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Thread: Types and taking offense

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    Default Types and taking offense

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    Quote Originally Posted by aixelsyd View Post
    Any noticeable patterns how different types seem to act when offended, on a general level?
    Ahh...why are you doing this again? I have tried to tell you that's it's too complicated...for example, depending on what the offense is

    If you offend people due to their race, ethnicity, color, class, cast, etc...then INFj might feel offended but will not likely voice it in person, but will likely voice it in writing, because in a forum, people are not subjects, they are more removed and kind of easier to talk to.

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    I feel like there are probably a lot more issues in regards to offense than just type. People are offended by different things and are not offended by different things, and this is probably more affected on an individual level than anything else. It probably also has to do with maturity levels, as well as culture/race/gender etc.
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    That and what mood they are in, too many things to measure...too complicated.

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    "Many LSEs, for instance, express offense by outright telling the person what they did but go on to find arbitrary things to make the person look bad." "IEIs tend to just react quickly or sulk or say cruel things"

    Don't you see these two sentences look the same?

    SLI then a pissed off LSE and any one else.

    "IEIs tend to just react quickly or sulk or say cruel things"

    never

    "ILIs will typically just shut off all emotion or else fabricate happy emotions."

    Not true CORRECTION HERE...SO SORRY I MEANT TRUE
    Last edited by Beautiful sky; 02-21-2010 at 06:11 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by aixelsyd View Post
    ILIs will typically just shut off all emotion or else fabricate happy emotions.
    This is rather curious, as ILIs are generally perceived as unemotional to begin with.



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    Quote Originally Posted by Brilliand View Post
    This is rather curious, as ILIs are generally perceived as unemotional to begin with.
    Yes, unemotional...on the surface a little upset or quiet looking; may simply smile but get excited, and will generally sit back and watch others observe...you can't see them doing Ni; a person is an accumulation of things, not to be disected into pieces like...I see Se in their this behavior and that behavior...because a person changes moment to mement and you must catch them being them, but what is them? It's a whole but inside the pieces there's a puzzle; If you step back and not look at the pieces, you will see type.

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    Fi/Te introverts. Passive aggression. Though, let's not overgeneralize.

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    Quote Originally Posted by aixelsyd View Post
    I agree with that, but I mean how types express their offense. I know it varies, but I think I see common trends with types.

    Many LSEs, for instance, express offense by outright telling the person what they did but go on to find arbitrary things to make the person look bad. If you are offensive to them, they will see you as 'all black' in that there are no redeeming qualities you possess or are under played and ignored. It's quite infuriating if at the receiving end but I have been under that sort of thing for as long as I remember in my situation. Cannot reason and can make you crazy enough to consider suicide.

    ILIs will typically just shut off all emotion or else fabricate happy emotions. They tend towards snide remarks but are usually subtle. Usually are reasonable enough to not let it sour every interaction with offender, but they will, if feeling emotional, turn towards very sharp cold politeness in direct interaction or else the cold shoulder. Personally, I am more inclined to point out the other person's hypocrisies, if this is based on accusation that causes offense. If it is just a douche bag and/or a manipulator, I just ignore. I do seek revenge by nature but not enough to really mortify the other person because that is bad. I am surprisingly forgiving when people show remorse but often regret being forgiving. With repeat offenders I just restrict interaction as much as possible, within reason.

    IEIs tend to just react quickly or sulk or say cruel things, depending on the person. Not really, but I have not dealt with offended IEIs enough but those are the main things I have witnessed. Like to guilt trip, too, with the 'poor me' facade and act all victimized and stuff. Disgusting, imo. I have coddled such on occasion but only because I felt it was justified and that they were a good enough human being and it's just how they act and it's not something all that bad on objective terms.

    But more mature individuals, regardless of type, will try to not get back at the person, ime, and will try to deal with the offense and offender in a way that doesn't drag others into the picture. I would think. They also don't prolong it, but I suppose in some situations, it's better to cling to the decision to cut off a person if they are chronically offensive. To me that is a moral decision, from my stand point. It's important to get over things but it is also important to prevent future offenses and sometimes cutting out sources of offense is wise and most expedient from an Fi/Te stand point, as in my case.
    I agree.

    Once a person is "all black" as you put it, it's hard to change. Unless the person shows redeeming qualities shortly after the offense and continues doing so for some time, they're pretty much doomed. But when it comes to quality people that have been known for some time, they go grey instead of black. Easier to fix.

    I don't do revenge. I avoid the offender. If they're not there, they're not a problem.

    I wonder whether there's a thread on what specific behaviors offend what types.

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    Quote Originally Posted by aixelsyd View Post
    IEIs tend to just react quickly or sulk or say cruel things, depending on the person. Not really, but I have not dealt with offended IEIs enough but those are the main things I have witnessed. Like to guilt trip, too, with the 'poor me' facade and act all victimized and stuff. Disgusting, imo. I have coddled such on occasion but only because I felt it was justified and that they were a good enough human being and it's just how they act and it's not something all that bad on objective terms.
    I think this is pretty spot on - we whine to get it out of our system, but not at the offender. We don't even guilt trip the offender as far as I'm aware, the victim routine is just for other people, the offender usually isn't the target.

    I don't think IEIs really want coddling (would our SLE duals coddle? It's more of a caregiver thing). We just want acknowledgement that you understand our side. So telling us to cheer up and giving us a smiley face on a post-it note would do just as well. It sounds awful manipulative, I know.
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    Quote Originally Posted by tuturututu View Post
    Fi/Te introverts. Passive aggression. Though, let's not overgeneralize.
    depends on the situation...my friend an INFj can talk aggressive but never raise her fist...talk is cheap also like redunant information.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa33 View Post
    SEE don't have "carefull" behavior.
    ? - aixelsyd wrote carefree, not carefull.

