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    Default Napoleon Bonaparte

    What was his type?

    No time to make my point yet, but here are some reference resources.

    Biography.
    Wikiquotes.









    Last edited by silke; 06-19-2014 at 07:21 PM. Reason: updated links

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    Something about Napoleon just does not strike me as intuitive, but I suppose it is possible.

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    "A man will fight harder for his interests than for his rights."

    "It is not enough that I succeed - everyone else must fail."

    “If I always appear prepared, it is because before entering an undertaking, I have meditated long and have foreseen what might occur. It is not genius where reveals to me suddenly and secretly what I should do in circumstances unexpected by others; it is thought and preparation.”

    “The best cure for the body is a quiet mind.”

    ~ Napoleon


    "There is no doubt that Napoleon repesents the very acme of primitivity."
    ~ A.A. Brill

    "His obsession with his family, and his conviction that every man has his price, reveal Napoleon as closer to a modern Mafia godfather than a visonary European."

    "The Corsican legacy may partly account for the ruthless pragmatism Napoleon's personality, the impatience with abstract theory and the conviction that, ultimately, human problems are solved by main force."

    Napoleon was described, in the McLynn Biography, as, "... a reserved, meditative loner who would turn to violence if provoked", and a "misanthropic recluse". It was also said that, "If Napoleon's academic progress at Brienne was fair, his social and personal formation was disastrous", and his Inspector-General declared him to have, "... a docile expression, mild, straightforward, thoughtful." (You can see Napoleon's expression in portraits). Even Napoleon's brother, Lucien, thought of him this way, "Napoleon was broody and withdrawn, greeted him without affection and showed no tenderness or kindness."

    "... when the children were taken for the afternoon walk, Napoleon liked to hold hands with a girl called Giacominetta. Noting also that Napoleon was sloppy with his appearance and often had his socks around his ankles, some juvenile wag composed the couplet:

    Napoleone di mezza calzetta
    Fa l'amore a Giacominetta.


    If this provocative was uttered, the sequel would have been predictable, which was doubtless where the boy Napoleon got his early reputation for fistcuffs."

    "... an unconscious desire for revenge against the opposite sex seems well grounded in the evidence of his later life."

    "Brutality was visited on him by both boys and masters."

    "Napoleon's response to such humiliations was to insult his fellow-pupils in turn, which led to further fistcuffs."

    "He did not fit in, did not make friends easily, was unpopular and a lone wolf."

    "He liked to retire inside this redoubt to be alone, private and au dessus de la melee."

    "He had absolutely no lingustic talent."

    "If the military schools ar Brienne and Paris had been designed to promote social inequality, as was claimed, they failed miserably with Napoleon."

    "He experienced severe difficulty in making friends, was let down by most of those he did make, but on the other hand seemed to make bitter enemies by the mere fact of his existence."

    "Although Napoleon tried to turn the whole thing into a joke (teasing), it was clear he was deeply affronted."


    And on, and on, and on.


    Sensory-logical Introvert.
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    Quote Originally Posted by vague
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    I was tempted to make quotes, but besides the fact that there was contextually much information that had no type relation whatsoever, absolutly nothing in those links really pointed towards one specific type so I chose not to make an effort.

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    ILE "Searcher"
    Socionics: ENTp
    DCNH: Dominant --> perhaps Normalizing
    Enneagram: 7w6 "Enthusiast"
    MBTI: ENTJ "Field Marshall" or ENTP "Inventor"
    Astrological sign: Aquarius

    To learn, read. To know, write. To master, teach.

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    Fuckin' Keirsey...
    MAYBE I'LL BREAK DOWN!!!


    Quote Originally Posted by vague
    Rocky's posts are as enjoyable as having wisdom teeth removed.

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    This does not sound dominant at all:

    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    "... when the children were taken for the afternoon walk, Napoleon liked to hold hands with a girl called Giacominetta. Noting also that Napoleon was sloppy with his appearance and often had his socks around his ankles, some juvenile wag composed the couplet:

    "He did not fit in, did not make friends easily, was unpopular and a lone wolf."

    "He liked to retire inside this redoubt to be alone, private and au dessus de la melee."
    Therefore Napoleon was not: ESTP, ESFP, ISFJ, ISTJ.
    "Nothing happens until the pain of staying the same outweighs the pain of change."

