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Thread: Quadra Progression by Valued Functions

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    Default Quadra Progression by Valued Functions

    I made a thread on this topic a while ago, but I wanted to elaborate on the distinct roles of each complimentary functional pairing to develop a clearer sense of each function's role in the larger picture of quadra progression.

    Delta

    Delta is the quadra of establishment and unity. Under Delta, all aspects of life are organized and unified into a sustainable whole that attempts to treat each individual according to their needs and maximize their usefulness for the perceived common good.

    Te/Fi

    The Te/Fi axis of Delta is primarily concerned with the implementation and standardization of productive and useful methods and the spreading of universal morality. They seek to establish holistic goals, rather than specific ones, that are geared towards universal applicability and sustaining an established implicit communitarian structure. Their goal is to foster sustainable productivity and establish universal ethical standards that everyone can live by.


    Ne/Si

    The Ne/Si axis of delta is primarily concerned with the continual refinement of established structures and ethical principles. They like to make "little changes here and there," constantly perfecting and refining various standardized procedures. Their goal is to maximize their usefulness and that of those around them by continual maintenance of their lifestyles. They are sincerely open and questioning regarding matters of morals and ethics, maintaining a generalized standpoint with common sense ideas of right and wrong while adjusting their own perspective to align with that of a sense of common good.

    Alpha

    Alpha is the quadra of new beginnings. Alphas seek to foster creative activity and promote holistic change in their environments and people's ideas.

    Ne/Si

    The Ne/Si axis of Alpha is primarily concerned with generation of ideas and maintenance of environments conducive to fun, intellectual stimulation, and creativity. They examine and challenge existing standards on a purely intellectual level, rarely seeking to dogmatically criticize or berate, but rather to break things up piece by piece and attempt to put them back together in the proper order. They are primarily focused on ideas as intellectual "toys" that may or may not develop into something worthy of support or pursuit; when they are not, they are used for their intrinsic worth and abandoned when they prove useless. When the Ne/Si axis of Alpha unearths ideas worthy of pursuit, it seeks to spread them in a grassroots fashion, appealing to those whom they think will be interested in mutual pursuits.

    Fe/Ti

    The Fe/Ti axis of Alpha is primarily concerned with the structuring and implementation of ideas that are seen as beneficial into everyday life. They often organize into loose collectivities that can resemble the tendencies of Aristocratic quadras, but are actually sublimations of common goals and a mutually perceived broader need for a sense of unity and collectivism.

    Beta

    Beta is the quadra of rebellion and disruption. Betas seek to organize in the name of uniting under a worthy cause in order to enact drastic change, and to do whatever is necessary to accomplish their ends.

    Fe/Ti

    The Fe/Ti axis of Beta is primarily concerned with the organization and standardization of ideas in order to unite. They are wary of doubters or non-believers, wanting everyone in their Aristocracy to agree on the matters that are deemed most important so that they can be united in common purpose and with equal resolve. Their role is to garner support for their cause and develop a central theme for organization that will carry them through to the end. Their purpose is to build the platform from which a final plan can be launched.

    Se/Ni

    The Se/Ni axis of Beta is primarily concerned with making the necessary push to accomplish their collective goals. Their focus is on determining when and where to strike for optimal impact. Typical tactics include inducing chaos intentionally, such that, though anyone affected, including themselves, is at a disadvantage for lack of structure or certainty, at least they are ready for it, and as such can capitalize on the lack of organization in order to establish a position or make a vital move. Their role in quadra progression is to do that which others are not willing to do in order to enact necessary change.


    Gamma

    Gamma is the quadra of reform, seeking to create stability in their environment, cultivate their individual potentialities, and organize themselves and others in pursuit of broad-scope productivity.

    Se/Ni

    The Se/Ni axis of Gamma is primarily concerned with steadfastness and genuine expression. They are acutely aware of the consequences of their actions, both concrete and personal, and are wary of those who seem blindly devoted or pious. They seek to surround themselves with others whom they can trust, searching out companions with strong character and moral fiber and banding together to "weather the storm." They are guided by common sense morals and a passionate sense of knowing their loved ones fully and being there for them at all costs under any circumstances. Their role in quadra progression is to jolt others back to reality, to properly assess their circumstances, and take the necessary action to begin

    Te/Fi

    The Te/Fi axis of Gamma is primarily concerned with organization and implementation of effective methods. They often live by an explicit personal code that is rooted in their own self-interest and that of those close to them. Perhaps more than any other pair, they pursue development of their own personal latent positive qualities as directly and fully as possibly in order to maximize their strength and usefulness. Their role in quadra progression is to promote personal growth and begin the natural process of organization and standardization that lays the ground work for collectivization.

