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    Default V.I. this girl please

    another friend of mine.

    she´s Enneagram type 4, probably 4w3, this I know for sure.
    I´m new to Socionics and would like to know her type.
    We get along very well, like we say what each other is thinking. I´m getting annoyed about this, because she lives in another city. We feel like we know each other for more time than we actually do - some 2 years. She also has a wide range of beliefs from God to reincarnation. Very open-minded to other questions also. Definitely not my type, ESTJ.









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    none in this forum can VI this one or am I being completely ignored?


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    ISFp, not a good match for you. Introverted, funny, fun to tease and play with, but don't get into a relationship; they have a low sex drive and you will get very frustrated with that.

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    Sadly I can`t help typing her face shape. I don`t know if it`s useful or not, but I will try to tell some observations, though...

    Her eyes grab my attention. They make me feel she is a bit detached from her surroundings, living rather in her own inner world, which makes me think she could be an intuitive type.

    And this is confirming my guess in a way:

    She also has a wide range of beliefs from God to reincarnation. Very open-minded to other questions also.
    Because it seems you are guessing an intuitive type, too. Aren`t you?

    She is putting herself in szene in the first two pictures, which makes me wonder if this is showing a "trait" of her personality, a sort of desire of attention/trying to be seen in a certain (maybe a bit mystical) way/..., or if it is an exception, just feeling relaxed and comfortable, only kidding around a bit with her friends, which wouldn`t be related to a certain type, I think...

    I also am wondering if her facial expression is showing a bit emotionally repressed person or if her facial expression is a furtiuty, caused by your choice of pictures, as maybe you picked the ones which reflect her face shape the best... ?

    Is it common for women to wear no clothes at the stomach where you are living, or is she rather an exception by doing so?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Airborne View Post
    none in this forum can VI this one or am I being completely ignored?

    TBH, based on other threads and users' guesses, VI alone isn't really accurate (or no one here is really good at it, but I rather think it never is).

    Edit: Also, I wouldn't believe "intuitive" merely based on wide range of beliefs and open-mindedness. I see it in both N and S types, although more so in irrationals (but there might be no relation at all).

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sasha View Post
    Sadly I can`t help typing her face shape. I don`t know if it`s useful or not, but I will try to tell some observations, though...

    Her eyes grab my attention. They make me feel she is a bit detached from her surroundings, living rather in her own inner world, which makes me think she could be an intuitive type.

    Yes she lives in her own personal world definitely, she told me so last week with these exact words: "it was not a day to study IN MY WORLD, you dumb!" when I didn´t understand that she told me she´d dissed classes because it was not a day for studying. [i am translating as accurate as possible.]

    And this is confirming my guess in a way:


    Because it seems you are guessing an intuitive type, too. Aren`t you?

    Yes but This girl is a mistery. But from her lack of physical activity, and apparent disregard for this, I guess N is more probable than S.



    She is putting herself in szene in the first two pictures, which makes me wonder if this is showing a "trait" of her personality, a sort of desire of attention/trying to be seen in a certain (maybe a bit mystical) way/..., or if it is an exception, just feeling relaxed and comfortable, only kidding around a bit with her friends, which wouldn`t be related to a certain type, I think...

    She was a photographic model for years until she became too old for it - she´s now 25. She poses for pictures somewhat well, making expressions which are not necessarily hers. The last picture may be more of what she looks like when she´s not posing, but like another photo model I´ve dated, who was also enneagram 4, she has a natural talent for posing and looking sexy. 4w3.



    I also am wondering if her facial expression is showing a bit emotionally repressed person or if her facial expression is a furtiuty, caused by your choice of pictures, as maybe you picked the ones which reflect her face shape the best... ?

    Yes, you are right, she´s emotionally repressed but very emotional. But she seems too sensitive so she doesn´t let her true feelings come to the surface easily. I am one he has chosen to let them come to the surface, and she sees me as 'her twin soul' as she´s told me. I really don´t know what to think about this.