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    Exactly.

    Besides, I decided to bold this below quote especially because when I first read it it struck a nerve with me. This is like, the definition of ISTP.

    "He experienced severe difficulty in making friends, was let down by most of those he did make, but on the other hand seemed to make bitter enemies by the mere fact of his existence."

    This would be the wrong topic to argue with me on. There are probably only three people who I'd defend being ISTP to this extreme (Napoleon, Cobb, and James Hetfield). This is just one of those things I know. In fact, there is a reason why a second one of those three guys mentioned, Cobb, had a library of books about Napoleon, and also said himself that he felt "rapoir" with Napoleon. It's the same reason why I am siting here right now talking about the both of them.

    I haven't seen anyone else even give a half-baked argument to the contrary.
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    Quote Originally Posted by vague
    Rocky's posts are as enjoyable as having wisdom teeth removed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    Exactly.

    Besides, I decided to bold this below quote especially because when I first read it it struck a nerve with me. This is like, the definition of ISTP.

    "He experienced severe difficulty in making friends, was let down by most of those he did make, but on the other hand seemed to make bitter enemies by the mere fact of his existence."

    This would be the wrong topic to argue with me on. There are probably only three people who I'd defend being ISTP to this extreme (Napoleon, Cobb, and James Hetfield). This is just one of those things I know. In fact, there is a reason why a second one of those three guys mentioned, Cobb, had a library of books about Napoleon, and also said himself that he felt "rapoir" with Napoleon. It's the same reason why I am siting here right now talking about the both of them.

    I haven't seen anyone else even give a half-baked argument to the contrary.
    Yeah, I also was thinking of ISTp when I was reading it too. So, we know for sure now that he is not a feeler or a dominant. Therefore his type is one of these:

    INTJ, ENTJ, INTP, ESTJ, ISTP, ENTP.

    EDIT: I'll look at more into the quotes:

    "The Corsican legacy may partly account for the ruthless pragmatism Napoleon's personality, the impatience with abstract theory and the conviction that, ultimately, human problems are solved by main force."

    Suggests Extraverted Thinking

    “If I always appear prepared, it is because before entering an undertaking, I have meditated long and have foreseen what might occur. It is not genius where reveals to me suddenly and secretly what I should do in circumstances unexpected by others; it is thought and preparation.”

    Suggests Introverted Sensing (Possibly Introverted Intuition)

    Therefore after reading this, I would say his personality type is:

    ISTp or ESTJ.

    Other possiblities: ENTJ, INTp
    "Nothing happens until the pain of staying the same outweighs the pain of change."

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    Default Not sure...

    I still believe that we can not prove 100% what type he was. I don't have a wish to argue about this, it is not really important for me. Appearance wise he looks like ESFP, sometimes his look is more of a logical type sometimes ther is more life/excitement in his face. I don't think it would be right to argue about any sentence known about him. There could be many factors involved in his specific behavour pattern. His life path:
    1+5+8+1+7+6+9 = 37/10 tells be that he was sensitive in expression, he had issues with trust and opennes (could be the reason for being alone), he had an energy/creativity and he had a natural gift of some sort.
    He was born in August that is Virgin, he must have been critical to detail and may be perfectionist. Virgin is earth sign, the possibility of being sensorical probably high. I know this info does not sound as serious, it just my method to look for info from different directions. A detailed astrological profile would probably help better. I do not exclude possibility for him to be other types than ESFP though when I looked very briefly through infoon the links (thanks a lot for posting pictures and links ) I noticed that his name was associated with some all different sorts of fights/wars, politics and revolution which again would fit Gamma quadra although we could sayit was not as such his personality to be a reason, he happened to live at such troubled time. I think it is always good to focuse onthe base function and comapre it with real facts and achievements if we can not prove by the method of testing. I would rather believe that he was sensorical type with as a major function may be beacouse he was always in trouble or trouble looked for him, struggle for power is obvious. Did he wish to be famous or just to have a piece of land of France and a couple more countries were not enough for him. What did he want? did he serously want to bringe a change to the world?
    According to info, he realy brought a few changes to a few countries, may be, but also a lot of distruction. Where was his logical mind to stop him being unreasonable or intuition to forsee the consequences of his actions?
    School of Associative socionics: http://socionics4you.com/

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    Default Re: Not sure...