    ---------

    This is a work in progress; feel free to criticize and contribute if you take exception to anything I've written, think I'm missing something, or think I could elaborate more on a specific point.

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    Notes:

    The beginning of each Aristocratic quadra is Rational and aligned with a cathexic attitude, seeking to gather resources and support, organize, and align systems of belief. They are probably the most inclined to view others as generally disorganized, uncommitted, or behaving below standards. The end of each Aristocratic quadra is Irrational, focused on catharsis, seeking to release the strain or tension of rigid organization and focus on the constant dissolution that is necessary in order for true idealism to be maintained. They are probably the most likely to disdain others as impure or "fake," not willing to do what is necessary to earnestly uphold truth and do what is necessary.

    The beginning of each Democratic quadra is irrational, aligned with catharsis; they are the afterbirth of the releasing of strained organization of the preceding Aristocratic quadra. They are probably the most laid-back types, likely to regard others as up-tight, pushy, or invasive; they insist upon their rights. The end of each Democratic quadra is rational, aligned with cathexis: they are the precursor to Rational Aristocrat encompassing structures, organizing not at the behest of simply ideals but rather because they see more than other types the actual, concrete benefit, and indeed necessity, of organization, that "two heads are better than one," whereas Aristocratic types tend to assume this, or even take it for granted.

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    Christ, you people whine about how this forum is going downhill/has no serious discussion, and then a thread like this goes untouched. The fuck do you want from me.

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    i read it and i think it's very good
    INTp

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    Not so sure what to think other than that it sounds good.
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    Even I don't think it's that good.

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    This is interesting because I can totally see how it applies to people in my daily life. Here are some reactions I had while reading it...

    Under Delta, all aspects of life are organized and unified into a sustainable whole that attempts to treat each individual according to their needs and maximize their usefulness for the perceived common good
    (emphasis mine)

    Isn't this contradictory? To me, treating people according to their individual needs implies a loose, amorphic paradigm, which seems at odds with the somewhat reductionistic notion of subordinating individuals to the "common good."

    The Ne/Si axis of delta is primarily concerned with the continual refinement of established structures and ethical principles. They like to make "little changes here and there," constantly perfecting and refining various standardized procedures.
    IME, this is so true. In fact, one of the things that annoys me about some Deltas as that they are always making incremental or even tangential changes when I feel like they need to make farther-reading, more fundamental changes.

    Alpha is the quadra of new beginnings. Alphas seek to foster creative activity and promote holistic change in their environments and people's ideas.
    I think this is too vague. Betas, with their penchant for rocking the boat, could easily identify with the "new beginnings" part. Maybe specify what sort of new beginnings are particularly Alpha -- new intellectual beginnings?

    Also, I'm not sure about the "creative activity" part, although I see where you're coming from here. I feel like different quadras define creativity differently and will thus relate to this statement in different ways.

    Finally, I'm just not sure what you mean by "holistic change." This could be me, but I'm not clear on what the difference between "holistic change" and ... non-holistic change is.

    The Ne/Si axis of Alpha is primarily concerned with generation of ideas and maintenance of environments conducive to fun, intellectual stimulation, and creativity. They examine and challenge existing standards on a purely intellectual level, rarely seeking to dogmatically criticize or berate, but rather to break things up piece by piece and attempt to put them back together in the proper order. They are primarily focused on ideas as intellectual "toys" that may or may not develop into something worthy of support or pursuit; when they are not, they are used for their intrinsic worth and abandoned when they prove useless. When the Ne/Si axis of Alpha unearths ideas worthy of pursuit, it seeks to spread them in a grassroots fashion, appealing to those whom they think will be interested in mutual pursuits.
    This definitely makes sense for Ne. But how does Si fit in here?

    Typical tactics include inducing chaos intentionally, such that, though anyone affected, including themselves, is at a disadvantage for lack of structure or certainty, at least they are ready for it, and as such can capitalize on the lack of organization in order to establish a position or make a vital move.
    Totally. I think this is specifically a Beta Ni tactic. Se tends to construct more meticulous plans.