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    Quote Originally Posted by aixelsyd View Post
    I apologize in advance if my viewpoints seem Gamma-centric, but it is what I am, I think. I realize different things offend different people (mine deals mostly with Gamma Fi), but it's about reaction, to again clarify.
    I would say the same thing. I am offended on an Fi level. and I think Fe valuers are offended on an Fe level (which I tend to find kind of obnoxious). To simply put it I guess.

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    Quote Originally Posted by polikujm's dog View Post
    I would say the same thing. I am offended on an Fi level. and I think Fe valuers are offended on an Fe level (which I tend to find kind of obnoxious). To simply put it I guess.
    Could you elaborate on 'Fi level' and 'Fe level'?

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    Another really annoying thing some people do is start crying or whining and acting like, "oh, I'm so hurt and victimized."
    To them, of course, they really do feel this way even to other people it's annoying. Like the whole saying ' play the victim' is just so retarded. It's not an act, sometimes people do feel hurt by others.

    I'm not disagreeing that it is annoying, tho- given how subjective emotions are. But I was never all that bothered by this as long as it didn't happen too frequently. I was always amused when other people did this, actually. I couldn't really understand why it made other people all offended when somebody would cry or act emo. I just think people are terrified of weaknesses in themselves, when they shouldn't be.

    My point is when people are acting this way it isn't some sort of ploy or game they're playing to cover something up. That is just retarded.

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    Quote Originally Posted by aixelsyd View Post

    But more mature individuals, regardless of type, will try to not get back at the person, ime, and will try to deal with the offense and offender in a way that doesn't drag others into the picture. I would think. They also don't prolong it, but I suppose in some situations, it's better to cling to the decision to cut off a person if they are chronically offensive. To me that is a moral decision, from my stand point. It's important to get over things but it is also important to prevent future offenses and sometimes cutting out sources of offense is wise and most expedient from an Fi/Te stand point, as in my case.
    When I was younger I think I reacted to offense more like how you posted for IEI but as I get older the statement you made above has taken over. If someone is seriously offending me due to me finding them, as a human being, inherently offensive, then I cut them out in as cleanly and politefully as possible (entertaining them with interaction is really a waste of time in such situations and risks infecting someone bearable that you know with offender's annoying problems). Almost 7 billion people in the world and supply of sympathy is tight, best use it properly because finding people is easier than finding time and energy.
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    SHIT THE THIRD TIME YOU THREATENED ME WITH EGREGIOUS NONSENSE WAS DEFINITELY THE SCARIEST

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pinocchio View Post
    I doubt he can, considering his history of labelling anything he doesn't like as Fe. But nothing's impossible.
    Well I'm not going to rush my thoughts and blurt out a bunch of crap. But I am thinking on how to elaborate.

    Quote Originally Posted by xixi View Post
    Could you elaborate on 'Fi level' and 'Fe level'?
    Generally the impression I get is that Fe valuers would find it highly rude if one were to somehow emotionally disclude themselves from the situation, as though it is personal enough, on the flip-side assuming that this person is missing out on a large part of life. They, oftentimes have a disregard towards many overlooked aspects of privacy and emotional security, and can be uncomfortably preassumptious (coming from an Fi valuer). Especially once the emotional environment has warmed up and it seems as though each person is attentive to one another, taking part and emotional states are being read, hooked-in basically, it can be a big let down when someone goes away from it, leaves the situation, an Fi valuer could often be that person (or also one weak at Fe, like an Fe-DS.) One must be open and able to respond to cues, and participate/involve themselves with the situation or people, judge how they're coming across, and attempt as much as they can to read each other's minds, for the benefit of the atmosphere or the personal feelings. For example, if someone doesn't show up for a meeting, Fe valuers can often take it very personally and assume the worst. Fe judges against the external situation, if one is providing the emotions needed, and expanding upon the emotional weight. This goes against the introverted value in emotions, of having security and a stable preparation, where an outward involvement is always second to stability and a deep contemplation of emotions. One of Fe sees no real benefit in right-wing ethics.

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    Fe valuers would find it highly rude if one were to somehow emotionally disclude themselves from the situation
    Yes. I have been on the shitty end of that MANY times.

    right-wing ethics
    Are you using right-wing in the political sense?
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    I rarely get offended at things. Most things I'm just like w/e. I'll even interact fine with people who offend me. It's just that if I've determined that they're going to be offensive, they just get level 1 of me, the completely constructed persona. Which is actually not a good or bad thing, really.

    Occasionally I'll plot revenge in my head, and that makes me feel better. Knowing that I can do a thing is usually as good as actually going it for me.

    I don't really do the whiny play the victim thing. I determined early on from watching TV that it was a bad thing to do, so I stopped doing it.

    Sometimes if I'm in a particularly bad mood, I'll lash out with a sarcastic remark or be particularly rude about something or other. But even that is comparatively rare.
    Last edited by silverchris9; 02-22-2010 at 06:09 PM.
    Not a rule, just a trend.

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    Quote Originally Posted by aixelsyd View Post
    Any noticeable patterns how different types seem to act when offended, on a general level?
    If one's deliberately trying to offend someone he will likely succed.

    But from my observations I can tell that people from opposite quadras are the easiest to offend or hurt while people from the same quadra will fairly easily find a common language and take no offence even if one side is being mean to the other. People from the same quadra will rarely hold a grudge even if they think that the other part did something wrong - they usually believe that they can reason with them. The opposite quadras often think of each other as nuts as soon as they start displaying any kind of offensive behaviour.

    I think it's pretty natural.

    So my reactions would depend on who's trying to offend me...

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