    Is it common for women to wear no clothes at the stomach where you are living, or is she rather an exception by doing so?
    Not very uncommon because it´s a tropical country. But she seems to be very sexual, she likes to wear provocative clothes, even when they are not needed, yes.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Airborne View Post
    none in this forum can VI this one or am I being completely ignored?

    I will never ignor you.

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    Sasha my responses to your queries are all except the last one inside the blue box.

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    Why do you think ISFp, Maritsa?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Airborne View Post
    Why do you think ISFp, Maritsa?
    Alpha quad is very commonly known for exploring all sorts of spirituality and out of the ordinary things like reincarnation.

    Carl Jung-very spiritual, explored all sorts of after life stuff.
    My sister (ESFj)-believes in after life reincarnation.

    Very good understanding comes from Ego block functions


    with


    Si in the ego block allows both of you to have sensing things in common and that's a lot. Also, ISFp's can look very neat and organized much like ESTj's are. They can easily relate with intellectual topics with one another and ISFp can easily lighten the ESTj and get them to tease.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa33 View Post
    Alpha quad is very commonly known for exploring all sorts of spirituality and out of the ordinary things like reincarnation.

    Carl Jung-very spiritual, explored all sorts of after life stuff.
    My sister (ESFj)-believes in after life reincarnation.

    Very good understanding comes from Ego block functions


    with


    Si in the ego block allows both of you to have sensing things in common and that's a lot. Also, ISFp's can look very neat and organized much like ESTj's are.
    Well I understand you but I also believe in reincarnation since I was 15 years old, I even had past life regression and saw some of my past lives, and I´m very matter-of-fact ESTj , so that should not count a lot for typing ???

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    Quote Originally Posted by VixenDogFox View Post
    Lots of Deltas believe in spiritual stuff too... that girl in the OP pictures seems kind of INFj to me.

    For the record, I do believe in reincarnation, sort of...
    INFj's wear conservative clothing. she wears a lot of revealing clothes, please read the comments before you type.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Airborne View Post
    Well I understand you but I also believe in reincarnation since I was 15 years old, I even had past life regression and saw some of my past lives, and I´m very matter-of-fact ESTj , so that should not count a lot for typing ???
    How does she use Fe externally?

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    Quote Originally Posted by VixenDogFox View Post
    Pffft, Maritsa, please don't try to manage the way I post; it's offensive and annoying.

    And not all INFj's dress exactly alike. She reminds me of an INFj I once knew... but I'm not saying she is that type for sure. For the record, typing based on clothing is near-ridiculous (though I admit there are themes in many cases).
    Yes we do, we are very conservative in our clothing style. You have to try to understand this from a psychological perspective, that we are uncomfortable with our body image; we feel awkward, too skinny too unshapely. Because of Ne influence, we feel that clothing don't fit well, that materials possess us.

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    She uses Fe well.

    She could be ISFp from what I´m reading about this type... she can´t make long term plans, she´s a hedonist... an INFj would be more disciplined. She can´t maintain a relationship with a guy for more than some weeks and then she starts feeling suffocated or bored and ends it - this is why I have not gotten involved with her physically yet, but it is being hard not to... especially since she likes to provoke me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Airborne View Post
    She uses Fe well.

    She could be ISFp from what I´m reading about this type... she can´t make long term plans, she´s a hedonist... an INFj would be more disciplined. She can´t maintain a relationship with a guy for more than some weeks and then she starts feeling suffocated or bored and ends it - this is why I have not gotten involved with her physically yet, but it is being hard not to... especially since she likes to provoke me.
    ISFp, that is very much so.

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    I sometimes feel like she would have to be supervised by me...and her sister likes me because she thinks I 'break her heat' a bit... because she wants to drink and party wildly. Seems like my Supervisee in a relationship fits well for her.

    But I don´t want to haste to conclusions I´d like to hear Sasha´s opinion also especially because Sasha is german and this girl is german descendant so there may be some sort of genetic understanding about her.