    The Se/Ni axis of Gamma is primarily concerned with steadfastness and genuine expression.
    Why is this Se/Ni? I see genuine expression as more of a Fe thing -- or Fi, depending on the context.

    Also, I think a lot of Deltas would relate to what you said about "personal growth," developing "individual potentialities," "latent positive qualities." This seems Ne/Fi to me.

    Anyway, I really enjoyed reading this. I'm hoping to see more stuff like this. Maybe even "Quadra Progression by Unvalued Functions."
    EIE-Ni

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    Quote Originally Posted by nilv View Post
    Anyway, I really enjoyed reading this. I'm hoping to see more stuff like this. Maybe even "Quadra Progression by Unvalued Functions."
    Hmm, that's an interesting idea... I suppose it would describe a progression of insecurities, i.e. how each quadra avoids being like its opposite quadra. Come to think of it, that would be quite enlightening - not that it's important in and of itself, but it would establish a nice contrast with the valued functions.



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    I love reading about the quadras! It seems like there is a lack of information on them and lack of descriptions. Does anyone have any others besides the ones on wikisocion?

    This is really good. Thanks for posting. It's helpful to read this stuff. I can see how it applies in real life.
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    Quote Originally Posted by nilv View Post
    Isn't this contradictory? To me, treating people according to their individual needs implies a loose, amorphic paradigm, which seems at odds with the somewhat reductionistic notion of subordinating individuals to the "common good."
    Well, common good has to be amorphous, because we aren't all the same; this is the compromise this approach makes.

    I think this is too vague. Betas, with their penchant for rocking the boat, could easily identify with the "new beginnings" part. Maybe specify what sort of new beginnings are particularly Alpha -- new intellectual beginnings?
    Well, on one hand it is intended to be broad; in itself it is not intended to be an object directed at catalyzing personal identification, but is more of a contextual placeholder, a statement of it's place in the cycle to start off the description, like the categorization of Betas as disruptive and rebellious. I would expect people to identify more thoroughly with the more specific descriptions of each valued function in whatever place it occupies in their functional arrangement.

    Also, I'm not sure about the "creative activity" part, although I see where you're coming from here. I feel like different quadras define creativity differently and will thus relate to this statement in different ways.
    The main point is that it's about creating a structured environment (Si+Ti) that promotes external expression of the flights of impulse (Fe+Ne), cultivating the conditions under which they are most likely to take place.

    Finally, I'm just not sure what you mean by "holistic change." This could be me, but I'm not clear on what the difference between "holistic change" and ... non-holistic change is.
    Ne and Ti try to provide explanations that are both essential and contextual; in other words, broadly interpretable and widely applicable (hence the Democratic, more individualistic quadra mindset).

    This definitely makes sense for Ne. But how does Si fit in here?
    Anti-conflict orientation, ideas being seen as useful for momentary entertainment and gratification rather than taking an implicitly selective and more far-reaching approach to selecting "relevant" input.

    Totally. I think this is specifically a Beta Ni tactic. Se tends to construct more meticulous plans.
    Well, they are dually suggestive: choosing the right time to strike in the right place for maximum impact, especially with implementation of inducing general chaos and unpredictability, is a synthesis of Se and Ni. This both indicates its specific nature and contrasts it from its two surrounding demi-quadras: Beta Fe/Ti seeks to cultivate a structure and following, a platform to be jumped from, and Gamma Se/Ni embraces the condensing of relations and greater need for personal boundaries and security.

    Why is this Se/Ni? I see genuine expression as more of a Fe thing -- or Fi, depending on the context.
    I'm taking basically about projections of Se+Fi "steadfastness," commitment, substantiated by Ni+Te long term orientation of one-to-one mutually aligned goals, general worldviews, etc. Se and Te represent the external manifestations of more personal, exlpicitly agreed upon and thereon implicitly assumed Ni+Fi boundaries, presumed ethical and intellectual standpoints; this is what "genuine expression" means to Gammas.

    Also, I think a lot of Deltas would relate to what you said about "personal growth," developing "individual potentialities," "latent positive qualities." This seems Ne/Fi to me.
    Well, the kind of development I'm talking about in Gamma is more directed towards individual effectiveness, a sort of Democratic utilitarian approach: developing specific personal potentialities into concretely projected strengths or abilities (lots of 3s, 8s, 1s).