    Quote Originally Posted by Olga
    I still believe that we can not prove 100% what type he was. I don't have a wish to argue about this, it is not really important for me. Appearance wise he looks like ESFP, sometimes his look is more of a logical type sometimes ther is more life/excitement in his face. I don't think it would be right to argue about any sentence known about him. There could be many factors involved in his specific behavour pattern. His life path:
    1+5+8+1+7+6+9 = 37/10 tells be that he was sensitive in expression, he had issues with trust and opennes (could be the reason for being alone), he had an energy/creativity and he had a natural gift of some sort.
    He was born in August that is Virgin, he must have been critical to detail and may be perfectionist. Virgin is earth sign, the possibility of being sensorical probably high. I know this info does not sound as serious, it just my method to look for info from different directions. A detailed astrological profile would probably help better. I do not exclude possibility for him to be other types than ESFP though when I looked very briefly through infoon the links (thanks a lot for posting pictures and links ) I noticed that his name was associated with some all different sorts of fights/wars, politics and revolution which again would fit Gamma quadra although we could sayit was not as such his personality to be a reason, he happened to live at such troubled time. I think it is always good to focuse onthe base function and comapre it with real facts and achievements if we can not prove by the method of testing. I would rather believe that he was sensorical type with as a major function may be beacouse he was always in trouble or trouble looked for him, struggle for power is obvious. Did he wish to be famous or just to have a piece of land of France and a couple more countries were not enough for him. What did he want? did he serously want to bringe a change to the world?
    According to info, he realy brought a few changes to a few countries, may be, but also a lot of distruction. Where was his logical mind to stop him being unreasonable or intuition to forsee the consequences of his actions?
    Don't include astrology in trying to figure out his type. I find it to be total bollocks in my opinion. This would be socionics if people were assigned personality types. I'm an Aries and I relate more to Sagitarrius anyways, though I can relate to almost any of them in the way they work it out.
    There's no way he was as a major function. I personally believe he most likely has as a dominant function and maybe
    "Nothing happens until the pain of staying the same outweighs the pain of change."

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    Quote Originally Posted by Young_and_Confused
    This does not sound dominant at all:

    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    "... when the children were taken for the afternoon walk, Napoleon liked to hold hands with a girl called Giacominetta. Noting also that Napoleon was sloppy with his appearance and often had his socks around his ankles, some juvenile wag composed the couplet:

    "He did not fit in, did not make friends easily, was unpopular and a lone wolf."

    "He liked to retire inside this redoubt to be alone, private and au dessus de la melee."

    That does not sound like anything dominant ... do not you guys even bother to read context? His loner tendencies developed from being a non-french speaker and a minority, and the fact that he was from the aristocricy did not seem to help to make him popular either. That has nothing to do with introversion. In fact, it is totally possible for him to still be an extrovert and act that way, as NT types [extroverted and introverted both] tend to be loners. Not sure about the other ones ...

    There are a few other quotes I keep seeing people use that contextually mean absolutly nothing as far as type goes and sound really silly when you read the context.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rmcnew
    NT types [extroverted and introverted both] tend to be loners.
    Bull.


    And he was a loner for a few reasons. All of them had to do with his personality. It wasn't so much of him being foreign as him being racist against other people and fighting against them for looking down upon his origins, for example.

    And though Introversion isn't the same as sociability, there is something about the nature of the Introverted Attitude that drives them in this direction before they even realize that they are seperated from the main stream and ignored.


    And what do you mean by non-french speaking?
    MAYBE I'LL BREAK DOWN!!!


    Quote Originally Posted by vague
    Rocky's posts are as enjoyable as having wisdom teeth removed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by rmcnew
    Quote Originally Posted by Young_and_Confused
    This does not sound dominant at all:

    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    "... when the children were taken for the afternoon walk, Napoleon liked to hold hands with a girl called Giacominetta. Noting also that Napoleon was sloppy with his appearance and often had his socks around his ankles, some juvenile wag composed the couplet:

    "He did not fit in, did not make friends easily, was unpopular and a lone wolf."

    "He liked to retire inside this redoubt to be alone, private and au dessus de la melee."