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    ENFJ was the first that came to my mind for this girl.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Airborne View Post
    But I don´t want to haste to conclusions I´d like to hear Sasha´s opinion also especially because Sasha is german and this girl is german descendant so there may be some sort of genetic understanding about her.
    I`m sorry, I`m new to socionics as well and sometimes wrong information are worse than no information...
    Last edited by anou; 04-10-2010 at 08:00 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Airborne View Post
    I sometimes feel like she would have to be supervised by me...and her sister likes me because she thinks I 'break her heat' a bit... because she wants to drink and party wildly. Seems like my Supervisee in a relationship fits well for her.

    But I don´t want to haste to conclusions I´d like to hear Sasha´s opinion also especially because Sasha is german and this girl is german descendant so there may be some sort of genetic understanding about her.
    Yes, some subtypes of ISFp continue this party behavior for a long time. This behavior will often clash with the ESTj who needs a stable and attention giving person. Some ISFp's can be very "I don't need you" attitude.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Airborne View Post
    ENFJ was the first that came to my mind for this girl.
    Oh far from it. ENFj's are very conservative...because of this...



    They can be concerned with jokings and emotional display of love and affection not necessarily, party and teasing. Looking at the dynamics of ENFj/ISTj dual pair, you can see that the in ENFj is used to comfort the emotions of her dual. Emotion of time. To produce emotions to comfort their dual. "He expresses his feelings for his partner not so much through material care, as with dramatic narratives and warnings against possible dangers." Emotional influence in forcast and completion of future plans and events

    With ISFp the is used to provide constant emotional recharge for her dual. Hedonic/sensing of emotion. "He is capable of remembering and reproducing emotions once experienced." To reproduce emotions to entertain their dual. "He loves pleasures and knows how to bestow them —an artist in loving." Also an artist of play/teasing and touching; soon though, from my understanding of my ISFp friends, they get bored of the sex style of ESTj.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Airborne View Post
    ENFJ was the first that came to my mind for this girl.
    Even with 9w1 ISFp and ESTj combination there will be a different feeling of supervision; because 9w1 are not as party harty as the other subtypes of ISFp they seem like they are a better match, but in terms of supervision with this combination, you will start to supervise what they do at home. ESTj constantly watches the steps of ISFp; ISFp watches everything they say around ESTj, while the ESTj just supervises.

    ESTj looks like a "self-satisfied, petty, faultfinding and narrative, the Supervisee pays attention to their actions and considers the Supervisor as consequential." ISFp will call ESTj's attention to their behavior, seeking recognition and commendation, which makes them look even more attractive to more supervision because, the more they ask the more ESTj feels like they are helping the ISFp, which isn't true. What is actually going on is that the ESTj feels like the ISFp is appealing to his inborn nobility, magnanimity and conscience; which isn't true, and adverse reaction is actually occuring deep underneath it all.

    This chemistry changes the dual seeking tendency and understanding of both of the types involved in this relationship. ESTj begins to not understand what they need from their dual and what their dual needs from them.

    The ISFp begins hyperdoubting all of their understandings about things and people.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa33 View Post
    ISFp will call ESTj's attention to their behavior, seeking recognition and commendation, which makes them look even more attractive to more supervision because, the more they ask the more ESTj feels like they are helping the ISFp, which isn't true. What is actually going on is that the ESTj feels like the ISFp is appealing to his inborn nobility, magnanimity and conscience; which isn't true, and adverse reaction is actually occuring deep underneath it all.
    Sounds very interesting, there is nothing more tempting for an ESTJ to believe that some attractive partner sees and appreciates his inborn nobility of character, magnanimity and conscience. But then, what is actually happen?This is not clear from your post, honey. Why there is so much mutual attraction and understanding between ISFp and ESTj, is it explainable in socionics? I attribute this to my 9 wing... ISFp has a very hedonistic character which, even when she´s not a type 9, matches perfectly with my 9 wing.

    4w3 ISFp is a true connoiser of pleasure, knows how to bestow it upon herself and her partner, which is why I think I am attracted to them, since I repress pleasure, as type 1 in the enneagram, pleasure for me often occurs in bursts of heavy intensity with some months of discipline and self-control delaying any type of pleasure (alcohol, sex, and even more innocent ones).