    Anyway, I really enjoyed reading this. I'm hoping to see more stuff like this. Maybe even "Quadra Progression by Unvalued Functions."
    I'll put that into the hopper.

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    With this I disagree, well the most part. Ne/Si in Delta manifests in a localisation of preoccupations, focus on a limited range of things and a small spatial range. It is a refinement, yes, but in the sense of picking something, sticking with it for a long time and make those little changes to adapt the traditional to the contemporary. They don't use to innovate, but fix those little details nobody cared about previously, using their continuous patience in usage.
    That is a good point I hadn't thought to include. I think specialization is inherent to Aristocratic quadras, partly given their propensity to assign everyone "social roles" but also simply because that's what happens when people work together.

    The part about adapting the traditional to the contemporary is well-worded, and what you say there is essentially identical to what I was trying to convey.

    Deltas find usually those little details like pouring some water on the blacksmith's wheel, leaving the game outside for several hours or predict some weather by the song of a bird. This is an amalgam of pure experience without any systematization, theory or principles.
    Lol, yeah, these are the kind of individually perfected, natural/holistic little practical but unnecessary skills that Deltas can perfect because of their need for both broad-scope applicability of skills, but also small-scale specialization and integration.

    Popular culture (including superstitions - Ne/Fi), slang and regional particularities are closely related to this.
    Mmmm, that's a bit further than I'm willing to go, because cultures can manifest different general quadra leanings, in which case the people who most clearly exemplify them will undoubtedly be of the same quadra,

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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly View Post
    Anti-conflict orientation, ideas being seen as useful for momentary entertainment and gratification rather than taking an implicitly selective and more far-reaching approach to selecting "relevant" input.
    I don't think the orientation is inherently anti-conflict; it just manifests that way because of the desire to systematize conceptual viewpoints as opposed to implementing them. As for their usefulness, I would say that the gratification is generated from crystallizing the most encompassing intellectual and social context for experiences to be subsumed under; it's far-reaching by virtue of volume, whereas betas systems/ideas are far-reaching because of internal distillation (assumption of isolated ends concentrates energy).
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    Gilly, thanks for clarifying those points. I think it would really help to include some of those elaborations in your article, since terms like "creative activity," "genuine expression," etc. might be too elastic to convey your point without diluting it, even if your goal is to establish a general contextual baseline.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    Well, common good has to be amorphous, because we aren't all the same; this is the compromise this approach makes.
    Ok, I was thinking of "common good" in the sum-is-greater-than-the-parts, subordinating people to something larger way. I guess for Delta, the "common good" is more an amalgamation of individual interests.

    The main point is that it's about creating a structured environment (Si+Ti) that promotes external expression of the flights of impulse (Fe+Ne), cultivating the conditions under which they are most likely to take place.
    "Flights of impulse" describes Alpha really well. In the context of Si + Ti, I think "creating a structured environment" actually means systematically removing what is perceived as superfluous organization to create a loosely associative structure with ad-hoc procedures. Like a Wiki.

    Well, they are dually suggestive: choosing the right time to strike in the right place for maximum impact, especially with implementation of inducing general chaos and unpredictability, is a synthesis of Se and Ni.
    Yeah, by itself I don't think Se would be comfortable with an act designed to induce chaos and instability. I feel like maybe Ni is the destructive component here and Se is the progressive component. Ni disrupts the internal cohesion in a system, sending it into a state of flux and kinesis. Once this happens, Se finds specific places to apply pressure in order to rearrange and solidify the system. Then again, figuring out the most crucial places to apply pressure to create uncertainty has an element of Se too.

    Well, the kind of development I'm talking about in Gamma is more directed towards individual effectiveness, a sort of Democratic utilitarian approach: developing specific personal potentialities into concretely projected strengths or abilities (lots of 3s, 8s, 1s).
    So then, this sounds like the flip side of Deltas attempts to maximize individual efficiency in terms of the common good. Both Gamma and Delta strive to promote effectiveness, but Delta does so by determining the individual's potential in relation to the greater productive structure they belong to while Gamma takes an "inside-out" approach by focusing on developing an individual's strengths/abilities before they are fit into the "common good."
    EIE-Ni

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