    That does not sound like anything dominant ... do not you guys even bother to read context? His loner tendencies developed from being a non-french speaker and a minority, and the fact that he was from the aristocricy did not seem to help to make him popular either. That has nothing to do with introversion. In fact, it is totally possible for him to still be an extrovert and act that way, as NT types [extroverted and introverted both] tend to be loners. Not sure about the other ones ...

    There are a few other quotes I keep seeing people use that contextually mean absolutly nothing as far as type goes and sound really silly when you read the context.
    What your saying about his language and him being a minority does make a lot of sense to contributing to his unpopularity. People that are different are usually scolded at and treated like dirt. Being a loner can attribute to introverted and extraverted types. However, I doubt an dominant could be a loner.
    "Nothing happens until the pain of staying the same outweighs the pain of change."

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    Default Y&C

    @Y&C Thanks for that:

    Don't include astrology in trying to figure out his type. I find it to be total bollocks in my opinion. This would be socionics if people were assigned personality types. I'm an Aries and I relate more to Sagitarrius anyways, though I can relate to almost any of them in the way they work it out.
    There's no way he was as a major function. I personally believe he most likely has as a dominant function and maybe

    I had a good laugh!

    By the way, what you think about base being and the role being is what I would really like to hear when I start to discuss the role functions, look forward to hear from you then.
    School of Associative socionics: http://socionics4you.com/

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    Quote Originally Posted by rmcnew
    NT types [extroverted and introverted both] tend to be loners.
    Bull.


    And he was a loner for a few reasons. All of them had to do with his personality. It wasn't so much of him being foreign as him being racist against other people and fighting against them for looking down upon his origins, for example.

    And though Introversion isn't the same as sociability, there is something about the nature of the Introverted Attitude that drives them in this direction before they even realize that they are seperated from the main stream and ignored.


    And what do you mean by non-french speaking?
    It means that I think you are taking the articles heavily out of context, and I see little point discuss it with you because apparently it never matters anyhow.

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    I'm not hiding anything. Read the book if you'd like. I'm just not about to re-write an entire biography. Instead, I decided to quote a bunch of stuff so you guys would know I'm not just pulling anything out of my ass.

    Here's the linkage,

    http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/155...lance&n=283155
    MAYBE I'LL BREAK DOWN!!!


    Quote Originally Posted by vague
    Rocky's posts are as enjoyable as having wisdom teeth removed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Young_and_Confused
    Quote Originally Posted by rmcnew
    Quote Originally Posted by Young_and_Confused
    This does not sound dominant at all:

    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    "... when the children were taken for the afternoon walk, Napoleon liked to hold hands with a girl called Giacominetta. Noting also that Napoleon was sloppy with his appearance and often had his socks around his ankles, some juvenile wag composed the couplet:

    "He did not fit in, did not make friends easily, was unpopular and a lone wolf."

    "He liked to retire inside this redoubt to be alone, private and au dessus de la melee."

    That does not sound like anything dominant ... do not you guys even bother to read context? His loner tendencies developed from being a non-french speaker and a minority, and the fact that he was from the aristocricy did not seem to help to make him popular either. That has nothing to do with introversion. In fact, it is totally possible for him to still be an extrovert and act that way, as NT types [extroverted and introverted both] tend to be loners. Not sure about the other ones ...

    There are a few other quotes I keep seeing people use that contextually mean absolutly nothing as far as type goes and sound really silly when you read the context.
    What your saying about his language and him being a minority does make a lot of sense to contributing to his unpopularity. People that are different are usually scolded at and treated like dirt. Being a loner can attribute to introverted and extraverted types. However, I doubt an dominant could be a loner.
    I was talking about this statement:

    Napoleon set foot in France for the first time in the winter of 1778, a thin, sallow nine year-old, accustomed to the warmth of the Mediterranean, suddenly alone on the windswept plains of northern France. He could hardly speak French.

    JOURQUIN: He thinks of himself as a Corsican. He is surrounded by students who are the children of French aristocrats. And they have nothing in common with this little foreigner. And since he is quite proud, he becomes a loner.

    CARRINGTON: When he was in school in Brienne in continental France, where he was very much laughed at and bullied for being a barbarous Corsican, he dreamt all the time of…liberating Corsica. But he did something quite exceptional. He conquered his conquerors. He got the better of the French.

    That does little to prove that he was an introvert or an extrovert, he just never fit in totally and in result decided to be content with not fitting in.