    I don´t think this happens to all ESTJs though, does it?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Airborne View Post
    Sounds very interesting, there is nothing more tempting for an ESTJ to believe that some attractive partner sees and appreciates his inborn nobility of character, magnanimity and conscience. But then, what is actually happen?This is not clear from your post, honey. Why there is so much mutual attraction and understanding between ISFp and ESTj, is it explainable in socionics? I attribute this to my 9 wing... ISFp has a very hedonistic character which, even when she´s not a type 9, matches perfectly with my 9 wing.

    4w3 ISFp is a true connoiser of pleasure, knows how to bestow it upon herself and her partner, which is why I think I am attracted to them, since I repress pleasure, as type 1 in the enneagram, pleasure for me often occurs in bursts of heavy intensity with some months of discipline and self-control delaying any type of pleasure (alcohol, sex, and even more innocent ones).

    I don´t think this happens to all ESTJs though, does it?
    from

    the connoiser of pleasure they have things in common because that function collects hedonistic experience which to the ESTj looks like ISFp is an intellectual match.

    Both ESTj and ISTp compete to have their Si recognized, that can't be good after a while because if they have two different Si understanding of sex and pleasure, which they do, they will accuse the other for not cooperating, and may like two different foods, scenes, or in the case of my cousin (ESTj-TeSi) and her husband (ISTp-SiTe), she can't get him to pick out the same paint she likes or do the work that is required to do with the same intensity to detail and conscientiousness that she likes. In the case of duality is the activating function of INFj; it sits in quietness and does not seem like the person posesses any skill in it; but once anyone with comes along and activates it in INFj, her activities passes that of ISFp. It may not look like it from the outside, but INFj very much wants this function, but can not produce it herself, giving the ESTj freedom to use it however they like.

    Si in common with ESTj and ISFp leads to mutual information exchange. Down sides are "First, both are equally weak in facing the same problems, both partners are inexperienced; their mutual assistance may be of a very low quality [due to the whole picture, of how the other elements come together to make a whole person. Assistance like tender attention, help with Ni]. Second, having a common field of activities may result in competition."

    Give and take and no competition is Duality also complementing of one partner’s weak traits by the strong ones of the other. Trust develops within duality that one is better in one area and can do it better then the other partner so instant cooperation, like task division and completion instead of competion in the same area.


    Do you delay pleasure out of guilt? It does happen to ESTj's, that periodic dip in and out of pleasure. The only thing that seems to be consistant is when ESTj's take up excersizing.
    Last edited by Beautiful sky; 04-10-2010 at 10:22 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa33 View Post
    ISFp, not a good match for you. Introverted, funny, fun to tease and play with, but don't get into a relationship; they have a low sex drive and you will get very frustrated with that.
    Maritsa, you have no right to make comments like that. Stating what you think her type is, is one thing and your opinion is (though suspect) welcome. But to make it absolute like that just from a few photos and telling him she's a bad match for him, is highly presumptuous and crossing the line in my opinion.
    Enneagram: 9w1 6w5 2w3 so/sx

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    My opinion regarding this girl's type:

    Can't say much from those photos.

    All I can kind of tell is, likely introvert, but not even sure about that.

    She doesn't clearly stand out as an obvious SEI though.

    Be careful about Maritsa typings. She is TOO sure, from a pure VI based on a few still photos. More often than not, she is wrong.
    Enneagram: 9w1 6w5 2w3 so/sx

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa33 View Post
    from

    the connoiser of pleasure they have things in common because that function collects hedonistic experience which to the ESTj looks like ISFp is an intellectual match.

    Both ESTj and ISTp compete to have their Si recognized, that can't be good after a while because if they have two different Si understanding of sex and pleasure, which they do, they will accuse the other for not cooperating, and may like two different foods, scenes, or in the case of my cousin (ESTj-TeSi) and her husband (ISTp-SiTe), she can't get him to pick out the same paint she likes or do the work that is required to do with the same intensity to detail and conscientiousness that she likes. In the case of duality is the activating function of INFj; it sits in quietness and does not seem like the person posesses any skill in it; but once anyone with comes along and activates it in INFj, her activities passes that of ISFp. It may not look like it from the outside, but INFj very much wants this function, but can not produce it herself, giving the ESTj freedom to use it however they like.

