I was wondering about Ne in ILEs and IEEs: does Ne involve the attitude that (raw) empirical data is discarded once its information has been integrated in the knowledge framework, i.e. easily forgotten?
I was wondering about Ne in ILEs and IEEs: does Ne involve the attitude that (raw) empirical data is discarded once its information has been integrated in the knowledge framework, i.e. easily forgotten?
“I have never tried that before, so I think I should definitely be able to do that.” --- Pippi Longstocking
I'm inclined to think so, as it is / that we are actively using rather than, let's say, /. I might be reaching/generalizing, but / leads tend to go off on their established conclusions and back themselves up whenever necessary, but have a stronger grasp on what they believe/think rather than on how or why they think the way they do. It's not to say these types have baseless beliefs, but it might be what they focus on more. I'm not completely sure, but this was my gut reaction.
I wouldn't say that it should be discarded, but I would say Ne egos find the data secondary to it's usefulness. That is, once it's been analyzed and a conclusion or use has been established, the knowledge of the initial data is less important than moving forward.
All of that said, I don't entirely believe in empiricism. There are very few arenas in the world where empirical data can actually be used empirically.
ILE
7w8 so/sp
Very busy with work. Only kind of around.
“I have never tried that before, so I think I should definitely be able to do that.” --- Pippi Longstocking
Just thought about this a little further and thought of something else. As Ne base types are focussed on a certain degree of discovery, their objective is completed simply by discovering and once they've found an acceptable conclusion they're prepared to move on. This discovery fixation is the foundation of certain IXE stereotypes like rapidly changing interests.
ILE
7w8 so/sp
Very busy with work. Only kind of around.
“I have never tried that before, so I think I should definitely be able to do that.” --- Pippi Longstocking
Removed at User Request
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Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
Enneagram 5 (wings either 4 or 6)?
I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE
Best description of functions:
http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html
I think you've slightly missed what I meant. I did not say that IXEs settle on an idea and are unopen to changing the interpretation of this idea. Rather, that instead of dwelling on a series of noted "facts" they wish to use them. This fixation on use, which in this context I've extrapolated to mean discovery, means that IXEs are less fixated on the data. They have no need to fixate on data because if they've observed the data once they can observe the data again.
In contrast, I've noticed Ni base types (ILI/IEI) have a tendency to fixate on data. Not only are they active data collectors, but they want to have constant access to this pool of concrete variables which they can use to filter through their own perception of possible outcomes.
ILE
7w8 so/sp
Very busy with work. Only kind of around.
Well, taking this analogy further:
I believe I have a floppy drive, but I don't use it as much. It may have dust on it, but it still exists, so I wouldn't say it's discarded completely. The drive is there, but the disk is somewhere out there "...if I can remember where." Even if I didn't have a drive, I can always find one on eBay and re-install it.
:wink:
Yes, I have observed the same phenomena. As to the IEEs memory for old things, I would say that is not the memory of old raw data, but snippets of information presented from the knowledge framework, which is the container of integrated information (note: not integrated data). So what I actually mean by raw empirical data, is sort of sensory data (not necessarily speaking of sensory in Socionics terms). Am I making sense?
“I have never tried that before, so I think I should definitely be able to do that.” --- Pippi Longstocking
Removed at User Request
"Never memorize something that you can look up."
— Albert Einstein
LII-Ne
"Come to think of it, there are already a million monkeys on a million typewriters, and the Usenet is NOTHING like Shakespeare!"
- Blair Houghton
Johari
The library I work at has external floppy drives that patrons can borrow. The external drive hooks up to a USB port and has a slot to stick a floppy in. We still get a couple of requests for it each day.
I mostly agree with this, I don't like to memorize stuff either. However, there are some things I will take the time to memorize because I don't want to have to look it up everytime.
It's funny how alot of people these days don't memorize their own phone number for example. They have to pop open their cell phone and look it up in the index. I know that you normally don't call yourself but when you have to fill out a form that asks for your phone number or someone asks for it, I think it would be a real pain to have to look it up every time.
I'm old enough to remember the days when most people didn't have cell phones. I remember when I was in elementary school, that we were told to always remember our phone number and never forgot it. Unless you have a major memory impairment, not knowing your own phone number was virtually unheard of.
LII-Ne with strong EII tendencies, 6w7-9w1-3w4 so/sp/sx, INxP
Ne frequently involves getting the roundabout gist of things. I certainly agree with the basic idea that Einstein presents in the quote. That is what reference material is for. Rote memorization is not necessarily learning, but when you do actually learn, you tend remember better and more.
Johari Box"Alpha Quadra subforum. You will never find a more wretched hive of scum and villainy. We must be cautious." ~Obi-Wan Kenobi
theeeeere used to ba graying tower alone on the seaaaa youuuuu became a litght on the darrk siiide of meeeee loooooooooinvg became a drug thats the hi and not the piiiillll but diitd you know that when it snows my eyyyyyse become laaarge ant the light that you shiiiinee can be seeen baaaabeeeeyyy i compare you to a kisss from a rose on the gray oohhhhhhh the more i get of you the strannN@gner is it is yeaaaaah and NOW that your rossse is in bloom a light hits the gloom on the greeyyy bahwhahaayayayayayayaya ayayaya ayabyaya Therrrree is so much a man can tell you so mucch he can say yooooouu remain my power err my pleasure MY PAIN bbaabaaay to me you're like a growins adiction that i cant deeennyyy wont you tell me is that.... healthy baaaaybay? but did you know that when it snow my eyes became large and the light that you shine can be seen? baby i compare you a kis from a roosse on the gray ohhhhh the more a get of you the stranger it feel yeeeaaaah now that you're rose is in blooom. a light hits the groom on the greayy iiivveee beeeen kised by a rose on the gray ive been kissed bytn a rose on the gray ive been kissed bya rose on the greay (ive been kissed by a rose on the greay in the background) ive been keiissed by a rose (and if i should fall at all (i think)) theeeere is so much a man can tell you sooo yoooou remain my power my PLEeassreue my PAin! to me your like a groiwn a ddictin that I cant deny wont you tell me is that healthly babbby but did you know that when it snows my eyes become large and the light that you shine can be seen???/ BAAABAAAAY you remind you me of a kiss from the rose on the gray oohhh the more i get you the strangers it feeelllssss yeaaaaaaah now that your rose isin bloom, a light hits the groom on the grey YES Icompare you to a kiss from the rose on the gray oooggghhhhh the more i get of you the srtanger it feellsss yeaaaaaa now that your rose is in bloom a light hits the groom on the grayyyy baallalahhalalahahahahaha alalal alalalaa alalallla lal now that your rosesss is in bloom...... a liiiggght hits the glooom on theeeee graayyyyyy .........
Lmao I was baked out of my mind when I wrote that.
Johari Box"Alpha Quadra subforum. You will never find a more wretched hive of scum and villainy. We must be cautious." ~Obi-Wan Kenobi