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    Default Re: Y&C

    Quote Originally Posted by Olga
    By the way, what you think about base being and the role being is what I would really like to hear when I start to discuss the role functions, look forward to hear from you then.
    I guess Rocky can go into having as a role function. I'm assuming that it deals with being paranoid or predicting things always in a negative fashion. It can even be true a lot of the time of course, since the world is such a let down.
    "Nothing happens until the pain of staying the same outweighs the pain of change."

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    I guess you can say that Ni role has somewhat to do with viewing the future negatively. Not always... just, unsure of it and how it will change.

    Also, we start to worry about somethings like people talking about us, or us somehow being alientated from society in general. Sometimes we start to think about that kind of thing too much, and when that happens we sort of get this look of exhaustion. Think about it like how other people get hysterical and cause scenes, only that acting overly-zealous like that, for us, is directly against our nature. This is why our "outbursts" are repressed and kept under control, thus the only thing to do is have a disgusted look on our face. It says, "You all are making me crazy."
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    Quote Originally Posted by vague
    Rocky's posts are as enjoyable as having wisdom teeth removed.

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    I'd like to come back to this post to share my research on his type. My final conclusion is ESFp-EXXx, fusion with ENTj.

    The clincher was his extreme rapport with the military. When he returned from exile on Elba, he opened his coat and said "Soldiers, I am your Emperor... if there is a man among you would kill his Emperor, here I am!" personal knowledge allows one to condense external field dynamics into statics; in this case, the common desire for personal liberty in France, and Napoleon's belief in it, allows him to condense those who believe in the concept into a single army, which can be thought of as an external field static. The presence of this static produces a creative art change in subjective perception (that of the perception of an army) which in turn releases potentials made possible by this new state of affairs. The release of these potentials offers change in strength levels of various forces, which are considered on the basis of their business potential. The acceptance of the best impact produces internal field statics in oneself regarding the suitability of the situation. The presence of this feeling reroutes the flow of time and produces role potentials. (these explain his determination on the battlefield and the ease with which he acheived victory: he literally molded the flow of time around his own feelings; or to put it another way, his feelings could control history.) The acceptance of a role potential implied the emergence of a new perceptive perception of himself by others. (note how the enslavement of to demands that he be perceived in the way he desires: "I am your emperor. If any man would strike his emperor..." ) These forced subjective perceptions create new external field statics (his supporters, his enemies) and new binding ties between these statics. (the union of the French under his rule, the alliances of his allies/defeated enemies)

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    umm, yeah, but you use the words objects/fields/external/internal/statics/dynamics way too much, and your labeling of functions seem so arbitraily placed that you could write a Family Guy episode with them, and you're forgetting the simple fact that he could not be an esfp.
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    Quote Originally Posted by vague
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    umm, yeah, but you use the words objects/fields/external/internal/statics/dynamics way too much, and your labeling of functions seem so arbitraily placed that you could write a Family Guy episode with them, and you're forgetting the simple fact that he could not be an esfp.
    ESFp-ENTj is not ESFp as you believe it: it is populism with an eye to profit and organization.

    The peoples of Germany, the peoples of France, of Italy, of Spain all desire equality and liberal ideas.
    I have guided the affairs of Europe for many years now, and I have had occasion to convince myself that the buzzing of the privileged classes is contrary to the general opinion. Be a constitutional king.
    Since when does ISTp care about the general opinion? ...Listen, your obstinance is helping no one, not even yourself.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Traveler
    This does not sound dominant at all:
    Why?
    Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit

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    Quote Originally Posted by FDG
    Quote Originally Posted by Traveler
    This does not sound dominant at all:
    Why?
    Looks like topics are coming back from the dead! Based on what I've read on him, he strikes me as a delta ST primarily. With SLI favouring LSE slightly. An dominant could be a loner like any type, but it is not their desire, and SLI would prefer seclusion even when it can be avoided and he could of easily been highly social with the power he had. His work ethic resembles an LSE, but his private life favors him as an SLI. He was also innovative when it came to tools/military weapons and he advanced them and this points to SLI as well.
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    Quote Originally Posted by tcaudilllg
    The peoples of Germany, the peoples of France, of Italy, of Spain all desire equality and liberal ideas.
    I have guided the affairs of Europe for many years now, and I have had occasion to convince myself that the buzzing of the privileged classes is contrary to the general opinion. Be a constitutional king.
    Since when does ISTp care about the general opinion? ...Listen, your obstinance is helping no one, not even yourself.
    Read a biography- he was no "E" anything.