    Si in common with ESTj and ISFp leads to mutual information exchange. Down sides are "First, both are equally weak in facing the same problems, both partners are inexperienced; their mutual assistance may be of a very low quality [due to the whole picture, of how the other elements come together to make a whole person. Assistance like tender attention, help with Ni]. Second, having a common field of activities may result in competition."

    Give and take and no competition is Duality also complementing of one partner’s weak traits by the strong ones of the other. Trust develops within duality that one is better in one area and can do it better then the other partner so instant cooperation, like task division and completion instead of competion in the same area.


    Do you delay pleasure out of guilt? It does happen to ESTj's, that periodic dip in and out of pleasure. The only thing that seems to be consistant is when ESTj's take up excersizing.
    Thank you for your explaining, Maritsa.

    Workaholic: don´t worry. I´m an ESTj. I will not let my decisions be based on some abstractions gathered from the internet. Although these theories may be of great help in thinking about my moves, they are not that much motivated by others´ opinions and not even for example socionics or enneagram. I would date any girl I find interesting even if she´s a type 7, for example.

    Of course, in the long run, the theories, if I experiment them and for myself see their validity or not, will have their weight. :wink:

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    Quote Originally Posted by Airborne View Post
    Thank you for your explaining, Maritsa.

    Workaholic: don´t worry. I´m an ESTj. I will not let my decisions be based on some abstractions gathered from the internet. Although these theories may be of great help in thinking about my moves, they are not that much motivated by others´ opinions and not even for example socionics or enneagram. I would date any girl I find interesting even if she´s a type 7, for example.

    Of course, in the long run, the theories, if I experiment them and for myself see their validity or not, will have their weight. :wink:

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    I would guess IEI, but I wouldn't call myself absolutely certain of that. Maybe 50% certain.
    Quaero Veritas.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa33 View Post
    INFj's wear conservative clothing. she wears a lot of revealing clothes, please read the comments before you type.
    he said it was a tropical country. her clothing could be very practical.
    6w5 sx
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    Quote Originally Posted by implied View Post
    he said it was a tropical country. her clothing could be very practical.
    We don't like to expose our midrift.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Airborne View Post
    Thank you for your explaining, Maritsa.

    Workaholic: don´t worry. I´m an ESTj. I will not let my decisions be based on some abstractions gathered from the internet. Although these theories may be of great help in thinking about my moves, they are not that much motivated by others´ opinions and not even for example socionics or enneagram. I would date any girl I find interesting even if she´s a type 7, for example.

    Of course, in the long run, the theories, if I experiment them and for myself see their validity or not, will have their weight. :wink:
    If the order of functions in the person that you are dating is reversed as in
    you are
    and she is

    then:

    "[t]he partners' 'vital rhythms' do not coincide. What one of them makes quickly, the other does slowly; where one of them pays a lot of attention to details, the other [does not] understands everything “at first glance” and does not need details [but the SiTe will be quick to criticize the TeSi for not doing things quickly enough and paying too much attention to details, often bickering at them and upseting them unnecessarily]. This causes problems in close communication [as in one always rushes the other, while the other tries to work dilligently, the TeSi accuses SiTe for not doing enough, building arguments around task seperation and completion; TeSi will always do much much more work then the limiting movements/energy person of the SiTe].
    Last edited by Beautiful sky; 04-13-2010 at 02:25 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa33 View Post
    We don't like to expose our midrift.
    you and your multiple personalities?
    6w5 sx
    model Φ: -+0
    sloan - rcuei

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    She looks introverted and intuitive to me, strong in her eyes...

    In my opinion she is most likely INFj, intuitive subtype, harmonizing subtype...

    INFp would show more emotions on pictures. She rather seems to be -ignoring...

    she´s Enneagram type 4, probably 4w3, this I know for sure.
    Certainly not ISFp then. 4w3 is typical of INFjs...

    She also has a wide range of beliefs from God to reincarnation.
    indicates strong - but not necessarily...

