write about how people do history, lol.
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