    Also, please please please explain how you attribute those functions.
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    Quote Originally Posted by vague
    Rocky's posts are as enjoyable as having wisdom teeth removed.

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    Rational extrovert subtypes tend to be less outgoing than irrational subtypes. You know this. He absolutely felt immersed by the military however, and he obviously enjoyed attention. He saw the business end of politics, you might say.

    ...I don't have time to explain the attributions now. I will later.

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    Quote Originally Posted by he died with a felafel
    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    Exactly.

    Besides, I decided to bold this below quote especially because when I first read it it struck a nerve with me. This is like, the definition of ISTP.

    "He experienced severe difficulty in making friends, was let down by most of those he did make, but on the other hand seemed to make bitter enemies by the mere fact of his existence."

    This would be the wrong topic to argue with me on. There are probably only three people who I'd defend being ISTP to this extreme (Napoleon, Cobb, and James Hetfield). This is just one of those things I know. In fact, there is a reason why a second one of those three guys mentioned, Cobb, had a library of books about Napoleon, and also said himself that he felt "rapoir" with Napoleon. It's the same reason why I am siting here right now talking about the both of them.

    I haven't seen anyone else even give a half-baked argument to the contrary.
    i have to ask... who's Cobb?
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ty_Cobb

    First man voted into the Baseball Hall of Fame (he got more votes then Babe Ruth), holds more records than anyone in baseball, was the first professional athlete to ever become a millionaire (though he never got paid more then $80,000 a year; he made his money playing the stockmarket), and he fought for player's rights by being the first person to get sercurity guards at the fields and by being the first one to suggests players have the right to free agency.


    (though this was awhile ago I now realize this argument is meanigless with tcaud because he'd probably saying something like Cobb's "actual" type is an intj inside of an esfp or something.)
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    Quote Originally Posted by vague
    Rocky's posts are as enjoyable as having wisdom teeth removed.

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    There's no wrong type to argue. You're still not bringing any argument whatsoever except stating your opinion.
    Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit

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    Quote Originally Posted by FDG
    There's no wrong type to argue. You're still not bringing any argument whatsoever except stating your opinion.
    Isn't that what I said in the last part of my last post?
    MAYBE I'LL BREAK DOWN!!!


    Quote Originally Posted by vague
    Rocky's posts are as enjoyable as having wisdom teeth removed.

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    No way he was ISTp. ISTp rarely care about politics, much less world domination.

    Nope, Napoleon was ENTj. ENTj's hidden agenda is Se.

    I'll add later as I'm heading to bed.
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    How many of you people have read a biography about his personal/family life? And if you did, how do you justify him being Extraverted? Just doesn't make sense.
    MAYBE I'LL BREAK DOWN!!!


    Quote Originally Posted by vague
    Rocky's posts are as enjoyable as having wisdom teeth removed.

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    Mikemex - why do you think ISTps don't care about politics? I don't think all people any type could be characterized that way.
    It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    How many of you people have read a biography about his personal/family life? And if you did, how do you justify him being Extraverted? Just doesn't make sense.
    I read a biography of him and Josephine and he didn't seem extraverted in that. *shrug* But I'm hardly an expert on Napoleon.
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    He liked to conceptualize. There is a version of Machiavello's The Prince with notes from him.

    Some quotes:

    "Power resides in the appearance of power".
    "To make a war you need three things: money, money and more money".

    Anyone who knows ENTj from close knows that they like having long conversations on such topics. They like theory, but theory about power. I really don't imagine an ESTp Napoleon being big into books or conceptualizing that much.

    ENTj might be NT, but they are oriented toward the practical, thus his dislike for theories that didn't have practical application. Napoleon was a strategist with an eye always on logistics. He didn't belive wars were won by the bravest, but by the smartest.

    I have two friends who are ENTj. Both are loners. I remember one of them very well when we out to eat with some friends, everyone gossiping and him very quiet. He seemed to only like to talk to me, because I know what are the topics that really interest him.
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikemex
    They like theory, but theory about power. I really don't imagine an ESTp Napoleon being big into books or conceptualizing that much.
    Napoleon did not like theory (from my very first post in this thread,
    "The Corsican legacy may partly account for the ruthless pragmatism Napoleon's personality, the impatience with abstract theory and the conviction that, ultimately, human problems are solved by main force."), and I never said he was an estp as I said he was most definately introverted.