    INFj's wear conservative clothing. she wears a lot of revealing clothes, please read the comments before you type.
    Bullshit! You can't type people by their clothes. Please get a brain before you type. Just read the INFj description on socionics.com: "INFjs are generally very modest, which is also noticeable in their choice of clothes. However from time to time they may wear something very flashy according to the latest fashion..."

    One more thing: INFj is the most likely type to be anorexic - whereas ISFp is one of the least likely ones...
    Last edited by JohnDo; 04-13-2010 at 12:40 PM.

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    INFj.
    OPERATION POOPLAIR

    Now conscripting, for more information come here: http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...48#post1003048

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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnDo View Post
    Bullshit! You can't type people by their clothes. Please get a brain before you type. Just read the INFj description on socionics.com: "INFjs are generally very modest, which is also noticeable in their choice of clothes. However from time to time they may wear something very flashy according to the latest fashion..."

    One more thing: INFj is the most likely type to be anorexic - whereas ISFp is one of the least likely ones...
    You totally contradicted yourself here by telling me I can't type them by their clothes and then quoting me a socionicas site where they dress modestly.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnDo View Post
    In my opinion she is most likely INFj, intuitive subtype, harmonizing subtype...

    INFp would show more emotions on pictures. She rather seems to be -ignoring...

    Certainly not ISFp then. 4w3 is typical of INFjs...

    indicates strong - but not necessarily...

    (...)

    One more thing: INFj is the most likely type to be anorexic - whereas ISFp is one of the least likely ones...
    I don't think VI is accurate, which is why I didn't give any examples of particular types earlier (especially since ISFp has been suggested), but IMO you're jumping to conclusions here. SEI I know fits the wide range of beliefs description completely - that's Ne-DS and Ti-HA in her case. I don't know if it's in any way common for this type.

    Also, judging people by their Enneagram type is no way to go, IMO. There's a correlation but it's hardly absolute. I laughed when I read ESE and 6 being listed as an impossible combination somewhere... my mother is both.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aiss View Post
    I don't think VI is accurate, which is why I didn't give any examples of particular types earlier (especially since ISFp has been suggested), but IMO you're jumping to conclusions here. SEI I know fits the wide range of beliefs description completely - that's Ne-DS and Ti-HA in her case. I don't know if it's in any way common for this type.

    Also, judging people by their Enneagram type is no way to go, IMO. There's a correlation but it's hardly absolute. I laughed when I read ESE and 6 being listed as an impossible combination somewhere... my mother is both.
    If you don't know VI then you take a picture of a person who is in an odd moment then you can mistype them.

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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnDo View Post
    She looks introverted and intuitive to me, strong in her eyes...

    In my opinion she is most likely INFj, intuitive subtype, harmonizing subtype...

    INFp would show more emotions on pictures. She rather seems to be -ignoring...

    Certainly not ISFp then. 4w3 is typical of INFjs...

    indicates strong - but not necessarily...

    Bullshit! You can't type people by their clothes. Please get a brain before you type. Just read the INFj description on socionics.com: "INFjs are generally very modest, which is also noticeable in their choice of clothes. However from time to time they may wear something very flashy according to the latest fashion..."

    One more thing: INFj is the most likely type to be anorexic - whereas ISFp is one of the least likely ones...
    You didn't read Airborne's description of this person and how she shows ; you're just making assumptions of her looks; she is not near INFj because of her style of clothing and her attitude about going out and partying.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sasha View Post
    Her eyes grab my attention. They make me feel she is a bit detached from her surroundings, living rather in her own inner world, which makes me think she could be an intuitive type.
    And this is confirming my guess in a way:
    Good observation, dear, but that's more a characteristic of Introverts then Intuitives. That's how you can tell I's from E's apart in photos.

    Quote Originally Posted by Airborne View Post
    She uses Fe well.

    She could be ISFp from what I´m reading about this type... she can´t make long term plans, she´s a hedonist... an INFj would be more disciplined. She can´t maintain a relationship with a guy for more than some weeks and then she starts feeling suffocated or bored and ends it - this is why I have not gotten involved with her physically yet, but it is being hard not to... especially since she likes to provoke me.
    Would you describe to me how you think she uses Fe well?

    What other behavioral traits can you share?

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