    I have two friends who are ENTj. Both are loners. I remember one of them very well when we out to eat with some friends, everyone gossiping and him very quiet. He seemed to only like to talk to me, because I know what are the topics that really interest him.
    Then they aren't entj.
    MAYBE I'LL BREAK DOWN!!!


    Quote Originally Posted by vague
    Rocky's posts are as enjoyable as having wisdom teeth removed.

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    Rocky, I think you should trust Napoleon's own words over the words of someone else's.

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    Quote Originally Posted by tcaudilllg
    Rocky, I think you should trust Napoleon's own words over the words of someone else's.
    Which words? The ones about power and money? I don't think that tells much about type. Any semi-resonable person realizes the importance of money.
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    Quote Originally Posted by vague
    Rocky's posts are as enjoyable as having wisdom teeth removed.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    I have two friends who are ENTj. Both are loners. I remember one of them very well when we out to eat with some friends, everyone gossiping and him very quiet. He seemed to only like to talk to me, because I know what are the topics that really interest him.
    Then they aren't entj.
    I disagree with you, Rocky.

    ENTjs' extraversion is seen in initiative-taking, restlessness, and focusing on external information as in . It is not necessarily seen - on the contrary - in being socially outgoing, or talkative in a group atmosphere. That is well described by Rick in his quadra group behavior profiles.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rocky
    "A man will fight harder for his interests than for his rights."

    "It is not enough that I succeed - everyone else must fail."

    “If I always appear prepared, it is because before entering an undertaking, I have meditated long and have foreseen what might occur. It is not genius where reveals to me suddenly and secretly what I should do in circumstances unexpected by others; it is thought and preparation.”

    “The best cure for the body is a quiet mind.”

    ~ Napoleon


    "There is no doubt that Napoleon repesents the very acme of primitivity."
    ~ A.A. Brill

    "His obsession with his family, and his conviction that every man has his price, reveal Napoleon as closer to a modern Mafia godfather than a visonary European."

    "The Corsican legacy may partly account for the ruthless pragmatism Napoleon's personality, the impatience with abstract theory and the conviction that, ultimately, human problems are solved by main force."

    Napoleon was described, in the McLynn Biography, as, "... a reserved, meditative loner who would turn to violence if provoked", and a "misanthropic recluse". It was also said that, "If Napoleon's academic progress at Brienne was fair, his social and personal formation was disastrous", and his Inspector-General declared him to have, "... a docile expression, mild, straightforward, thoughtful." (You can see Napoleon's expression in portraits). Even Napoleon's brother, Lucien, thought of him this way, "Napoleon was broody and withdrawn, greeted him without affection and showed no tenderness or kindness."

    "... when the children were taken for the afternoon walk, Napoleon liked to hold hands with a girl called Giacominetta. Noting also that Napoleon was sloppy with his appearance and often had his socks around his ankles, some juvenile wag composed the couplet:

    Napoleone di mezza calzetta
    Fa l'amore a Giacominetta.


    If this provocative was uttered, the sequel would have been predictable, which was doubtless where the boy Napoleon got his early reputation for fistcuffs."

    "... an unconscious desire for revenge against the opposite sex seems well grounded in the evidence of his later life."

    "Brutality was visited on him by both boys and masters."

    "Napoleon's response to such humiliations was to insult his fellow-pupils in turn, which led to further fistcuffs."

    "He did not fit in, did not make friends easily, was unpopular and a lone wolf."

    "He liked to retire inside this redoubt to be alone, private and au dessus de la melee."

    "He had absolutely no lingustic talent."

    "If the military schools ar Brienne and Paris had been designed to promote social inequality, as was claimed, they failed miserably with Napoleon."

    "He experienced severe difficulty in making friends, was let down by most of those he did make, but on the other hand seemed to make bitter enemies by the mere fact of his existence."

    "Although Napoleon tried to turn the whole thing into a joke (teasing), it was clear he was deeply affronted."
    All this points to quadra values.

    ISTps are not sloppy about their appearance.

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